Re: outdated ssl cert

2010-01-18 Thread Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.
On Saturday 16 January 2010 10:56:29 Vadkan Jozsef wrote:
> ..I mean does an outdated self-signed certificate give the same security
> as a normal cert?

It depends on what you mean by security.  You do get the same level of end-to-
end encryption -- so attackers attempting to read the connection after it has 
been established will be stymied.

However, you do not get the same level of authenticity verification.  So, you 
don't know the validity of the end point you are negotiating with.  This 
allows an attacker to attack the connection setup -- a man-in-the-middle 
attack.  A successful man-in-the-middle attack results in total compromise of 
the data transferred; the attacker can both record and manipulate the data 
exchanged in either direction or both.

Depending on the user agent (browser), once the user has accepted a self-
signed certificate for a certain domain the user might not be prompted about 
the same certificate (based on secure hash) for the same domain.  In this 
case, if the first connection was NOT intercepted, future connections would 
NOT be subject to man-in-the-middle attack.  Also, if the first connection WAS 
intercepted and future connections were NOT, the user would be prompted 
because the certificate presented would have changed (based on secure hash).

Finally, if users or user agents can be transmitted the expected hash of a 
self-signed certificate presented by a certain domain using a secure path 
prior to establishing the connection, the self-signed certificate is as good 
as one with a cert chain ending in a CA.  The CA infrastructure is established 
as a means of confirming the hash <-> domain mapping without every site having 
to communicate their hash to every potential user.
-- 
Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.   ,= ,-_-. =.
b...@iguanasuicide.net  ((_/)o o(\_))
ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-'
http://iguanasuicide.net/\_/


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Re: outdated ssl cert

2010-01-16 Thread Eduardo M KALINOWSKI

On 01/16/2010 02:56 PM, Vadkan Jozsef wrote:

what does a self-signed outdated ssl cert worth? [https]

could it be tricked [https] in a way, that the end user will not
recognize? [e.g. he already accepted the cert one time, and the browser
would warn her, if it been ""attacked""?]

..I mean does an outdated self-signed certificate give the same security
as a normal cert?

   


If by "outdated" you mean "expired", that is, it's not valid anymore, 
then any browser (or other software that uses certificates) should warn 
the user, regardless of whether it's self-signed or not.



--
  An empty cab drove up and Sarah Bernhardt got out. -Arthur Baer,
  American comic and columnist

Eduardo M KALINOWSKI
edua...@kalinowski.com.br


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outdated ssl cert

2010-01-16 Thread Vadkan Jozsef
what does a self-signed outdated ssl cert worth? [https]

could it be tricked [https] in a way, that the end user will not
recognize? [e.g. he already accepted the cert one time, and the browser
would warn her, if it been ""attacked""?]

..I mean does an outdated self-signed certificate give the same security
as a normal cert?

thanks


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