Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Thu, 2003-03-27 at 23:53, Karsten M. Self wrote: on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 04:31:15PM -0600, Nathan E Norman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:12:14PM +, Karsten M. Self wrote: [snip] Ah, the old whack the drive case with a screwdriver handle trick :-) How brutal! No, I pull the drives, give them a bunch of rapid half-spins about the major platter axis, and try powering them up. Once they spin up, I let them run for a few minutes, then put them back on their rails in the case. Usually they'll spin up again immediately after. Gak! That could get a bit time-consuming if your SAN has a dozen TB. (With 75GB disks, that would be 160 spindles...) -- ++ | Ron Johnson, Jr.mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | Jefferson, LA USA http://members.cox.net/ron.l.johnson | || | After listening to many White House, Pentagon CENTCOM brief- | | ings in both Gulf Wars, it is my firm belief that most senior | | correspondents either have serious agendas that don't get | | shaken by facts, or are dumb as dog feces. | ++ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Sun, Mar 30, 2003 at 03:05:57AM -0600, Ron Johnson wrote: On Thu, 2003-03-27 at 23:53, Karsten M. Self wrote: on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 04:31:15PM -0600, Nathan E Norman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:12:14PM +, Karsten M. Self wrote: [snip] Ah, the old whack the drive case with a screwdriver handle trick :-) How brutal! No, I pull the drives, give them a bunch of rapid half-spins about the major platter axis, and try powering them up. Once they spin up, I let them run for a few minutes, then put them back on their rails in the case. Usually they'll spin up again immediately after. Gak! That could get a bit time-consuming if your SAN has a dozen TB. (With 75GB disks, that would be 160 spindles...) You could use the agitator drive out of a top-loading washing machine to build a gizmo that makes the entire chassis do the twist (just leave plenty of slack in the cables). Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Karsten M. Self [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 04:31:15PM -0600, Nathan E Norman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: If you really want to hear stiction horror stories, go talk to people who have administrated (big) mainframes and experienced a power outage. /me hands Nathan a beer. You've got long arms dude. You could hand me a beer, but I don't have any stiction stories. I was in Nathan's neighborhood this summer (http://www.newt.com/wohler/ustour2002/) but alas, no beer with Nathan (but with lots of his closest friends). I think we've slipped off-topic; I suggest we take this offline at the BBC tomorrow (Friday) night at 6. -- Bill Wohler [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD Maintainer of comp.mail.mh FAQ and MH-E. Vote Libertarian! If you're passed on the right, you're in the wrong lane. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Mar 27, 2003 at 10:08:17AM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: if it's a 24/7 box it's probably better to run it headless and administer it from a web interface. i.e. webmin etc Why go with the insecurity of webforms when SSH exists and gives you a real environment? - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae [EMAIL PROTECTED] : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gs9PJ5vLSqVpK2kRAn7UAJ4+tnqUPRQV5b2jXNnZHV6ClBnYTACg3+1F AC/dkWMq6OgsQPtYnxareqw= =4SEO -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Thu, Mar 27, 2003 at 02:15:43AM -0800, Paul Johnson wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Mar 27, 2003 at 10:08:17AM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: if it's a 24/7 box it's probably better to run it headless and administer it from a web interface. i.e. webmin etc Why go with the insecurity of webforms when SSH exists and gives you a real environment? Or a serial connection. kent -- To know the truth is to distort the Universe. Alfred N. Whitehead (adaptation) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 04:31:15PM -0600, Nathan E Norman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:12:14PM +, Karsten M. Self wrote: ... Additional problem: stiction on old drives. I've got a set of SCSIs from 1998 which can't be shut down for more than a few minutes without requiring some manual encouragement to spin up again. Ah, the old whack the drive case with a screwdriver handle trick :-) How brutal! No, I pull the drives, give them a bunch of rapid half-spins about the major platter axis, and try powering them up. Once they spin up, I let them run for a few minutes, then put them back on their rails in the case. Usually they'll spin up again immediately after. If you really want to hear stiction horror stories, go talk to people who have administrated (big) mainframes and experienced a power outage. /me hands Nathan a beer. Do tell ;-) Peace. -- Karsten M. Self [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://kmself.home.netcom.com/ What Part of Gestalt don't you understand? Moderator, Free Software Law Discussion mailing list: http://lists.alt.org/mailman/listinfo/fsl-discuss/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:26:31 +0100, Koen Dejonghe wrote: I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. No problem. Are there options in linux where I can turn of the hard disks after x minutes? I don't know, but *this* will damage your hard disks. -- Vincent Lefèvre [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Web: http://www.vinc17.org/ - 100% validated (X)HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc. Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
El mié, 26 de 03 de 2003 a las 12:26, Koen Dejonghe escribió: Hi, I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. Are there options in linux where I can turn of the hard disks after x minutes? We have now 2 PC (one Pentium 120 and one Pentium MMX) working 24/7 without problems. Time ago we had a Pentium 100 as our web, file server and used as workstation working for 5 years without important problems. Only had to change CPU fan. It had a SCSI disk with an adaptec AHA-1540, but it was a normal PC. Cheers, Koen Dejonghe. _ -- --+--- José Manuel Pérez Fuente | Universidad del País Vasco Punto Neutro EuskoNIX (UPV/EHU) | E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Plaza Elhuyar, 1 (Edif. Barriola) | Tel.: +34 943 018 281 20018 San Sebastián (SPAIN) | Fax.: +34 943 219 306 --+--- signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:26:31PM +0100, Koen Dejonghe wrote: I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. Yes. Scheduled maintenance tasks by default run during the night, if you don't leave your machine on 24/7, I would recommend installing anacron. Are there options in linux where I can turn of the hard disks after x minutes? man hdparm. Use hdparm with care if you value your data and your hard disk. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae [EMAIL PROTECTED] : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gZv4J5vLSqVpK2kRAoJPAJ9a/+6f5pi/F6RfJ9SsYizLmLpYhgCcC5+R 2cfyEHSHDOlhxANfqHG7s/I= =Qq/F -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Koen writes: Are there options in linux where I can turn of the hard disks after x minutes? There are two methods that I am aware of: 1) By tweaking the hard disk drive itself via the utility hdparm(8) 2) Using the utility noflushd(8) Elizabeth -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Koen Dejonghe [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. If anything, it's harder on the machine to turn it on and off rather than just leave it running. Tread very carefully with hdparm. Instead, I'd suggest looking at apmd to reduce power usage. I used that with success with my laptop. If you have a desktop with a newer motherboard, your motherboard might support the features too. -- Bill Wohler [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD Maintainer of comp.mail.mh FAQ and MH-E. Vote Libertarian! If you're passed on the right, you're in the wrong lane. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Best advice I could give you if you're trying to minimize downtime is to try and double up on everything. If you get another HDD the same size as the one you've got, you can run it in a RAID-1 configuration (check the howtos) and get at least two sticks of RAM in there (if one fails, the others keep working, so I'm told). Steve Sherlock -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:12:14PM +, Karsten M. Self wrote: on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:03:39AM -0800, Bill Wohler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Koen Dejonghe [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. If anything, it's harder on the machine to turn it on and off rather than just leave it running. Additional problem: stiction on old drives. I've got a set of SCSIs from 1998 which can't be shut down for more than a few minutes without requiring some manual encouragement to spin up again. Ah, the old whack the drive case with a screwdriver handle trick :-) If you really want to hear stiction horror stories, go talk to people who have administrated (big) mainframes and experienced a power outage. -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Just because an idea originated at redhat does not mean it is evil. -- Sean 'Shaleh' Perry -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Karsten M. Self wrote: [...] IBM (late 1990s?) suggests that: - Turning off your monitor (CRT) will provide power savings and spare your phosphors. Given that a monitor is likely the most long-lived component of your system, this is significant. Yes. But don't forget, if you're on UPS and have a power failure, switching on monitor to shutdown computer can simply crash the system if UPS is on last period. So probably you will prefer to use power management of monitor (sleep mode). -- : __ __ __ __ __ __ [EMAIL PROTECTED] : /_// __ // __ //_// __ // / phone.: +48 32 285 4554 : / / / /_/ // /_/ / / / / /_/ // / fax: +48 32 285 4554 : /_/ /_//_/ /_/ /_/ /_//_/ mobile..: +48 602 284 546 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: leaving computer on 24/7
if it's a 24/7 box it's probably better to run it headless and administer it from a web interface. i.e. webmin etc cheers Lindsay | -Original Message- | From: daniel huhardeaux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 09:32 | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Subject: Re: leaving computer on 24/7 | | | Karsten M. Self wrote: | | [...] IBM (late 1990s?) suggests that: | | - Turning off your monitor (CRT) will provide power savings and spare | your phosphors. Given that a monitor is likely the most long-lived | component of your system, this is significant. | | | Yes. But don't forget, if you're on UPS and have a power failure, | switching on monitor to shutdown computer can simply crash the system if | UPS is on last period. So probably you will prefer to use power | management of monitor (sleep mode). | | -- | : __ __ __ __ __ __ [EMAIL PROTECTED] | : /_// __ // __ //_// __ // / phone.: +48 32 285 4554 | : / / / /_/ // /_/ / / / / /_/ // / fax: +48 32 285 4554 | : /_/ /_//_/ /_/ /_/ /_//_/ mobile..: +48 602 284 546 | | | | -- | To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | --- | Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. | Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). | Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 | --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:03:48PM -, Stephen Sherlock wrote: ... and get at least two sticks of RAM in there (if one fails, the others keep working, so I'm told). Yeah, they do, but your machine still crashes when it tries to use the faulty RAM. It doesn't do a sort of RAID across memory modules. That is theoretically possible, but I don't think the Linux kernel supports it - certainly can't see any config options for it. Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
