[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
This has nothing to do with software-center itself. The only way you are going to make this better is to get the upstreams to do the requisite packaging work and make the packages available as updates through software-center by publishing them via the web site for managing one's applications published to Ubuntu. It is easier to upgrade individual applications on those proprietary OSes, because the developers are taking the time to publish those packages through the Apple store, or Google Play, or similar means. The developers who put together the Ubuntu release every 6 months understand the frustrations with this, but bug reports are not a channel for dumping complaints. If there are specific applications that fall into this category of not being up to date enough on the version of Ubuntu you are using, as shipped in that version of Ubuntu, then you should ask the developers of those applications to help by doing the packaging work to get the app published through the Software Center; in the same way that they are doing that work to publish their apps in the Apple store. ** Package changed: software-center (Ubuntu) = ubuntu ** Changed in: ubuntu Status: In Progress = Opinion ** Changed in: ubuntu Assignee: Matthew Paul Thomas (mpt) = (unassigned) -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in Ubuntu: Opinion Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Changed in: software-center (Ubuntu) Assignee: Matthew Paul Thomas (mpt) = Nick Thiemann (thiemann-nick) -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: In Progress Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * For software in the Ubuntu archive: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui * For software not in the Ubuntu
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Changed in: software-center (Ubuntu) Assignee: Nick Thiemann (thiemann-nick) = Matthew Paul Thomas (mpt) -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: In Progress Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * For software in the Ubuntu archive: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui * For software not in the Ubuntu
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Description changed: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian-based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: - * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) - * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the Ubuntu archive) + * For software in the Ubuntu archive: + https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui + * For software not in the Ubuntu archive: + https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppDevUploadProcess + https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ This bug will be marked as Fixed when at least 50% of Ubuntu applications can be updated to a new
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Tags removed: ca-escalated -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: In Progress Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the Ubuntu archive) This bug will be marked as Fixed when
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Tags added: ca-escalate ** Tags removed: ca-escalate ** Tags added: ca-escalated -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: In Progress Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Changed in: software-center (Ubuntu) Status: Fix Committed = In Progress -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: In Progress Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Changed in: software-center (Ubuntu) Status: In Progress = Fix Committed -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to software-center in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045 Title: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu: Fix Committed Bug description: It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian- based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS
** Description changed: - It's hard to imagine that this could be true, but it is easier to - upgrade to the newest stable versions of popular free and open source - software (referred to from here on as FOSS) in proprietary operating - systems, than it is to do so on Ubuntu. + It is easier to upgrade to the newest stable versions of most + applications -- even open source applications -- on a proprietary + operating system than it is on Ubuntu. Two examples: 1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released. What happens: * http://www.libreoffice.org/download/ offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. 2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.) What happens: * http://hedgewars.org/download.html links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted Playdeb channel. * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks. * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way. Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install. What should happen: * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version. WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN: A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to upgrade software easily and safely: -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as, or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern, mainstream operating system. -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources. -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian-based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for (at least) commonly used software. Latest progress: * https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui (for software in the Ubuntu archive) - * http://voices.canonical.com/isd/?p=167 (for software not in the Ubuntu archive) + * https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/ (for software not in the Ubuntu archive) + + This bug will be
