Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Roland Winklmeier]

2018-02-21 13:44 GMT+01:00 Harald Kjølberg :

>
> Hi,
>
> Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for MSVC
> 2017. The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt 32-bit
> binaries also for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt binaries, we increase
> the complexity, and add to the overall maintenance of our QA system. Our
> preferred approach would be to add binaries for MSVC 2017 and remove the
> binaries for MSVC 2015, as the numbers of binaries in the build remains the
> same. It will still be possible to manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the
> same way as it is possible to manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback
> and viewpoints are much appreciated and will enable us to make the best
> possible decision.
>

I'm using MSVC 2017 with Qt5 2015 prebuilt binaries. I never had issues
with this combination so far, but still would appreciate to have the also
have the 32 bit binaries prebuilt with 2017.
So I'm happy to hear that this is considered.

A little bit offtopic:
I think those discussions about prebuilt binaries would be less
controversal, if it would be easier to produce custom Qt installers. I'm
aware that I can build 32 bit with MSVC 2017 on my own, but creating an
installer for my colleagues is a mystery to me. Yes, its easy enough to
_build_ Qt yourself. I regularly do that. But its a pain to produce any
kind of installers to share it with team members or relocate the built. I
would produce more custom prebuilts of Qt, if the documentation about how
to create custom installers is up to date and accurate. I tried once to
follow http://code.qt.io/cgit/qtsdk/qtsdk.git/tree/packaging-tools/README
but it was so much dependent on the Qt CI infrastructure (shares, node
names etc), hard to follow and presumably outdated (it referenced Qt 5.5).

R.
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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Markus Maier]

Hello,

just to add my opinion as a current user of the MSVC 2015 32 bit binaries.

When selecting an MSVC version to use with Qt, one should keep in mind that
Microsoft tends to change things in the compilers even in minor releases. I
had quite some issues with one of the updates of MSVC2013 which broke
things in my code together with a prebuilt version of Qt. Something similar
might happen again when Microsoft fixes the bug mentioned by Thiago.

That's why I decided for my projects to always stick with the MSVC version
before the current version, where updates are not likely to break something
in builds anymore. I believe the same reasons should also apply for
choosing a MSVC version for prebuilt 32 bit binaries.

Another point might be: whoever uses prebuilt 32 bit binaries now and wants
to switch to a static build of Qt would currently be forced to downgrade
the compiler because MSVC 2017 as of now doesn't support static builds of
Qt (QTBUG-59721).

Best regards
Markus Maier
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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Thiago Macieira]

On Thursday, 22 February 2018 01:39:50 PST Tim Blechmann wrote:
> > Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for
> > MSVC 2017. The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt
> > 32-bit binaries also for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt binaries,
> > we increase the complexity, and add to the overall maintenance of our
> > QA system. Our preferred approach would be to add binaries for MSVC
> > 2017 and remove the binaries for MSVC 2015, as the numbers of
> > binaries in the build remains the same. It will still be possible to
> > manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the same way as it is possible to
> > manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback and viewpoints are much
> > appreciated and will enable us to make the best possible decision.
> 
> the ABI of msvc2015 and msvc2017 is the same. so unlike earlier msvc
> releases, one can mix binaries from both compilers.

In theory.

In practice, we've found that it doesn't work for Qt, at least because of the 
Q_COMPILER_xxx defines as MSVC 2015 has fewer C++11 features than 2017.

> in theory. in practice there is a still unresolved compiler bug in
> msvc2017 (we've experienced it only with static libs and debug builds,
> but i'm not sure if it has any implication on the binaries you want to
> release):

That's another one: everything compiled with MSVC 2017 has incorrect 
initialisation sequneces. You're running on borrowed time, until Microsoft 
fixes it (they're saying they'll fix it in the 15.7 release in May).

Note I did not say "static".

-- 
Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com
  Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center



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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Tim Blechmann]

> Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for
> MSVC 2017. The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt
> 32-bit binaries also for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt binaries,
> we increase the complexity, and add to the overall maintenance of our
> QA system. Our preferred approach would be to add binaries for MSVC
> 2017 and remove the binaries for MSVC 2015, as the numbers of
> binaries in the build remains the same. It will still be possible to
> manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the same way as it is possible to
> manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback and viewpoints are much
> appreciated and will enable us to make the best possible decision.

the ABI of msvc2015 and msvc2017 is the same. so unlike earlier msvc
releases, one can mix binaries from both compilers.

in theory. in practice there is a still unresolved compiler bug in
msvc2017 (we've experienced it only with static libs and debug builds,
but i'm not sure if it has any implication on the binaries you want to
release):

https://developercommunity.visualstudio.com/content/problem/76198/vs-2017-compiler-creates-broken-debug-build-using.html

cheers,
tim

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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Henry Skoglund]

On 2018-02-21 14:22, Maurice Kalinowski wrote:

The reason we have had x86 and x64 packages for UWP is not to target those two 
architectures for the desktop, but rather that the x86 version also works for 
the emulators for Windows Phone 8 / Windows 10 Mobile as well as Windows 10 IoT 
(Core).

Given that two out of those are basically gone by now, I'd be fine with 
dropping UWP x86 packages, but keep the arm packages for out embedded user base 
on Windows 10 IoT.

BR,
Maurice


This is very good news. Several times in the Qt Forums I've helped 
people who wanted 32-bit prebuilt MSVC2017 Qt binaries, and ended up 
downloading the UWP version for building Win32 apps.



Of course Visual Studio when building UWP apps does not use the linker 
switch /SUBSYSTEM:WINDOWS,6.2 setting to disallow starting the .exe file 
on Windows 7 (but allowing the same .exe to run on Windows 10).
Instead you get a missing .dll error like "The program can't start 
because api-ms-win-core-rtlsupport-l1-2-0.dll is missing from your 
computer." And this leads to people struggling with trying to install 
that .dll etc. Windows 7 (see for example here 
https://forum.qt.io/topic/85047/can-t-launch-application-dll-is-missing )


But Visual Studio uses the same switch set to /SUBSYSTEM:WINDOWS,6.0 to 
disallow MSVC2015/MSVC2017 Win32 apps to run on Windows XP and Win2K3, 
go figure.



Rgrds Henry

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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Maurice Kalinowski]

The reason we have had x86 and x64 packages for UWP is not to target those two 
architectures for the desktop, but rather that the x86 version also works for 
the emulators for Windows Phone 8 / Windows 10 Mobile as well as Windows 10 IoT 
(Core).

Given that two out of those are basically gone by now, I'd be fine with 
dropping UWP x86 packages, but keep the arm packages for out embedded user base 
on Windows 10 IoT.

BR,
Maurice 

> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
> Von: Development [mailto:development-
> bounces+maurice.kalinowski=qt...@qt-project.org] Im Auftrag von Henry
> Skoglund
> Gesendet: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 2:16 PM
> An: development@qt-project.org
> Betreff: Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017
> 
> Hi,
> if I want to download prebuilt Qt binaries for the UWP platform then I can
> choose between 32-bit and 64-bit flavors of both MSVC 2015 and MSVC 2017.
> 
> It should be possible to offer the same variety for the Win32 versions,
> especially since I think the # of downloads for the Win32 Qt versions exceed
> the # of downloads for the UWP platform (for example, UWP requires
> Windows 10, but Win32 versions also work on Windows 7 and 8).
> 
> Rgrds Henry
> 
> 
> On 2018-02-21 14:04, NIkolai Marchenko wrote:
> > This dedication to dropping MSVC2015x32 seems quite stange after the
> > whole controversy of dropping MSVC2013 and how many people prefered to
> > tread very carefully and slowly.
> >
> > Unlike msvc 2013, 15th compiler is way better and doesn't restrain Qt
> > codebase nearly as much
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 3:44 PM, Harald Kjølberg
> > <harald.kjolb...@qt.io <mailto:harald.kjolb...@qt.io>> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for
> > MSVC 2017. The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt
> > 32-bit binaries also for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt
> > binaries, we increase the complexity, and add to the overall
> > maintenance of our QA system. Our preferred approach would be to add
> > binaries for MSVC 2017 and remove the binaries for MSVC 2015, as the
> > numbers of binaries in the build remains the same. It will still be
> > possible to manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the same way as it
> > is possible to manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback and
> > viewpoints are much appreciated and will enable us to make the best
> > possible decision.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Harald Kjølberg
> > Product Manager - Qt for Application Development
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> >
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> 
> 
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Re: [Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[NIkolai Marchenko]

This dedication to dropping MSVC2015x32 seems quite stange after the whole
controversy of dropping MSVC2013 and how many people prefered to tread very
carefully and slowly.

Unlike msvc 2013, 15th compiler is way better and doesn't restrain Qt
codebase nearly as much

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 3:44 PM, Harald Kjølberg 
wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for MSVC
> 2017. The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt 32-bit
> binaries also for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt binaries, we increase
> the complexity, and add to the overall maintenance of our QA system. Our
> preferred approach would be to add binaries for MSVC 2017 and remove the
> binaries for MSVC 2015, as the numbers of binaries in the build remains the
> same. It will still be possible to manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the
> same way as it is possible to manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback
> and viewpoints are much appreciated and will enable us to make the best
> possible decision.
>
>
>
>
> Best regards,
> Harald Kjølberg
> Product Manager - Qt for Application Development
>
>
>
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[Development] Prebuilt 32-bit versjon for MSVC 2017

[Harald Kjølberg]

Hi,

Currently Qt ships with 32-bit binaries for MSVC 2015, but not for MSVC 2017. 
The Qt Company have received requests for adding prebuilt 32-bit binaries also 
for MSVC 2017. By adding more prebuilt binaries, we increase the complexity, 
and add to the overall maintenance of our QA system. Our preferred approach 
would be to add binaries for MSVC 2017 and remove the binaries for MSVC 2015, 
as the numbers of binaries in the build remains the same. It will still be 
possible to manually build Qt for MSVC 2015, in the same way as it is possible 
to manually build for MSVC 2017 today. Feedback and viewpoints are much 
appreciated and will enable us to make the best possible decision.




Best regards,
Harald Kjølberg
Product Manager - Qt for Application Development



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