Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Hi, On 19 Jan 2007, at 10:41, hepabolu wrote: http://people.apache.org/~hepabolu/all.html The 'all' page contains all designs at once for easy comparison, the top line contains links to four identical mockups with one of the mastheads. #3 for me ... blocks blocks blocks! :-) (And excellent work Thien, by the way.) Thanks, Andrew. -- Andrew Savory, Managing Director, Luminas Limited Tel: +44 (0)870 741 6658 Fax: +44 (0)700 598 1135 Web: http://www.luminas.co.uk/ Sourcesense: http://www.sourcesense.com/
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On 1/19/07, hepabolu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ...Thien has kindly provided some awesome designs for the masthead. Thanks Thien!... Thanks very much, my favorite is #4 (something in it makes me happy ;-) followed by #3. -Bertrand
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Friday 19 January 2007 20:35, hepabolu wrote: > Let me first say, I think all are fabulously done and show off your skills. And thanks for putting them into context. I reviewed this stuff earlier, without the full page, and I must say that the perception changed a bit. My preference also lies in #2 or #3. Cheers Niclas
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Thien wrote: 3. Trying to describe the lightness and agility of cocoon with randomly positioned square that can be taken out or repositioned without affecting each otherok, maybe not too obvious :D your intention was quite obvious to me here .. This design is my favourite mainly because the block metaphor will become increasingly apparent in next Cocoon versions. Perhaps you could visualize the tiles differently, putting them more apart and somehow interconnect them with something, lines or *cough* tubes of some sort ? Or perhaps try to give the tiles a more 3d-ish look so they become more block alike ? 4. Cocoon and nature, probably not the most appropriate association, but I wish this tells something about the framework's being easy and friendly to use. well it immediately made me think of spring and consequently Spring, not a bad association at all IMO. Thanks for the great work! Jorg
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 10:39 +0800, Thien wrote: > No worries, it actually helps a lot :D I will improve the design > further once a final one has been picked. (#2 or #3 so far.) My favorite is #2. Cheers, Alfred.
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Thanks everyone for the comment so far. #3 My first impression: the kitchen tiles of Mum's kitchen. ;-) *Oops, now you remind me, though I didn't create this with that in mind :D But I think it looks simple but unique at the same time.* #4 Although I like the lightness and the colors, I immediately got an association with Windows XP's default theme, also dubbed here "TeleTubby theme". If you could change the link to "nature" (after all a 'cocoon' is a natural thing) to something different this one would really stand out. *+1. There probably isn't enough details going into the drawing.* I've been critiquing this kind of stuff for too many years, so don't take me too seriously, it seems to be a habit to nit pick this kinds of stuff to death... *No worries, it actually helps a lot :D I will improve the design further once a final one has been picked. (#2 or #3 so far.)* The #2 design incorporating that text sort of elevates this phrase to the level of a slogan, which I don't like. OTOH, I think /something/ needs to go there :-).. the design now would, to my eye, look incomplete without it! Some kind of text, but what? *Yeah, I can change it.* Cheers, Thien
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Jan 19, 2007, at 11:14 AM, Vadim Gritsenko wrote: Joerg Heinicke wrote: On 19.01.2007 12:01, Jeroen Reijn wrote: wow great designs Thien! I really like 2-4. #3 has a nice touch with the 'blocks', but somehow #4 was the first one that appealed to me. It's kind of playfull and dreamy. I really like it. It's a bit too dreamy IMO. :-) I prefer #2 and #3. Same here. Great job! +1 +1 Vadim Same here, I would say #2 is my favorite, followed by #3. Really nice work Thien, thanks a lot! Helma, your comments cracked me up... because #4 struck me as too cartoony, and I was also going to describe it as "like WinXP meets Teletubbies" :-) :-) My only quibble about #2 I have always disliked that phrase "web glue for your web application development needs". Maybe I just don't have positive associations with glue; anyway, when I work with Cocoon it does not particularly feel like I am working with something gluey. The qualities of glueyness are not ones that one associates with a framework. "Glue" IMHO doesn't harmonize well with the idea of "contracts", which Cocoon pushes a little bit (maybe not quite as much now as in the past, but IMHO that's a good thing). The #2 design incorporating that text sort of elevates this phrase to the level of a slogan, which I don't like. OTOH, I think something needs to go there :-).. the design now would, to my eye, look incomplete without it! Some kind of text, but what? anyway, great stuff, thx again! :-) —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Joerg Heinicke wrote: On 19.01.2007 12:01, Jeroen Reijn wrote: wow great designs Thien! I really like 2-4. #3 has a nice touch with the 'blocks', but somehow #4 was the first one that appealed to me. It's kind of playfull and dreamy. I really like it. It's a bit too dreamy IMO. :-) I prefer #2 and #3. Same here. Great job! +1 +1 Vadim
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On 1/19/07, Thien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Thanks Helma, A little explanation to the visuals. 1. Typical masthead design, the dark area has the word "cocoon" drawn in a Lego-like look . I like this one a lot but the "cocoon" is hard to see on a color matched monitor with the contrast and brightness correctly set, I think you need to bump up the contrast. 2. Tried a few other colors, find that green match quite well with the logo's blue, here's a simple and nice layout, with a bit of Web2.0 touch The green seems a bit too bright for me, I like the bottom blue area. The bottom blue with the tag line might make a very good combination if combined with the top bar from number 1. 3. Trying to describe the lightness and agility of cocoon with randomly positioned square that can be taken out or repositioned without affecting each otherok, maybe not too obvious :D Sort of neat, a little bit too pastel for me, maybe try it with slightly bolder colors? Where do you envision the "Search" going on this one? 4. Cocoon and nature, probably not the most appropriate association, but I wish this tells something about the framework's being easy and friendly to use. Interesting, a little heavy on the left hand side, maybe the Cocoon logo could move, or the hills and cluds could be more evenly distributed? It seems to take up maybe just a bit too much vertical real estate. Some modifications need to be made to the left navigation to match the new masthead, once it has been chosen. I've been critiquing this kind of stuff for too many years, so don't take me too seriously, it seems to be a habit to nit pick this kinds of stuff to death... Overall I've got to say that you've done some really good work heref, I'm impressed. -- Peter Hunsberger
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Great designs! My first choice is #3 which looks really good and capture the soul of Cocoon well. #4 is really cool as well. /Daniel Thien skrev: Thanks Helma, A little explanation to the visuals. 1. Typical masthead design, the dark area has the word "cocoon" drawn in a Lego-like look . 2. Tried a few other colors, find that green match quite well with the logo's blue, here's a simple and nice layout, with a bit of Web2.0 touch 3. Trying to describe the lightness and agility of cocoon with randomly positioned square that can be taken out or repositioned without affecting each otherok, maybe not too obvious :D 4. Cocoon and nature, probably not the most appropriate association, but I wish this tells something about the framework's being easy and friendly to use. Some modifications need to be made to the left navigation to match the new masthead, once it has been chosen. Thien
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Thien said the following on 19/1/07 11:56: A little explanation to the visuals. Let me first say, I think all are fabulously done and show off your skills. 1. Typical masthead design, the dark area has the word "cocoon" drawn in a Lego-like look. To me this one felt like: "the old one but done better", nothing new under the sun. 2. Tried a few other colors, find that green match quite well with the logo's blue, here's a simple and nice layout, with a bit of Web2.0 touch I like this one, although there's something to be said for #4. 3. Trying to describe the lightness and agility of cocoon with randomly positioned square that can be taken out or repositioned without affecting each otherok, maybe not too obvious :D My first impression: the kitchen tiles of Mum's kitchen. ;-) 4. Cocoon and nature, probably not the most appropriate association, but I wish this tells something about the framework's being easy and friendly to use. Although I like the lightness and the colors, I immediately got an association with Windows XP's default theme, also dubbed here "TeleTubby theme". If you could change the link to "nature" (after all a 'cocoon' is a natural thing) to something different this one would really stand out. Some modifications need to be made to the left navigation to match the new masthead, once it has been chosen. Sure, the individual pages are there just to give a better impression of how the masthead looks on an actual page. I hope I was not too harsh. ;-) Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On 19.01.2007 12:01, Jeroen Reijn wrote: wow great designs Thien! I really like 2-4. #3 has a nice touch with the 'blocks', but somehow #4 was the first one that appealed to me. It's kind of playfull and dreamy. I really like it. It's a bit too dreamy IMO. :-) I prefer #2 and #3. Great job! +1 Jörg PS: I'll be off for the next 5 weeks starting on Monday. I'll be on vacation in New Zealand - that's were I get dreamy :-)
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Jeroen Reijn wrote:
#3 and #4 would be my pick :-)
same here!
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer & (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Hi Helma, wow great designs Thien! I really like 2-4. #3 has a nice touch with the 'blocks', but somehow #4 was the first one that appealed to me. It's kind of playfull and dreamy. I really like it. #3 and #4 would be my pick :-) Great job! Regards, Jeroen Reijn hepabolu wrote: Hi everyone, Thien has kindly provided some awesome designs for the masthead. Thanks Thien! I've put them up at: http://people.apache.org/~hepabolu/all.html The 'all' page contains all designs at once for easy comparison, the top line contains links to four identical mockups with one of the mastheads. I'll share my opinions later to avoid immediate bias. Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Thanks Helma, A little explanation to the visuals. 1. Typical masthead design, the dark area has the word "cocoon" drawn in a Lego-like look . 2. Tried a few other colors, find that green match quite well with the logo's blue, here's a simple and nice layout, with a bit of Web2.0 touch 3. Trying to describe the lightness and agility of cocoon with randomly positioned square that can be taken out or repositioned without affecting each otherok, maybe not too obvious :D 4. Cocoon and nature, probably not the most appropriate association, but I wish this tells something about the framework's being easy and friendly to use. Some modifications need to be made to the left navigation to match the new masthead, once it has been chosen. Thien
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Hi everyone, Thien has kindly provided some awesome designs for the masthead. Thanks Thien! I've put them up at: http://people.apache.org/~hepabolu/all.html The 'all' page contains all designs at once for easy comparison, the top line contains links to four identical mockups with one of the mastheads. I'll share my opinions later to avoid immediate bias. Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Yeap, I am working on the masthead, I will show you a few options soon. Thanks. Thien hepabolu wrote: I'm just curious to know how things are progressing. Any news? Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
I'm just curious to know how things are progressing. Any news? Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Jorg Heymans said the following on 7/12/06 09:06: Niclas Hedhman wrote: 3. PNG scaling == big problems. 4. Thien normally works with Illustrator, and handing over SVG instead of rendered PNG is not a big deal. I see your point. Well as long as Thien is happy in the end that's fine then :) Thien: how good is Illustrators SVG output nowadays? I had to process its output once and remember having to manually clean up each file to stop Batik from barfing during rendering. The way it embedded fonts, used custom elements and namespaces etc seemed to completely confuse the renderer. This was 4 years ago though, so i'm just curious to see if batik and illustrator have evolved since then ;) From my very limited experience (creating simple things in Inkscape and continu in Illustrator because of easier to use features): - text blocks created in Inkscape give problems in Illustrator (CS2): they end up as gray blocks and Illustrator complains about fonts if they happen to be unavailable. I haven't yet found a solution other than going back to Inkscape, change the fonts and redo the steps in Illustrator. - there is something different between positions and scaling between Inkscape and Illustrator: a drawing that is centered on the page in Inkscape is suddenly half way off the page in Illustrator. There are issues, but I'm not sure if it's a major problem. We might do a reverse check: Illustrator SVG to Inkscape and see what happens. Just my €0.02 Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Niclas Hedhman wrote: 3. PNG scaling == big problems. 4. Thien normally works with Illustrator, and handing over SVG instead of rendered PNG is not a big deal. I see your point. Well as long as Thien is happy in the end that's fine then :) Thien: how good is Illustrators SVG output nowadays? I had to process its output once and remember having to manually clean up each file to stop Batik from barfing during rendering. The way it embedded fonts, used custom elements and namespaces etc seemed to completely confuse the renderer. This was 4 years ago though, so i'm just curious to see if batik and illustrator have evolved since then ;) Cheers, Jorg
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 06:34, Jorg Heymans wrote: > I've never heard about Cocoon requiring 100% SVG for its gfx. It sure > sounds cool but IMO we should not dictate this - we'll most likely > render the SVG to JPG or PNG anyway for the website. Not talking about "requiring", but 1. SVG -> PNG == no problems. 2. SVG scaling == no problems. 3. PNG scaling == big problems. 4. Thien normally works with Illustrator, and handing over SVG instead of rendered PNG is not a big deal. Cheers Niclas
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Jorg Heymans wrote:
Mark Lundquist wrote:
On Nov 30, 2006, at 9:27 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote:
Thien: I would also like to point out that Cocoon is all about XML
processing,
and not sure if you know that SVG is XML, and the prefered (one might
even
say required) source format of any work produced.
Niclas, you're the boss of course :-)... but I for one would be
disappointed if any toolchain constraints were to compromise the
primary goal of ultimate graphical coolness :-).
I've never heard about Cocoon requiring 100% SVG for its gfx. It sure
sounds cool but IMO we should not dictate this - we'll most likely
render the SVG to JPG or PNG anyway for the website.
forgot to answer, but I agree with Jorg.
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer & (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
___
Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Mark Lundquist wrote: On Nov 30, 2006, at 9:27 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: Thien: I would also like to point out that Cocoon is all about XML processing, and not sure if you know that SVG is XML, and the prefered (one might even say required) source format of any work produced. Niclas, you're the boss of course :-)... but I for one would be disappointed if any toolchain constraints were to compromise the primary goal of ultimate graphical coolness :-). I've never heard about Cocoon requiring 100% SVG for its gfx. It sure sounds cool but IMO we should not dictate this - we'll most likely render the SVG to JPG or PNG anyway for the website. Jorg
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Nov 30, 2006, at 9:27 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: Thien: I would also like to point out that Cocoon is all about XML processing, and not sure if you know that SVG is XML, and the prefered (one might even say required) source format of any work produced. Niclas, you're the boss of course :-)... but I for one would be disappointed if any toolchain constraints were to compromise the primary goal of ultimate graphical coolness :-). cheers, —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Nov 30, 2006, at 2:42 PM, hepabolu wrote: the time for work at Cocoon. He knows html and css a little bit, but it is not his I'll take on this part of the "job". I just the other day stumbled on the dev-docs area at the Cocoon, so now I know what the latest Forrest skin looks like. I think that except for the masthead area, what we have there is farther along the right direction than the 2.1 project site. So, it looks like the coolness gap we have to cross is not as bad. We still couldn't exactly just cram the new masthead image onto the top and call it good :-)... but I'll bet once we have a cool masthead look across the top, it won't take much trouble to finish the rest of the reskinning. —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Vadim Gritsenko said the following on 1/12/06 01:18: hepabolu wrote: All: I know it is quite early for this, but in order to review the galleries of samples that Thien will be delivering ;-) we need a space to put them. I don't mind to help out in getting them uploaded, but it would be nice if it's not a "public" place such as the wiki or Daisy on the zone, people.apache.org/~yourname or zones is perfectly fine for this, imho. Right, I think for now my space will do. If we have reached some agreement we could put it out in the "publicity" of the zones. Thien: Once you have something to show, just email me and I'll put it up on my space. Bye, Helma
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Friday 01 December 2006 11:23, Thien wrote: > Hello!! > > Cool, I will give this a try. Hope to show you some artworks soon. The > information I have so far is good enough but if you have any ideas or > suggestions, please do tell me. Thien: I would also like to point out that Cocoon is all about XML processing, and not sure if you know that SVG is XML, and the prefered (one might even say required) source format of any work produced. Cheers Niclas
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
hepabolu wrote: > > All: I know it is quite early for this, but in order to review the > galleries of samples that Thien will be delivering ;-) we need a space > to put them. I don't mind to help out in getting them uploaded, but it > would be nice if it's not a "public" place such as the wiki or Daisy on > the zone, to avoid endless discussions (which we will probably have > anyway) with a huge group of people. Each committer has an un-official space: http://www.apache.org/dev/new-committers-guide.html#public_html By the way, here are some resources that might help with the contruction of new banners and logos: http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/PoweredByCocoon http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/cocoon/trunk/commons/misc http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/forrest/trunk/tools/logos ... there are apache feather SVG in there. The real name is "Apache Cocoon". -David
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Hello!! Cool, I will give this a try. Hope to show you some artworks soon. The information I have so far is good enough but if you have any ideas or suggestions, please do tell me. Cheers! Thien Mark Lundquist wrote: On Nov 30, 2006, at 2:42 PM, hepabolu wrote: This sounds like a good idea, although I do think that the masthead/banner has a large part in the definition of the "look and feel" of the site. In other words the final choice for the banner is also a global decision for the look and feel of the rest of the page. Absolutely true, the artwork drives the rest of the styling... this is in fact the reason I suggested this approach. Once we've settled on a cool design concept, as represented by one of the masthead comps, then (a) we have some momentum, and (b) someone with the right skills + motivations + access could complete a re-skinning of the site essentially as an elaboration of a "theme" suggested by the new masthead artwork. For instance, I have enough design sensibility to do something like that, but I am not a graphic artist by any stretch of the imagination, so I could never produce the artwork; I think this community must have a lot of people like me in this regard, so if we can get the "creative" aspect done by somebody with actual graphic arts talent+skills, there ought to be somebody who can take that and realize an actual redesign :-). —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
hepabolu wrote: All: I know it is quite early for this, but in order to review the galleries of samples that Thien will be delivering ;-) we need a space to put them. I don't mind to help out in getting them uploaded, but it would be nice if it's not a "public" place such as the wiki or Daisy on the zone, people.apache.org/~yourname or zones is perfectly fine for this, imho. Vadim
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Nov 30, 2006, at 2:42 PM, hepabolu wrote: He knows html and css a little bit, but it is not his I'll take on this part of the "job". Hey, great... I missed that the first time. Awesome! :-) —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
On Nov 30, 2006, at 2:42 PM, hepabolu wrote: This sounds like a good idea, although I do think that the masthead/banner has a large part in the definition of the "look and feel" of the site. In other words the final choice for the banner is also a global decision for the look and feel of the rest of the page. Absolutely true, the artwork drives the rest of the styling... this is in fact the reason I suggested this approach. Once we've settled on a cool design concept, as represented by one of the masthead comps, then (a) we have some momentum, and (b) someone with the right skills + motivations + access could complete a re-skinning of the site essentially as an elaboration of a "theme" suggested by the new masthead artwork. For instance, I have enough design sensibility to do something like that, but I am not a graphic artist by any stretch of the imagination, so I could never produce the artwork; I think this community must have a lot of people like me in this regard, so if we can get the "creative" aspect done by somebody with actual graphic arts talent+skills, there ought to be somebody who can take that and realize an actual redesign :-). —ml—
Re: [graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Mark Lundquist said the following on 30/11/06 12:48: Niclas Hedhman wrote: I have just hired a Graphics Designer here at CodeDragons, and we don't think we will manage to fill his pipeline with commercial work from the start. I have previously promised that he will be available some of I'm sorry I missed this announcement completely. the time for work at Cocoon. He knows html and css a little bit, but it is not his I'll take on this part of the "job". main skill. He makes graphics. Icons, logos, photo assemblies and so forth. His name is Thien Luh Tay, and will shortly start subscribing to this list, I'm not sure if you read this already, but anyway: welcome Thien. OK, well, I have in mind a Cocoon task for a graphics designer! There've been discussions here before about how the main Cocoon site needs a face-lift... compare cocoon.apache.org with maven.apache.org or springframework.org, the latter two sites have a clean, light look, and they feel "modern". The Cocoon site looks heavy, kinda thick and blocky and "old-school". +1 (Thien: this means I agree) I'd like to see some choices for a new treatment of the masthead/banner region along the top of the page. Just that. Not looking for a full page design here, just a different look across the top. The real site revision would incorporate some other things as well, like different visual styling for the nav sidebar, but for now let's just concentrate on the masthead. This sounds like a good idea, although I do think that the masthead/banner has a large part in the definition of the "look and feel" of the site. In other words the final choice for the banner is also a global decision for the look and feel of the rest of the page. Still, small steps can take us where we want to go. Here are the branding "rules" I would propose... 1) Elements that must be retained from the current design: (a) the Apache feather logo (though preferably reduced in size from how it appears on the site today) +1 (b) the Cocoon logo. The cocoon logo may appear in either of two forms: (i) as unadorned, stylized text, as in the current masthead on cocoon.apache.org, or (ii) as text within its traditional "frame" of a bordered, oblong field with rounded ends as seen on cocoon.apache.org/2.1 under the heading "Apache Cocoon". I think the Cocoon logo is cool and conveys a strong identity, we should keep it. I agree that we need a Cocoon logo, although I'm not "set" on this one. I personally don't think this logo is cool, but I won't start a fight over it. 2) Elements that /need not/ be retained (may, but need not be): (a) the text "the Apache Cocoon Project" Depends on the logo. I agree that the name "Cocoon" should not appear twice in the masthead. (b) the text "http://cocoon.apache.org"; +1 (c) any of the current color scheme. I'd like to see a range of concept samples using variety of color palettes. In particular, the colors used by the Cocoon logo can be varied. I think I would still like the logo text to be either black or white depending on the background color, but the background color can be anything that looks appealing with the rest of the artwork and color palette. +1 I prefer "sophisticated" colors to screaming yellow and orange and the like. From there on out, it's wide open! I would love to see a half-dozen or so different ideas, and then we can see which ones people think are the coolest :-). +1 Thien: if you take on this assignment (and I do hope so), please start asking any question you'd like to be answered. Do note that you have a lot of "listeners" and a few people responding, which doesn't mean that the others don't care. All: I know it is quite early for this, but in order to review the galleries of samples that Thien will be delivering ;-) we need a space to put them. I don't mind to help out in getting them uploaded, but it would be nice if it's not a "public" place such as the wiki or Daisy on the zone, to avoid endless discussions (which we will probably have anyway) with a huge group of people. content that matters..." and I agree — however, improving the content vs. styling require different skill sets and don't really compete for resources, so I say let's work on both at the same time, 'cause visual impressions matter, too :-) True. Bye, Helma
[graphics] Masthead artwork for cocoon.apache.org
Niclas Hedhman wrote: I have just hired a Graphics Designer here at CodeDragons, and we don't think we will manage to fill his pipeline with commercial work from the start. I have previously promised that he will be available some of the time for work at Cocoon. He knows html and css a little bit, but it is not his main skill. He makes graphics. Icons, logos, photo assemblies and so forth. I have not hired him for Flash work, but I think he know a bit of that as well. His name is Thien Luh Tay, and will shortly start subscribing to this list, which is probably as alien as a Hortoculture mailing list would be to most of us. He is also not experienced in open source, nor doing work on distance. So, I am requesting a few things; 1. Any thread you start that you want him to read, put [graphics] in the subject. That would make it real easy for him to filter the scary noise. 2. Start thinking of what kind of stuff you want him to do. 3. Try to educate in a friendly manner, the principles of OSS collaboration. OK, well, I have in mind a Cocoon task for a graphics designer! There've been discussions here before about how the main Cocoon site needs a face-lift... compare cocoon.apache.org with maven.apache.org or springframework.org, the latter two sites have a clean, light look, and they feel "modern". The Cocoon site looks heavy, kinda thick and blocky and "old-school". I'd like to see some choices for a new treatment of the masthead/banner region along the top of the page. Just that. Not looking for a full page design here, just a different look across the top. The real site revision would incorporate some other things as well, like different visual styling for the nav sidebar, but for now let's just concentrate on the masthead. Here are the branding "rules" I would propose... 1) Elements that must be retained from the current design: (a) the Apache feather logo (though preferably reduced in size from how it appears on the site today) (b) the Cocoon logo. The cocoon logo may appear in either of two forms: (i) as unadorned, stylized text, as in the current masthead on cocoon.apache.org, or (ii) as text within its traditional "frame" of a bordered, oblong field with rounded ends as seen on cocoon.apache.org/2.1 under the heading "Apache Cocoon". I think the Cocoon logo is cool and conveys a strong identity, we should keep it. But see below w.r.t. color... 2) Elements that need not be retained (may, but need not be): (a) the text "the Apache Cocoon Project" (b) the text "http://cocoon.apache.org"; (c) any of the current color scheme. I'd like to see a range of concept samples using variety of color palettes. In particular, the colors used by the Cocoon logo can be varied. I think I would still like the logo text to be either black or white depending on the background color, but the background color can be anything that looks appealing with the rest of the artwork and color palette. From there on out, it's wide open! I would love to see a half-dozen or so different ideas, and then we can see which ones people think are the coolest :-). I think it's hard to promote our light, agile framework from a heavy, clunky, chunky looking site :-). Someone will say "well, it's the content that matters..." and I agree — however, improving the content vs. styling require different skill sets and don't really compete for resources, so I say let's work on both at the same time, 'cause visual impressions matter, too :-) WDYAT? —ml—
