Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Hi, On Sun, 16 Mar 2008, Holger Levsen wrote: On Saturday 15 March 2008 22:40, Marc Haber wrote: Additionally, it may be a good idea to have regular IRC conferences where the DPL is available to answer questions. A good time would probably be a week after bits have been posted so that the questions that the bits have raised can be answered. But that's only an idea, not a must, as long as the regular bits actually appear. I actually like the idea. IRC conference might sound a bit too much, rather something like IRC feedback time or such... As a regular IRC user, I have nothing against trying that. It would make a good excuse to create #debian-meeting (similar to #ubuntu-meeting with facilities to create IRC logs, a topic with a schedule and a bot to translate hours in any local timezone). But I don't see IRC as a very effective mass-communication mechanism [1] and as such, it would probably be more useful to discuss the status of various projects and inform people interested to help so that they are up-to-date and can help effectively. Cheers, [1] Because not everybody uses IRC (Moritz for example doesn't use it often), because it's difficult to refer to an IRC discussion and because the ideas discussed live are not always well thought out. -- Raphaël Hertzog Le best-seller français mis à jour pour Debian Etch : http://www.ouaza.com/livre/admin-debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Hi, On Saturday 15 March 2008 22:40, Marc Haber wrote: Additionally, it may be a good idea to have regular IRC conferences where the DPL is available to answer questions. A good time would probably be a week after bits have been posted so that the questions that the bits have raised can be answered. But that's only an idea, not a must, as long as the regular bits actually appear. I actually like the idea. IRC conference might sound a bit too much, rather something like IRC feedback time or such... I think by making it less formal, its more likely the DPL wants to do such a thing :-) OTOH, anyone can reply via mail to the bits... hm. regards, Holger pgpkFkTRmwpdK.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 10:26:00PM +, Steve McIntyre wrote: Do you have any suggestions yourself of things that you'd like a DPL to do to raise visibility? As long as the regular bits are actually posted, I'm fine with it. Additionally, it may be a good idea to have regular IRC conferences where the DPL is available to answer questions. A good time would probably be a week after bits have been posted so that the questions that the bits have raised can be answered. But that's only an idea, not a must, as long as the regular bits actually appear. Greetings Marc -- - Marc Haber | I don't trust Computers. They | Mailadresse im Header Mannheim, Germany | lose things.Winona Ryder | Fon: *49 621 72739834 Nordisch by Nature | How to make an American Quilt | Fax: *49 3221 2323190 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 07:44:46PM +0100, Marc Haber wrote: Dear Candidates, Hi Marc, in the last few years, it has unfortunately become kind of custom that the DPL kind of vanishes from the Earth after the wave of inauguration and taking over powers has ebbed. Anthony has been kind of an exception (since he was quite visible with the dunc-tank experiment), and I really haven't seen much from Sam during his term. What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? At the very least, I plan on posting regular bits mails, summarising both what I've been up to and important happenings in the project that I believe deserve more attention. I also expect that I will end up representing Debian in other ways (e.g. at events like conferences). Do you have any suggestions yourself of things that you'd like a DPL to do to raise visibility? -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK.[EMAIL PROTECTED] Who needs computer imagery when you've got Brian Blessed? signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Anthony Towns [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 07:44:46PM +0100, Marc Haber wrote: and I really haven't seen much from Sam during his term. For example, there's been: [6 dda posts and a blog category] which is pretty comparable to either my own Steve's communication individually during my term, if you exclude the dunc-tank stuff. I'm assuming we're not looking for a DPL to create a hugely controversial project just for the visibility it gives the DPL. [...] Erm, announcements != communication. I think the dunc-tank was quite an example of the difference between the two, with various inputs seemingly ignored. Now, I'm hardly the most involved with the DPL, but I've had substantive replies from Sam the two or three times I've contacted him, compared with responses (seldom replies) followed by non-response from previous DPLs. (It wasn't a language thing AFAICT, as lazily I used English with all three.) So my limited experience of Sam has been that he's improved communications. I'd be interested to know if other DDs felt the same, as well as any comments from those who've interacted with these candidates. Are any of the DDs planning to automate announcements at all, similar to Aigars Mahinov's idea on lines 428/429 of last year's debate? Oh and is Marc Haber wanting to cash in this pledge:- # SamHocevar If I fail to properly report, I shall offer full reimbursement for your annual Debian subscription and a right to spank me at the next DebConf. [22:48] ? Thanks, -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only: see http://people.debian.org/~mjr/ Please follow http://www.uk.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Dear Candidates, in the last few years, it has unfortunately become kind of custom that the DPL kind of vanishes from the Earth after the wave of inauguration and taking over powers has ebbed. Anthony has been kind of an exception (since he was quite visible with the dunc-tank experiment), and I really haven't seen much from Sam during his term. What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? I will communicate and post regular summaries of my work has frequently been part of past DPL's platforms and has never been reached in a satisfactory way, which makes me want to make sure that _this_ DPL has thought about this. Greetings Marc -- - Marc Haber | I don't trust Computers. They | Mailadresse im Header Mannheim, Germany | lose things.Winona Ryder | Fon: *49 621 72739834 Nordisch by Nature | How to make an American Quilt | Fax: *49 3221 2323190 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Marc Haber wrote: What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? You seem to value visibility more than achievements... I'm not so sure I would qualify a lack of visibility as a real failure, though I obviously value achievements more :-) I think it's very important that candidate DPLs have the intention to do better in communication, though I think many people underestimate the time and efforts it takes to communicate... Note also that visibility can also be very negatively or not at all related to being a DPL... I would rather rephrase the question to: What is your plan to ensure ongoing communication about your (progress towards) DPL achievements? Cheers Luk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Hi, On Mon, 10 Mar 2008, Marc Haber wrote: What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Continue doing lots of stuff for Debian. And since the DPL role will be handled by 3 persons, we should hopefully be more visible as a whole too. If one member is busy with real life during some time, with some luck the 2 others are not. Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? I expect to use the wiki to aggregate progressively stuff that I want to send out to the community, exactly like I do with http://wiki.debian.org/DeveloperNews It works quite well. On Mon, 10 Mar 2008, Luk Claes wrote: I would rather rephrase the question to: What is your plan to ensure ongoing communication about your (progress towards) DPL achievements? Hopefully I'll use the wiki to follow the status/progress of DPL-initiated projects as well. However for some projects there are large parts of private stuff that can't be reported publicly. But the timing could be reported: - 20080401: Mailed foo to get his input on X - 20080408: No answer from foo, try pinging on IRC I don't want to commit to this kind of ChangeLog style communication (it has a cost!) but it's worth a try at least and we can then see if it's sustainable. I do use such reporting in my professionnal work already (even if its purpose is project management/time accounting more than communication). Cheers, -- Raphaël Hertzog Le best-seller français mis à jour pour Debian Etch : http://www.ouaza.com/livre/admin-debian/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
Marc Haber [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, Regular reports to the project are planned, not only about DPL activities, but about anything that is going on in the project and wasn't announced on debian-(devel-)announce. and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? Asking for help when it is needed, delegating work to people who are experts on a specific field, report problems (even lack of time) when they become a blocker. Marc -- BOFH #399: We are a 100% Microsoft Shop. pgpSa2j3hbTJg.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: All Candidates: Do you plan to be prominently visible during your term?
On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 07:44:46PM +0100, Marc Haber wrote: in the last few years, it has unfortunately become kind of custom that the DPL kind of vanishes from the Earth after the wave of inauguration and taking over powers has ebbed. Anthony has been kind of an exception (since he was quite visible with the dunc-tank experiment), I'd like to think I was visible otherwise too: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/04/msg00015.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/05/msg9.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/08/msg7.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/08/msg00015.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/10/msg1.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/10/msg2.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/02/msg5.html Steve likewise: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/05/msg3.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/05/msg00012.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/07/msg0.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/09/msg9.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/02/msg00019.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/04/msg9.html There was a bunch of stuff not in dda too (some interviews, a couple of talks, involvement on issues on other debian lists). The lack of posts in 2006/11, 2006/12, 2007/01, 2007/03 are pretty directly attributable to trying not to make the dunc-tank controversy even worse, and Steve's and my direct involvement in the etch release itself. OTOH, the platform on which Sam was elected explicitly says in regard to my term: Also, looking for the word communication in [Anthony's] platform does not make it look like he acknowledges or plans to address the communication problems that have been raised throughout his term. My conclusion from all that is that communication is _really_ hard to do well and it's even harder if you want to be seen to do well. We're in the habit of expecting DPLs to not communicate, to the point where even if they do it doesn't really count. and I really haven't seen much from Sam during his term. For example, there's been: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/04/msg00011.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/07/msg3.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/08/msg1.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/11/msg0.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/11/msg5.html http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2008/02/msg9.html http://sam.zoy.org/blog/?cat=dpl which is pretty comparable to either my own Steve's communication individually during my term, if you exclude the dunc-tank stuff. I'm assuming we're not looking for a DPL to create a hugely controversial project just for the visibility it gives the DPL. What is your plan to ensure your ongoing visibility during your term? Do you plan to post regular bits from the DPL, and which measures will you implement to prevent a failure similiar to the failures of your predecessors? Personally, I'd consider mine and Steve's communications to have been a success; and if you're not going to count delegate communications (like the 2IC, or the other Bits From...), then _I_ think Sam's communication has been exactly what we should expect from the DPL. So, to the candidates (and maybe Sam): how do you define as success for communication, and how will we judge whether you've achieved that when your term concludes? How does that criteria compare against the performance of previous DPLs? Cheers, aj signature.asc Description: Digital signature
