Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Alexey Lunacharsky]

Thanks for proposals

2010/1/18 Archie Cobbs 

> On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 10:25 PM, Alexey Lunacharsky  >wrote:
>
> > Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the
> top
> > of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
> > installation in the system on user level,
> > through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS
> on
> > Unix systems.
> >
>
> These are not exact answers but...
>
>   1. The JPackage  system attempts to do a
>   limited version of this. It's not nearly as flexible as ivy.
>   2. Ivy does have a command line interface; you could probably get what
>   you want by writing a bunch of scripts around it.
>
>  -Archie
>
> --
> Archie L. Cobbs
>



-- 
Best regards, Alexey Lunacharsky (http://alun.katlex.com/en)

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Alexey Lunacharsky]

That are a good news.
I like groovy for its agility and found on par with gant very
good solution for crossplatform scripting

2010/1/18 Paul King 

>
> Yes, startup speed can be a factor though I am not sure it is as bad
> as 10 times slower these days. Some potentially useful info for you:
>
> * if you grab 1.7.1 snapshot or 1.8 snapshot from one of the CI servers
> then it avoids one of the big startup delays due to DGM
> class loading by loading that info in one go as serialised data.
>
> * targeted for 1.8 but not yet finished is some lazy loading logic
> which should speed that up even further
>
> * also targeted for 1.8 is a modularisation of the libraries so you
> could package up a streamlined Groovy system that would load quicker
> if you didn't need all of the library functionality
>
> * there is a still experimental static groovy project which performs
> on par with Java which might allow you to gain some further speed.
>
> So, while Groovy isn't the only game in town these days in terms of
> innovative languages on the JVM, it should only improve in the areas
> that are of concern to you.
>
>
> Cheers, Paul.
>
> Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:
>
>> Thanks you a lot.
>>
>> I've heard about grape. But didn't know it is almost what I need.
>> It is very good point to start... But
>> The biggest problem with groovy it is very slow at startup.
>> The pure java solution such Ivy or thin wrapped with ant scripting can be
>> about 10 times faster for
>> using from command shell.
>>
>> 2010/1/18 Paul King 
>>
>>  Paul King wrote:
>>>
>>>  Not 100% the same as what you suggest but Groovy's Grape system does
 some
 of what you are asking for. Normally Grapes are used from within
 scripts,
 e.g.:

 @Grab('org.apache.ant:ant:1.7.1')
 import org.apache.tools.ant.Main
 Main.main(['-version'] as String[])

 but it also has a commandline interface. Excerpt from doco shown below:

 
 Command Line Tools

 grape install   []

 This installs the specified groovy module or maven artifact. If a
 version
 is specified that specific version will be installed, otherwise the most
 recent version will be used (as if '*' we passed in).

  Even though the doco says maven artifact, it is Ivy under the covers
>>> so it is strictly speaking an Ivy artifact which can be and often is
>>> a maven artifact.
>>>
>>> Paul.
>>>
>>>
>>>  grape list
>>>
 Lists locally installed modules (with their full maven name in the case
 of
 groovy modules) and versions.

 grape resolve (  )+

 This returns the file locations of the jars representing the artifcats
 for
 the specified module(s) and the respective transitive dependencies.
 

 This may not be what you want but might be a useful starting point.


 Cheers, Paul.



 Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:

  Hello!
>
> Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the
> top
> of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and
> source
> installation in the system on user level,
> through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS
> on
> Unix systems.
>
> For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which
> can
> be used in unit tests):
>
> $ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0
>
> by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
> resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
> available in ivy cache and it can be run by:
>
> $ jpt run apache-ant
>
> This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
> review, and than
> run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation
> XML
> file)
>
> $ jpt wrap apache-ant ant
>
> Creates system dependent warapper script for running application
> through
> 'jpt run'.
>
> $ ant
>
> will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant
>
> $ jpt unwrap ant
>
> now wrapper no more exist
>
> $ ant
>
> no such command
>
> $ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0
>
> deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain
>
> And so on.
>
> In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
> development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
> So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.
>
> This is the system of my dream!
>
> So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already
> exist
> or
> why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?
>
>
>  -
 To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
 For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apac

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Archie Cobbs]

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 10:25 PM, Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:

> Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the top
> of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
> installation in the system on user level,
> through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS on
> Unix systems.
>

These are not exact answers but...

   1. The JPackage  system attempts to do a
   limited version of this. It's not nearly as flexible as ivy.
   2. Ivy does have a command line interface; you could probably get what
   you want by writing a bunch of scripts around it.

 -Archie

-- 
Archie L. Cobbs

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Paul King]

Yes, startup speed can be a factor though I am not sure it is as bad
as 10 times slower these days. Some potentially useful info for you:

* if you grab 1.7.1 snapshot or 1.8 snapshot from one of the 
CI servers then it avoids one of the big startup delays due to DGM

class loading by loading that info in one go as serialised data.

* targeted for 1.8 but not yet finished is some lazy loading logic
which should speed that up even further

* also targeted for 1.8 is a modularisation of the libraries so you
could package up a streamlined Groovy system that would load quicker
if you didn't need all of the library functionality

* there is a still experimental static groovy project which performs
on par with Java which might allow you to gain some further speed.

So, while Groovy isn't the only game in town these days in terms of
innovative languages on the JVM, it should only improve in the areas
that are of concern to you.

Cheers, Paul.

Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:

Thanks you a lot.

I've heard about grape. But didn't know it is almost what I need.
It is very good point to start... But
The biggest problem with groovy it is very slow at startup.
The pure java solution such Ivy or thin wrapped with ant scripting can be
about 10 times faster for
using from command shell.

2010/1/18 Paul King 


Paul King wrote:


Not 100% the same as what you suggest but Groovy's Grape system does some
of what you are asking for. Normally Grapes are used from within scripts,
e.g.:

@Grab('org.apache.ant:ant:1.7.1')
import org.apache.tools.ant.Main
Main.main(['-version'] as String[])

but it also has a commandline interface. Excerpt from doco shown below:


Command Line Tools

grape install   []

This installs the specified groovy module or maven artifact. If a version
is specified that specific version will be installed, otherwise the most
recent version will be used (as if '*' we passed in).


Even though the doco says maven artifact, it is Ivy under the covers
so it is strictly speaking an Ivy artifact which can be and often is
a maven artifact.

Paul.


 grape list

Lists locally installed modules (with their full maven name in the case of
groovy modules) and versions.

grape resolve (  )+

This returns the file locations of the jars representing the artifcats for
the specified module(s) and the respective transitive dependencies.


This may not be what you want but might be a useful starting point.


Cheers, Paul.



Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:


Hello!

Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the
top
of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
installation in the system on user level,
through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS
on
Unix systems.

For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which
can
be used in unit tests):

$ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0

by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
available in ivy cache and it can be run by:

$ jpt run apache-ant

This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
review, and than
run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation XML
file)

$ jpt wrap apache-ant ant

Creates system dependent warapper script for running application through
'jpt run'.

$ ant

will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant

$ jpt unwrap ant

now wrapper no more exist

$ ant

no such command

$ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0

deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain

And so on.

In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.

This is the system of my dream!

So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already
exist
or
why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?



-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org




-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org








-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Alexey Lunacharsky]

Thanks you a lot.

I've heard about grape. But didn't know it is almost what I need.
It is very good point to start... But
The biggest problem with groovy it is very slow at startup.
The pure java solution such Ivy or thin wrapped with ant scripting can be
about 10 times faster for
using from command shell.

2010/1/18 Paul King 

> Paul King wrote:
>
>>
>> Not 100% the same as what you suggest but Groovy's Grape system does some
>> of what you are asking for. Normally Grapes are used from within scripts,
>> e.g.:
>>
>> @Grab('org.apache.ant:ant:1.7.1')
>> import org.apache.tools.ant.Main
>> Main.main(['-version'] as String[])
>>
>> but it also has a commandline interface. Excerpt from doco shown below:
>>
>> 
>> Command Line Tools
>>
>> grape install   []
>>
>> This installs the specified groovy module or maven artifact. If a version
>> is specified that specific version will be installed, otherwise the most
>> recent version will be used (as if '*' we passed in).
>>
>
> Even though the doco says maven artifact, it is Ivy under the covers
> so it is strictly speaking an Ivy artifact which can be and often is
> a maven artifact.
>
> Paul.
>
>
>  grape list
>>
>> Lists locally installed modules (with their full maven name in the case of
>> groovy modules) and versions.
>>
>> grape resolve (  )+
>>
>> This returns the file locations of the jars representing the artifcats for
>> the specified module(s) and the respective transitive dependencies.
>> 
>>
>> This may not be what you want but might be a useful starting point.
>>
>>
>> Cheers, Paul.
>>
>>
>>
>> Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:
>>
>>> Hello!
>>>
>>> Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the
>>> top
>>> of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
>>> installation in the system on user level,
>>> through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS
>>> on
>>> Unix systems.
>>>
>>> For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which
>>> can
>>> be used in unit tests):
>>>
>>> $ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0
>>>
>>> by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
>>> resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
>>> available in ivy cache and it can be run by:
>>>
>>> $ jpt run apache-ant
>>>
>>> This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
>>> review, and than
>>> run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation XML
>>> file)
>>>
>>> $ jpt wrap apache-ant ant
>>>
>>> Creates system dependent warapper script for running application through
>>> 'jpt run'.
>>>
>>> $ ant
>>>
>>> will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant
>>>
>>> $ jpt unwrap ant
>>>
>>> now wrapper no more exist
>>>
>>> $ ant
>>>
>>> no such command
>>>
>>> $ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0
>>>
>>> deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain
>>>
>>> And so on.
>>>
>>> In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
>>> development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
>>> So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.
>>>
>>> This is the system of my dream!
>>>
>>> So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already
>>> exist
>>> or
>>> why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org
>>
>>
>>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org
>
>


-- 
Best regards, Alexey Lunacharsky (http://alun.katlex.com/en)

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Paul King]

Paul King wrote:


Not 100% the same as what you suggest but Groovy's Grape system does some
of what you are asking for. Normally Grapes are used from within scripts,
e.g.:

@Grab('org.apache.ant:ant:1.7.1')
import org.apache.tools.ant.Main
Main.main(['-version'] as String[])

but it also has a commandline interface. Excerpt from doco shown below:


Command Line Tools

grape install   []

This installs the specified groovy module or maven artifact. If a 
version is specified that specific version will be installed, otherwise 
the most recent version will be used (as if '*' we passed in).


Even though the doco says maven artifact, it is Ivy under the covers
so it is strictly speaking an Ivy artifact which can be and often is
a maven artifact.

Paul.


grape list

Lists locally installed modules (with their full maven name in the case 
of groovy modules) and versions.


grape resolve (  )+

This returns the file locations of the jars representing the artifcats 
for the specified module(s) and the respective transitive dependencies.



This may not be what you want but might be a useful starting point.


Cheers, Paul.



Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:

Hello!

Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the 
top

of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
installation in the system on user level,
through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through 
FHS on

Unix systems.

For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which 
can

be used in unit tests):

$ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0

by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
available in ivy cache and it can be run by:

$ jpt run apache-ant

This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
review, and than
run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation XML
file)

$ jpt wrap apache-ant ant

Creates system dependent warapper script for running application through
'jpt run'.

$ ant

will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant

$ jpt unwrap ant

now wrapper no more exist

$ ant

no such command

$ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0

deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain

And so on.

In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.

This is the system of my dream!

So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already 
exist

or
why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?




-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org





-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org

Re: Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Paul King]

Not 100% the same as what you suggest but Groovy's Grape system does some
of what you are asking for. Normally Grapes are used from within scripts,
e.g.:

@Grab('org.apache.ant:ant:1.7.1')
import org.apache.tools.ant.Main
Main.main(['-version'] as String[])

but it also has a commandline interface. Excerpt from doco shown below:


Command Line Tools

grape install   []

This installs the specified groovy module or maven artifact. If a version is 
specified that specific version will be installed, otherwise the most recent 
version will be used (as if '*' we passed in).

grape list

Lists locally installed modules (with their full maven name in the case of 
groovy modules) and versions.

grape resolve (  )+

This returns the file locations of the jars representing the artifcats for the 
specified module(s) and the respective transitive dependencies.


This may not be what you want but might be a useful starting point.


Cheers, Paul.



Alexey Lunacharsky wrote:

Hello!

Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the top
of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
installation in the system on user level,
through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS on
Unix systems.

For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which can
be used in unit tests):

$ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0

by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
available in ivy cache and it can be run by:

$ jpt run apache-ant

This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
review, and than
run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation XML
file)

$ jpt wrap apache-ant ant

Creates system dependent warapper script for running application through
'jpt run'.

$ ant

will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant

$ jpt unwrap ant

now wrapper no more exist

$ ant

no such command

$ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0

deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain

And so on.

In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.

This is the system of my dream!

So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already exist
or
why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?




-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@ant.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@ant.apache.org

Java Packaging Tool - one for development and using. The best wish of many developers

[Alexey Lunacharsky]

Hello!

Does anybody think about imlementation a "Debian APT"-like tool on the top
of an Ivy dependency manager. It can manage all java binaries and source
installation in the system on user level,
through home directory located workspace, or on admin level through FHS on
Unix systems.

For the give what I mean I write some high level usage examples, which can
be used in unit tests):

$ jpt install apache-ant-1.7.0

by this command ant and all of its dependencies (jars and maybe other
resources such jpt run configurations) are get downloaded and become
available in ivy cache and it can be run by:

$ jpt run apache-ant

This execution will find and organize classpath through ivy depencies
review, and than
run spesified class (which is specified through jpt run configuation XML
file)

$ jpt wrap apache-ant ant

Creates system dependent warapper script for running application through
'jpt run'.

$ ant

will now execute $ jpt run apache-ant

$ jpt unwrap ant

now wrapper no more exist

$ ant

no such command

$ jpt uninstall apache-ant-1.7.0

deletes a softfare binaries if there is no dependencies remain

And so on.

In future it can manage also the libraries source code. And be used for
development environment buildings based on ant or gant scripts.
So many software can be integrated on the top of spring framework etc.

This is the system of my dream!

So I will be very glad if you tell me, if such the system have already exist
or
why to not imlement such as a thin wrapper across the Ivy?

-- 
Best regards, Alexey Lunacharsky (http://alun.katlex.com/en)