Re: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Well it seems version dirs are here to stay. I'd try to get the version updater be smart enough to figure out the previous installed version, so we do not have to change that in every release. It could be also possible to add a task which checks the previous user/cache dirs and offer them for removal if they are not being used for a month or so. On 4/4/19 12:48 PM, Tim Boudreau wrote: On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 7:40 AM Laszlo Kishalmi wrote: Dear all, I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir with every release. We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 That's great, but only until somebody breaks something, which you typically don't know until a lot of users have had a bad experience. Keeping the cache dir seems reasonable - the developer should be expected to change subdir names if the data format is changed incompatibly. But for the userdir, if a new version has written incompatible data, you've closed off any way to downgrade to the previous version. That's not okay. -Tim e dirs are just kept floating around. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists -- http://timboudreau.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
Sharing user dir but not cache dir was: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Dne čtvrtek 4. dubna 2019 14:17:57 CEST, Junichi Yamamoto napsal(a): > The user directory includes plugins. The cache directory has a splash > screen. So, probably, problems occur if a user uses NetBeans IDEs of > different versions, I suppose. ## Problem with Caches Right. Using two different versions of NetBeans on top of the same cache directory will effectively disable the caches (or worse, break their behavior). ## Backward Compatibility Reusing user directory in newer version directly was always my dream, but we never got it working properly - hence the QA required the "import of previous version" behavior to import only what is explicitly requested and tested. Sharing the user directory is technically possible. Future versions of the code just have to be able to read older settings. That is achievable if good coding practices are obeyed. ## Future Compatibility However using the same directory by older versions is even more tricky. That requires proper versioning and/or extensible settings format and not many developers really think about that. Consider reading more in my [notes about protocols](http://wiki.apidesign.org/wiki/Protocols) and related articles. ## Non Fixable Bug Reports The problem with sharing the user directory is that we will get bug reports that aren't reproducible without the actual user directory. E.g. there'll be bugs nobody will be able to fix. We have been in such situation in the past - when the upgrade was automatic, a lot of debris got into the new version and the new code was not really to deal with it. ## Conclusion If you want to share the user dir, you can. It will work to some extent. In any case, don't share the cache directory between different versions. Luckily there is a way to place caches elsewhere than under the user directory... Best regards and good luck. -jt - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
Re: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 7:40 AM Laszlo Kishalmi wrote: > Dear all, > > I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir > with every release. > > We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 That's great, but only until somebody breaks something, which you typically don't know until a lot of users have had a bad experience. Keeping the cache dir seems reasonable - the developer should be expected to change subdir names if the data format is changed incompatibly. But for the userdir, if a new version has written incompatible data, you've closed off any way to downgrade to the previous version. That's not okay. -Tim > e dirs are just kept floating around. > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > -- http://timboudreau.com
Re: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
On 4/4/19 6:39 AM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote: > I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir > with every release. > I'm bringing this up for two + one reasons: > > 1. The user experience of the upgrades would be more seamless. > > 2. Avoid code change required to check the previous release folder. > > +1 Abandoned older user and cache dirs are just kept floating around. 3. Multiple cache dirs == multiple Maven indexes: 2.0G/home/cenbe/.cache/netbeans/11.0/mavenindex -- Glenn Holmer (Linux registered user #16682) "After the vintage season came the aftermath -- and Cenbe." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
Re: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Plugins with implementation dependencies not gonna work this way. Thanks Gaurav Gupta On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 5:48 PM Junichi Yamamoto wrote: > Hi Laszlo, > > The user directory includes plugins. The cache directory has a splash > screen. So, probably, problems occur if a user uses NetBeans IDEs of > different versions, I suppose. > > Thanks, > Junichi > > > > On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 8:40 PM Laszlo Kishalmi > wrote: > > > > Dear all, > > > > I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir > > with every release. > > > > We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 > > and actually many of us are actually living on the edge using refreshed > > dev versions every now and then without any issue. > > > > So how do you think that having a non versioned user and cache-dir work > > out (like: "release" instead of "11.0" or "11.1")? > > > > I'm bringing this up for two + one reasons: > > > > 1. The user experience of the upgrades would be more seamless. > > > > 2. Avoid code change required to check the previous release folder. > > > > +1 Abandoned older user and cache dirs are just kept floating around. > > > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > > > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > >
Re: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Hi Laszlo, The user directory includes plugins. The cache directory has a splash screen. So, probably, problems occur if a user uses NetBeans IDEs of different versions, I suppose. Thanks, Junichi On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 8:40 PM Laszlo Kishalmi wrote: > > Dear all, > > I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir > with every release. > > We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 > and actually many of us are actually living on the edge using refreshed > dev versions every now and then without any issue. > > So how do you think that having a non versioned user and cache-dir work > out (like: "release" instead of "11.0" or "11.1")? > > I'm bringing this up for two + one reasons: > > 1. The user experience of the upgrades would be more seamless. > > 2. Avoid code change required to check the previous release folder. > > +1 Abandoned older user and cache dirs are just kept floating around. > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
AW: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Hey Laszlo, I’m in between. I’m for it, do to removing old stuff automatically and getting the preferences from previous Version. But also I often read that someone says: please delete your user dir, if someone encountered a problem. So there we can see smth is not that stable as expected and needs further Investigation somehow. On the other hand I would not use the old preferences automatically or as default, due to mentioned problems. When I install a newer version of IntelliJ they ask me, whether I want to uninstall the old version with the old settings or not. So after it, it seems, that the old settings are the default. So all in all, but with asking to use the old ones or not and not make it as default. Cheers Chris Von: Laszlo Kishalmi Gesendet: Donnerstag, 4. April 2019 13:40 An: Apache NetBeans Betreff: NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases Dear all, I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir with every release. We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 and actually many of us are actually living on the edge using refreshed dev versions every now and then without any issue. So how do you think that having a non versioned user and cache-dir work out (like: "release" instead of "11.0" or "11.1")? I'm bringing this up for two + one reasons: 1. The user experience of the upgrades would be more seamless. 2. Avoid code change required to check the previous release folder. +1 Abandoned older user and cache dirs are just kept floating around. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
NetBeans UserDir vs. Releases
Dear all, I would like to ask your opinion about changing the user and cache-dir with every release. We have been pretty much compatible with our plugins and code since 8.2 and actually many of us are actually living on the edge using refreshed dev versions every now and then without any issue. So how do you think that having a non versioned user and cache-dir work out (like: "release" instead of "11.0" or "11.1")? I'm bringing this up for two + one reasons: 1. The user experience of the upgrades would be more seamless. 2. Avoid code change required to check the previous release folder. +1 Abandoned older user and cache dirs are just kept floating around. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
