Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Sat, Dec 5, 2020 at 6:24 PM Kevin Fenzi wrote: > > On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. > > I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered > conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out > things. > > Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the > qa/compose test reports to another list? Yes, I think the rawhide/branched reports are useful on the main list, it shows what's changed and useful soname breakages but I also agree the rest should go to another list. ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Sat, Dec 05, 2020 at 12:25:05PM -0800, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Sat, 2020-12-05 at 10:23 -0800, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > > On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > > > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > > > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > > > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > > > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > > > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > > > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > > > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. > > > > I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered > > conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out > > things. > > > > Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the > > qa/compose test reports to another list? > > I quite like the Rawhide compose and compose check reports going > together, because it's sort of logical: here's what changed, and here's > what it broke/fixed. I think it doesn't make sense to create a separate list. It'll inconvenience people who have filters set up already, and those who like to receive those mails. A new list will require additional advertising to allow people to find it. OTOH, based on the replies in this thread, it's clear that there are multiple overlapping subsets of reports that people would like to read, which means that people will need to set up filters anyway. > What about keeping those two on devel@ but I could fiddle with check- > compose again and have it send the IoT and Cloud reports to iot and > cloud lists (if they want them) or not send them (if they don't)? +1. People who care about those variants will most likely be subscribed to those lists already. Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On 15/12/20 10:36 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote: Well, the potential problem I see is that you have to *know* the other list exists. For a new Fedora user this isn't trivial. I've no idea how people find out about devel@ but I imagine it's linked all over the intarwebs, having existed for literal decades at this point. Right now if you sign up for devel@ for *whatever* reason, you find out about these report emails because they start showing up in your mailbox. If we move them to a separate list which *won't* be linked all over the intarwebs, how will people know the reports exist? We could add a link this this footer ... devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Sat, Dec 5, 2020 at 6:24 PM Kevin Fenzi wrote: > I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered > conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out > things. I also find the rawhide reports (at least occasionally) useful, as being the early canaries for potentially more interesting issues. However, subscribing to one more list is not really that hard, so if most people find those reports to be only noise, eliminating sending them to devel (which the project encourages one to do) is probably the right thing to do. ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Tue, 2020-12-15 at 13:07 -0500, Robbie Harwood wrote: > Mauricio Tavares writes: > > > On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 12:18 PM Robbie Harwood wrote: > > > > > > Vít Ondruch writes: > > > > > > > I have setup filter ages ago and it moves such emails into subfolder. I > > > > still think this is preferable to moving them into different ML. > > > > > > I would like to disagree with the idea that everyone needing to create > > > their own filtration is preferable to putting them on a separate list. > > > > So giving people the option to decide what to do with their > > emails is less preferable than having 4-5 people decide for every > > single subscriber? > > Subscribing to two mailing lists instead of one isn't preventing you > from deciding what to do with your email. Well, the potential problem I see is that you have to *know* the other list exists. For a new Fedora user this isn't trivial. I've no idea how people find out about devel@ but I imagine it's linked all over the intarwebs, having existed for literal decades at this point. Right now if you sign up for devel@ for *whatever* reason, you find out about these report emails because they start showing up in your mailbox. If we move them to a separate list which *won't* be linked all over the intarwebs, how will people know the reports exist? -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA IRC: adamw | Twitter: adamw_ha https://www.happyassassin.net ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
Mauricio Tavares writes: > On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 12:18 PM Robbie Harwood wrote: >> >> Vít Ondruch writes: >> >> > I have setup filter ages ago and it moves such emails into subfolder. I >> > still think this is preferable to moving them into different ML. >> >> I would like to disagree with the idea that everyone needing to create >> their own filtration is preferable to putting them on a separate list. > > So giving people the option to decide what to do with their > emails is less preferable than having 4-5 people decide for every > single subscriber? Subscribing to two mailing lists instead of one isn't preventing you from deciding what to do with your email. Let's keep this in proportion, please. This isn't oppression. Thanks, --Robbie signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 12:18 PM Robbie Harwood wrote: > > Vít Ondruch writes: > > > I have setup filter ages ago and it moves such emails into subfolder. I > > still think this is preferable to moving them into different ML. > > I would like to disagree with the idea that everyone needing to create > their own filtration is preferable to putting them on a separate list. > So giving people the option to decide what to do with their emails is less preferable than having 4-5 people decide for every single subscriber? > Thanks, > --Robbie > ___ > devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
Vít Ondruch writes: > I have setup filter ages ago and it moves such emails into subfolder. I > still think this is preferable to moving them into different ML. I would like to disagree with the idea that everyone needing to create their own filtration is preferable to putting them on a separate list. Thanks, --Robbie signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
I have setup filter ages ago and it moves such emails into subfolder. I still think this is preferable to moving them into different ML. Vít Dne 05. 12. 20 v 19:23 Kevin Fenzi napsal(a): On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: Hi all, I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out things. Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the qa/compose test reports to another list? kevin ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org OpenPGP_0x0CE09EE79917B87C.asc Description: application/pgp-keys OpenPGP_signature Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
Fwiw I have been filtering out the rawhide report to a separate folder for years... I mean I originally did it for the opposite reason: I wanted to be able to find the reports without all the other devel discussions. Jens ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Sat, 2020-12-05 at 10:23 -0800, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. > > I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered > conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out > things. > > Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the > qa/compose test reports to another list? I quite like the Rawhide compose and compose check reports going together, because it's sort of logical: here's what changed, and here's what it broke/fixed. What about keeping those two on devel@ but I could fiddle with check- compose again and have it send the IoT and Cloud reports to iot and cloud lists (if they want them) or not send them (if they don't)? I've actually twice before written mechanisms for sending the reports for different things to different places, but they keep breaking because we keep changing what things we build, what we call them, and how we build them :/ -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA IRC: adamw | Twitter: adamw_ha https://www.happyassassin.net ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Sat, 2020-12-05 at 10:23 -0800, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. > > I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered > conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out > things. > > Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the > qa/compose test reports to another list? BTW, people do actually follow those reports even if they don't reply to them, because I get pings when they stop working :) -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA IRC: adamw | Twitter: adamw_ha https://www.happyassassin.net ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > Hi all, > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. I'm a bit torn by this. The rawhide report has actually triggered conversation (less than 3 weeks ago) and I find it usefull to point out things. Perhaps we could keep the traditional rawhide report, but send the qa/compose test reports to another list? kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
Am 04.12.20 um 22:43 schrieb Dennis Gilmore: Hi all, I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. ack. best regards, Marius ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Fri, 4 Dec 2020 at 22:43, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > Hi all, > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. > Big thanks for doing this Dennis! It definitely helps :). ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Fri, 2020-12-04 at 15:43 -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > Hi all, > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. As someone who generates half these reports, I'd be fine with that, though it does make them somewhat less discoverable. I'd suggest we should look for places people find devel@ and link to the new reports@ or whatever from those places too. If anyone winds up trying to find out where we decide where to mail "compose check reports", this is it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infra/ansible/blob/master/f/inventory/group_vars/checkcompose checkcompose_emailto would be the thing to change. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA IRC: adamw | Twitter: adamw_ha https://www.happyassassin.net ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 03:43:04PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. I feel like I requested this several years ago and was widely shot down. But perhaps times have changed. :) -- Matthew Miller Fedora Project Leader ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Reducing noise on devel list
On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 10:46 PM Dennis Gilmore wrote: > Hi all, > > I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all > automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow > can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming > here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to > trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from > having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people > bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to > bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. +1, thank you. P ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Reducing noise on devel list
Hi all, I filed https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2512 asking FESCo to move all automated emails to a separate list where people who want to follow can, while I was part of the proliferation of compose reports coming here, there is now a great deal of them, and they no longer seem to trigger any conversation. I think that devel list would benefit from having all automated reports sent to a reports-list and letting people bring reports over when there is something to discuss. I was asked to bring the request to the list for people to weigh in. Thanks Dennis ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
