Re: Selinux and pbuilder

[Sandro Mani]

On 11.12.2014 01:13, Andrew Lutomirski wrote:

On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 4:03 PM, Sandro Mani  wrote:

Hi,

Before digging around more, though I'd check here if some debian+selinux
experienced person has any ideas... I'm encountering two kinds of failure
when using pbuilder which seem selinux related:

- When building packages for newer releases (i.e. Ubuntu >= trusty),
pbuilder used to fail with

[...]
dpkg: error processing archive
.deb (--unpack):
  cannot get security labeling handle: No such file or directory
[...]

This looked like upstream [1], at the end of which it was suggested to
bind-mount /sys/fs/selinux into the pbuilder chroot and remount it
read-only. Did so, and things worked, horray.

- Today I built the package for an older release, and now, with selinux
mounted read-only, it fails with
[...]
I: Extracting source
Password: su: Authentication failure

Hmm.

Can you run setpriv -d inside your chroot and see what it says?

You could also try running su directly and confirming that it works.

In an ubuntu precise chroot (i.e. oldish) with selinux mounted 
read-only, su does indeed not work (that is, it asks for a password), 
but mounted read-write it does work (no password asked). setpriv does 
not seem to be available on debian systems.

In an ubuntu utopic chroot, su works with either setting.

Thanks,
Sandro

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Re: PackageKit refresh(?) is wiping out local repositories and changing owner to root

[Remi Collet]

Le 30/11/2014 01:20, Sandro Mani a écrit :
> Hi,
> 
> Today it happened a handful of times that my local rpm repository got
> wiped out (except for the repodata folder), and owner/group changed to
> root/root (including the repodata folder). After playing around a bit, I
> noticed that a
> 

Same bug affects me :(


An update to libhif 1.6-2 in testing seems to improve things

But I still see a empty folder created by root

Repo definition:

baseurl=file:///home/rpmbuild/site/rpms/fedora/$releasever/remi/$basearch/


Dir created (yes, with the $ sign):
/home/rpmbuild/site/rpms/fedora/$releasever/remi/$basearch/


Remi.

P.S. for now I have simply remove libhif, PackageKit, apper and deps
(I really don't need them)
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Re: Other download options

[Reindl Harald]

Am 11.12.2014 um 05:32 schrieb Felix Miata:

[ re: https://getfedora.org/ ]

Reindl Harald composed on 2014-12-11 01:06 (UTC+0100):


Felix Miata composed:



Actions speak louder than words. The need to zoom 3X-6X to reach legible a
legible state belies "polished, easy to use".



no need to zoom anything and as said my eyes are really not good


Your image hasn't presented anything useful, because you offered insufficient
context to know what it is that you see when you look at what you captured.
All we know is "my eyes are not really good", whatever that means.


i explained what that means, a cornea implanted from a previously died 
person on both eyes as well as a new lense and finally able to see only 
60-70% or a normal human on the left and 90% on the right eye


that means two different pictures composed by the brain to one and so 
you can imagine that typically if i can read things without problems 
they are just fine



We have no idea what your screen size is, what your resolution is,
or what the distance between eyes and screen is. IOW, the physical
size presented to you is utterly absent.


1920x1080, 23", 96dpi and the font-size of that page is similar to 98% 
of websites i face and we create - you should really ask yourself to 
consult a doctor and check your eyes and that is by far meant insulting 
(see above paragraph!)




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Re: Other download options

[Ankur Sinha]

Hi Alexander.

On Thu, 2014-12-11 at 08:21 +0200, Alexander Ploumistos wrote:
> Sorry to cut in, but whom can I contact about localization issues with
> the getfedora.org website?

Please contact the websites team via their mailing list or trac
instance:

https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites

https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-websites/
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Regards,
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http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha


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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Richard W.M. Jones]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 12:03:58AM +0400, Igor Gnatenko wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 9:05 PM, Richard W.M. Jones  wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 05:56:43PM +, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> >> I found your email a bit confusing, so hopefully this is what you
> >> are after:
> >>
> >> (1) virt-builder --install is implemented using 'yum install'
> >>
> >> (2) virt-customize --install is implemented using 'yum install'
> >
> > More precisely it's 'yum -y install '
> >
> > I forgot: There is also an --update flag for both of these
> > commands, currently implemented using 'yum -y update'.
> yes, you can. you can also do this via dnf API ;)

It's unlikely to work for libguestfs though, since we're running those
commands in the context of a guest where we have little or no control
over what software is installed.  (Especially for virt-customize)

Rich.

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Re: "Workstation" Product defaults to wide-open firewall

[Bastien Nocera]

- Original Message -
> On 10 December 2014 at 11:47, Bastien Nocera  wrote:

> >> I see no
> >> explanation of why rygel needs a random port or why it cannot supply
> >> that information to firewalld. The same goes for any others that have
> >> random ports.
> >
> > Because that's the mechanism the kernel offers for applications when
> > selecting a
> > port isn't important, the high port isn't defined by the IANA, and the
> > specs
> > (DLNA/UPnP in this case) don't force particular ports to be opened.
> >
> > Even if we chose static ports for those (or rather port ranges, because if
> > you
> > have multiple users running, you'd need multiple ports), leaving only those
> > ports
> > opened wouldn't stop other random applications from choosing those ports to
> > do something nefarious. You're just limiting the availability of ports
> > without
> > increasing security.
> 
> There's no predefined port. So rather than picking one, which would be
> perfectly possible, any port is asked for. Yes, limiting it to one
> means only one user can use it without changing those scary settings,
> but how often is that actually done?

It's relevant enough that it's a problem.

> Having the other ports closed
> prevents unintentional exposure and also makes life harder for any
> nefarious use. But this has all been pointed out already. It also, if
> I understand correctly, means policies could be shipped with the
> package.

firewalld maintainers didn't want policy to be anywhere but in firewalld
itself (or in sub-packages).

> But if you really want to use a random port, this is what firewalld
> was for, dynamic firewall changes. In fact, a quick google finds this
> bug:
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=626188
> Which was showing progress towards rygel being able to do that. But
> it's been closed 'next release', because apparently the ports above
> 1024 have been unblocked in the firewall. Except this is not a fix, as
> (as we've learned) it doesn't apply to Fedora other than Desktop and
> Cloud. That's an interesting move, perhaps you would like to suggest a
> 'fixed in product X' resolution for use in future.

There's absolutely no way that firewalld is going to be anything but a
Fedora-only thing, which is a first problem in getting any patches to
upstream projects. Which is the first problem.

Adding support for firewalld's D-Bus APIs to every application, even
just the ones we ship by default, would demand huge amounts of work
(I think you'd be looking at a full cycle for one person just doing that).

And, as firewalld won't have application whitelists (probably because we
still can't detect applications securely), or port whitelists (because if you
don't require a root password, any app can poke holes, even behind your back),
there's not a lot of leeway in terms of user interface.

Yeah, it's fixable, it's only code, except that I don't want to make this my
life's work. We can certainly revisit when any of the above changes.

Cheers
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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Ian Malone]

On 9 December 2014 at 17:28, Radek Holy  wrote:
> Dear users of YUM and DNF,
>
> I'm writing to you regarding a request for your feedback. I would be very 
> grateful if you could send me a brief description of how you use YUM or DNF 
> currently or how would you like to use it. I am particularly interested in 
> the occurrences of "dnf/yum install" calls in your scripts. What does these 
> scripts do and what do they expect when they call the "install" command in 
> different situations?
>
> Please share with me the use cases, not the description of the "install" 
> command. Think twice before you share something because I believe it's not as 
> easy as it might seem. As an example I think it might be something like:
>

Hi,

I do different things at home (Fedora) and work (RHEL). At work our
system administrator uses satellite to push out changes (as a result
no scripting of yum), but as I do building and testing of things I
need to be able to install packages and often while maintaining
existing versions, so things will usually go:
1. yum install foo-devel
2. If offered a foo-devel with update to foo and various dependencies,
say no, if no updates then say no.
3. Copy current version of package and attempt with that appended,
e.g. yum install mesa-libGLU-devel-7.11
In the single example of a -devel package I could short circuit this
by doing an rpm -q on the base package first, but in some cases you're
installing completely new libraries, in which case offered updates
mean using
yum search --showduplicates
to find earlier available versions. Don't do this often enough to have
looked into more efficient ways of doing it, since it's not that time
consuming if the things actually exist.

Home, usually just the regular user stuff of making sure packages are
most recent. Occasionally downgrading or installing things from koji
when working with bugs.

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Richard W.M. Jones]

On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 02:20:32PM -0800, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> On 12/10/2014 02:09 PM, Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote:
> >I am using web proxy on Synology NAS at home and all my Fedora machines
> >use it for dnf/yum fetching. With on-disk cache set to 10GB it makes all
> >system upgrades and mock builds very fast.
> >
> How does the proxy work with the various mirrors?  Do you have
> client side settings to deal with that?
> 
> I wrote my own proxy in python that is specifically for yum and
> matches filenames from any url.  It's quite a hack and fails once in
> a while, but it saves me a huge amount of time and bandwidth with
> the large amount of Fedora computers I manage.  I suppose I could
> mirror the whole thing locally, but this way I only download the
> packages I need as I need them.

This is definitely a thing which is needed.

Also:

http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/09/09/half-baked-idea-content-addressable-web-proxy/#content

Rich.

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Dan Horák]

On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 14:20:32 -0800
Samuel Sieb  wrote:

> On 12/10/2014 02:09 PM, Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote:
> > I am using web proxy on Synology NAS at home and all my Fedora
> > machines use it for dnf/yum fetching. With on-disk cache set to
> > 10GB it makes all system upgrades and mock builds very fast.
> >
> How does the proxy work with the various mirrors?  Do you have client 
> side settings to deal with that?
> 
> I wrote my own proxy in python that is specifically for yum and
> matches filenames from any url.  It's quite a hack and fails once in
> a while, but it saves me a huge amount of time and bandwidth with the
> large amount of Fedora computers I manage.  I suppose I could mirror
> the whole thing locally, but this way I only download the packages I
> need as I need them.

http://sharkcz.livejournal.com/2534.html


Dan

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Re: "Workstation" Product defaults to wide-open firewall

[Matthew Miller]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 06:03:49AM -0500, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> There's absolutely no way that firewalld is going to be anything but a
> Fedora-only thing, which is a first problem in getting any patches to
> upstream projects. Which is the first problem.

Well, it's a CentOS and RHEL thing, and it's at least _packaged_ in
Debian. It might indeed become more of a thing... I'm sure its authors
would like it to. I think the C rewrite will help, although I'm not
sure of the state of that. Maybe these days a Go implementation is
called for :) )


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rawhide report: 20141211 changes

[Fedora Rawhide Report]

Compose started at Thu Dec 11 05:15:02 UTC 2014
Broken deps for i386
--
[3Depict]
3Depict-0.0.16-3.fc22.i686 requires libmgl.so.7.2.0
[Sprog]
Sprog-0.14-27.fc20.noarch requires perl(:MODULE_COMPAT_5.18.0)
[bibletime]
bibletime-2.10.1-4.fc22.i686 requires libsword-1.7.3.so
[cab]
cab-0.1.9-12.fc22.i686 requires cabal-dev
[dnssec-check]
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.i686 requires libval-threads.so.14
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.i686 requires libsres.so.14
[glances]
glances-2.1.2-2.fc22.noarch requires python-psutil >= 0:2.0.0
[kdeplasma-addons]
plasma-wallpaper-marble-4.14.3-1.fc22.i686 requires 
libmarblewidget.so.19
[nwchem]
nwchem-openmpi-6.3.2-11.fc21.i686 requires libmpi_usempi.so.1
[openstack-neutron-gbp]
openstack-neutron-gbp-2014.2-0.2.acb85f0git.fc22.noarch requires 
openstack-neutron = 0:2014.2
[pam_mapi]
pam_mapi-0.2.0-3.fc22.i686 requires libmapi.so.0
[python-selenium]
python3-selenium-2.43.0-1.fc22.noarch requires python3-rdflib
[rubygem-wirb]
rubygem-wirb-1.0.3-2.fc21.noarch requires rubygem(paint) < 0:0.9
[shogun]
shogun-doc-3.2.0.1-0.27.git20140804.96f3cf3.fc22.noarch requires 
shogun-data = 0:0.8.1-0.18.git20140804.48a1abb.fc22
[subsurface]
subsurface-4.2-3.fc22.i686 requires libmarblewidget.so.19
[uwsgi]
uwsgi-plugin-gridfs-2.0.7-2.fc22.i686 requires libmongoclient.so
uwsgi-stats-pusher-mongodb-2.0.7-2.fc22.i686 requires libmongoclient.so
[vfrnav]
vfrnav-20140510-2.fc22.i686 requires libpolyclipping.so.16
vfrnav-utils-20140510-2.fc22.i686 requires libpolyclipping.so.16
[xiphos]
xiphos-3.2.2-2.fc22.i686 requires libsword-1.7.3.so
xiphos-3.2.2-2.fc22.i686 requires libbiblesync.so.1.0.2



Broken deps for x86_64
--
[3Depict]
3Depict-0.0.16-3.fc22.x86_64 requires libmgl.so.7.2.0()(64bit)
[Sprog]
Sprog-0.14-27.fc20.noarch requires perl(:MODULE_COMPAT_5.18.0)
[bibletime]
bibletime-2.10.1-4.fc22.x86_64 requires libsword-1.7.3.so()(64bit)
[cab]
cab-0.1.9-12.fc22.x86_64 requires cabal-dev
[dnssec-check]
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.x86_64 requires 
libval-threads.so.14()(64bit)
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.x86_64 requires libsres.so.14()(64bit)
[glances]
glances-2.1.2-2.fc22.noarch requires python-psutil >= 0:2.0.0
[kdeplasma-addons]
plasma-wallpaper-marble-4.14.3-1.fc22.x86_64 requires 
libmarblewidget.so.19()(64bit)
[nwchem]
nwchem-openmpi-6.3.2-11.fc21.x86_64 requires libmpi_usempi.so.1()(64bit)
[openstack-neutron-gbp]
openstack-neutron-gbp-2014.2-0.2.acb85f0git.fc22.noarch requires 
openstack-neutron = 0:2014.2
[pam_mapi]
pam_mapi-0.2.0-3.fc22.i686 requires libmapi.so.0
pam_mapi-0.2.0-3.fc22.x86_64 requires libmapi.so.0()(64bit)
[python-selenium]
python3-selenium-2.43.0-1.fc22.noarch requires python3-rdflib
[rubygem-wirb]
rubygem-wirb-1.0.3-2.fc21.noarch requires rubygem(paint) < 0:0.9
[shogun]
shogun-doc-3.2.0.1-0.27.git20140804.96f3cf3.fc22.noarch requires 
shogun-data = 0:0.8.1-0.18.git20140804.48a1abb.fc22
[subsurface]
subsurface-4.2-3.fc22.x86_64 requires libmarblewidget.so.19()(64bit)
[uwsgi]
uwsgi-plugin-gridfs-2.0.7-2.fc22.x86_64 requires 
libmongoclient.so()(64bit)
uwsgi-stats-pusher-mongodb-2.0.7-2.fc22.x86_64 requires 
libmongoclient.so()(64bit)
[vfrnav]
vfrnav-20140510-2.fc22.i686 requires libpolyclipping.so.16
vfrnav-20140510-2.fc22.x86_64 requires libpolyclipping.so.16()(64bit)
vfrnav-utils-20140510-2.fc22.x86_64 requires 
libpolyclipping.so.16()(64bit)
[xiphos]
xiphos-3.2.2-2.fc22.x86_64 requires libsword-1.7.3.so()(64bit)
xiphos-3.2.2-2.fc22.x86_64 requires libbiblesync.so.1.0.2()(64bit)



Broken deps for armhfp
--
[3Depict]
3Depict-0.0.16-3.fc22.armv7hl requires libmgl.so.7.2.0
[Sprog]
Sprog-0.14-27.fc20.noarch requires perl(:MODULE_COMPAT_5.18.0)
[avro]
avro-mapred-1.7.5-9.fc22.noarch requires hadoop-mapreduce
avro-mapred-1.7.5-9.fc22.noarch requires hadoop-client
[bibletime]
bibletime-2.10.1-4.fc22.armv7hl requires libsword-1.7.3.so
[cab]
cab-0.1.9-12.fc22.armv7hl requires cabal-dev
[dnssec-check]
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.armv7hl requires libval-threads.so.14
dnssec-check-1.14.0.1-4.fc20.armv7hl requires libsres.so.14
[glances]
glances-2.1.2-2.fc22.noarch requires python-psutil >= 0:2.0.0
[kdeplasma-addons]
plasma-wallpaper-marble-4.14.3-1.fc22.armv7hl requires 
libmarblewidget.so.19
[openstack-neutron-gbp]
openstack-neutron-gbp-2014.2-0.2.acb85f0git.fc22.noarch requires 
openstack-neutron = 0:2014.2
[ostree]
ostree-grub2-2014.12-1.fc22.armv7hl requires grub2
[pam_mapi

License change: lirc

[Alec Leamas]

Current version in rawhide is (GPLv2 and MIT). As of 0.9.0, the license 
was plain GPLv2.

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lirc: so-name bump

[Alec Leamas]

I have pushed a new version 0.9.2 of lirc to rawhide. It changes the 
so-name from 2:1:2  to  3:0:3 .


I'm sorry for not notifying in advance, I  just missed it.

This is  upwards-compatible change, so while there is a need to rebuild 
it can wait for some time.



The following apps are affected:

audacious-plugins
banshee-community-extensions
geeqie
gnomeradio
gxine
kradio4
lcdproc
lxdream
media-explorer
mplayer
mplayer-gui
mpv
ncmpc
pulseaudio-module-lirc
python-lirc
rhythmbox-lirc
rosegarden4
totem-lirc
vlc-core
xine-ui
xmms-lirc


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lirc: so-name bump

[Alec Leamas]

I have pushed a new version 0.9.2 of lirc to rawhide. It changes the 
so-name from 2:1:2  to  3:0:3 .


I'm sorry for not notifying in advance, I  just missed it.

This is  upwards-compatible change, so while there is a need to rebuild 
it can wait for some time.



The following apps are affected:

audacious-plugins
banshee-community-extensions
geeqie
gnomeradio
gxine
kradio4
lcdproc
lxdream
media-explorer
mplayer
mplayer-gui
mpv
ncmpc
pulseaudio-module-lirc
python-lirc
rhythmbox-lirc
rosegarden4
totem-lirc
vlc-core
xine-ui
xmms-lirc


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F22 System Wide Change: Change xorg input stack to use libinput

[Jaroslav Reznik]

= Proposed System Wide Change: Change xorg input stack to use libinput =
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LibinputForXorg

Change owner(s): Hans de Goede 

Replace the current (low-level) input xorg drivers with libinput using the 
xorg-x11-drv-libinput wrapper. 

== Detailed Description ==
Currently xorg uses different input drivers depending on the device type. This 
makes it impossible to do things like middle button scrolling on the 
trackpoint on laptops where the trackpoint buttons are software-emulated 
buttons on the touchpad. Besides this the xf86-input-synaptics driver was 
never really designed for multi-touch touchpads and this causes various 
issues.

For Wayland we've been working on a new improved input stack, which is to be 
shared by all compositors and lives inside libinput. We plan to replace the 
current (low-level) input xorg drivers with libinput using the xorg-x11-drv-
libinput wrapper. 

== Scope ==
Besides xorg changes, this will also require changes to the control panel 
applets for mouse / touchpad configuration in the various desktop environments, 
as those all are hardcoded to use the xorg-x11-drv-synaptics specific 
interfaces.

* Proposal owners:
Package libinput and xorg-drv-input-libinput (done), make sure that xorg-drv-
input-libinput has the necessary config interfaces for control panel 
mouse/touchpad config applets (wip). Write patches for gnome-control-center 
mouse/touchpad capplet. Coordinate with other desktop environments.

* Other developers:
GNOME: merge the gnome-control-center patches. KDE: limits itself to standard 
X11 mouse config interfaces, no changes needed. Other Desktop Environments: 
adjust control-panel code to deal with xorg-x11-drv-libinput, merge these 
changes.

* Release engineering: N/A
* Policies and guidelines: N/A
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F22 System Wide Change: Perl 5.20

[Jaroslav Reznik]

= Proposed System Wide Change: Perl 5.20 =
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/perl5.20

Change owner(s):  Jitka Plesníková , Petr Písař 


A new perl 5.20 version brings a lot of changes done over a year of 
development. See 5.20.0 perldelta [1] for more details. 

== Detailed Description ==
New perl is released every year and updates containing mainly bug fixes follow 
during the year. The 5.20.0 version is stable release this year. 

== Scope ==
Every Perl package will be rebuilt in a dedicated ''f22-perl'' build-root 
against perl 5.20.0 and then if no major problem emerges the packages will be 
merged back to ''f22'' build-root. 

* Proposal owners:
New perl and all packages requiring perl or a Perl module will be rebuilt into 
f22-perl build-root.

* Other developers:
Owners of packages that fail to rebuild, mainly perl-sig users, will be asked 
using Bugzilla to fix or remove their packages from the distribution.

* Release engineering:
Release engineers will be asked for new f22-perl build-root inheriting from 
f22 build-root. After successful finishing the rebuild, they will be asked to 
merge f22-perl packages back to f22 build-root.

* Policies and guidelines:
No policies have to be modified to complete this change.

[1] http://search.cpan.org/dist/perl-5.20.0/pod/perldelta.pod
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F22 Self Contained Change: Preupgrade Assistant

[Jaroslav Reznik]

= Proposed Self Contained: Preupgrade Assistant =
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Preupgrade_Assistant

Change owner(s): Petr Hracek  

The Preugrade Assistant is a tool to help people upgrade from one release to 
another and be sure to track important manual configuration changes they 
performed. 

== Detailed Description ==
The idea behind the The Preupgrade Assistant came from the notion that even 
during the rather short release cycles in Fedora occasionally there are 
changes that are incompatible between releases and which are either hard or 
nearly impossible to cover during a standard package upgrade. Examples would 
be major version upgrades of applications or services that change configuration 
file syntax or on-disk date format changes.

The Preupgrade Assistant works by analyzing the source system and will 
generate a report which will offer information and configuration files for 
typically changed settings and services. It offers a plugin architecture where 
component or functional area owners can contribute and write their on plugins 
in python, bash or perl that can generate additional information for the 
report. 

== Scope ==
The Preupgrade Assistant is a standalone tool that doesn't affect any other 
component in the system. The scope for Fedora 22 is to provide the basic 
framework and initial plugins for general use. Additional component or 
functional area plugins rely on component owners to actively help working on 
them. 

* Proposal owners: Provide the basic framework and initial plugins for general 
use
* Other developers: Provide additional component or functional area plugins 
(optional)
* Release engineering: N/A (not a System Wide Change)
* Policies and guidelines: N/A (not a System Wide Change)
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Re: fedup speed

[Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 08:05:42AM +0100, drago01 wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 4:37 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
>  wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 06:51:51PM -0500, Sam Varshavchik wrote:
> >> Josh Stone writes:
> >>
> >> >On 12/10/2014 11:18 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
> >> >> 2. at the end, fedup creates a log by running 'journalctl -a -m',
> >> >>which is --all --merge. This seems a bit excessive. On this machine
> >> >>I have 4.5 GB of logs from this machine, plus a few GB more from
> >> >>other sources. journalctl is not very fast (which is another issue),
> >> >>but even if it was, dumping all this is bound to be slow, and not
> >> >>particularly useful.
> >> >
> >> >https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1161366
> >>
> >> In the meantime, how about adding a blurb to known issues, giving
> >> the systemd-fu to flush all logs, before running fedup?
I added a blurb: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Common_F21_bugs#fedup-journald.
I don't think this a very serious issue, but might be annoying in some
circumstances.

Zbyszek
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Re: fedup speed

[drago01]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 4:27 PM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
 wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 08:05:42AM +0100, drago01 wrote:
>> On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 4:37 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
>>  wrote:
>> > On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 06:51:51PM -0500, Sam Varshavchik wrote:
>> >> Josh Stone writes:
>> >>
>> >> >On 12/10/2014 11:18 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
>> >> >> 2. at the end, fedup creates a log by running 'journalctl -a -m',
>> >> >>which is --all --merge. This seems a bit excessive. On this machine
>> >> >>I have 4.5 GB of logs from this machine, plus a few GB more from
>> >> >>other sources. journalctl is not very fast (which is another issue),
>> >> >>but even if it was, dumping all this is bound to be slow, and not
>> >> >>particularly useful.
>> >> >
>> >> >https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1161366
>> >>
>> >> In the meantime, how about adding a blurb to known issues, giving
>> >> the systemd-fu to flush all logs, before running fedup?
> I added a blurb: 
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Common_F21_bugs#fedup-journald.
> I don't think this a very serious issue, but might be annoying in some
> circumstances.

Does not seem like you added anything on this site ...
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Re: fedup speed

[Michael Cronenworth]

On 12/11/2014 09:30 AM, drago01 wrote:

Does not seem like you added anything on this site ...


Caching issue. Refresh the page a few times, or login, and it will show up.
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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Miroslav Suchý]

On 12/09/2014 06:28 PM, Radek Holy wrote:
> Dear users of YUM and DNF,
> 
> I'm writing to you regarding a request for your feedback. I would be very 
> grateful if you could send me a brief description of how you use YUM or DNF 
> currently or how would you like to use it. I am particularly interested in 
> the occurrences of "dnf/yum install" calls in your scripts. What does these 
> scripts do and what do they expect when they call the "install" command in 
> different situations?
> 
> Please share with me the use cases, not the description of the "install" 
> command. Think twice before you share something because I believe it's not as 
> easy as it might seem. As an example I think it might be something like:
> 
> - "I call YUM install, because I want to get given packages into my system 
> and I don't care whether it requires an upgrade or downgrade or what." or
> - "I want to get them there but it should protect me against dangerous 
> operations like downgrades" or
> - "I often make typos, so I expect that the program knows what I mean" or
> - "it would be nice if it would literally perform the installation; if any of 
> the packages cannot be installed because of any reason, it should fail".
> 
> Not something like: "that's obvious that the install command should never 
> downgrade packages".
> 
> Please focus on *use cases*. The *real* (non-hypothetical) use cases. Not on 
> the command's name as it might also result in a new command (while preserving 
> the well-known install command together with an appropriate behaviour).
> 
> I don't mind if you send it offlist (or to another list). I think there is no 
> need to comment on anyone's use case. Every case is valid. Just not every 
> case can be supported.
> 
> Thank you very much in advance.
> 


I quite often start new instances from images in Cloud (either OpenStack or 
EC2) and do "yum upgrade". But because root
partition is very limited (e.g. 3GB) and "yum upgrade" needs XX MB of 
additional space I need to manually run:
  yum install foo
  yum install bar
with several packages, which does not have too much deps and repeat it until
  yum upgrade
finally fit the free space.

If I can have "dnf upgrade-in-chunks" I would be very happy.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1032541

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Re: fedup speed

[drago01]

On Thursday, December 11, 2014, Michael Cronenworth  wrote:

> On 12/11/2014 09:30 AM, drago01 wrote:
>
>> Does not seem like you added anything on this site ...
>>
>
> Caching issue. Refresh the page a few times, or login, and it will show up.
>
> Ah indeed nm then.
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Re: Is ARM productized?

[Darryl L. Pierce]

On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 08:36:55AM -0500, Stephen Gallagher wrote:
> On Wed, 2014-12-10 at 15:21 +0200, Nikos Roussos wrote:
> > Having some hard time to discover the ARM F21 image at the new website.
> > Is the link somewhere and I completely missed it?
> > 
> > I found the ARM images directly from the ftp
> > http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/21/Images/armhfp/
> > 
> > But as a general question is ARM productized? Would it make sense to
> > have Workstation or Server images for ARM?
> 
> The Fedora Server has an install tree for ARM devices that can boot the
> installer from the network:
> 
> http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux//releases/21/Server/armhfp/os/

Is there an updated recipe for installing F21 onto a Chromebook?

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Re: F22 Self Contained Change: Preupgrade Assistant

[Bruno Wolff III]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 15:06:25 +0100,
 Jaroslav Reznik  wrote:

= Proposed Self Contained: Preupgrade Assistant =
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Preupgrade_Assistant

Change owner(s): Petr Hracek 

The Preugrade Assistant is a tool to help people upgrade from one release to
another and be sure to track important manual configuration changes they
performed.


Will this handle packages that have been dropped but not obsoleted in 
the next release?

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Miroslav Suchý]

On 12/11/2014 12:56 PM, Dan Horák wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 14:20:32 -0800
> Samuel Sieb  wrote:
> 
>> On 12/10/2014 02:09 PM, Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote:
>>> I am using web proxy on Synology NAS at home and all my Fedora
>>> machines use it for dnf/yum fetching. With on-disk cache set to
>>> 10GB it makes all system upgrades and mock builds very fast.
>>>
>> How does the proxy work with the various mirrors?  Do you have client 
>> side settings to deal with that?
>>
>> I wrote my own proxy in python that is specifically for yum and
>> matches filenames from any url.  It's quite a hack and fails once in
>> a while, but it saves me a huge amount of time and bandwidth with the
>> large amount of Fedora computers I manage.  I suppose I could mirror
>> the whole thing locally, but this way I only download the packages I
>> need as I need them.
> 
> http://sharkcz.livejournal.com/2534.html

Some variables for squid, which we used in Spacewalk Proxy and you can find it 
useful:

# Average object size, used to estimate number of objects your
# cache can hold.  The default is 13 KB.
# I done the calculation across all RHEL package we had in DB several years ago
store_avg_object_size 817 KB

# rpm will hardly ever change, force to chache it for very long time
refresh_pattern  \.rpm$  10080 100% 525960 override-expire override-lastmod 
ignore-reload reload-into-ims
refresh_pattern .   0   100%525960

# if transport is canceled, finish downloading anyway
quick_abort_pct -1
quick_abort_min -1 KB

# when range is required, download whole file anyway
# when we request rpm header, we will nearly always get
# request for the rest of the file
range_offset_limit -1 KB

# we download only from 1 server, default is 1024
# which is too much for us
fqdncache_size 4


And of course, it is good idea to tune this according your HW:
cache_mem 400 MB
maximum_object_size 200 MB
maximum_object_size_in_memory 1024 KB
# Size should be about 60% of your free space
cache_dir ufs /var/spool/squid 15000 16 256


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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Matthew Miller]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 05:15:25PM +0100, Miroslav Suchý wrote:
> I quite often start new instances from images in Cloud (either
> OpenStack or EC2) and do "yum upgrade". But because root partition is
> very limited (e.g. 3GB) and "yum upgrade" needs XX MB of additional
> space I need to manually run:

Hmmm — are you doing this on purpose or is growpart not working for
you?

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/11/2014 02:57 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:

This is definitely a thing which is needed.

Also:

http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/09/09/half-baked-idea-content-addressable-web-proxy/#content

I did read that.  It's one step beyond what I have, but how does the 
hash get sent?  The client would need to be modified (yum plugin?) to 
send the hash.


My proxy is actually pretty effective as it is.  It just needs to be a 
bit more robust about slow or stuck connections.

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Heads up: F21 LLVM rebase

[Adam Jackson]

I've started staging an LLVM 3.5 rebase in F21.  I hope to have
everything built by this Friday and the update available in testing by
Monday.  Test feedback would be particularly appreciated on secondary
arches and radeonsi 3D hardware.

- ajax

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Heads up! Fedora 21 and Ejabberd

[Peter Lemenkov]

Hello All!

I'm really sad to say that but I overlooked a very nasty upgrade issue
while updating Ejabberd up to a very recent version. As a result it's
barely working now (at least some perfectly valid configurations are
now refusing connections) and what is even worse *it will wipe out all
the data from the previous ejabberd installation* (chat logs, history,
user subscriptions, etc) during the upgrade.

So far I have the only advice - don't upgrade Ejabberd if possible.
I'll try to provide a fixed build soon.

I'm terribly sorry for that.

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Richard W.M. Jones]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 09:06:46AM -0800, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> On 12/11/2014 02:57 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> >This is definitely a thing which is needed.
> >
> >Also:
> >
> >http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/09/09/half-baked-idea-content-addressable-web-proxy/#content
> >
> I did read that.  It's one step beyond what I have, but how does the
> hash get sent?  The client would need to be modified (yum plugin?)
> to send the hash.

Yes, it does require a modified client.

Yum already has the hash information - there are sha256 checksums of
the RPMs in the primary XML metadata.  Yum just needs to send them in
the HTTP request.  So I'm assuming the modifications are fairly
simple.  (Not actually have done them or tried to do them of course!)

> My proxy is actually pretty effective as it is.  It just needs to be
> a bit more robust about slow or stuck connections.

Rich.

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Planned Outage: Updates and Migrations - 2014-12-15, 2014-12-16, 2014-12-17 22UTC

[Kevin Fenzi]

Planned Outage: Updates and Migrations - 2014-12-15, 2014-12-16, 2014-12-17 
22UTC

 There will be 3 outages, each starting at 22UTC on 2014-12-15,
 2014-12-16, and 2014-12-17 which will last approximately 4 hours.

 To convert UTC to your local time, take a look at
 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/UTCHowto
 or run:

 date -d '2014-12-15 22:00 UTC'

 Reason for outage:

 2014-12-15 - We will be updating servers and rebooting them with the
 latest updates.

 2014-12-16 - We will be migrating database servers to RHEL7 and ansible
 deployed.

 2014-12-17 - We will be migrating various other virthosts and
 instances to RHEL7 and ansible deployed.

 Affected Services:

 All services may be affected in the outage window, although we will try
 and keep downtime for any one service to a minimum.

 Ask Fedora - http://ask.fedoraproject.org/

 Badges - https://badges.fedoraproject.org/

 BFO - http://boot.fedoraproject.org/

 Blockerbugs - https://qa.fedoraproject.org/blockerbugs/

 Bodhi - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/

 Buildsystem - http://koji.fedoraproject.org/

 GIT / Source Control - pkgs.fedoraproject.org

 Darkserver - https://darkserver.fedoraproject.org/

 DNS - ns-sb01.fedoraproject.org, ns02.fedoraproject.org,
 ns04.fedoraproject.org, ns05.fedoraproject.org

 Docs - http://docs.fedoraproject.org/

 Elections - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/voting

 Email system

 Fedmsg busmon - http://apps.fedoraproject.org/busmon

 Fedora Account System - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/accounts/

 Fedora Community - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/community/

 Fedora Calendar - https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/

 Fedora Hosted - https://fedorahosted.org/

 Fedora OpenID - https://id.fedoraproject.org/

 Fedora People - http://fedorapeople.org/

 Main Website - http://fedoraproject.org/

 Mirror List - https://mirrors.fedoraproject.org/

 Mirror Manager - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mirrormanager/

 Package Database - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/

 QA Services

 Secondary Architectures

 Spins - http://spins.fedoraproject.org/

 Start - http://start.fedoraproject.org/

 Torrent - http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/

 Wiki - http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/

 Unaffected Services:

 Contact Information:

 Ticket Link: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/4614

 Please join #fedora-admin or #fedora-noc on irc.freenode.net or add
 comments to the ticket for this outage above


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Re: CSS on getfedora.org (was: Other download options)

[Felix Miata]

Reindl Harald composed on 2014-12-11 11:44 (UTC+0100):

> Felix Miata composed:

>> [ re: https://getfedora.org/ ]

>> Reindl Harald composed on 2014-12-11 01:06 (UTC+0100):

>>> Felix Miata composed:

 Actions speak louder than words. The need to zoom 3X-6X to reach legible a
 legible state belies "polished, easy to use".

>>> no need to zoom anything and as said my eyes are really not good

>> Your image hasn't presented anything useful, because you offered insufficient
>> context to know what it is that you see when you look at what you captured.
>> All we know is "my eyes are not really good", whatever that means.

> i explained what that means, a cornea implanted from a previously died 
> person on both eyes as well as a new lense and finally able to see only 
> 60-70% or a normal human on the left and 90% on the right eye

> that means two different pictures composed by the brain to one and so 
> you can imagine that typically if i can read things without problems 
> they are just fine

So far, you have only explained your visual condition, nothing about what is
presented to your eyes.

>> We have no idea what your screen size is, what your resolution is,
>> or what the distance between eyes and screen is. IOW, the physical
>> size presented to you is utterly absent.

> 1920x1080, 23", 96dpi and the font-size of that page is similar to 98% 
> of websites i face and we create 

Therein lie multiple problems. A 23" 1920x1080 screen is indeed 95.8 DPI.
Xorg, unless overridden, same as Windows and Mac, presumes a 96 DPI screen.
By default, all popular Linux DEs obey the Xorg configured DPI. In all such
environments, the 13px CSS "size" used for the items in the footer columns
does in fact compute to a physical size of 9.75pt.

Problem 1: For today's Internet, where yesteryear's CRTs are mostly memories,
and laptops and smaller internet access devices abound, selling in far larger
numbers than "desktop" computers, 96DPI is a low density screen. Low density
means objects of any given nominal "size" are rendered large in comparison to
screens of medium or high density. What is adequate in size on a low density
screen morphs into inadequacy as actual screen density increases. Without the
user environment applying any compensation, that 13px/9.75pt text on a 96DPI
screen becomes 13px/7.8pt on a 120DPI screen, 13px/6.5pt on a 144DPI screen,
13px/5.2pt on a 180DPI screen, and so forth. So clearly from a usability
perspective, since it exhibits zero adaptation to the user environment, the
px unit makes a poor choice for sizing web objects that need to be legible.

Problem 2: Just because everybody else does something does not justify
everyone else doing the same. Copying what everybody else does only makes
more of the same, not wisdom. Computers are tools with the capability to do
things automatically, to make things easier. Sizing web content in CSS px
units impedes a computer's ability to do that. Better sizing options exist
and are therefore recommended.[1]

Problem 3: Sizing using px units completely disregards user needs and
preferences. Users' browser defaults are presumptively optimal. Users who
find the as shipped defaults inappropriate are free to adjust them. One word
describing that process is called personalizing. Disregarding what users find
optimal is rude, and for the same reason as problem 2 above, just as 
unnecessary.

>- you should really ask yourself to consult a doctor and check your eyes

WRT viewing a computer display, there is nothing wrong with my eyes that
prescription lenses don't correct. The problem is with web designs that
override user settings, either by disregarding them entirely (sizing in px),
or assuming them inappropriate (base sizing to other than browser default,
e.g. body {font-size: 80%} or p {font-size: .8rem}). 100% is the
presumptively optimal base size for everyone. It's personalizable precisely
so those who don't like the size it was shipped with can optimize it, thus
allowing the computer to automatically compute, making everything nice size
automatically.

> and that is by far meant insulting (see above paragraph!)

You have me totally lost by that comment.

[1] e.g. http://www.w3.org/2003/07/30-font-size
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20140916/C28
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Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[john.tiger]

As an AI guy, it's been frustrating that installing Fedora on my Macbook 
has been 3 days and counting, a living hell, and still not right (still 
can't get wireless to work not having eth0 available) - I've come to 
realize the installer is "stupid" from an intelligence standpoint.  
Installing Fedora requires many decisions and tweeking from the user who 
must rely on insufficient documentation and searching user posts that 
are often outdated, do not work, and lacking key details.


Installation is often the "first impression" or "key impression" of 
Fedora.  As consultant Brian Tracy states "don't meet customer 
expectations, don't exceed customer expectations, but WOW the customer.  
It is what Apple has mostly done.   Fedora / Linux can be the best, 
should be the best - time for a "first in class" installation process.


Here's what I've found:

1) Linux actually does an extensive "pre-flight" check but this 
information is not conveyed to the user in any simple, exception 
reporting, pretty UI dashboard kind of way.


a) the first screen of F21 workstation live is simple and nice looking - 
ie does user want to run Live or install Fedora - the "pre-flight" check 
needs to be something simple and attractive as this


2) This "first screen" needs to identify the existence of key elements 
for successful installation and operation.  RAM, hard disk space, 
wireless / eth0, ..   If key requirement is missing / insufficient 
then pop suggestion - if it's a non shipping proprietary issue, then 
provide popup dialog info and links to get problem solved - none of the 
current "go look it up" - needs the right info right there - yes this 
adds lots of up-to-date work but is really important !!   ie. for 
Broadcom  - dialog should explain this is proprietary, must be added 
from outside source, do you want outside source installed ?  click 
install, BAM!, it's taken care of.
a) realize this is hard, but if done in a modular fashion, then all the 
different requirement combinations can be more easily managed - ie 
wireless check, separate popup module for each driver - many of these 
drivers seem to exist on apps.fedoraproject.org - needs to be better 
integrated


3) Some of #2) might depend on type (workstation, cloud, server) and 
possibly language, etc so there might be some iterative process needed 
for the initial 1-3 screens


4) Some info (ie setting time zone ) just does not seem critical at this 
point - push it to later - get past the critical element stage first


5) Partitioning has improved but still not good enough.  Again simple 
screen of what's there, what needs to be there, and any desired 
overrides - bouncing the user into gparted is terrible (gparted needs 
it's own intelligence...).

  a) based on existing OS - simple question of dual-booting, or replacing
  b) simple 3 col screen:
col 1 - list of current partitions,
col 2 list of recommended  -
col 3 based on selected item in col 2 input boxes of each partition 
details

  c) some of above is already there (ie col 3) - just needs some UI fixing
  d) then immediately ask to apply - then BAM! partitioning is done and 
show user clearly what was done - then ask to either change partitions 
again, proceed with software install, or cancel out
  e) there seems to be real problems with current "going back" - like 
due to caching - it doesn't go back right


5) After all these critical requirements are done and installed - then 
proceed to other info such as passwords, user, time zone, software to be 
installed - make sequential simple screens with big nice UI buttons 
a) get rid of current async around the screen paragraph buttons that is  
confusing to user
b) perhaps it seems efficient to do multitasking (ie fill out user while 
stuff is installing)  but filling out a couple of simple screens 
sequentially is a lot more efficient in terms of less confusing, 
ensuring more accurate input, etc


6 Before saying install is complete - run another "flight check" to be 
sure everything is right and installed correctly - if not, alert user 
and show recommendations .  Time to stop the install completed, reboot, 
and then no wireless, 


7)  Give option to save successful install in a simple install config 
file for multiple similar machines


8)  team working on install needs to put together wireframe / sketches 
of screens - suggested UI needs to be posted for feedback before 
programming effort  - current installer iterations seem more trial and 
error rather than getting good user feedback right from the start


Am willing to work on this - can mock up the input screens -  just point 
the direction of how to help

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Re: Other download options

[Andrew Clayton]

On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 18:37:54 +0100, Michael Catanzaro wrote:

> On Wed, 2014-12-10 at 09:52 -0700, Jerry James wrote:
> > Workstation isn't suitable; they
> > aren't developers (yet).  Server and Cloud are definitely right out.
> > I don't want a Live CD; I want to actually install.  (In the past,
> > installing from a Live CD left one with different defaults than an
> > install from DVD, so I've learned to avoid the Live CD.  Perhaps
> > that reflex is now wrong.)
> 
> Yes, this has always been a problem, one that has been solved by
> removing everything except the live CD. :p

Hmm, just checked, your not kidding!

My usual way for updating/installing was to download the netinst and DVD
install images. Then with netinst, install using the DVD image over NFS.

I guess that's now out the window?

What would be the nearest equivalent thing?

Cheers,
Andrew
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Re: Other download options

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/11/2014 04:45 PM, Andrew Clayton wrote:

My usual way for updating/installing was to download the netinst and DVD
install images. Then with netinst, install using the DVD image over NFS.

I guess that's now out the window?

What would be the nearest equivalent thing?

You can use the server netinst iso the same as a generic netinst.  But 
it looks like you'll have to get the packages over the network.  There's 
no iso with packages on it.  So either mirror the packages you need or 
download them during install.  I have a proxy setup, so that download 
only happens once (per arch).

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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Alexander Ploumistos]

2014-12-12 2:37 GMT+02:00 john.tiger :

> Am willing to work on this - can mock up the input screens -  just point
> the direction of how to help
>

Then you should get in touch with the Anaconda team:
fedoraproject.org/wiki/Anaconda
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Review swaps

[Sandro Mani]

Hi,

Some packages needing review. All pretty simple cmake/qmake stuff:

- https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173373 - qtspell - Spell 
checking for Qt text widgets [*]
- https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173378 - osgearth - 
Dynamic map generation toolkit for OpenSceneGraph
- https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1128394 - qcustomplot - Qt 
widget for plotting and data visualization [**]
- https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1128393 - qhexedit2 - 
Binary Editor for Qt [***]
- https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173375 - sqlitebrowser - 
Create, design, and edit SQLite database files


[*] I need this for the upcoming new release of gImageReader, so this 
has highest priority for me.

[**] Dependency for sqlitebrowser
[***] Also dependency for sqlitebrowser. This package actually looks 
dead upstream, and sqlitebrowser bundles it by default. Perhaps it would 
be better to just keep the bundled version in sqlitebrowser instead of 
packaging dead software. OTOH unbundling is trivial. Is there a policy 
for such cases, what is preferred?



Happy to review in exchange.

Thanks,
Sandro

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Re: [Fedora-packaging] Summary/Minutes from today's FPC Meeting (2014-12-11 17:00 - 18:25 UTC)

[Michel Alexandre Salim]

Dear developers,

On 12/12/2014 01:27 AM, James Antill wrote:
> ==
> #fedora-meeting-1: fpc
> ==
> 
> 
> Meeting started by geppetto at 17:01:37 UTC. The full logs are available
> at
> http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2014-12-11/fpc.2014-12-11-17.01.log.html
> .
> 
> 
> 
> Meeting summary
> ---
> * Roll Call  (geppetto, 17:01:37)
> 
> * #476  Requesting copylib exemption for libgnome-volume-control
>   (geppetto, 17:06:19)
>   * ACTION: General agreement that it should be made at least a static
> lib. … hopefully a shared lib. eventually.  (geppetto, 17:20:11)
> 
Per the FPC decision that libgnome-volume-control is not an acceptable
copylib, and therefore it has to be packaged as a static lib and
packages using it modified to use it, some questions:

1. who should be performing the modification?
2. presumably reviews of new packages depending on this would be blocked
until such a static lib is available?
3. presumably whereas legacy packages that have already gone in are
fine, we won't want to yank them

Best regards,


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Re: Review swaps

[Mukundan Ragavan]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

On 12/11/2014 08:04 PM, Sandro Mani wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Some packages needing review. All pretty simple cmake/qmake stuff:
> 
> - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173373 - qtspell -
> Spell checking for Qt text widgets [*] -
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173378 - osgearth - 
> Dynamic map generation toolkit for OpenSceneGraph -
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1128394 - qcustomplot -
> Qt widget for plotting and data visualization [**] -
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1128393 - qhexedit2 - 
> Binary Editor for Qt [***] -
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1173375 - sqlitebrowser
> - Create, design, and edit SQLite database files
> 
> [*] I need this for the upcoming new release of gImageReader, so
> this has highest priority for me. [**] Dependency for
> sqlitebrowser [***] Also dependency for sqlitebrowser. This package
> actually looks dead upstream, and sqlitebrowser bundles it by
> default. Perhaps it would be better to just keep the bundled
> version in sqlitebrowser instead of packaging dead software. OTOH
> unbundling is trivial. Is there a policy for such cases, what is
> preferred?
> 
> 
> Happy to review in exchange.
> 
> Thanks, Sandro
> 

I can take qtspell and qcustomplot for review. I can do others as well
but I do not want to take too many and sit on it.

qcustomplot looks very nice!

Mukundan.

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Re: Poll: How users use DNF

[Kevin Kofler]

Radek Holy wrote:
> I'm writing to you regarding a request for your feedback. I would be very
> grateful if you could send me a brief description of how you use YUM or
> DNF currently or how would you like to use it.

One thing I do twice a year, whenever I upgrade to a new Fedora release, is 
to first run this in graphical mode:
yum --releasever=n+1 --downloadonly distro-sync
and then this in text mode:
yum --releasever=n+1 -C distro-sync

The important feature there is --downloadonly. It is essential to make this 
work.

Without --downloadonly, I'd have to run the whole thing in text mode, which:
1. forces me off the desktop environment for the whole download time, and
2. works at all only if the network is accessible in text-mode, which is
   only the case if the credentials are stored systemwide in NM and not in
   KWallet (or gnome-keyring for that matter).

Kevin Kofler

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Re: Other download options

[Andrew Clayton]

On Thu, 11 Dec 2014 17:46:18 -0800, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> You can use the server netinst iso the same as a generic netinst.
> But it looks like you'll have to get the packages over the network.
> There's no iso with packages on it.  So either mirror the packages
> you need or download them during install.  I have a proxy setup, so
> that download only happens once (per arch).

OK, thanks.
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Re: "Workstation" Product defaults to wide-open firewall

[Kevin Kofler]

Kevin Kofler wrote:
> I just happened to look at the firewalld default settings, and I was not
> amused when I noticed this:
> http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/firewalld.git/tree/FedoraWorkstation.xml
>>  
>>  
> This "firewall" is a joke! ALL higher ports are wide open!

FESCo ticket filed: https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1372

Kevin Kofler

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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Corey Sheldon]

also, seeing as much of that is in the Install Guide and/or release notes
it is expected the user will check that and that extra documentation on the
live takes up space fast and size constraints do exist for ISOs

Corey W Sheldon
Freelance IT Consultant, Multi-Discipline Tutor
310.909.7672
www.facebook.com/1stclassmobileshine
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On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 8:47 PM, Alexander Ploumistos <
alex.ploumis...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> 2014-12-12 2:37 GMT+02:00 john.tiger :
>
>> Am willing to work on this - can mock up the input screens -  just point
>> the direction of how to help
>>
>
> Then you should get in touch with the Anaconda team:
> fedoraproject.org/wiki/Anaconda
>
>
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Qwt and QwtPolar for Qt5?

[Dave Johansen]

I would like to create Qwt and QwtPolar packages for Qt5 and before opening
the Bugzilla I wanted to check if there was any feedback on here. I have
spec files and source RPMs available at:
https://daveisfera.fedorapeople.org/qwt-qt5/qwt-qt5.spec
https://daveisfera.fedorapeople.org/qwt-qt5/qwt-qt5-6.1.1-3.el6.src.rpm
https://daveisfera.fedorapeople.org/qwtpolar-qt5/qwtpolar-qt5.spec
https://daveisfera.fedorapeople.org/qwtpolar-qt5/qwtpolar-qt5-1.1.1-2.el6.src.rpm

I'm primarily interested in the RHEL 6/7 and haven't tested this on Fedora,
so if anyone is willing to build it and do some testing, then that would be
helpful as well.

Thanks,
Dave
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Re: "Workstation" Product defaults to wide-open firewall

[M. Edward (Ed) Borasky]

Is there an upvote mechanism for that? I'd like to join the chorus if I can. ;-)

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 7:06 PM, Kevin Kofler  wrote:
> Kevin Kofler wrote:
>> I just happened to look at the firewalld default settings, and I was not
>> amused when I noticed this:
>> http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/firewalld.git/tree/FedoraWorkstation.xml
>>>  
>>>  
>> This "firewall" is a joke! ALL higher ports are wide open!
>
> FESCo ticket filed: https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1372
>
> Kevin Kofler
>
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Bruno Wolff III]

On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 22:26:50 -0500,
 Corey Sheldon  wrote:

also, seeing as much of that is in the Install Guide and/or release notes
it is expected the user will check that and that extra documentation on the
live takes up space fast and size constraints do exist for ISOs


Most of the lives are targeting small (1-2 GB) USB devices now rather 
the DVDs and aren't really that size constrained any more.

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is it possible to skip a noarch subpackage on certains archs (arm)

[Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek]

Hi,

I have a package (a C++ library), which generated doxygen
documentation during build. The documentation lands in a noarch -doc
subpackage, the rest in the main package or in subpackages, all
arch-ed.  The problem is that generating the documentation takes
forever (6+ hours) on arm. The arch-ed parts build fairly
quickly. Would it be possible to use %ifarch or equivalent to only
build the (slow) -doc subpackage on x86_64 or i686 archs? Would arm
then get the noarch subpackage from other archs?

Zbyszek
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Jan Kratochvil]

On Fri, 12 Dec 2014 01:37:52 +0100, john.tiger wrote:
> 2) If key requirement is missing / insufficient then pop
> suggestion - if it's a non shipping proprietary issue, then provide popup
> dialog info and links to get problem solved - none of the current "go look
> it up" - needs the right info right there

First wireless is not a requirement, I do not use wireless anywhere for PCs as
wired connection is in all aspects (except for the wire) better.

Second Fedora has more strict Free software policy:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Forbidden_items
The proprietary software and drivers discussed may be available from
the respective owners and other vendors. Fedora Project instead highly
recommends that you support the right vendors and get hardware that
can work with completely free and open source software

From my own experience I had nVidia gfx card in one computer and its user
wanted 3D so I trashed that crap and bought there ATI gfx card instead.
Since that time everything works out of the box.  Low-end Free software
friendly card is really not such a financial burden.  The same can be applied
to WiFi USB - when one was unfortunate to buy/get Free software hostile
hardware in the first place.


Jan
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Satyajit Sahoo]

Wireless is a requirement for laptops. For example, Macbook Air doesn't
have an ethernet port.

On 12 December 2014 at 12:44, Jan Kratochvil 
wrote:
>
> On Fri, 12 Dec 2014 01:37:52 +0100, john.tiger wrote:
> > 2) If key requirement is missing / insufficient then pop
> > suggestion - if it's a non shipping proprietary issue, then provide popup
> > dialog info and links to get problem solved - none of the current "go
> look
> > it up" - needs the right info right there
>
> First wireless is not a requirement, I do not use wireless anywhere for
> PCs as
> wired connection is in all aspects (except for the wire) better.
>
> Second Fedora has more strict Free software policy:
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Forbidden_items
> The proprietary software and drivers discussed may be available
> from
> the respective owners and other vendors. Fedora Project instead
> highly
> recommends that you support the right vendors and get hardware that
> can work with completely free and open source software
>
> From my own experience I had nVidia gfx card in one computer and its user
> wanted 3D so I trashed that crap and bought there ATI gfx card instead.
> Since that time everything works out of the box.  Low-end Free software
> friendly card is really not such a financial burden.  The same can be
> applied
> to WiFi USB - when one was unfortunate to buy/get Free software hostile
> hardware in the first place.
>
>
> Jan
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Jan Kratochvil]

On Fri, 12 Dec 2014 08:17:45 +0100, Satyajit Sahoo wrote:
> Wireless is a requirement for laptops. For example, Macbook Air doesn't
> have an ethernet port.

s/requirement for laptops/requirement for Macbook Air/

Sure the installer could be improved but slightly differently (soft warning if
there is wired but no wireless connection, red warning if there is neither
wired nor wireless connection; but no connection is still valid for example
for test VMs).


Jan
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Satyajit Sahoo]

Okay, forget Macbook Air. I don't have ethernet at my office, and it's the
only place where I have internet. What can I do then?

Wireless might not be a strict requirement, but still essential.

Also, why did Macbook Air come to the "Not laptop" category?

On 12 December 2014 at 12:55, Jan Kratochvil 
wrote:
>
> On Fri, 12 Dec 2014 08:17:45 +0100, Satyajit Sahoo wrote:
> > Wireless is a requirement for laptops. For example, Macbook Air doesn't
> > have an ethernet port.
>
> s/requirement for laptops/requirement for Macbook Air/
>
> Sure the installer could be improved but slightly differently (soft
> warning if
> there is wired but no wireless connection, red warning if there is neither
> wired nor wireless connection; but no connection is still valid for example
> for test VMs).
>
>
> Jan
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Season 5, Episode 13.
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Re: Fedora Installation Needs Intelligence

[Ralf Corsepius]

On 12/12/2014 08:25 AM, Jan Kratochvil wrote:

On Fri, 12 Dec 2014 08:17:45 +0100, Satyajit Sahoo wrote:

Wireless is a requirement for laptops. For example, Macbook Air doesn't
have an ethernet port.


s/requirement for laptops/requirement for Macbook Air/
No. These days, many (esp. low-end) notebooks, do not come with an 
ethernet port. Not worth mentioning these 
chrome-/win-books/~tablet-style mobile devices.



Sure the installer could be improved but slightly differently (soft warning if
there is wired but no wireless connection, red warning if there is neither
wired nor wireless connection; but no connection is still valid for example
for test VMs).
In other words, the OP has a good point: The installer needs more 
intelligence.


Ralf


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