Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[Don Armstrong]

On Sun, 29 Apr 2018, Martin Hanson wrote:
> I have posted this bug report
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=896806 that has been
> rejected by the maintainer.
>
> Maybe I have misunderstood the issue completely, but I do have some
> experience with legal issues and AFAIK, there IS a problem here.

There isn't an issue here. I am aware of no US case law suggesting that
using an advertised public interface can cause third parties to be bound
by a license agreement that they have not been informed of or
accepted.[1]

Furthermore, this is not a DFSG violation, even if there was concern
about third parties being bound to license agreements.

If there is a concern here, it's a privacy concern. Google's public
statements regarding maintaining privacy and the need for working DNS to
do most things on the internet should counterbalance this privacy
concern for most users.

1: If you know of some, please provide specific citations.
-- 
Don Armstrong  https://www.donarmstrong.com

Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure.
We get very little wisdom from success, you know.
 -- William Saroyan _My Heart's in the Highlands_

Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[Brian]

On Sun 29 Apr 2018 at 18:53:08 +0200, Martin Hanson wrote:

> I am posting this to the mailing list in order to get "more eyes on
> the issue".

The right kind of eyes, of course.

-- 
Brian. 

Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[Reco]

Hi.

On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 06:53:08PM +0200, Martin Hanson wrote:
> I have posted this bug report 
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=896806 that has been 
> rejected by the maintainer.
> 
> Maybe I have misunderstood the issue completely, but I do have some 
> experience with legal issues and AFAIK, there IS a problem here.
> 
> I am posting this to the mailing list in order to get "more eyes on the 
> issue".

Seems to be fixed by upstream commit 72cdb3e783174dcf9223a49f03e3b0e2ca95ddb8, 
which roughly corresponds to v236.

Current systemd tree lacks any mention of Google DNS and NTP servers, as far as 
I can tell.

Reco

Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[Brian]

On Sun 29 Apr 2018 at 18:53:08 +0200, Martin Hanson wrote:

> I have posted this bug report
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=896806 that has been
> rejected by the maintainer.
> 
> Maybe I have misunderstood the issue completely, but I do have some
> experience with legal issues and AFAIK, there IS a problem here.
> 
> I am posting this to the mailing list in order to get "more eyes on
> the issue".

Our Leader wrote this mail today. A different context, of course, but
food for thought. [1]

 > Not speaking to this case specifically, but in general I would try
 > to convince maintainers with some combination of irrefutable
 > argument and well-tested patches (combined with a friendly demeanour
 > and a rhethorical flourish) rather than try and summon the "mob" from
 > debian-devel if I didn't immediately get my way.  ;)

Substitute debian-user for debian-devel.

[1] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2018/04/msg00699.html

-- 

Brian.

Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[Brad Rogers]

On Sun, 29 Apr 2018 18:53:08 +0200
Martin Hanson  wrote:

Hello Martin,

>I am posting this to the mailing list in order to get "more eyes on the
>issue".

I'd suggest posting it on Debian legal, as well as (in preference to?) 
here.  I suspect that there are far more ppl there capable of analysing
the issue.

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   "The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent"
This disease is catching
Into The Valley - Skids


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Re: systemd-resolved violates The Debian Free Software Guidelines

[tomas]

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On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 06:53:08PM +0200, Martin Hanson wrote:
> I have posted this bug report 
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=896806 that has been 
> rejected by the maintainer.
> 
> Maybe I have misunderstood the issue completely, but I do have some 
> experience with legal issues and AFAIK, there IS a problem here.
> 
> I am posting this to the mailing list in order to get "more eyes on the 
> issue".

In a nutshell the above bug report states that systemd-resolved
has hard-coded fallbacks for Google DNS servers (8.8.8.{4,8})
(and BTW for Google NTP servers too). Those fallbacks will AFAIU
only become active if no other alternative exists, but then the
user might be led to (tacitly) accept terms of service (s)he doesn't
know about and possibly doesn't approve of.

Martin, you might have a point there.

Could Debian just replace those by something non-functional (e.g.
localhost)? DNS wouldn't be there if not configured, a behaviour
which has been OK before arrival of systemd-resolved?

Cheers
- -- tomás
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