Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 17/02/15 22:26, jan i wrote: > Do we (AOO) have to solve that, or is it the project (being downstream to > AOO) ? > To me it sounds like a downstream adaptation. If the point is to remove _existing_ functionality, then it is a downstream adaption. If the point is to make it appear as if functionality has been removed, then an extension that changes/rewrites the main menu line will suffice. Rephrasing, if an extension can currently be written, than changes the content of the "File | Edit | Insert | etc" line, then a third party can write that extension today. jonathon * English - detected * English * English -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJU5mzsAAoJEKG7hs8nSMR7legP/ittAhhXIDZUVojLsHm2M0pU lmrSpIRFyXDOvFYPYEjHiHg9gIH1e4aYxS2cXR0CaSb9xsj+AZ1ToR/WVUg9H80f giBlPDfQxVvr021bXX5UXGAwM2C5Xj62oy3qaOUW2h3AKOmkVl4i4+xuydc4Z8eF lAiJ/FH2UrOPUszOOHUP9FwtL1jl2Lve3+ZWls4Mz5RvCiI/XvaevKaWI74/fMAT S6ayhWiE9I5N7eQshqESxjwhBBDGmm+OVwXz3yafqYCMAtBxaz4oJkjmzh6XXJH0 OaHFh5R8YDuGnOf0nOXHzH2HNZJRB+No13+qzjT5Nv2xLsSem1nKJJilg2SvWqU0 Io4nx8181R5nqv3ASLE7LCbIvFfPvFIk5sXmXerSbXiYrDIj+xGODjD5xCWNykn1 ZNX6hJIIyh2n2ct78IQ50g+URRlGTlsllsd4OrY0oVHEcbt1JsZ8qg9W70gj1t2+ blB5dPD2vW0610XyPW4nQnBc5C9b7hcIJSmXpXCoaEyRfJNQ58UgdnH42Ndf4QUl LMIIEzlrD19f7Hqi2JP3sva/kR2j2W1Y+/qdB2jwZm+BP3KaLnTvVAYjPRnIsGTH st2+93Pc4Z1pzj6IDiYoN/piACaPG2tufQ/cM+qTIjmU0tkJW9TnfIFtnlL62ytJ U8w2ue8n3N+EbLF8YOpq =eH4Q -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
-- replying in-line to -- From: jan i [mailto:j...@apache.org] Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 14:27 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; dennis.hamil...@acm.org Subject: Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status On Tuesday, February 17, 2015, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: > +1, > > Nice thinking, Guy. > > Perhaps a bit more work and resource to make this customizable, and a > great idea. This also matters for enterprise deployments and such. That, > along with customized template sets can be very important in certain areas > of application. > > We still have the original resource problem to solve, yet it is nice to > see thoughtful definition taking place. Do we (AOO) have to solve that, or is it the project (being downstream to AOO) ? To me it sounds like a downstream adaptation. I confess I was thinking of customizations as something that could be added without having to rebuild the code. That would require building-in of a technique for customization. The starter and intermediates might well be introduced in that manner, though part of the default build. I suppose that means creation of an extension point unless it is practical to skin the product using the existing extension machinery. I also suppose that there has to be versioning of an extension point and concerns for future distributions breaking existing customizations. rgds jan i [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On Tuesday, February 17, 2015, Dennis E. Hamilton
wrote:
> +1,
>
> Nice thinking, Guy.
>
> Perhaps a bit more work and resource to make this customizable, and a
> great idea. This also matters for enterprise deployments and such. That,
> along with customized template sets can be very important in certain areas
> of application.
>
> We still have the original resource problem to solve, yet it is nice to
> see thoughtful definition taking place.
Do we (AOO) have to solve that, or is it the project (being downstream to
AOO) ?
To me it sounds like a downstream adaptation.
rgds
jan i
>
> - Dennis
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Guy Waterval [mailto:waterval@gmail.com ]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 13:00
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
>
> Hi Jan,
> Hi all,
>
> 2015-02-16 10:26 GMT+01:00 jan i >:
>
> >
> > In order to keep it (as AOO) we. need to know
> > - is the brand registred and eho has the current right to the brand
> > - can we as AOO provide resources to keep this alive
> >
> > I think it is a good downstream project, but I do not currently see a
> > possibility to add this to the AOO project.
> >
>
> Hi Jan,
> Hi all,
>
> Many thanks for the proposition. But I think (personal opinion, I don't
> speak for educoo) that it would be a waste of ressources, as we don't
> actually have the needed dev capacity to assist in such a process. For me,
> the best way is to maintain the availability of OOoLight and OOo4Kids (they
> are always usable), but the users should be informed (for transparency
> purpose) that their developpement is currently discontinued due to a lack
> of developers.
>
> Regarding a possible personalization of the UI of AOO to fit it better for
> Kids or users with low needs, here are some thoughts. Please, consider that
> it is not a request but only "some thoughts" to enhance the use of profiles
> and get again more flexibility to AOO. All this can perfectly be managed
> manually.
>
> Reading the posts of jonathon and Dennis, perhaps a possible way :
>
> Command : Tools > Options > Appearance > Select UI-Profile ... opens the
> Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles".
>
> Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles"
> Lists the existing profiles from the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory
> (Windows example) and allows to activate, delete or export one of them or
> allows to add a new one.
> Button "Add a new Profile ..." : opens the dialogbox "Add a new Profile" to
> add a new Profile to the list.
> Button "Activate profile" :
> - renames the actual activ profile "user" and restores its original name.
> - renames the choosen profile as "user" and stores its original name in a
> memory.
> - restarts AOO with the choosen profile.
> Button "Cancel" to quit.
> Button "Delete" : to suppress a selected profile after advertisement ("Do
> you really want to suppress the sected profile ?").
> Button "Export" : creates a zip archive of the selected profile in the list
> to can save and share it with other users, or send a corrupt profile for
> expertise.
> Button "Help" : displays an information text about what is a profile and
> what is stored in it. It's not so clear for most users (me included). An
> opportunity to clarify definitely this question.
>
> Dialogbox "Add a new UI Profile"
> Allows to install a new Profile in the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\"
> directory
> - Button "Browse" near an editing zone to search the new Profile (.zip
> file) to install.
> - Button "OK" : unzip the choosen .zip file and installs the resultant
> directory to the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory. Returns to the
> dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles" and actualizes the list.
> - Button "Cancel" to quit and return to the dialogbox "Available
> UI-Profiles" without modifications.
>
> Possible interests :
> - more flexibility with a single product. No reduction of size, but most
> computers currently support AOO without any problem.
> - adaptable UI in a school context or for users with low needs.
> - for advanced users, possibility to create more sophisticated profiles
> (integrating sets of special templates or galleries, etc. ) for specific
> purposes (i.e. lawyers, translators, specific technical needs), and
> shareable with other colleagues.
>
> Some questions about that :
> - Interest or not, from a marketing point of view, for instance?
> - Feasability : easy or not easy task ? Cost
RE: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
+1,
Nice thinking, Guy.
Perhaps a bit more work and resource to make this customizable, and a great
idea. This also matters for enterprise deployments and such. That, along with
customized template sets can be very important in certain areas of application.
We still have the original resource problem to solve, yet it is nice to see
thoughtful definition taking place.
- Dennis
-Original Message-
From: Guy Waterval [mailto:waterval@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 13:00
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Hi Jan,
Hi all,
2015-02-16 10:26 GMT+01:00 jan i :
>
> In order to keep it (as AOO) we. need to know
> - is the brand registred and eho has the current right to the brand
> - can we as AOO provide resources to keep this alive
>
> I think it is a good downstream project, but I do not currently see a
> possibility to add this to the AOO project.
>
Hi Jan,
Hi all,
Many thanks for the proposition. But I think (personal opinion, I don't
speak for educoo) that it would be a waste of ressources, as we don't
actually have the needed dev capacity to assist in such a process. For me,
the best way is to maintain the availability of OOoLight and OOo4Kids (they
are always usable), but the users should be informed (for transparency
purpose) that their developpement is currently discontinued due to a lack
of developers.
Regarding a possible personalization of the UI of AOO to fit it better for
Kids or users with low needs, here are some thoughts. Please, consider that
it is not a request but only "some thoughts" to enhance the use of profiles
and get again more flexibility to AOO. All this can perfectly be managed
manually.
Reading the posts of jonathon and Dennis, perhaps a possible way :
Command : Tools > Options > Appearance > Select UI-Profile ... opens the
Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles".
Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles"
Lists the existing profiles from the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory
(Windows example) and allows to activate, delete or export one of them or
allows to add a new one.
Button "Add a new Profile ..." : opens the dialogbox "Add a new Profile" to
add a new Profile to the list.
Button "Activate profile" :
- renames the actual activ profile "user" and restores its original name.
- renames the choosen profile as "user" and stores its original name in a
memory.
- restarts AOO with the choosen profile.
Button "Cancel" to quit.
Button "Delete" : to suppress a selected profile after advertisement ("Do
you really want to suppress the sected profile ?").
Button "Export" : creates a zip archive of the selected profile in the list
to can save and share it with other users, or send a corrupt profile for
expertise.
Button "Help" : displays an information text about what is a profile and
what is stored in it. It's not so clear for most users (me included). An
opportunity to clarify definitely this question.
Dialogbox "Add a new UI Profile"
Allows to install a new Profile in the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory
- Button "Browse" near an editing zone to search the new Profile (.zip
file) to install.
- Button "OK" : unzip the choosen .zip file and installs the resultant
directory to the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory. Returns to the
dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles" and actualizes the list.
- Button "Cancel" to quit and return to the dialogbox "Available
UI-Profiles" without modifications.
Possible interests :
- more flexibility with a single product. No reduction of size, but most
computers currently support AOO without any problem.
- adaptable UI in a school context or for users with low needs.
- for advanced users, possibility to create more sophisticated profiles
(integrating sets of special templates or galleries, etc. ) for specific
purposes (i.e. lawyers, translators, specific technical needs), and
shareable with other colleagues.
Some questions about that :
- Interest or not, from a marketing point of view, for instance?
- Feasability : easy or not easy task ? Cost of ressources acceptable or
not ?Unreachable objectiv ?
- Implementation directly in the AOO code obligatory or possible
installation through an extension "ChangeProfile" ?
- Standard profiles could be created inside the users mailing list, after
discussion, to select the commands to integrate by default in the the
different standard levels. Certainly not a trivial work to select the
commands. After that, an advanced user can always refine the standard
profiles or replace them with its own personal profiles.
Thank you to have read this piece of bad English up to the end ;-)
Regards
--
gw
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Hi Jan,
Hi all,
2015-02-16 10:26 GMT+01:00 jan i :
>
> In order to keep it (as AOO) we. need to know
> - is the brand registred and eho has the current right to the brand
> - can we as AOO provide resources to keep this alive
>
> I think it is a good downstream project, but I do not currently see a
> possibility to add this to the AOO project.
>
Hi Jan,
Hi all,
Many thanks for the proposition. But I think (personal opinion, I don't
speak for educoo) that it would be a waste of ressources, as we don't
actually have the needed dev capacity to assist in such a process. For me,
the best way is to maintain the availability of OOoLight and OOo4Kids (they
are always usable), but the users should be informed (for transparency
purpose) that their developpement is currently discontinued due to a lack
of developers.
Regarding a possible personalization of the UI of AOO to fit it better for
Kids or users with low needs, here are some thoughts. Please, consider that
it is not a request but only "some thoughts" to enhance the use of profiles
and get again more flexibility to AOO. All this can perfectly be managed
manually.
Reading the posts of jonathon and Dennis, perhaps a possible way :
Command : Tools > Options > Appearance > Select UI-Profile ... opens the
Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles".
Dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles"
Lists the existing profiles from the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory
(Windows example) and allows to activate, delete or export one of them or
allows to add a new one.
Button "Add a new Profile ..." : opens the dialogbox "Add a new Profile" to
add a new Profile to the list.
Button "Activate profile" :
- renames the actual activ profile "user" and restores its original name.
- renames the choosen profile as "user" and stores its original name in a
memory.
- restarts AOO with the choosen profile.
Button "Cancel" to quit.
Button "Delete" : to suppress a selected profile after advertisement ("Do
you really want to suppress the sected profile ?").
Button "Export" : creates a zip archive of the selected profile in the list
to can save and share it with other users, or send a corrupt profile for
expertise.
Button "Help" : displays an information text about what is a profile and
what is stored in it. It's not so clear for most users (me included). An
opportunity to clarify definitely this question.
Dialogbox "Add a new UI Profile"
Allows to install a new Profile in the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory
- Button "Browse" near an editing zone to search the new Profile (.zip
file) to install.
- Button "OK" : unzip the choosen .zip file and installs the resultant
directory to the "AOO_4.1\User\OpenOffice4\" directory. Returns to the
dialogbox "Available UI-Profiles" and actualizes the list.
- Button "Cancel" to quit and return to the dialogbox "Available
UI-Profiles" without modifications.
Possible interests :
- more flexibility with a single product. No reduction of size, but most
computers currently support AOO without any problem.
- adaptable UI in a school context or for users with low needs.
- for advanced users, possibility to create more sophisticated profiles
(integrating sets of special templates or galleries, etc. ) for specific
purposes (i.e. lawyers, translators, specific technical needs), and
shareable with other colleagues.
Some questions about that :
- Interest or not, from a marketing point of view, for instance?
- Feasability : easy or not easy task ? Cost of ressources acceptable or
not ?Unreachable objectiv ?
- Implementation directly in the AOO code obligatory or possible
installation through an extension "ChangeProfile" ?
- Standard profiles could be created inside the users mailing list, after
discussion, to select the commands to integrate by default in the the
different standard levels. Certainly not a trivial work to select the
commands. After that, an advanced user can always refine the standard
profiles or replace them with its own personal profiles.
Thank you to have read this piece of bad English up to the end ;-)
Regards
--
gw
RE: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
I recommend something more neutral such as Starter, Intermediate, and Full or some equivalent, so it is about the interface, not the user of it. The default on an install could be Starter in the absence of an existing user configuration. Should we consider having the skins simply be options on a single binary, especially since they should all be able to consume the same ODF files? This should mean that the same localizations would work and be done once for a release. The help system might be specialized based on the skin selection, but that is an isolatable provision. There would also be no explosion in the builds and problems of users having to choose among them. I am assuming there would be no dramatic difference in the "chrome" so the move among levels is not startling in terms of appearance, but more in availability of menus, sidebars, some dialogs, etc. And, of course, this is yet one more interesting area where we would have to find developers that are equipped and available to work on something like this. - Dennis THINKING OUT LOUD [To help with interchange, the configuration file could be used to signal which level was used to produce a document, so that the consumer has some idea what might be needed to edit all of its features. Having this be smooth in all directions takes some more thought.] My limited sense of OOo4Kids is that it is not just the build of OpenOffice but the packaging of extensions and other aids that matters. The downside of a single distribution is that it does not become smaller than the current one. I don't know if that matters for an OOo4Kids clone or not. OT: This is a problem that Microsoft Office has attempted to address in a variety of ways over the years. The idea is not to confront new users and the very occasional users with a plethora of choices and complex menus. One attempt involved progressive disclosure of additional options and choices based on what an *individual* user tended to use, so it was personalized and dynamic. Like it or not, the ribbon was the replacement for all that. One useful feature about the ribbon is that it can be collapsed and almost all of the application window used for the document being worked on. The context (right-click) menu provides a variety of immediate actions depending on where the cursor is and the ribbon can be recalled when needed. And there are substantial provisions for customization, including simple tuning by users who put features they use often on a quick-start bar next to the window title. I put a sample screen capture about this at <https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=126098#c9>. -Original Message- From: jan i [mailto:j...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, February 16, 2015 01:26 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status On Monday, February 16, 2015, RA Stehmann wrote: > On 15.02.2015 23:14, Guy Waterval wrote: > > > > > > You could reduce the number of options here. For instance OOoLight is not > > necessary. The differences with OOo4Kids are too small. > > Novice, Intermediate and Advanced (AOO without modifications) should be > > enough (personal opinion). > > > IMO the brand (OOoLight) should be kept and a special skin, so adults > need not to use a "kiddy" skin, if they want to use a lighter office suit. In order to keep it (as AOO) we. need to know - is the brand registred and eho has the current right to the brand - can we as AOO provide resources to keep this alive I think it is a good downstream project, but I do not currently see a possibility to add this to the AOO project. rgds jan i > > But this may not be important. > > Regards > Michael > > -- Sent from My iPad, sorry for any misspellings. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On Monday, February 16, 2015, RA Stehmann wrote: > On 15.02.2015 23:14, Guy Waterval wrote: > > > > > > You could reduce the number of options here. For instance OOoLight is not > > necessary. The differences with OOo4Kids are too small. > > Novice, Intermediate and Advanced (AOO without modifications) should be > > enough (personal opinion). > > > IMO the brand (OOoLight) should be kept and a special skin, so adults > need not to use a "kiddy" skin, if they want to use a lighter office suit. In order to keep it (as AOO) we. need to know - is the brand registred and eho has the current right to the brand - can we as AOO provide resources to keep this alive I think it is a good downstream project, but I do not currently see a possibility to add this to the AOO project. rgds jan i > > But this may not be important. > > Regards > Michael > > -- Sent from My iPad, sorry for any misspellings.
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On 15.02.2015 23:14, Guy Waterval wrote: > > You could reduce the number of options here. For instance OOoLight is not > necessary. The differences with OOo4Kids are too small. > Novice, Intermediate and Advanced (AOO without modifications) should be > enough (personal opinion). > IMO the brand (OOoLight) should be kept and a special skin, so adults need not to use a "kiddy" skin, if they want to use a lighter office suit. But this may not be important. Regards Michael signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Hello, 2015-02-14 23:36 GMT+01:00 jonathon : > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > [..] > > That would require one addition to the ">Tools >Options >Appearance" > Select UI-Profile, and offer: > * Prebuilt; > * Default; > * Custom; > That's exactly what we have discussed by Educoo, but not so sophisticated : only 3 levels: Beginner, Intermediate and Expert. I already have addressed this issue on this list in the past, but I didn't get an answer. I have also tried to test a possible interest by EuroOffice, but also without result. My conclusion is that it could be not so easy to implement or not possible via an extension. > Clicking on "Prebuilt" has the following options: > * Ooo4Kids; > * OOoLight; > * Novice; > * Basic; > * Intermediate; > * Advanced; > * Default; > You could reduce the number of options here. For instance OOoLight is not necessary. The differences with OOo4Kids are too small. Novice, Intermediate and Advanced (AOO without modifications) should be enough (personal opinion). > > Clicking on "Custom" has the following options: > * Custom1; > * Custom2; > * Custom3; > * Custom4; > * Custom5; > * Custom6; > * Custom7; > > > Custom1, Custom2, .. Custom7, would be created by users, not the > project. The major use-case I see for the "Custom#" profiles, is an > office restricting/granting users access to specific parts of AOo. > > In theory, and maybe in practice, people will wrap their Custom# as an > extension, for distribution to third parties. > Custom is a nice idea for people working in specific areas, for instance chemists, physicians, translators, etc. > > > not the perfect way but it has the merit to be realizable without any > modification of the code. > > In one sense, both OOo4Kids and OOoLight were nothing more than > sophisticated skins. Yes, they did gut some of the innards of OOo, but > that gutting would have had minimal impact on _most_ users. > OOo4Kids and OOoLight were not just limited to that. There was also the independence from Java, the decoupling of the base module, the list of Calc functions adapted to different levels, etc. These changes will not be possible by a profile mechanism, but this method should be an acceptable workaround to adjust AOO to different user levels or needs. Regards -- gw
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 14/02/15 19:47, Guy Waterval wrote: > more easy to simplify the interface of AOO and adapt it for the school For both OOoLight and OOo4Kids, if a function was accessible using keystrokes in OOo, it was accessible in those products. However, if the function required mouse-clicks in OOo, then it was not available in either OOo4Kids or OOoLight. > A possible but limited way to reach such an objective is to create specific > AOO profiles That would require one addition to the ">Tools >Options >Appearance" Select UI-Profile, and offer: * Prebuilt; * Default; * Custom; Clicking on "Prebuilt" has the following options: * Ooo4Kids; * OOoLight; * Novice; * Basic; * Intermediate; * Advanced; * Default; Clicking on "Custom" has the following options: * Custom1; * Custom2; * Custom3; * Custom4; * Custom5; * Custom6; * Custom7; Custom1, Custom2, .. Custom7, would be created by users, not the project. The major use-case I see for the "Custom#" profiles, is an office restricting/granting users access to specific parts of AOo. In theory, and maybe in practice, people will wrap their Custom# as an extension, for distribution to third parties. > not the perfect way but it has the merit to be realizable without any > modification of the code. In one sense, both OOo4Kids and OOoLight were nothing more than sophisticated skins. Yes, they did gut some of the innards of OOo, but that gutting would have had minimal impact on _most_ users. FWIW, I'd rather see all of the built-in functionality and capability available as a set of keystroke commands. A superset of The WordStar Command Set. Literally anything that can currently be done by using mouse-clicks, should be doable by using just keystrokes. jonathon -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJU383vAAoJEKG7hs8nSMR7w2cP/1DqffZogKns/HGAzd2ojGPO OiIMLzFtoODb1mzvB5ncBkojsp8MURwZsh9FVOSHA4cq2b+oKqwIG3MMDskD+e4g o+RtN5CKMsyBjA512/AFYwdXtANxMBfbQQl6H/BWeA03te4/QoY9CXQqOOGmp7JQ weGuRi8fwMfSzkdgQbA8JYM/d4iIy6B004WK2gA9cuW8h19tmCl20OS8jTtsYqTg mPTzDWVRL53KoXxFA0MEd7wtLT2oVDZ0LqYFHVYlvzcO95J8QuJMNuGJund2eOap bcML+erYthtd3jpE3hO+hmUrwF6NU5KS1Neb/iSQA8ubKX+nd+PuUtNVU1fypb3E CTj06MwKdW89JpBM3kTI4RcSOclHvvbpA2SB1BO5pyRoWhBD31A0VVsLrZITGe7U GPExKgQl+tKUObp9KLbxogbPsEdskWYGKhpkM6ss11c7ygeyAhWD2jLviS2qSZAQ +FsNY9ynBT36nXO1/yJG5ssbf1GKWOphEPoGIEj6/ZTOtXVGbCF8xYCnVuLrce7b isznNo+jaJXQ/DIWuD745/WVl9TtuBtTY+vlWy4AbPM3VZOaPeyMCOuZNdCYkm3G 2xj5Q34wWadKMN5OFrPzGGTqfSXFAn3JLtpHw+Xi7Yj5VL9zP1p6WL4gXR2lgCSw 7L740DYNzhwsaBsqAWWj =Zyw3 -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Hi Michael, Hi all, 2015-02-13 9:42 GMT+01:00 RA Stehmann : > On 13.02.2015 09:05, jan i wrote: > > > > > > >> I cannot see them included in the original IP clearance, so my best > guess > >> is that they were forgotten, but others might know more. > > > > I think, that both products are derived works from OpenOffice.org. > Exactly. > Maybe the people, who developed both projects, have not all signed a > copyright assignment contract with SUN or Oracle. > I think so. > [...] > > OOo4Kids is a fine product and can be important for the success of Free > Software. > Yes, but perhaps that the maintaining of OOoKids could also disperse the forces instead of concentrate the effort on AOO. Specific functions for the school can be provided as extensions, as our member Mary B. already does, with her PicoSvox extension, for instance . So, I wonder if it couldn't be more easy to simplify the interface of AOO and adapt it for the school, as OOo4Kids did, but avoiding to maintain two separated products, acting directly on AOO. A possible but limited way to reach such an objectiv is to create specific AOO profiles adapted for different categories of students. It's perhaps not the perfect way but it has the merit to be realizable without any modification of the code. Perhaps other more sophisticated solutions are also possible, but I'm not a coder. Regards -- gw > >
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Hi Andrea, Hi all, 2015-02-13 20:51 GMT+01:00 Andrea Pescetti : > On 13/02/2015 jonathon wrote: > >> Were these projects (OOo4Kids, OooLight) included, when OOo became an >> Apache project? >> > > No. But as several people pointed out, they have always been independent > projects. Eric's messages to this list cover pretty much all discussions we > had about them: > http://markmail.org/search/?q=list%3Aorg.apache.incubator. > ooo-dev+from%3A%22eric+b%22 > > (note that discussions referring to OOo4Kids being "included" do not refer > to the source code; they refer to it being listed in the > https://forum.openoffice.org/en/forum/ header for support). > > If so, have they since been abandoned? >> > > No idea, but they are managed independently of the Apache OpenOffice > project. > The developpement is curruntly stopped due to a lack of coders, Marie B. being our latest capacity for the code. The actual tendency is to restrict the activity to the production of ressources for OpenOffice in the form of extensions. I forward this message to the CA mailing list of Educoo. Regards -- gw > >
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On 13/02/2015 jonathon wrote: Were these projects (OOo4Kids, OooLight) included, when OOo became an Apache project? No. But as several people pointed out, they have always been independent projects. Eric's messages to this list cover pretty much all discussions we had about them: http://markmail.org/search/?q=list%3Aorg.apache.incubator.ooo-dev+from%3A%22eric+b%22 (note that discussions referring to OOo4Kids being "included" do not refer to the source code; they refer to it being listed in the https://forum.openoffice.org/en/forum/ header for support). If so, have they since been abandoned? No idea, but they are managed independently of the Apache OpenOffice project. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
My recollection is that OOo4Kids was intended to remain downstream and under LGPL in any case. The OOo4Kids developer participated on the AOO Podling. There was a complicated disagreement (not about licensing and more about AOO's unwillingness to arbitrate a conflict between third parties) that had the developer bolt from AOO. Please do not trust my recollection. It is better to see what is on the AOO dev archive back in 2011-2012. - Dennis -Original Message- From: RA Stehmann [mailto:anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de] Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 00:43 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status On 13.02.2015 09:05, jan i wrote: > > >> I cannot see them included in the original IP clearance, so my best guess >> is that they were forgotten, but others might know more. > I think, that both products are derived works from OpenOffice.org. Maybe the people, who developed both projects, have not all signed a copyright assignment contract with SUN or Oracle. So we have to aware some legal problems. We should find out first, who are the developers of these products and how we can contact them. OOo4Kids is a fine product and can be important for the success of Free Software. Kind regards Michael - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
>who are the developers of these products and >how we can contact them. See Eric Bachard https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/User:Ericb - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On 13.02.2015 09:05, jan i wrote: > > >> I cannot see them included in the original IP clearance, so my best guess >> is that they were forgotten, but others might know more. > I think, that both products are derived works from OpenOffice.org. Maybe the people, who developed both projects, have not all signed a copyright assignment contract with SUN or Oracle. So we have to aware some legal problems. We should find out first, who are the developers of these products and how we can contact them. OOo4Kids is a fine product and can be important for the success of Free Software. Kind regards Michael signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 13/02/15 08:05, jan i wrote: >so my best guess is that they were forgotten, That would be "forgotten by developers". The current Trinidad and Tobago DVD contains OOo4Kids. jonathon -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJU3bSjAAoJEKG7hs8nSMR7GvUP/RKkY9WwojyujLXFk17qdORc Sk2JvUnboUn5J+WTD6cXyL9WCM/JlmtJ5Pv/l29KVtmehWFps8RR/sJ49TirhKo+ Vk1xNLEj1+CXM45Fb4ku2drzPqkxs5jlHDEVT/HHljcYR1Yx3DTZnmBTFUn1edDT FyT0Nmw4xiofkY654+iS6u7+b92/qkzFyxVxPC8GHfacQvDnWb2bZrSQcHcPqLpR jYT+OvsV1vb5Dan/1RSGXhXzAoMa9dA1CTod6i7qN/u6DLcf/uonBXhZXDj7c6QG oiSrFUuzkmoXvNxxiKoAnfG8S22ULJgjfyPaiUZ7xv/VAuOiAniMdFX/C9baysE5 oJSaO8zhp1aLdpFdKlBmL+uzm3cZvV14wHqh/70hW7R9xRsMr3SZm1DPTBSkaYRV h4aU2Xxii4H6iMKuVpcc/4KhnFGR3YLt6pxCB6ej9NNR3pbFVjcPQpKGcpUnrUNN 2q74OzeOqKSTeo5KqARBPxzxqO6/PkCmIIXFRBzQjnMsara4she1o7jujw7Y0knK LsqQiYi0AAoQXd8jnI4WCpp9cLeURhq9GhdPSKMs7Yy11mMB2vyBLfOi5As/kESE hUIDRi7QhEX1sslzieANRlzLe2bvuWVdE4LdmUcLiobwwciQ2NEczOqKdAg0yWok /av7cUkwMZwuGihQ9bh2 =GSg+ -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
jan i wrote: > On 13 February 2015 at 08:58, jonathon wrote: > > All: > > My impression was that when Apache Foundation accepted OOo, they also > accepted the OOo4Kids and OOoLight projects. > > https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Education_Project/OOo4Kids says that > the OOo4Kids has been depreciated, and points to > http://educoo.org/OOo4Kids.php as the main page. > > As far as OOoLight goes, the only hit on the Apache Wiki is > > https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE_%D0%9F%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8:_%D1%83%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%8B_%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE > , > which is a description of things that can be removed from OOo, to > improve performance/reduce the CPU/memory requirements. > > OOo4Kids 1.3 can be downloaded from > http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOo4Kids.php, and is licenced under the > LGPL 3.0. > > http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/ lists December 2013 as the date > of OOo4Kids 1.3.1, as the most recent release. > > OOoLight 1.1 can be downloaded from > http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOoLight.php. > > OOoLight_1.1_120609_LinuxIntel_install_rpm.tar.gz is listed at > http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/files/OOoLight/Linux/1.1/en-US/ > with a modification date of 2013-12-30. The sourceforge site implies > that it is LGPL 3.0. > > Were these projects (OOo4Kids, OooLight) included, when OOo became an > Apache project? > If so, have they since been abandoned? > > >> I cannot see them included in the original IP clearance, so my best guess >> is that they were forgotten, but others might know more. > >> rgds >> jan i > > > jonathon These were independent projects forked from OOo. They were not part of the original IP clearance, because Sun/Oracle never owned them. Dave - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
Пятница, 13 февраля 2015, 7:58 UTC от jonathon : >-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- >Hash: SHA1 > >All: > >My impression was that when Apache Foundation accepted OOo, they also >accepted the OOo4Kids and OOoLight projects. > >https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Education_Project/OOo4Kids says that >the OOo4Kids has been depreciated, and points to >http://educoo.org/OOo4Kids.php as the main page. > >As far as OOoLight goes, the only hit on the Apache Wiki is >https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE_%D0%9F%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8:_%D1%83%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%8B_%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE > , >which is a description of things that can be removed from OOo, to >improve performance/reduce the CPU/memory requirements. > >OOo4Kids 1.3 can be downloaded from >http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOo4Kids.php , and is licenced under the >LGPL 3.0. > >http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/ lists December 2013 as the date >of OOo4Kids 1.3.1, as the most recent release. > >OOoLight 1.1 can be downloaded from >http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOoLight.php . > >OOoLight_1.1_120609_LinuxIntel_install_rpm.tar.gz is listed at >http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/files/OOoLight/Linux/1.1/en-US/ >with a modification date of 2013-12-30. The sourceforge site implies >that it is LGPL 3.0. > > This versions are based on OpenOffice.org 3.2 -- Yakov Reztsov
Re: OOo4Kids & OOoLight Status
On 13 February 2015 at 08:58, jonathon wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > All: > > My impression was that when Apache Foundation accepted OOo, they also > accepted the OOo4Kids and OOoLight projects. > > https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Education_Project/OOo4Kids says that > the OOo4Kids has been depreciated, and points to > http://educoo.org/OOo4Kids.php as the main page. > > As far as OOoLight goes, the only hit on the Apache Wiki is > > https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE_%D0%9F%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%B7%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8:_%D1%83%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%8B_%D0%9E%D0%9E%D0%BE > , > which is a description of things that can be removed from OOo, to > improve performance/reduce the CPU/memory requirements. > > OOo4Kids 1.3 can be downloaded from > http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOo4Kids.php, and is licenced under the > LGPL 3.0. > > http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/ lists December 2013 as the date > of OOo4Kids 1.3.1, as the most recent release. > > OOoLight 1.1 can be downloaded from > http://educoo.org/TelechargerOOoLight.php. > > OOoLight_1.1_120609_LinuxIntel_install_rpm.tar.gz is listed at > http://sourceforge.net/projects/educooo/files/OOoLight/Linux/1.1/en-US/ > with a modification date of 2013-12-30. The sourceforge site implies > that it is LGPL 3.0. > > Were these projects (OOo4Kids, OooLight) included, when OOo became an > Apache project? > If so, have they since been abandoned? > I cannot see them included in the original IP clearance, so my best guess is that they were forgotten, but others might know more. rgds jan i > > jonathon > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- > Version: GnuPG v1 > > iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJU3a61AAoJEKG7hs8nSMR7PEcP/1E7WrHGr7MsLsov6l9+QVNC > BAwJcFO3elkz37Ds4CGYVjEvSgznOzukd4bLvnuezQ6KCg309Lzgj8KgL8u9Rtn9 > dafUiMu2pgZwU9lhzxD+Xx59ZpJUHrYw/yP3tw9cWfnp44eVCuKxWxLqLghwvftR > Zt5HKvEnvUEt3isl87fjK3Jtujq1iy0aqzhpQbMg9wPcWYcbPgbICs/E/fZDbLNh > 6NEM2OapCw4ZandD4WstGWXWYW3vwCubIcldwWskNfeucq7CmKQS7bRA43b6I/zC > TgAE2aTJlFcfwVEN5ONZBzTEYQ1xwK85Vk8KA3YTI1EOxHUl1ftfMCxi06qzcGn6 > cjbyMECWQUZN4pkWZSHjtaCv+t/80geXwfGHO6ICB493T2FJab43JUXY05AWlf/p > QL15dfPQNtaQcIKmG5tT5Fym6bJptQW/OK5AdXt3ojYgAhQaxearbkoPSMZi6Aa/ > 20yB1cgXrj5G4HO6jJLH7AgNcA90nWkNI9s5I8lZWslA/FDZfaGE4rjONRYejU3s > qR/z5Km5WbxKazrcLVv3jCZFGQL9g9P+Ezt1+4Kx/eDXm6T5Urp/LmeqOnNepDAT > FKXVoZ013zYo4Gj3QZb5e3wHGTovRyJgZrJ8RJ8qHIPqW9FcdcdkS3847VDgwkLa > DuJc3Pleq6Cx02tUrW1v > =ZtSS > -END PGP SIGNATURE- > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > >
