Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 08.07.2012 22:33, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Thanks for enduring your work on this - glad to see that it has become comments.a.o. in the meantime! I'm in favor of enabling it for 2.2/2.4, generally speaking, but am having some concerns with regard to the proposed approval policy: it changed from the Comments will be moderated by appointed moderators to Comments will, in general, be allowed through without pre-approval. Comments with hyperlinks in them will require approval from a moderator before they are shown on the site [1]. Auto-approval of comments makes me feel somewhat uneasy - on the one hand, there's the risk of inappropriate/incorrect content appearing on httpd.apache.org and going unnoticed for some time, and on the other hand, this means that input validation (Name and Comment fields in particular) has to be very tight... is http://c.apaste.info/source/add_comment.lua the current version of the code which validates the input? (If so, it's e.g. missing checks for https URIs, and at least at first sight, I couldn't spot any further checks on the POST input you're processing [the site, page, thread variables etc.].) Kaspar [1] http://wiki.apache.org/httpd/DocsCommentSystem?action=diffrev1=6rev2=7
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 07/11/2012 08:24 AM, Kaspar Brand wrote: On 08.07.2012 22:33, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Thanks for enduring your work on this - glad to see that it has become comments.a.o. in the meantime! I'm in favor of enabling it for 2.2/2.4, generally speaking, but am having some concerns with regard to the proposed approval policy: it changed from the Comments will be moderated by appointed moderators to Comments will, in general, be allowed through without pre-approval. Comments with hyperlinks in them will require approval from a moderator before they are shown on the site [1]. Auto-approval of comments makes me feel somewhat uneasy - on the one hand, there's the risk of inappropriate/incorrect content appearing on httpd.apache.org and going unnoticed for some time, and on the other hand, this means that input validation (Name and Comment fields in particular) has to be very tight... is http://c.apaste.info/source/add_comment.lua the current version of the code which validates the input? (If so, it's e.g. missing checks for https URIs, and at least at first sight, I couldn't spot any further checks on the POST input you're processing [the site, page, thread variables etc.].) Kaspar [1] http://wiki.apache.org/httpd/DocsCommentSystem?action=diffrev1=6rev2=7 Hi Kaspar, No, I haven't updated that source repository since we moved it all to the infra SVN repo about a month ago. It is now in place at https://svn.apache.org/repos/infra/infrastructure/trunk/projects/comments/ and has been rewritten extensively. names and comments are checked for http(s) schemes, size (no more than 2500 characters allowed) and so on, and while comments require approval if a hyperlink is found that doesn't point to an official apache web site, names with hyperlinks are flat out denied. I think the general idea has, from the start, been to allow for comments to go through without pre-approval, at least for a period so we can see if that's what we want. If we later on decide that all comments needs approval before they are shown, then fine, we'll do so. The system is geared to respond to a lot of different wishes from different projects, for example, some may choose to enable Gravatar avatars for their comments, while others may not (this is not enabled for the httpd site by the way ;) ). As for comments going unnoticed, we currently have four people who automatically receive an email when someone posts on the site and we have the option to add *every single Apache committer* to this list of people moderating our site, so I think any 'bad' comments will be spotted rather fast and removed. We also have other options up our sleeves: 1) We can require that all posters be registered users first 2) We can ban the sorry people that try to spam out site 3) We can temporarily disable comments on the fly if something goes wrong I hope this answered your concerns, and if you have any other suggestions for how our little part of comments.a.o should work, please do say so, and I'll see if I can figure out a way to make it work. With regards, Daniel.
[Result] [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
The votes are in: +1: 9 (humbedooh, joes, issac, rpluem, druggeri, rjung, lgentis, sfritsch, rbowen) 0: 0 -1: 1 (mads) As this is a majority vote issue, the vote has passed and the integration of comments.a.o into the 2.2 and 2.4 branches will begin tomorrow (that is, 2.4 will start tomorrow, 2.2 will probably be Friday). We have a new feature on comments.a.o which is support for mailing list notifications, and I think that it might be a good idea for us to consider whether we should either create a separate mailing list for people who wish to follow new comments on the sites, or whether we should simply plug it into one of our existing lists, such as docs@ - ideas are welcome :) As with my previous letters, I encourage those of you who haven't tried out the comment system to take a glance at it, post an example comment in the trunk or check out the moderator panel. With regards, Daniel.
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On Sun, 8 Jul 2012, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because I am +1 in principle, providing that some issues are fixed: Currently, it is possible to make comments.a.o send mail to arbitrary recipients because the email addresses are not verified. IMHO comments.a.o should only send mail to addresses that have been verified. This would mean that the email notification service would require an account. Also, it may be problematic that URLs that lack the protocol part (e.g. www.spam-now.com) are accepted. But it may be enough if such spam comments are removed by the moderators (at least if the mail address problem is solved). Cheers, Stefan
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 07/10/2012 11:14 PM, Stefan Fritsch wrote: On Sun, 8 Jul 2012, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because I am +1 in principle, providing that some issues are fixed: Currently, it is possible to make comments.a.o send mail to arbitrary recipients because the email addresses are not verified. IMHO comments.a.o should only send mail to addresses that have been verified. This would mean that the email notification service would require an account. Also, it may be problematic that URLs that lack the protocol part (e.g. www.spam-now.com) are accepted. But it may be enough if such spam comments are removed by the moderators (at least if the mail address problem is solved). Cheers, Stefan Thanks for your input, Stefan. I've added a check that will only allow registered users to be notified when someone replies to their comments. We also discussed email confirmation checks on IRC, and I will look into that tomorrow, as well as probably start a new thread on the ML for future suggestions to the comments system. We can enable/disable these features at any point in the future, if it becomes a hassle or any such thing. With regards, Daniel.
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
[ x ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because -- Rich Bowen rbo...@rcbowen.com
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
Daniel Gruno wrote: After many an attempt, we now have LDAP authentication for comments.apache.org set up, and the comment system is ready to roll. Any committer that wishes to moderate comments can now do so using their Apache credentials. With that in order, and with the comment system already tested in our trunk branch (as well as on the Apache Traffic Server site), I would propose that we also adopt this new system for the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of our documentation, so we can get some useful comments from the majority of people who don't normally visit the trunk docs. Voting will last the usual 72 hours, standard majority consensus applies. If you haven't already, I suggest you try out the system by either posting a comment somewhere or by logging onto the moderator control panel and familiarizing yourself with it. [X] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Regards Rüdiger
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 09/07/2012 01:12, Mads Toftum wrote: On Sun, Jul 08, 2012 at 10:33:56PM +0200, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [X] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Only trunk is CTR. Can you explain the rationale of that veto?
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 09 Jul 2012, at 12:12 AM, Mads Toftum wrote: On Sun, Jul 08, 2012 at 10:33:56PM +0200, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [X] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Only trunk is CTR. The way I understand it what's been built is a comments system that allows end users to annotate the existing documentation, it doesn't represent a system that allows the documentation to be modified directly in any way. As I understand it, the comments are not versioned at all, meaning that it makes no sense to say CTR or RTC, as there is no commit in the comments system. Would it be possible to clarify? Regards, Graham --
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 07/09/2012 09:24 AM, Issac Goldstand wrote: On 09/07/2012 01:12, Mads Toftum wrote: On Sun, Jul 08, 2012 at 10:33:56PM +0200, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [X] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Only trunk is CTR. Can you explain the rationale of that veto? Let me reiterate, in case I was being vague earlier on: This is a _majority_ vote issue just like with releases (and like we did with adopting the CMS system for our site), there is no veto, just +1, 0 and -1. I can, to some extent, understand Mads' reasons for voting -1, but I'd also like some elaboration, so I don't get the wrong impression. Personally, my rationale for adopting it to 2.2 and 2.4 is that _people will use it_ there, which is what we want. I have described this in the wiki proposal a while ago, at http://wiki.apache.org/httpd/DocsCommentSystem and I had really hoped that all the pros and cons had been discussed by now. With regards, Daniel.
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 7/9/2012 3:20 AM, Daniel Gruno wrote: I can, to some extent, understand Mads' reasons for voting -1, but I'd also like some elaboration, so I don't get the wrong impression. Personally, my rationale for adopting it to 2.2 and 2.4 is that _people will use it_ there, which is what we want. I have described this in the wiki proposal a while ago, at http://wiki.apache.org/httpd/DocsCommentSystem and I had really hoped that all the pros and cons had been discussed by now. Agreed [X] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because -- Daniel Ruggeri
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 08.07.2012 22:33, Daniel Gruno wrote: [X] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Thanks for your work on this! Rainer
[VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
After many an attempt, we now have LDAP authentication for comments.apache.org set up, and the comment system is ready to roll. Any committer that wishes to moderate comments can now do so using their Apache credentials. With that in order, and with the comment system already tested in our trunk branch (as well as on the Apache Traffic Server site), I would propose that we also adopt this new system for the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of our documentation, so we can get some useful comments from the majority of people who don't normally visit the trunk docs. Voting will last the usual 72 hours, standard majority consensus applies. If you haven't already, I suggest you try out the system by either posting a comment somewhere or by logging onto the moderator control panel and familiarizing yourself with it. [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because With regards, Daniel.
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On Sun, Jul 08, 2012 at 10:33:56PM +0200, Daniel Gruno wrote: [ ] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [X] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Only trunk is CTR. vh Mads Toftum -- http://soulfood.dk
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
On 07/08/2012 10:33 PM, Daniel Gruno wrote: [X] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Forgot to cast my own vote - so there.
Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs
+1! - Original Message - From: Daniel Gruno rum...@cord.dk To: dev@httpd.apache.org; d...@httpd.apache.org Cc: Sent: Sunday, July 8, 2012 6:22 PM Subject: Re: [VOTE] Adopt the comments.a.o system to the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of the httpd docs On 07/08/2012 10:33 PM, Daniel Gruno wrote: [X] +1: Adopt the comments.a.o system in the 2.2 and 2.4 branch of docs [ ] 0: I don't care [ ] -1: Don't adopt the system, because Forgot to cast my own vote - so there.
