Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Monday, 15 September 2014 at 20:09:31 UTC, Martin Nowak wrote: # unbelievable we're still missing in the programming language shootout http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/ D is one of the 30 or so language implementations not measured on Q6600 that were measured on Pentium 4 before September 2008. http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/dont-jump-to-conclusions.html#multicore "Why don't you include language X?" http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/play.html#languagex
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Monday, 15 September 2014 at 23:56:23 UTC, bearophile wrote: -snip- By now - if they had actually made measurements, and published and promoted them - their website would be highly ranked.< This is probably false, for two or more reasons. It's so much less-effort to assume failure than to do the work required to make a success ;-)
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Tuesday, 16 September 2014 at 02:20:18 UTC, Freddy wrote: What The D community do wrong in the first place? Nothing. There are just too many language implementations. It takes more time than I choose to donate. Been there; done that.
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Tuesday, 16 September 2014 at 03:53:10 UTC, Thomas Mader wrote: I am in the "progress" of building a benchmarking suite … But don't expect fast progress. ;-) Well, for faster progress, someone could just take the Python scripts from the benchmarks game, measure programs and figure out how they were going to publish the measurements (and keep them up-to-date, and whether they'd accept contributed programs, and how to manage that, and … ). And once that was working, write a benchmarking suite :-)
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Tuesday, 16 September 2014 at 21:04:59 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote: -snip- I'll take a stab at it. Will give me something to do on my commute :-) (assuming his scripts work, or can be made to work on OS X). It'll be interesting to see which linux stuff is missing: -- without libgtop2 you could still get cpu and elapsed times (but not resident memory or CPU load) -- without highlight you could still get gzip source code size (but the source would include comments and whitespace) When you have questions, please ask in the benchmarks game discussion forum -- http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/play.html#misc
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Wednesday, 17 September 2014 at 18:30:37 UTC, David Nadlinger wrote: -snip- On a somewhat related note, I've been working on a CI system to keep tabs on the compile-time/run-time performance, memory usage and file size for our compilers. Maybe you've seen Emery Berger's work on Stabilizer? http://plasma.cs.umass.edu/emery/stabilizer I'm not smart enough to understand how that could be applied to D compilers ;)
Re: Increasing D's visibility
On Thursday, 18 September 2014 at 00:59:41 UTC, Vladimir Panteleev wrote: -snip- Off-topic question: I've been wondering, how do you magically appear here every time the Shootout is mentioned? Google magic. The project was renamed 6 years ago, it's the benchmarks game. Google shootout and you'll find porn and gun fights.
Re: dmd codegen improvements
On Monday, 24 August 2015 at 08:59:57 UTC, ixid wrote: -snip- People love competitions, the current benchmark site that seems to weirdly dislike D is one of people's go to references. I do not have the ability to do this but it would seem like an excellent project for someone outside the major development group, a Summer of Code-esque thing. Lest we forget, this time last year -- http://forum.dlang.org/post/lv9s7n$1trl$1...@digitalmars.com
Re: dmd codegen improvements
On Monday, 24 August 2015 at 15:36:42 UTC, ixid wrote: -snip- Yes, it requires someone to pick up the baton for what is clearly a very significant task. Your site is excellent and it's very unfortunate that D is absent. iirc I asked Peter Alexander about progress last December and he had successfully used the provided scripts without any difficulty. Someone has published a Python comparison website (even re-using the PHP scripts as-is!) without needing to ask me any questions at all -- http://pybenchmarks.org/ It just needs "someone to pick up the baton" and do it, instead of talking about doing it.
Re: Benchmarking suite
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 at 12:05:18 UTC, qznc wrote: I started something on my own. Kudos to qznc! The C/C++ programs were selected quite randomly. Note: There are separate C and C++ programs shown on the benchmarks game -- so for something like regex-dna there's a C program using the C library written for Tcl and there's a C++ program using the re library. fwiw Doing both would make your comparison a little broader.
Re: Benchmarking suite
On Tuesday, 8 September 2015 at 09:27:13 UTC, qznc wrote: For example, threadring measures context switching. thread-ring has aged badly. It was added when the measurements were only made on single-core hardware, and Erlang's huge number of lightweight processes seemed interesting ;-) It's been many years since the thread-ring measurements were included in the summary charts. The pidigits programs basically measures libGMP performance. And arbitrary precision arithmetic without libGMP :-)
Re: Benchmarking suite
On Tuesday, 8 September 2015 at 21:06:26 UTC, qznc wrote: Afaik the Erlang runtime does not interrupt processes. Depends what you mean by "processes" :-) In this comparison it is actually interesting, because D has its own bignum implementation in the standard library. There you go! On Tuesday, 8 September 2015 at 21:11:15 UTC, qznc wrote: The general goal is "D claims that it can match C/C++ in performance, let's have some actual numbers". - You're only dealing with 3 programming languages, although more than 3 language implementations - Those programming languages are intended to be used for similar tasks. - You'll correctly be seen as a D language advocate, so your presentation needs to show that you accept advice on how to improve the C and C++ programs. - "short idiomatic programs" is difficult because the tradeoff between performance and "idiomatic" is so subjective, and you will correctly be seen as a D language advocate :-) When asked, one of the C++ program contributors to the benchmarks game did try to write some "shorter" C++ programs, see: http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64/code-used-time-used-shapes.php#shortest
Re: Benchmark of D against other languages
On Friday, 3 April 2015 at 02:20:24 UTC, Laeeth Isharc wrote: not evaluated by the Computer Language Benchmarks Game any more. iirc Some people in the D community were going to make their own measurements of benchmarks game tasks and publish them. Has that happened? I just noticed someone has used the benchmarks game measurement scripts (and even the PHP scripts!) to show a bunch of Python language implementations -- http://python.milde.cz/u64q/performance.php?test=nbody
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Thursday, 4 August 2016 at 20:15:35 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote: but the measurement code is available for others to use: Someone had those benchmarks game measurement scripts working with D - a couple of years ago - but then … ? https://forum.dlang.org/post/lvajbi$1477$1...@digitalmars.com http://forum.dlang.org/post/bsljikpxxvrcxwspo...@forum.dlang.org
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Friday, 5 August 2016 at 05:22:07 UTC, ZombineDev wrote: ... It seems that this one has a more active community around it... ? https://alioth.debian.org/activity/?group_id=100815 ;-)
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Sunday, 7 August 2016 at 13:30:27 UTC, Russel Winder wrote: In the end a bit of X10 or Chapel code running on a Blue Gene ro Cray is going to annihilate any code written in Fortran, FORTRAN, C++, C, or any other language for performance. http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/compare.php?lang=chapel&lang2=gpp
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Sunday, 7 August 2016 at 05:04:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Ultimately, my opinion is that the benchmark is outdated and not useful today. I ignore it, if anybody cites the benchmark game for performance measurements. Yeah, I wouldn't bother with it, either. Rather than only being dismissive, wouldn't it be more effective to say what you would bother with. https://github.com/kostya/crystal-benchmarks-game https://github.com/def-/nim-benchmarksgame Where are the D comparison programs that people should bother with?
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Sunday, 7 August 2016 at 21:19:54 UTC, qznc wrote: Comparing so many languages is too broad. We need more specific benchmarks which must be looked at in more detail. "Chapel programs versus C++ g++" just compares 2. Where are those "more specific benchmarks" ? If you want to answer the big question of "how fast is D compared to C", the best answer is "roughly the same if you compare clang to LDC, because they use the same optimizer and code generator". So does -fllvm Haskell. Is your "roughly the same" within 10% or is it 2x slower or is it 3x slower? Doesn't "getting some numbers from a bunch of benchmark programs" improve that answer.
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Monday, 8 August 2016 at 00:15:09 UTC, jmh530 wrote: I think he's referring to a HPC cluster running chapel vs. C++ versions of programs. Let's not speculate about Russel Winder's comment. The advantage to Chapel is its simplicity and expressiveness. That does seem to be the selling point -- even with tiny tiny benchmarks game programs.
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Monday, 8 August 2016 at 00:44:46 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/7/2016 10:53 AM, Isaac Gouy wrote: Rather than only being dismissive, How did you get from Yeah, I wouldn't bother with it, either. to If you've changed your mind about putting D back on the site, we'd be happy to help. ?
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Monday, 8 August 2016 at 17:11:54 UTC, Meta wrote: Despite the fact that comparing benchmarks across languages tells you very little about how "fast" that language is … Doing so would at-least offer something for people to consider.
Re: The Computer Language Benchmarks Game
On Thursday, 4 August 2016 at 20:15:35 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote: but the measurement code is available for others to use It's down to you -- "If you're interested in something not shown on the benchmarks game website then please take the program source code and the measurement scripts and publish your own measurements." You've already found the measurement scripts -- http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/download/benchmarksgame-script.zip To help you start, I've gone through the archive and zip'd the previously-contributed D programs which you should probably update -- http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/download/dlang-benchmarksgame-programs.zip
Re: Thoughts from newcommer
On Thursday, 13 April 2017 at 03:29:26 UTC, Joakim wrote: Cooperative with what? He chose not to include D anymore, which at one point dominated the shootout, and says we should just start our own site: https://forum.dlang.org/post/no8klt$1d1i$1...@digitalmars.com When did D dominate? http://web.archive.org/web/20090303214521/http://shootout.alioth.debian.org:80/gp4/benchmark.php?test=all%26lang=all On that archived page you can see a lot of language implementations that I chose not to include on the "new" quad core measurements, that began back in 2008 iirc. For newer languages like Crystal and Nim and Julia the tiny benchmarks game programs have been used to provide performance examples (without needing my involvement): https://github.com/kostya/crystal-benchmarks-game https://github.com/def-/nim-benchmarksgame https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/tree/master/test/perf/shootout :but when it comes to D as-far-as-I-can-tell those efforts seem to somehow disappoint the D community and the comparisons are not publicized in the same way: https://forum.dlang.org/post/ihfqubwtadgvlxkve...@forum.dlang.org
Re: Thoughts from newcommer
On Sunday, 16 April 2017 at 04:19:56 UTC, Joakim wrote: came out tops if I weighted time, memory, and source code size equally. Not always highest, as Free Pascal would sometimes beat it, but D usually won. You juggled the numbers to get a result ;-) This one doesn't show any benchmarks because it says it's in your game, so you are involved. No it does not say that. It says "This directory contains the Julia version of the "The Computer Language Benchmarks Game". It provides "perf.jl" to time those Julia programs. Those Julia programs are not included in the benchmarks game. I'm guessing that's because he tried to update the old D benchmarking code and likely the C/C++ code has been optimized a lot more since. ... I suspect D would do just as well on the other benchmarks now. What a great opportunity for someone in the D community to help publicize the language!
Re: Thoughts from newcommer
On Sunday, 16 April 2017 at 08:44:07 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: When anyone mentions the Compiler Shootout for the last 10 years, Isaac always pops up and says he won't put it on his site. I wish he'd just go away. I wish the D community would stop using the benchmarks game as an excuse.
