[Desktop-packages] [Bug 822872] Re: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key
In my opinion there should be added an option to enable and as a replacement for just for the keys where it is necesary. On a german keyboard, combination of , and + could be used to make ~ because it is not used for an other function. Even if it is also not comfortable to use and , many Windows users are used to it. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to xkeyboard-config in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/822872 Title: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key Status in “xkeyboard-config” package in Ubuntu: Invalid Bug description: This is a _major ergonomics issue_ (not to mention Windows-Ubuntu compatibility and newbie-friendliness). I shall explain why hereafter. One of the principles for speedy and ergonomic touch typing is that one hand should generally not need to press a key and its modifier at the same time. You can see this in the fact that keyboards have both a right and a left Shift/Ctrl/Alt/Win/Fn… key. So, for example, a capital A should not be typed by pressing LeftShift+A, but rather RightShift+A (using both hands, that is): this, to my knowledge, is what professional typists do, to reduce the burden on a single hand and distribute it on both. For this reason, the Windows OS treats LeftCtrl+LeftAlt as a third level chooser equivalent to RightAlt+Key. The advantage of this may not be apparent to someone using a standard US keyboard, but many European keyboards, in fact, make extensive use of third level keys to input characters as vital as @, [ or ]. The Ubuntu keyboard preferences let one specify other third level choosers, but: 1) such a feature should be included by default in the Ubuntu OS, because it is vital for anybody extensively typing (one of the main uses of a computer!) through an extended keyboard layout (such as European layouts) and because anybody switching from Windows would expect to find it (just as one would expect LeftAlt+F4 to close a window, which it does in both OS); 2) none of the left-hand alternatives offered in the preferences is satisfactory (specifically: the left Win key is now used by Unity for the dash and launcher and is less comfortable to reach than LeftCtrl+LeftAlt; LeftAlt cannot be used for this, as its shortcuts [such as LeftAlt+F4] would then stop working; CapsLock already has a major function that cannot be traded off; “<” is a common character, and as such probably very important to some users). I hope I have managed to set forth why it is so important to make LeftCtrl+LeftAlt equivalent to RightAlt (AltGr) . If one still doesn’t think so, I kindly ask that one try to press RightAlt and Y at the same time with one’s right hand only and keep the unused fingers still on the home row (one of the rules of good touch typing). Isn’t it then evident how hard and bad for one’s hand that was? Now, what if (as it is) one had a vital character there, an often needed character: one would end up either injuring one’s right hand or switching back to Windows! I have taken care to write so much, because a previous (2006) report of this problem (Bug #34126: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source /xkeyboard-config/+bug/34126) turned into a flame for being misunderstood and underestimated. I have found many instances of such disregarded/misunderstood help requests on the net (mainly by Europeans) regarding this problem, none of them solved, which contributes to prove this bug’s importance. Here are a couple of links: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-general-1/how-to-make-control_l-alt_l-act-like-alt_r-alt-gr-449531/ http://serverfault.com/questions/264681/xfree86-keyboard-make-ctrl-alt-work-like-altgr http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=853249 http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/15212/ Help, please. Thank you very much. To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/822872/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages Post to : desktop-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 822872] Re: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key
The Ctrl+Alt equivalence to AltGr is a Windows workaround to the fact that some keyboards didn't have an AltGr (such keyboards are still sometimes found in the US) to enable people with such keyboards to attempt to write languages like Spanish and English (okay, there are other ways of writing words like façade and naïve, but Windows didn't support those either, and indeed the Ctrl+Alt technique still leaves many characters out - so copy-paste from charmap or autocorrect bindings are still needed on Windows to write many languages). This is a reasonable workaround in that system for the following reasons: 1. They were stuck for anything else to try, because there simply wasn't an AltGr key on those keyboards. 2. They don't have many uses for other Ctrl+Alt bindings, and those they do use (Ctrl+Alt+Delete of course) don't have AltGr bindings on most keyboard layouts. It remains a reasonable workaround for that system, because it's a fixed workaround for that system - this leads to item 2 remaining true, and people don't create Ctrl+Alt bindings. Strictly, that last point isn't true; people sometimes do program bindings to Ctrl+Alt combos that have no built-in binding in their locale, and then have internationalisation problems, but the workaround dug a hole that it's now next to impossible to dig out of because so many Windows users are used to it. This is not a reasonable workaround on other systems. 1. It isn't needed for most keyboards (though admittedly such keyboards do still exist). 2. There are a large number of cases where Ctrl+Alt is bound to something. Ctrl+Alt L will default to locking the screen, Ctrl+Alt T will launch a terminal window; clearly we cannot have those happening when someone tries to type a letter, or vice versa. Windows did something decades ago that seemed like a good idea at the time, and arguably was, and has to live with the negative consequences because Windows users are used to it. *nix did something different decades ago that seemed like a good idea at the time to people who did have AltGr keys, was largely invisible to most who didn't (who mostly make little use of the characters it allows anyway), and has to live with the fact that it confuses Windows users because *nix users are used to it. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to xkeyboard-config in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/822872 Title: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key Status in “xkeyboard-config” package in Ubuntu: Invalid Bug description: This is a _major ergonomics issue_ (not to mention Windows-Ubuntu compatibility and newbie-friendliness). I shall explain why hereafter. One of the principles for speedy and ergonomic touch typing is that one hand should generally not need to press a key and its modifier at the same time. You can see this in the fact that keyboards have both a right and a left Shift/Ctrl/Alt/Win/Fn… key. So, for example, a capital A should not be typed by pressing LeftShift+A, but rather RightShift+A (using both hands, that is): this, to my knowledge, is what professional typists do, to reduce the burden on a single hand and distribute it on both. For this reason, the Windows OS treats LeftCtrl+LeftAlt as a third level chooser equivalent to RightAlt+Key. The advantage of this may not be apparent to someone using a standard US keyboard, but many European keyboards, in fact, make extensive use of third level keys to input characters as vital as @, [ or ]. The Ubuntu keyboard preferences let one specify other third level choosers, but: 1) such a feature should be included by default in the Ubuntu OS, because it is vital for anybody extensively typing (one of the main uses of a computer!) through an extended keyboard layout (such as European layouts) and because anybody switching from Windows would expect to find it (just as one would expect LeftAlt+F4 to close a window, which it does in both OS); 2) none of the left-hand alternatives offered in the preferences is satisfactory (specifically: the left Win key is now used by Unity for the dash and launcher and is less comfortable to reach than LeftCtrl+LeftAlt; LeftAlt cannot be used for this, as its shortcuts [such as LeftAlt+F4] would then stop working; CapsLock already has a major function that cannot be traded off; “<” is a common character, and as such probably very important to some users). I hope I have managed to set forth why it is so important to make LeftCtrl+LeftAlt equivalent to RightAlt (AltGr) . If one still doesn’t think so, I kindly ask that one try to press RightAlt and Y at the same time with one’s right hand only and keep the unused fingers still on the home row (one of the rules of good touch typing). Isn’t it then evident how hard and bad for one’s hand that was? Now, what if (as it is) one had a vital character there, an often needed character: one woul
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 822872] Re: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key
** Changed in: xkeyboard-config (Ubuntu) Status: Confirmed => Invalid -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to xkeyboard-config in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/822872 Title: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key Status in “xkeyboard-config” package in Ubuntu: Invalid Bug description: This is a _major ergonomics issue_ (not to mention Windows-Ubuntu compatibility and newbie-friendliness). I shall explain why hereafter. One of the principles for speedy and ergonomic touch typing is that one hand should generally not need to press a key and its modifier at the same time. You can see this in the fact that keyboards have both a right and a left Shift/Ctrl/Alt/Win/Fn… key. So, for example, a capital A should not be typed by pressing LeftShift+A, but rather RightShift+A (using both hands, that is): this, to my knowledge, is what professional typists do, to reduce the burden on a single hand and distribute it on both. For this reason, the Windows OS treats LeftCtrl+LeftAlt as a third level chooser equivalent to RightAlt+Key. The advantage of this may not be apparent to someone using a standard US keyboard, but many European keyboards, in fact, make extensive use of third level keys to input characters as vital as @, [ or ]. The Ubuntu keyboard preferences let one specify other third level choosers, but: 1) such a feature should be included by default in the Ubuntu OS, because it is vital for anybody extensively typing (one of the main uses of a computer!) through an extended keyboard layout (such as European layouts) and because anybody switching from Windows would expect to find it (just as one would expect LeftAlt+F4 to close a window, which it does in both OS); 2) none of the left-hand alternatives offered in the preferences is satisfactory (specifically: the left Win key is now used by Unity for the dash and launcher and is less comfortable to reach than LeftCtrl+LeftAlt; LeftAlt cannot be used for this, as its shortcuts [such as LeftAlt+F4] would then stop working; CapsLock already has a major function that cannot be traded off; “<” is a common character, and as such probably very important to some users). I hope I have managed to set forth why it is so important to make LeftCtrl+LeftAlt equivalent to RightAlt (AltGr) . If one still doesn’t think so, I kindly ask that one try to press RightAlt and Y at the same time with one’s right hand only and keep the unused fingers still on the home row (one of the rules of good touch typing). Isn’t it then evident how hard and bad for one’s hand that was? Now, what if (as it is) one had a vital character there, an often needed character: one would end up either injuring one’s right hand or switching back to Windows! I have taken care to write so much, because a previous (2006) report of this problem (Bug #34126: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source /xkeyboard-config/+bug/34126) turned into a flame for being misunderstood and underestimated. I have found many instances of such disregarded/misunderstood help requests on the net (mainly by Europeans) regarding this problem, none of them solved, which contributes to prove this bug’s importance. Here are a couple of links: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-general-1/how-to-make-control_l-alt_l-act-like-alt_r-alt-gr-449531/ http://serverfault.com/questions/264681/xfree86-keyboard-make-ctrl-alt-work-like-altgr http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=853249 http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/15212/ Help, please. Thank you very much. To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/822872/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages Post to : desktop-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Desktop-packages] [Bug 822872] Re: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key
I have just found this bug, and I disagree completely. Ctrl+Alt+T, for example, should not be the same as AltGr+T. The two have different meanings and functions. For example, on Ubuntu, Ctrl+Alt+T opens the Terminal; whereas AltGr+T creates a character: ŧ This bug should be marked as invalid. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Desktop Packages, which is subscribed to xkeyboard-config in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/822872 Title: LeftCtrl+LeftAlt+Key should be equivalent to RightAlt+Key Status in “xkeyboard-config” package in Ubuntu: Confirmed Bug description: This is a _major ergonomics issue_ (not to mention Windows-Ubuntu compatibility and newbie-friendliness). I shall explain why hereafter. One of the principles for speedy and ergonomic touch typing is that one hand should generally not need to press a key and its modifier at the same time. You can see this in the fact that keyboards have both a right and a left Shift/Ctrl/Alt/Win/Fn… key. So, for example, a capital A should not be typed by pressing LeftShift+A, but rather RightShift+A (using both hands, that is): this, to my knowledge, is what professional typists do, to reduce the burden on a single hand and distribute it on both. For this reason, the Windows OS treats LeftCtrl+LeftAlt as a third level chooser equivalent to RightAlt+Key. The advantage of this may not be apparent to someone using a standard US keyboard, but many European keyboards, in fact, make extensive use of third level keys to input characters as vital as @, [ or ]. The Ubuntu keyboard preferences let one specify other third level choosers, but: 1) such a feature should be included by default in the Ubuntu OS, because it is vital for anybody extensively typing (one of the main uses of a computer!) through an extended keyboard layout (such as European layouts) and because anybody switching from Windows would expect to find it (just as one would expect LeftAlt+F4 to close a window, which it does in both OS); 2) none of the left-hand alternatives offered in the preferences is satisfactory (specifically: the left Win key is now used by Unity for the dash and launcher and is less comfortable to reach than LeftCtrl+LeftAlt; LeftAlt cannot be used for this, as its shortcuts [such as LeftAlt+F4] would then stop working; CapsLock already has a major function that cannot be traded off; “<” is a common character, and as such probably very important to some users). I hope I have managed to set forth why it is so important to make LeftCtrl+LeftAlt equivalent to RightAlt (AltGr) . If one still doesn’t think so, I kindly ask that one try to press RightAlt and Y at the same time with one’s right hand only and keep the unused fingers still on the home row (one of the rules of good touch typing). Isn’t it then evident how hard and bad for one’s hand that was? Now, what if (as it is) one had a vital character there, an often needed character: one would end up either injuring one’s right hand or switching back to Windows! I have taken care to write so much, because a previous (2006) report of this problem (Bug #34126: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source /xkeyboard-config/+bug/34126) turned into a flame for being misunderstood and underestimated. I have found many instances of such disregarded/misunderstood help requests on the net (mainly by Europeans) regarding this problem, none of them solved, which contributes to prove this bug’s importance. Here are a couple of links: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-general-1/how-to-make-control_l-alt_l-act-like-alt_r-alt-gr-449531/ http://serverfault.com/questions/264681/xfree86-keyboard-make-ctrl-alt-work-like-altgr http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=853249 http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/15212/ Help, please. Thank you very much. To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/822872/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages Post to : desktop-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~desktop-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
