Re: installing a second hard disk?
An image copy is taken at a level closer to the hardware than the filesystem is. The data files are copied into the image still firmly embedded into the filesystem, along with all its metadata. Thanks very much for that illuminating description. I have to go deeper. I did find this link: http://www.debian-administration.org/article/Migrating_a_live_system_from_ext3_to_ext4_filesystem - C -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100712180730.60750...@mondo
Re: installing a second hard disk?
Charles Kroeger wrote: My question was since this backup is on an ext3 formatted USB stick, if my hard drive was reformatted with ext4, could the backup [image] on the USB stick be 'copied' back to the new ext4 partition, without problems, as it were. If that software is filesystem agnostic, it will obviously require you to wipe out the ext4 filesystem to copy the saved ext3 filesystem back. As we said already, you can then upgrade the ext3 filesystem to ext4. Alternatively, you can find a way to mount the image with a loop device in order to copy the files from the saved filesystem to the new ext4 filesystem. Since you're using proprietary software, I must note that you might have a hard time with this alternative solution. You should get better help from that software developer. -t -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c396804.4080...@stammed.net
Re: installing a second hard disk?
On 11/07/10 04:18, Charles Kroeger wrote: Are you saying you took a copy of the partition using something like dd if=/dev/sdXy of=/mnt/removeable-media/a-file-on this-media or did you just copy the files? Thanks for your interesting suggestions; however, they reflect a considerable knowledge. In my case, I'm using a proprietary imaging software based on the Linux kernel that offers images made of one's whole hard drive or by way of an options menu, a list of individual partitions. My 'working system' is on one partition, sda1 and I've made a backup copy of this partition that is compressed into an 8GB kingston USB stick. I had this notion that after the hard drive was reformatted with ext4 I could boot up with the .iso Linux image that comes with the proprietary software and rebuild the partition by using the above backup. I've had to use this on a few occasions to rebuild my 'working system' after certain sid dist-upgrades were performed. I'm happy to report this doesn't happen as much now as in the recent past. My question was since this backup is on an ext3 formatted USB stick, if my hard drive was reformatted with ext4, could the backup [image] on the USB stick be 'copied' back to the new ext4 partition, without problems, as it were. It looks as if the point you're missing is the nature of an image. It's a bit-for-bit copy of a region of a drive, possibly compressed to avoid backing up unused space. It contains not only the data, but the entire filesystem structure, including any boot code it may use. If you restore a partition image, you're going to completely overwrite whatever was there before, so it's irrelevant what filesystem was there. What is there afterwards is an exact copy of the source of the image, including the filesystem used in that source. -- Joe -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c39fce1.40...@jretrading.com
Re: installing a second hard disk?
It looks as if the point you're missing is the nature of an image. Thanks for your reply. I was aware of the nature of an image, that's what I like about them. If your HD blows up or your computer is stolen just restore the image to the new hardware a chasteningly but wiser user perhaps but not the disaster I read in The Buffalo News about a woman whose laptop containing ten years of musical composition, was stolen with its contents being the only copies. Ten years without backing up, imagine that. I was hoping however that if one changed the file system on the backup media, then the 'data,' would be saved to the file system. At that point one could then change the file system of the source partition with mkfs.ext4 [I'm using unstable here] then restore the image as envisioned above. Grub2 is on board so the ext4 image should boot. I would have to change some labeling in fstab probably. Is this just magical thinking? -- CK -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100711145550.3d26e...@mondo
Re: installing a second hard disk?
On 11/07/10 19:55, Charles Kroeger wrote: It looks as if the point you're missing is the nature of an image. Thanks for your reply. I was aware of the nature of an image, that's what I like about them. If your HD blows up or your computer is stolen just restore the image to the new hardware a chasteningly but wiser user perhaps but not the disaster I read in The Buffalo News about a woman whose laptop containing ten years of musical composition, was stolen with its contents being the only copies. Ten years without backing up, imagine that. I was hoping however that if one changed the file system on the backup media, then the 'data,' would be saved to the file system. At that point one could then change the file system of the source partition with mkfs.ext4 [I'm using unstable here] then restore the image as envisioned above. Grub2 is on board so the ext4 image should boot. I would have to change some labeling in fstab probably. Is this just magical thinking? Afraid so. An image copy is taken at a level closer to the hardware than the filesystem is. The data files are copied into the image still firmly embedded into the filesystem, along with all its metadata. It's a bit like a tar archive containing not only a set of files, but also their directory structure. When you open the tarfile, you find the original directory structure inside, and the files can't be restored straight from the tarfile into a different directory structure, they have to be picked out one at a time. I haven't had any dealings with ext4 yet, but it would appear possible to convert a system from ext3 to ext4. Is this not an option for you? -- Joe -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c3a2229.6080...@jretrading.com
Re: installing a second hard disk?
There's a hell lot of confusion about ext4 If you had an image of a partition that used the ext3 file system and tried to install this image unto a freshly partitioned hard drive with an ext4 file system, would the image be destroyed or corrupted? thanks, -- CK Deo Soli Debianae, Invicto, Seculari -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100710133808.00d5f...@mondo
Re: installing a second hard disk?
Charles Kroeger wrote: If you had an image of a partition that used the ext3 file system and tried to install this image unto a freshly partitioned hard drive with an ext4 file system, would the image be destroyed or corrupted? I'm sorry I really don't understand, please define what you mean by installing the image. Random guesses: - If you want to restore the image then upgrade the ext3 filesystem to ext4, there's no problem; you can find some procedures around the net, although generally just mounting the filesystem as ext4 will do the trick. Note however that only newer files will take advantage of most ext4 features (extents,..). - If you want to restore the ext3 filesystem image in a separate partition than the one containing the existing (and new) ext4 filesystem, then there's no problem either, you can mount any filesystem on any other filesystem, as long as they have enough POSIX features (AFAIK). -t -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c38d9aa.4020...@stammed.net
Re: installing a second hard disk?
I'm sorry I really don't understand, please define what you mean by installing the image. Like I have an image of the data in a partition recorded on removable media. The source of this data [hard drive] and the removable media containing the copy [image] of this data both reside on an ext3 file system. My question is if the hard drive is reformatted with the ext4 file system and I re-install that 'image' [ext3 file system] will the data be corrupted? thanks, -- CK -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100710172807.454fc...@mondo
Re: installing a second hard disk?
On 10/07/10 22:28, Charles Kroeger wrote: I'm sorry I really don't understand, please define what you mean by installing the image. Like I have an image of the data in a partition recorded on removable media. The source of this data [hard drive] and the removable media containing the copy [image] of this data both reside on an ext3 file system. My question is if the hard drive is reformatted with the ext4 file system and I re-install that 'image' [ext3 file system] will the data be corrupted? thanks, You are using the word Install in an ambiguous way. Also the removable media can't reside on an ext3 system - more an ext3 filesystem resides on the removeable media (maybe). This filesystem then will be (potentially) mounted into the overall filesystem. Are you saying you took a copy of the partition using something like dd if=/dev/sdXy of=/mnt/removeable-media/a-file-on this-media or did you just copy the files? If you now have this file, you don't install it to recover it. You either copy it back using dd dd if=/mnt/removeable-media/a-file-on-this-media of=/dev/sdXy Or you could mount the file as a loopback device mount -o loop /mnt/removeable-media/a-file-on-this-media /a-new-mnt-point/ and copy the files from there -- Alan Chandler http://www.chandlerfamily.org.uk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c38ef93@chandlerfamily.org.uk
Re: installing a second hard disk?
On 10/07/10 00:36, Zachary Uram wrote: I just got a 500gb Hitachi hard drive (this is my second drive, my first drive is /dev/sda). What is the best way to install this in Linux? Is it better to run ext3 or ext4? Zach http://www.fidei.org Assuming you already have a fully working system on your first drive, I see two possibilities, dependent on your space needs. Either use some or all of the 500GB to turn some or all of your existing hard drive into a RAID 1 volume (dependent upon how that is partitioned) (To do this, you have to create one or more partitions on your new disk that are the same size as partitions on your old drive. Set the new disk up as half of a raid pair (so there is one missing drive), copy the data from your old disk on to it and reconfigure the kernel boot and /etc/fstab to handle the revised raid device. Then when you are sure its working, turn the old drive into the other half of the raid pair. Whether you create a raid partition or not, consider creating an LVM volume group so that you can dynamically add and remove logical volumes dependent on where you need the space. -- Alan Chandler http://www.chandlerfamily.org.uk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c38ec66.8020...@chandlerfamily.org.uk
Re: installing a second hard disk?
Are you saying you took a copy of the partition using something like dd if=/dev/sdXy of=/mnt/removeable-media/a-file-on this-media or did you just copy the files? Thanks for your interesting suggestions; however, they reflect a considerable knowledge. In my case, I'm using a proprietary imaging software based on the Linux kernel that offers images made of one's whole hard drive or by way of an options menu, a list of individual partitions. My 'working system' is on one partition, sda1 and I've made a backup copy of this partition that is compressed into an 8GB kingston USB stick. I had this notion that after the hard drive was reformatted with ext4 I could boot up with the .iso Linux image that comes with the proprietary software and rebuild the partition by using the above backup. I've had to use this on a few occasions to rebuild my 'working system' after certain sid dist-upgrades were performed. I'm happy to report this doesn't happen as much now as in the recent past. My question was since this backup is on an ext3 formatted USB stick, if my hard drive was reformatted with ext4, could the backup [image] on the USB stick be 'copied' back to the new ext4 partition, without problems, as it were. thanks, -- CK -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100710231834.397b4...@mondo
Re: installing a second hard disk?
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 05:06, Zachary Uram net...@gmail.com wrote: I just got a 500gb Hitachi hard drive (this is my second drive, my first drive is /dev/sda). What is the best way to install this in Linux? Is it better to run ext3 or ext4? Zach http://www.fidei.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktil_1iifv226smws3qm7un2o0uekvlxgic6vo...@mail.gmail.com Whenever possible use ext4, actually ext4 got merged into the kernel during 2.6.29 times. It depends upon what debian version you are using. Lenny standard debian kernel is 2.6.26 which does not have support for ext4, but if you are using backports then you get 2.6.32 kernel. Also ext4 works with squeeze/sid. You do not need to install anything. Just connect it, then from root do fdisk -l you should see your new hard drive.
Re: installing a second hard disk?
Just plug it in and format it. If it's not supposed to be bootable and you only plan to format one block device on it (a filesystem, a physical volume, an encrypted volume, ...), you don't have to partition it (I usually don't) although some software *might* get confused by disks without labels. If you're going for one, consider GUID instead of DOS partition tables (look for GPT). There's a hell lot of confusion about ext4, so I wouldn't trust much recommendations unfortunately, you might want to dig the facts for yourself. You can find many other ext3 vs ext4 threads here and there if you really want to read those debates, just make sure to double check the facts and see if the discussion is recent enough. I personally use ext4 without hesitation, for what it's worth. If your question was more related to the layout of your setup, feel free to give us more information about what you want exactly. If you wanted some pointers about the tools you should use to accomplish this, please say so. -t -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c37ee37.5020...@stammed.net
