Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Miro Hrončok]

On 12.4.2018 20:32, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:

I am hear-by volunteer to support python27 in EPEL8 and EPEL6. It will
be based off of the EL7 code.


Thank you. For EPEL6, consult the guidelines on how to add such package. 
For the other EPEL you have mentioned, I unfortunately cannot say 
anything, however if such EPEL will ever exist, just add the package :)


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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Nico Kadel-Garcia]

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 2:32 PM, Stephen John Smoogen  wrote:
> On 12 April 2018 at 11:48, Miro Hrončok  wrote:
>> On 11.4.2018 21:31, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>>>
>>> Miro Hrončok wrote:

 This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for
 everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that
 encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to
 "if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that
 simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see
 for example already mentioned [3] or [4].
>>>
>>>
>>> Well, python2 could simply be branched for EPEL.
>>
>>
>> Yes, if somebody wants to maintain python2 in Fedora/EPEL, they have the
>> right to do so. So far nobody volunteered. You keep repeating it. Please
>> either volunteer to do it, or bring new information to the discussion.
>> Repeating that something "could be done" is not helpful.
>>
>
> I am hear-by volunteer to support python27 in EPEL8 and EPEL6. It will
> be based off of the EL7 code.

python 2.7 is already available for EPEL 6 in the software collections
library, over in /opt/rh/python27/. Getting more recent modules built
in that environment can be awkward, and can require careful management
of the document building tools to avoid conflicts. py2pack has been my
friend for doing local builds of those.tools for testing or local
user.
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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Stephen John Smoogen]

On 12 April 2018 at 11:48, Miro Hrončok  wrote:
> On 11.4.2018 21:31, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>>
>> Miro Hrončok wrote:
>>>
>>> This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for
>>> everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that
>>> encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to
>>> "if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that
>>> simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see
>>> for example already mentioned [3] or [4].
>>
>>
>> Well, python2 could simply be branched for EPEL.
>
>
> Yes, if somebody wants to maintain python2 in Fedora/EPEL, they have the
> right to do so. So far nobody volunteered. You keep repeating it. Please
> either volunteer to do it, or bring new information to the discussion.
> Repeating that something "could be done" is not helpful.
>

I am hear-by volunteer to support python27 in EPEL8 and EPEL6. It will
be based off of the EL7 code.


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> Miro Hrončok
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> Phone: +420777974800
> IRC: mhroncok
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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Miro Hrončok]

On 11.4.2018 21:26, Raphael Groner wrote:

Hi Miro,

what to do with packages that can not be ported to python3?


If you are asking about next major RHEL release, I'm afraid I cannot tell.

If you are asking about Fedora then there are two options:

 * somebody maintains python2
 * we drop such packages

Note that there might be a compromise (i.e. we maintain pythno27 for a 
carefully selected security noncritical packages). See [6].


If your are asking about future EPEL, then somebody needs to add python2 
there if they want to maintain it (we don't).



[6] 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/2XDT6S62SEN4KGWQCOUYKXLBYVTKJ5VI/


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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Miro Hrončok]

On 11.4.2018 21:31, Kevin Kofler wrote:

Miro Hrončok wrote:

This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for
everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that
encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to
"if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that
simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see
for example already mentioned [3] or [4].


Well, python2 could simply be branched for EPEL.


Yes, if somebody wants to maintain python2 in Fedora/EPEL, they have the 
right to do so. So far nobody volunteered. You keep repeating it. Please 
either volunteer to do it, or bring new information to the discussion. 
Repeating that something "could be done" is not helpful.


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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Jason L Tibbitts III]

> "RG" == Raphael Groner  writes:

RG> what to do with packages that can not be ported to python3?

Can anything really not be ported to python3?  I suppose if there was
something which messed with the internals of the python interpreter in
some way then that would potentially never be portable to python3, but
instances of that should be quite rare.

If the software is dead upstream, or upstream truly does not want to
port to python2, nobody wants to do the port or the Fedora maintainer
simply does not wish to carry patches to make things work with python3
and python2 is no longer in the distribution then... what else can be
done besides dropping the software?

Eventually all Linux distributions will have to do the same, or will
have to carry (or share) the burden of maintaining the python2
interpreter.  Software which requires python2 will become increasingly
difficult to use and I imagine that most authors would want to see their
software ported rather than have it become increasingly difficult to use
without the user having to build or obtain their own python2
interpreter.

 - J<
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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Kevin Kofler]

Miro Hrončok wrote:
> This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for
> everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that
> encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to
> "if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that
> simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see
> for example already mentioned [3] or [4].

Well, python2 could simply be branched for EPEL.

Kevin Kofler
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Re: Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Raphael Groner]

Hi Miro,

what to do with packages that can not be ported to python3?

For instance ecryptfs-utils … an orphan process will also orphan some 
dependencies like ecryptfs-simple etc.
And therefore sirikali is going to loose some of its features that are 
available by help from ecryptfs tools.

RFE ecryptfs-utils: Add a Python 3 subpackage - 
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/1458602

Regards,
Raphael
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Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Miro Hrončok]

Hi, see the deprecation notes for RHEL 7.5 [1]:

  Python 2 has been deprecated
  

  Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next Red Hat Enterprise
  Linux (RHEL) major release.

  See the Conservative Python 3 Porting Guide [2] for information on how
  to migrate large code bases to Python 3.

While this might have been obvious from the conditionals we have been 
adding in some specfiles [3][4], this is AFAIK the first time this has 
been publicly announced.


This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for 
everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that 
encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to 
"if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that 
simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see 
for example already mentioned [3] or [4].


(If the conditionals are getting too complicated, consider not using 
them at all and maintain multiple branches of the specs instead.)


This is also important for everybody who still runs their code on Python 
2. Please consider to migrate ASAP. The Conservative Python 3 Porting 
Guide [2] is very helpful. (I'm looking mostly at Fedora infra and QA here.)


We (Red Hat Python Maint and Fedora Python SIG) are happy to help. If 
you feel lost, talk to us. Also, this is a reminder that we intend to 
orphan Python 2 from Fedora [6] and so far nobody volunteered to 
maintain it.


Python 2 will go upstream EOL in 1.75 years [7].

[1] 
https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterprise_linux/7/html/7.5_release_notes/chap-red_hat_enterprise_linux-7.5_release_notes-deprecated_functionality

[2] https://portingguide.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
[3] 
https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/createrepo_c/pull-request/3#request_diff
[4] 
https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/python-bugzilla/pull-request/2#request_diff
[5] 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/de...@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/UG6XYG3EPLMLA5N47AK63NCF2Y6MDWFJ/
[6] 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/de...@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/2XDT6S62SEN4KGWQCOUYKXLBYVTKJ5VI/

[7] https://pythonclock.org/

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Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next RHEL major release

[Miro Hrončok]

Hi, see the deprecation notes for RHEL 7.5 [1]:

  Python 2 has been deprecated
  

  Python 2 will be replaced with Python 3 in the next Red Hat Enterprise
  Linux (RHEL) major release.

  See the Conservative Python 3 Porting Guide [2] for information on how
  to migrate large code bases to Python 3.

While this might have been obvious from the conditionals we have been 
adding in some specfiles [3][4], this is AFAIK the first time this has 
been publicly announced.


This is important for those who like to maintain a single spec for 
everything. Previously, there have been messages on the devel list that 
encouraged people to change the python3 conditional from "if fedora" to 
"if fedora or rhel > 7" [5]. Please make a note that it will not be that 
simple, because you'll also need to add conditionals for python2, see 
for example already mentioned [3] or [4].


(If the conditionals are getting too complicated, consider not using 
them at all and maintain multiple branches of the specs instead.)


This is also important for everybody who still runs their code on Python 
2. Please consider to migrate ASAP. The Conservative Python 3 Porting 
Guide [2] is very helpful. (I'm looking mostly at Fedora infra and QA here.)


We (Red Hat Python Maint and Fedora Python SIG) are happy to help. If 
you feel lost, talk to us. Also, this is a reminder that we intend to 
orphan Python 2 from Fedora [6] and so far nobody volunteered to 
maintain it.


Python 2 will go upstream EOL in 1.75 years [7].

[1] 
https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterprise_linux/7/html/7.5_release_notes/chap-red_hat_enterprise_linux-7.5_release_notes-deprecated_functionality

[2] https://portingguide.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
[3] 
https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/createrepo_c/pull-request/3#request_diff
[4] 
https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/python-bugzilla/pull-request/2#request_diff
[5] 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/UG6XYG3EPLMLA5N47AK63NCF2Y6MDWFJ/
[6] 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/2XDT6S62SEN4KGWQCOUYKXLBYVTKJ5VI/

[7] https://pythonclock.org/

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