Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Andrea Pescetti wrote: > On 04/06/2013 Rob Weir wrote: >> >> On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Dave Barton wrote: >>> >>> If someone would be kind enough to advise me how to create a public html >>> page ~bmcs (like https://people.apache.org/~arielch/), I will put all >>> the OOo& AOO related svg images I have collected there. > > > It corresponds to a public_html folder that you can create in your home > directory, on the people.apache.org machine that you access with your > committer credentials. See > https://www.apache.org/dev/new-committers-guide#ssh-setup > > >> Could you check what you have? I have a version as well, where there >> is an SVG, but the SVG merely points to a bitmap image for the orb and >> gulls. So not really pure SVG. If you have something that is >> entirely SVG, feel free to send it along and I can check it into SVN >> for you. > > > Limited to the orb, the best version we have is > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/27834483/ApacheOpenOfficeTM.svg > (where we have a pure vector orb; the font is wrong so it's not used > elsewhere). > That is described as "a very rough freehand demonstration of the concept knocked up in five minutes using Inkscape".It is also deleted. As far as I can tell, we don't have any vector version of the current logo. -Rob > See http://www.mail-archive.com/ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org/msg26911.html > for more. > > Regards, > Andrea. > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
On 04/06/2013 Rob Weir wrote: On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Dave Barton wrote: If someone would be kind enough to advise me how to create a public html page ~bmcs (like https://people.apache.org/~arielch/), I will put all the OOo& AOO related svg images I have collected there. It corresponds to a public_html folder that you can create in your home directory, on the people.apache.org machine that you access with your committer credentials. See https://www.apache.org/dev/new-committers-guide#ssh-setup Could you check what you have? I have a version as well, where there is an SVG, but the SVG merely points to a bitmap image for the orb and gulls. So not really pure SVG. If you have something that is entirely SVG, feel free to send it along and I can check it into SVN for you. Limited to the orb, the best version we have is https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/27834483/ApacheOpenOfficeTM.svg (where we have a pure vector orb; the font is wrong so it's not used elsewhere). See http://www.mail-archive.com/ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org/msg26911.html for more. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
Original Message From: Rob Weir To: dev@openoffice.apache.org , Dennis Hamilton Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 08:45:32 -0400 > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: >> I think if the "Apache" is made thicker by using Bold and a touch darker >> grey, it will work much better, at least as positioned in the Rottensteiner >> Stage 2 refinement. It also gives "Apache" more (symbolic) weight without >> overpowering the "OpenOffice" part. >> >> I agree one wants to use the best of resampled PNG and regenerated SVG at >> the lower size. Also, if the SVG has hints about the visually-intended size >> (at whatever pixel resolution), the fonts may be adjusted automatically to >> avoid excessive thinning at smaller presentation sizes. Then there are the >> tricks needed when rasterization also becomes significant. >> > > Right. And I hope that no one thinks that we're voting for pixels > carved in marble. We're voting on a design. I'd expect ordinary > technical adjustments to be made to suit the scale and medium of a > particular use. It should feel the same to a user, of course. That's > the advantage of having the vector source to a logo. With the current > logo it has been difficult to work with, since we only have the orb as > a bitmap. > > -Rob Maybe I am missing something here (very possible), but I have the current logo and a couple of variants in svg format. If required I would be happy to upload them. If someone would be kind enough to advise me how to create a public html page ~bmcs (like https://people.apache.org/~arielch/), I will put all the OOo & AOO related svg images I have collected there. Dave >> - Dennis >> >> I don't have enough personal knowledge about SVG implementations and font >> hinting (although Adobe has information about it). I do know that Knuth had >> to introduce anomorphic scaling into his fonts because the smaller ones >> would become visually too thin at the smaller point sizes if simply scaled >> geometrically. It's a human vision thing. He was producing images for >> production publishing systems and had a luxury of pixels; there was more >> involved that nudging pixel alignments. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 04:54 PM >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org >> Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0 >> >> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: >> >>> Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. >>> >>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: >>> >>> . >>> . >>> . >>>> >>>> My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray >>>> "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin >>>> letters also don't scale well going smaller. >>>> >>> >>> How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that >>> probably doesn't give the optimal quality. >> >> >> yes, this is what I did... >> >> >>> If we resize from the SVG >>> source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then >>> it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In >>> theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the >>> light gray. >>> >> >> Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is >> only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and >> things were not great on any of these with that very light gray >> "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. >> >> >>> -Rob - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Dave Barton wrote: > Original Message > From: Rob Weir > To: dev@openoffice.apache.org , Dennis > Hamilton > Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 08:45:32 -0400 > >> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: >>> I think if the "Apache" is made thicker by using Bold and a touch darker >>> grey, it will work much better, at least as positioned in the Rottensteiner >>> Stage 2 refinement. It also gives "Apache" more (symbolic) weight without >>> overpowering the "OpenOffice" part. >>> >>> I agree one wants to use the best of resampled PNG and regenerated SVG at >>> the lower size. Also, if the SVG has hints about the visually-intended >>> size (at whatever pixel resolution), the fonts may be adjusted >>> automatically to avoid excessive thinning at smaller presentation sizes. >>> Then there are the tricks needed when rasterization also becomes >>> significant. >>> >> >> Right. And I hope that no one thinks that we're voting for pixels >> carved in marble. We're voting on a design. I'd expect ordinary >> technical adjustments to be made to suit the scale and medium of a >> particular use. It should feel the same to a user, of course. That's >> the advantage of having the vector source to a logo. With the current >> logo it has been difficult to work with, since we only have the orb as >> a bitmap. >> >> -Rob > > Maybe I am missing something here (very possible), but I have the > current logo and a couple of variants in svg format. If required I would > be happy to upload them. > > If someone would be kind enough to advise me how to create a public html > page ~bmcs (like https://people.apache.org/~arielch/), I will put all > the OOo & AOO related svg images I have collected there. > Could you check what you have? I have a version as well, where there is an SVG, but the SVG merely points to a bitmap image for the orb and gulls. So not really pure SVG. If you have something that is entirely SVG, feel free to send it along and I can check it into SVN for you. -Rob > Dave > >>> - Dennis >>> >>> I don't have enough personal knowledge about SVG implementations and font >>> hinting (although Adobe has information about it). I do know that Knuth >>> had to introduce anomorphic scaling into his fonts because the smaller ones >>> would become visually too thin at the smaller point sizes if simply scaled >>> geometrically. It's a human vision thing. He was producing images for >>> production publishing systems and had a luxury of pixels; there was more >>> involved that nudging pixel alignments. >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com] >>> Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 04:54 PM >>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org >>> Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0 >>> >>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: >>> >>>> Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: >>>> >>>> . >>>> . >>>> . >>>>> >>>>> My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray >>>>> "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin >>>>> letters also don't scale well going smaller. >>>>> >>>> >>>> How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that >>>> probably doesn't give the optimal quality. >>> >>> >>> yes, this is what I did... >>> >>> >>>> If we resize from the SVG >>>> source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then >>>> it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In >>>> theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the >>>> light gray. >>>> >>> >>> Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is >>> only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and >>> things were not great on any of these with that very light gray >>> "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. >>> >>> >>>> -Rob > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
Original Message From: Rob Weir To: dev@openoffice.apache.org , Dennis Hamilton Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 08:45:32 -0400 > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: >> I think if the "Apache" is made thicker by using Bold and a touch darker >> grey, it will work much better, at least as positioned in the Rottensteiner >> Stage 2 refinement. It also gives "Apache" more (symbolic) weight without >> overpowering the "OpenOffice" part. >> >> I agree one wants to use the best of resampled PNG and regenerated SVG at >> the lower size. Also, if the SVG has hints about the visually-intended size >> (at whatever pixel resolution), the fonts may be adjusted automatically to >> avoid excessive thinning at smaller presentation sizes. Then there are the >> tricks needed when rasterization also becomes significant. >> > > Right. And I hope that no one thinks that we're voting for pixels > carved in marble. We're voting on a design. I'd expect ordinary > technical adjustments to be made to suit the scale and medium of a > particular use. It should feel the same to a user, of course. That's > the advantage of having the vector source to a logo. With the current > logo it has been difficult to work with, since we only have the orb as > a bitmap. > > -Rob Maybe I am missing something here (very possible), but I have the current logo and a couple of variants in svg format. If required I would be happy to upload them. If someone would be kind enough to advise me how to create a public html page ~bmcs (like https://people.apache.org/~arielch/), I will put all the OOo & AOO related svg images I have collected there. Dave >> - Dennis >> >> I don't have enough personal knowledge about SVG implementations and font >> hinting (although Adobe has information about it). I do know that Knuth had >> to introduce anomorphic scaling into his fonts because the smaller ones >> would become visually too thin at the smaller point sizes if simply scaled >> geometrically. It's a human vision thing. He was producing images for >> production publishing systems and had a luxury of pixels; there was more >> involved that nudging pixel alignments. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 04:54 PM >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org >> Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0 >> >> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: >> >>> Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. >>> >>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: >>> >>> . >>> . >>> . >>>> >>>> My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray >>>> "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin >>>> letters also don't scale well going smaller. >>>> >>> >>> How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that >>> probably doesn't give the optimal quality. >> >> >> yes, this is what I did... >> >> >>> If we resize from the SVG >>> source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then >>> it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In >>> theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the >>> light gray. >>> >> >> Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is >> only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and >> things were not great on any of these with that very light gray >> "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. >> >> >>> -Rob - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: > I think if the "Apache" is made thicker by using Bold and a touch darker > grey, it will work much better, at least as positioned in the Rottensteiner > Stage 2 refinement. It also gives "Apache" more (symbolic) weight without > overpowering the "OpenOffice" part. > > I agree one wants to use the best of resampled PNG and regenerated SVG at the > lower size. Also, if the SVG has hints about the visually-intended size (at > whatever pixel resolution), the fonts may be adjusted automatically to avoid > excessive thinning at smaller presentation sizes. Then there are the tricks > needed when rasterization also becomes significant. > Right. And I hope that no one thinks that we're voting for pixels carved in marble. We're voting on a design. I'd expect ordinary technical adjustments to be made to suit the scale and medium of a particular use. It should feel the same to a user, of course. That's the advantage of having the vector source to a logo. With the current logo it has been difficult to work with, since we only have the orb as a bitmap. -Rob > - Dennis > > I don't have enough personal knowledge about SVG implementations and font > hinting (although Adobe has information about it). I do know that Knuth had > to introduce anomorphic scaling into his fonts because the smaller ones would > become visually too thin at the smaller point sizes if simply scaled > geometrically. It's a human vision thing. He was producing images for > production publishing systems and had a luxury of pixels; there was more > involved that nudging pixel alignments. > > -Original Message- > From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com] > Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 04:54 PM > To: dev@openoffice.apache.org > Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0 > > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: > >> Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. >> >> On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: >> >> . >> . >> . >> > >> > My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray >> > "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin >> > letters also don't scale well going smaller. >> > >> >> How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that >> probably doesn't give the optimal quality. > > > yes, this is what I did... > > >> If we resize from the SVG >> source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then >> it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In >> theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the >> light gray. >> > > Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is > only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and > things were not great on any of these with that very light gray > "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. > > >> -Rob >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org >> >> > > > -- > > MzK > > "You can't believe one thing and do another. > What you believe and what you do are the same thing." > -- Leonard Peltier > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
I think if the "Apache" is made thicker by using Bold and a touch darker grey, it will work much better, at least as positioned in the Rottensteiner Stage 2 refinement. It also gives "Apache" more (symbolic) weight without overpowering the "OpenOffice" part. I agree one wants to use the best of resampled PNG and regenerated SVG at the lower size. Also, if the SVG has hints about the visually-intended size (at whatever pixel resolution), the fonts may be adjusted automatically to avoid excessive thinning at smaller presentation sizes. Then there are the tricks needed when rasterization also becomes significant. - Dennis I don't have enough personal knowledge about SVG implementations and font hinting (although Adobe has information about it). I do know that Knuth had to introduce anomorphic scaling into his fonts because the smaller ones would become visually too thin at the smaller point sizes if simply scaled geometrically. It's a human vision thing. He was producing images for production publishing systems and had a luxury of pixels; there was more involved that nudging pixel alignments. -Original Message- From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 04:54 PM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0 On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: > Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. > > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: > > . > . > . > > > > My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray > > "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin > > letters also don't scale well going smaller. > > > > How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that > probably doesn't give the optimal quality. yes, this is what I did... > If we resize from the SVG > source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then > it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In > theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the > light gray. > Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and things were not great on any of these with that very light gray "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. > -Rob > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > > -- MzK "You can't believe one thing and do another. What you believe and what you do are the same thing." -- Leonard Peltier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Rob Weir wrote: > Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. > > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: > > . > . > . > > > > My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray > > "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin > > letters also don't scale well going smaller. > > > > How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that > probably doesn't give the optimal quality. yes, this is what I did... > If we resize from the SVG > source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then > it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In > theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the > light gray. > Well maybe someone could resize appropriately. Our current "web" logo is only 200 x 100. I actually used 300 x ??? (kept the aspect ratio) and things were not great on any of these with that very light gray "Apache"...even slightly darker would help I think. > -Rob > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > > -- MzK "You can't believe one thing and do another. What you believe and what you do are the same thing." -- Leonard Peltier
[VOTE][DISCUSS] Logo selection for Apache OpenOffice 4.0
Staring a [VOTE][DISCUSS] thread parallel to the [VOTE] thread. On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: . . . > > My comments with some very preliminary testing: the VERY LIGHT gray > "Apache" in any form doesn't scale well going smaller. The very thin > letters also don't scale well going smaller. > How did you scale the image? By resizing the PNG file? If so that probably doesn't give the optimal quality. If we resize from the SVG source, and if the SVG references a vector font with "hinting", then it is possible that the text will be clearer at smaller sizes. In theory that should help with the letter scaling. Not sure about the light gray. -Rob - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
