Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
Hello Sophie & all, Le 22/12/2014 15:13, Sophie a écrit : so are you volunteering to write that manual and document the templates or are you only ranting on those who are currently trying and are doing something? of course not: it's up to the template maker to document his/her work. What I want to emphasize is the *need* for documentation and that asking for a *no text* template is in many occurences plain wrong. IOW, providing a template without documenting it is stupid. HTH, -- Jean-Francois Nifenecker - Bordeaux -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
Hi Charles, I guess you took my words way too personnally. Or I couldn't explain myself clearly enough. So let me rephrase it. Le 22/12/2014 15:27, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit : Yes, but as you know in French, "criticism is easy, action is more difficult". So I would have guessed you would have come up with an actual proposal. Or maybe it was just a warning that you think that it might lead to problems ? What I wanted to emphasize it that the cultural difference is very important from a country to another. IOW, what is OK for a Swissman won't do for an Italian and so on. Just /translating/ won't do the trick because the visual aspect of the template is culturally defined and *can't* be translated: it has to be thoroughly rethought which is a whole job by itself. Any other word is pure verbiage. -- Jean-Francois Nifenecker - Bordeaux -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
Hello Milan, Le 22/12/2014 15:27, Milan Bouchet-Valat a écrit : I don't understand what's so country-specific in a template. AFAIK MS Office does not ship different templates in the US and in Europe. Cannot templates be made mostly country-neutral if contributors are asked to avoid adding too nationally-rooted details? OMG! Did you *actually* have a look a MS templates? They CAN'T (sorry for shouting) be used as they are in any other context than an american one. Just ask any graphical spacialist. -- Jean-Francois Nifenecker - Bordeaux -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
Ah, OK. This may need some careful work by localization teams. not only. There are aesthetical and cultural points that you seem to ignore. *I* for one, wouldn't use *any* foreign template for a French use. Not because they are not translated, but because they don't fit the French culture. Translation is a side job for this matter. -- Jean-Francois Nifenecker - Bordeaux -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
Le mardi 23 décembre 2014 à 20:12 +0100, Jean-Francois Nifenecker a écrit : > Hello Milan, > > Le 22/12/2014 15:27, Milan Bouchet-Valat a écrit : > > I don't understand what's so country-specific in a template. AFAIK MS > > Office does not ship different templates in the US and in Europe. Cannot > > templates be made mostly country-neutral if contributors are asked to > > avoid adding too nationally-rooted details? > > OMG! Did you *actually* have a look a MS templates? They CAN'T (sorry > for shouting) be used as they are in any other context than an american > one. Just ask any graphical spacialist. I'm not very familiar with them except with PowerPoint templates, but I find them much better than what LibreOffice currently offers -- which is nothing for Writer. Anyway people are not forced to use them, they can also choose the one that is closest to their "national culture", and some visual diversity can be retained for default templates. (I really doubt preferences in that domain are so strongly rooted in national contexts.) The alternative is to provide nothing, with amounts to 1) leaving people create their own half-polished documents on their own, or 2) download random and often unsatisfying templates from the Web. But you don't seem to be very open to debate this issue, so let's not argue further. Regards -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] New templates contest
On 22/12/14 14:27, Milan Bouchet-Valat wrote: > I don't understand what's so country-specific in a template. Depends upon what the template is to be used for. The United States uses its own system of weights and measurements, even though it was one of the first countries to pass legislation legalizing, and encouraging its usage. Colour schemes tend to be country specific: * Orange, White, and Blue used to be the dominant background colours in South Africa. * Green & Red were the dominant background colours in Libya; * Red, Blue, and White are the dominant background colours in the United States; Usages can be country specific. By way of example: * Accounting Templates that meet all legal requirements for Germany, fail to meet all of the legal requirements for the United States, and has things that are unnecessary for US Legal compliance. They may, but probably don't meet the legal requirements of France, or the United Kingdom; * Fuel usage. Depending upon where one lives, this is measured in: # Miles per gallon; # Kilometres per litre; # Litres per 100 kilometres; # Something else; * Human Resource Management: Things that are legal to ask in one country, are illegal to ask in other countries, and mandatory questions in still other countries; * Font style: I always get this mixed up. I _think_ it is Sans Serif for the United States, and Serif for Europe. But it might be the other way around. > Cannot templates be made mostly country-neutral if contributors are asked to avoid adding too nationally-rooted details? "Nationally-rooted" implies that the designer consciously includes these country-specific factors. As a general rule, designers are not aware of these country-specific things, unless they have extensive experience with designing things for different cultures. Regardless, for some things, country / national root can be avoided, but for other things, they are pretty much mandated, by either legal, or cultural requirements. jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
