Re: D brand identity repository

[Jose Armando Garcia]

This is pretty cool it can probably be modify to look more like mars
and make the vertical line the orbit of mars' moons.

http://www.amorian.org/images/temp/D.jpg

PS. found the image using Google...

Re: D brand identity repository

[Roman Ivanov]

On 7/2/2011 6:09 AM, James Fisher wrote:
> I'm keeping this organized at http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  Feedback
> and additions (or subtractions) welcome.
> 
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 8:51 AM, James Fisher  > wrote:
> 
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 1:50 AM, Daniel Gibson  > wrote:
> 
> [...] I think it's important that the logo makes sense for
> 
> somebody who is not deeply familiar with D and its (digital)mars
> origin.
> 
> 
> I definitely agree, and that was kinda my point.  Of two options,
> 
> (1) a half-baked abstraction of Mars, where the representation is
> only clear to the community inner circle and where an outsider would
> think "What are those balls/warts?",
> 
> (2) a clear representation of Mars, where the worst the outsider can
> think is "what does Mars have to do with D?" (a question that would
> also follow your explanation of the abstract representation),
> 
> I'd take the latter.  If that's still not good enough because the
> Mars theme doesn't make sense, then the only real option is to scrap
> the Mars theme altogether.  I wouldn't want to do that.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/269/dmars.jpg/

I'm not proposing this as a logo, it's just a digital version of
"thinking out loud".

Mars is tough to represent in abstract. Unless you use the mars symbol:

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/703/dsymbol.png/

That might evoke some unnecessary associations, though.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrej Mitrovic]

Hey look it hosts the docs:
http://dm.dlang.org/

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrej Mitrovic]

I was just trying out various domain names when I stumbled onto this:
http://www.dlang.org/

Re: D brand identity repository

[Brad Roberts]

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011, Brad Roberts wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Jul 2011, Russel Winder wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 2011-07-05 at 16:27 +0200, David Nadlinger wrote:
> > [ . . . ]
> > > That should be just a trivial change to the redirection rule used with 
> > > most web servers?
> > 
> > Shouldn't the redirect be at the DNS level rather than the Web server
> > level?  Currently it isn't, perhaps it should be?  This would solve the
> > "rest of the URL should still work" problem someone raised.
> 
> I specifically want a redirect rather than to just work.  The reason being 
> that I think we want what's indexed and what's "real" so to speak to be 
> the long form.
> 
> I meant to change the redirect config to keep the trailing path, but 
> didn't get around to it this weekend.  I'll do that tonight.

All set, the path is maintained now and the redirect is a 301 rather than 
302.  Also, both www.d-p-l.org and just d-p-l.org for those that are 
alergic to typing www both redirect to www.d-programming-language.org.  
It's still recommended that any links go directly to the long name, if for 
no other reason than one less thing that can fail and it's just that much 
faster.

Later,
Brad

Re: D brand identity repository

[David Nadlinger]

On 7/6/11 1:03 AM, Brad Roberts wrote:

I meant to change the redirect config to keep the trailing path, but
didn't get around to it this weekend.  I'll do that tonight.



You might also want to change the redirect status code to 301 (moved 
permanently), but I'm not sure, maybe the search engines interpret 302 
just the same anyway.


David

Re: D brand identity repository

[Brad Roberts]

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011, Russel Winder wrote:

> On Tue, 2011-07-05 at 16:27 +0200, David Nadlinger wrote:
> [ . . . ]
> > That should be just a trivial change to the redirection rule used with 
> > most web servers?
> 
> Shouldn't the redirect be at the DNS level rather than the Web server
> level?  Currently it isn't, perhaps it should be?  This would solve the
> "rest of the URL should still work" problem someone raised.

I specifically want a redirect rather than to just work.  The reason being 
that I think we want what's indexed and what's "real" so to speak to be 
the long form.

I meant to change the redirect config to keep the trailing path, but 
didn't get around to it this weekend.  I'll do that tonight.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Russel Winder]

On Tue, 2011-07-05 at 16:27 +0200, David Nadlinger wrote:
[ . . . ]
> That should be just a trivial change to the redirection rule used with 
> most web servers…

Shouldn't the redirect be at the DNS level rather than the Web server
level?  Currently it isn't, perhaps it should be?  This would solve the
"rest of the URL should still work" problem someone raised.

-- 
Russel.
=
Dr Russel Winder  t: +44 20 7585 2200   voip: sip:russel.win...@ekiga.net
41 Buckmaster Roadm: +44 7770 465 077   xmpp: rus...@russel.org.uk
London SW11 1EN, UK   w: www.russel.org.uk  skype: russel_winder


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Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 05.07.2011 16:27, schrieb David Nadlinger:
> On 7/5/11 1:52 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 12:37 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
>> mailto:seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Speaking of the recurring appearance of the shortcut d-p-l.org
>> , it's worth mentioning that Brad Robert
>> graciously bought that domain and forwarded it to
>> d-programming-language.org .
>>
> 
> Aww, seems like I wasn't the only one who had that idea when the domain
> was still available – now I need to contact my hoster on how to get my
> 9.99€ back… ;)
> 

Your hoster charges you for registering a domain that belongs to someone
else?

Re: D brand identity repository

[David Nadlinger]

On 7/5/11 1:52 PM, James Fisher wrote:

On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 12:37 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
mailto:seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org>>
wrote:

Speaking of the recurring appearance of the shortcut d-p-l.org
, it's worth mentioning that Brad Robert
graciously bought that domain and forwarded it to
d-programming-language.org .



Aww, seems like I wasn't the only one who had that idea when the domain 
was still available – now I need to contact my hoster on how to get my 
9.99€ back… ;)



(Also, not to complain, but it would be *extra* awesome if it forwarded
to the requested path -- i.e., a request to "d-p-l.org/
" forwards to
"d-programming-language.org/
".  Not sure how
much work that would be.)


That should be just a trivial change to the redirection rule used with 
most web servers…


David

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 12:37 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu <
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org> wrote:
>
> Speaking of the recurring appearance of the shortcut d-p-l.org, it's worth
> mentioning that Brad Robert graciously bought that domain and forwarded it
> to d-programming-language.org.
>

Hey, look at that!  I never thought to click on it.  Great work Brad!

(Also, not to complain, but it would be *extra* awesome if it forwarded to
the requested path -- i.e., a request to "d-p-l.org/"
forwards to "d-programming-language.org/".  Not sure how
much work that would be.)

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrei Alexandrescu]

On 7/5/11 6:21 AM, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 04:39:31 -0400, James Fisher
 wrote:


On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 12:25 PM, Steven Schveighoffer
wrote:


If it's worth anything, I like the coloring and logo scheme of the
current
site, but I like the design of James' mockup better.



Do you mean "the current one is good, but I prefer James' mockup", or
"James' design is best, but I prefer the old coloring and logo scheme"?

(Just because I'd like your opinion.)


Not sure what the subtlety is I'm missing, but I'll try to clarify:

I like your site design (the layout) but I like the color scheme of the
current d-p-l.org site. The logo on d-p-l.org I don't mind, and I also
like your mockup logo.


Speaking of the recurring appearance of the shortcut d-p-l.org, it's 
worth mentioning that Brad Robert graciously bought that domain and 
forwarded it to d-programming-language.org.


Thanks Brad,

Andrei

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 04:39:31 -0400, James Fisher   
wrote:



On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 12:25 PM, Steven Schveighoffer
wrote:


If it's worth anything, I like the coloring and logo scheme of the  
current

site, but I like the design of James' mockup better.



Do you mean "the current one is good, but I prefer James' mockup", or
 "James' design is best, but I prefer the old coloring and logo scheme"?

(Just because I'd like your opinion.)


Not sure what the subtlety is I'm missing, but I'll try to clarify:

I like your site design (the layout) but I like the color scheme of the  
current d-p-l.org site.  The logo on d-p-l.org I don't mind, and I also  
like your mockup logo.  I could go either way on the logo.  In any case,  
both look more professional than the current digitalmars.com site (no  
offense to Walter).


I think others have brought up good points about being able to navigate  
the library documentation -- the tabs will not scale well for that.  So do  
you have ideas on how that will look?  It should *not* be a popup menu or  
dropdown.  I think it necessarily has to be a navigation bar on the left.


-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 5:54 AM, Russel Winder  wrote:

> On Mon, 2011-07-04 at 11:56 -0600, David Gileadi wrote:
> [ . . . ]
> > One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the
> > navigation can be a bit hairy.  I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page,
> > a Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what
> > sub-navigation would look like with your design.
>
> Although my familiarity with the experimental studies is now 12+ years
> old, and so arguably a little out of date, the headline from then was
> that there is a very complex interaction between "immediate visual
> impact", "navigability", and "need to use".  If the "immediate visual
> impact" of a page is poor then there has to be a very high "need to use"
> for "navigability" to be a factor.  Similarly if the "navigability" is
> poor then "need to use" has to be high for good "immediate visual
> impact" to offset the problems.  In the middle ground there is a lot of
> individual preference.
>
> Of course where "immediate visual impact" and "navigability" are good
> "need to use" falls away as a factor, and indeed the web site enters the
> realm of being a positive draw.
>
> So what is my point?  Much of the debate recently has been about
> "immediate visual impact" and from what I can tell, none has been about
> "navigability".  Without there being an easily inferable navigation
> model, there are always going to be problems, and often they manifest as
> grumbles about "immediate visual impact" whereas in fact the problem is
> a lack of "navigability".
>
> Basically, I think there needs to be a discussion of the navigation
> model and navigation structures as much and probably before discussing
> the look.


Hi Russel, you're right: most of the discussion has been about visual
impact, yet navigation is absolutely crucial.  By designing a homepage I've
given the impression that I just want to design a "showpiece" site.

This is wrong and I've been giving thought to navigation, but haven't had
the confidence to properly tackle it yet.

There are a few things I'm reasonably sure of:

   - Documentation (language and library reference) is 95% of the challenge.
Navigation of the rest of the site, which is either just single top-level
   pages or lists of pages (e.g. Howtos), pales in comparison.
   - Documentation should not be squished into the rest of the navigation.
I much prefer the approach taken by languages that host docs in a sub-site.
This works because I visit their documentation all the time, but the rest
   of the site only rarely.  Pop quiz: how many of you visit
   http://www.d-programming-language.org/ every day to read the quote from
   Andrei?  Not many I'd bet -- you go there as a waypoint in getting to the
   docs.
   - Navigation design should be based heavily on experience.  I'd like
   everyone's input on what online documentation exists that really works, and
   what aspects of it work.  (For instance, I like it when all exported symbols
   are listed at the top of the page, like this 
   .)

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 12:25 PM, Steven Schveighoffer
wrote:
>
> If it's worth anything, I like the coloring and logo scheme of the current
> site, but I like the design of James' mockup better.


Do you mean "the current one is good, but I prefer James' mockup", or
 "James' design is best, but I prefer the old coloring and logo scheme"?

(Just because I'd like your opinion.)

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 7:09 PM, David Nadlinger  wrote:

> On 7/4/11 7:56 PM, David Gileadi wrote:
>
>> One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the
>> navigation can be a bit hairy. I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page, a
>> Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what
>> sub-navigation would look like with your design.
>>
>
> Personally, I would suggest using every possible bit of screen real estate
> to make the API documentation more accessible, with a symbol
> hierarchy/search results bar (identifier search like dpldocs.info) to the
> left and the main content area taking the rest of the browser window.
>
> The »DDoc viewer« would be integrated into the rest of the site with a thin
> bar at the top of the window, saying »[<<< Back to main site.] D Standard
> Library (Phobos) API documentation«, and, most importantly, a dark
> background (hey, I had this idea before Google changed their design^^).
>

I find dark backgrounds to be a big strain on the eyes.  (Some people must
disagree though, e.g. those that rape their true-color monitors into
displaying green text on a black background.)


> I have been planning to build something like this for ages, but just didn't
> find enough time to do so…
>
> David
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Russel Winder]

On Mon, 2011-07-04 at 11:56 -0600, David Gileadi wrote:
[ . . . ]
> One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the 
> navigation can be a bit hairy.  I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page, 
> a Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what 
> sub-navigation would look like with your design.

Although my familiarity with the experimental studies is now 12+ years
old, and so arguably a little out of date, the headline from then was
that there is a very complex interaction between "immediate visual
impact", "navigability", and "need to use".  If the "immediate visual
impact" of a page is poor then there has to be a very high "need to use"
for "navigability" to be a factor.  Similarly if the "navigability" is
poor then "need to use" has to be high for good "immediate visual
impact" to offset the problems.  In the middle ground there is a lot of
individual preference.

Of course where "immediate visual impact" and "navigability" are good
"need to use" falls away as a factor, and indeed the web site enters the
realm of being a positive draw.

So what is my point?  Much of the debate recently has been about
"immediate visual impact" and from what I can tell, none has been about
"navigability".  Without there being an easily inferable navigation
model, there are always going to be problems, and often they manifest as
grumbles about "immediate visual impact" whereas in fact the problem is
a lack of "navigability".

Basically, I think there needs to be a discussion of the navigation
model and navigation structures as much and probably before discussing
the look.
-- 
Russel.
=
Dr Russel Winder  t: +44 20 7585 2200   voip: sip:russel.win...@ekiga.net
41 Buckmaster Roadm: +44 7770 465 077   xmpp: rus...@russel.org.uk
London SW11 1EN, UK   w: www.russel.org.uk  skype: russel_winder


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Re: D brand identity repository

[David Nadlinger]

On 7/4/11 7:56 PM, David Gileadi wrote:

One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the
navigation can be a bit hairy. I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page, a
Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what
sub-navigation would look like with your design.


Personally, I would suggest using every possible bit of screen real 
estate to make the API documentation more accessible, with a symbol 
hierarchy/search results bar (identifier search like dpldocs.info) to 
the left and the main content area taking the rest of the browser window.


This »DDoc viewer« would be integrated into the rest of the site with a 
thin dark bar at the top of the window, saying »[<<< Back to main site.] 
D Standard Library (Phobos) API documentation« (hey, I already had this 
in my mind before Google changed their design^^).


I have been planning to build something like this for ages, but just 
didn't find enough time to do so…


David

Re: D brand identity repository

[David Nadlinger]

On 7/4/11 7:56 PM, David Gileadi wrote:

One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the
navigation can be a bit hairy. I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page, a
Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what
sub-navigation would look like with your design.


Personally, I would suggest using every possible bit of screen real 
estate to make the API documentation more accessible, with a symbol 
hierarchy/search results bar (identifier search like dpldocs.info) to 
the left and the main content area taking the rest of the browser window.


The »DDoc viewer« would be integrated into the rest of the site with a 
thin bar at the top of the window, saying »[<<< Back to main site.] D 
Standard Library (Phobos) API documentation«, and, most importantly, a 
dark background (hey, I had this idea before Google changed their 
design^^).


I have been planning to build something like this for ages, but just 
didn't find enough time to do so…


David

Re: D brand identity repository

[David Gileadi]

On 7/4/11 4:50 AM, James Fisher wrote:

A second draft: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup2.png

Changes:

Swapped out logo for more conservative change.
Reduction in size of the tabs.
Search bar.
Quick-download thing.  Would have to use OS/arch detection to be effective.
Moved code down into page.  Could expand.

And important point that's not evident is that I'm designing for
variable-width.  That image is for 1600px width, but that could shrink.

On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 8:42 AM, James Fisher mailto:jameshfis...@gmail.com>> wrote:

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Jonathan M Davis
mailto:jmdavisp...@gmx.com>> wrote:

Overall, I'd say that I have to agree. I like the current look
and feel of d-
programming-language.org , and
I don't see anything wrong with its logo either
(and it looks _way_ better than any of the logos suggested here
IMHO). I'm
sure that the site could be improved, but the kind of stuff
being discussed in
this thread is incredibly subjective and it doesn't generally
seem like much
of an improvement. d-programming-language.org
 is generally a step up from how
www.digitalmars.com  looks, and the
website situation has been improving. So
truth be told, I don't understand this discussion at all. It
seems to me like
it's a bikeshedding argument on website and logo design. I'm
sure that help on
d-programming-language.org 
would be appreciated, but working on redesigning
the website _again_ seems to me like a waste of time which would
be better
spent elsewhere.


I'm not sure what gave the impression that the people in this thread
want to start again from scratch, but that impression seems to be
the source of some hostility.  At least in my case, that's *not*
what I'm proposing.  Pretty much everything here can be categorized
as formalizing, cleaning up, or improving work that's already been done.


I think the fact that the mockups look quite different from the current 
site is generating the heat--something that looks radically different is 
different in peoples' minds, even if it's just a new skin.


I like your mockups, the 2nd one better than the first.  As with some 
other folks, I'm in favor of keeping the existing logo, which I think 
would look good with your design--better than it does on the existing 
site, in my opinion.  I also like that you're designing for variable widths.


One concern I have is that the D site has a lot of pages, and the 
navigation can be a bit hairy.  I'd like to see a mockup of a sub-page, 
a Phobos or Language Spec page for instance, that shows what 
sub-navigation would look like with your design.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jacob Carlborg]

On 2011-07-04 12:50, James Fisher wrote:

A second draft: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup2.png

Changes:

Swapped out logo for more conservative change.
Reduction in size of the tabs.
Search bar.
Quick-download thing.  Would have to use OS/arch detection to be effective.
Moved code down into page.  Could expand.

And important point that's not evident is that I'm designing for
variable-width.  That image is for 1600px width, but that could shrink.


The size of the tabs are better, still quite high, but now you're 
actually using the space for something else, the search bar.


--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 3:14 PM, Jose Armando Garcia wrote:

> Hey, in general I like what you are doing and I find it an improvement on
> the current site.
>
> I quickly looked at your site and I notice the ubuntu logo. I really like
> their logo and what in represent (people holding hands, community,
> solidaridarity).
>

Ubuntu has perhaps the best brand awareness of perhaps any OSS project in
the world:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Brand
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Official
http://design.canonical.com/the-toolkit/ubuntu-brand-guidelines/

(It's perhaps no coincidence that it's also the most popular distro.)


> Why don't we use something similar for inspiration for D's logo. For D we
> can use duality and have the two moons of mars represent that duality. For
> example these are dualities that are first class citizens in D: Functional
> vs OO, Stack (struct) vs heap (class), message passing (Tid) vs shared
> memory (shared), runtime polymorphism (inheritance and override)  vs compile
> time (template), etc.
>
> I am currently unable to create an image for inspiration due to lack of
> access to a decent computer and lack of skill creating digital images. I'll
> try to play with the concept and submit some drafts.
>

Everything appreciated!

Re: D brand identity repository

[David Nadlinger]

On 7/4/11 4:14 PM, Jose Armando Garcia wrote:

[…]  Why don't we use something similar for inspiration for
D's logo. For D we can use duality and have the two moons of mars
represent that duality. For example these are dualities that are first
class citizens in D: Functional vs OO, Stack (struct) vs heap (class),
message passing (Tid) vs shared memory (shared), runtime polymorphism
(inheritance and override) vs compile time (template), etc.


I have also been thinking about this, not so much about the duality 
aspect, but simply the fact that D allows you to easily express a number 
of different concepts (template metaprogramming, OOP, functional 
programming, …) and in most cases to freely mix and match as you see 
fit, but I wasn't really able to come up with an idea how to express 
this in logo form.


The only thing coming to my mind was different abstract geometric 
shapes, but I just couldn't get a finished image to appear in front of 
my mind's eye…


David

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jose Armando Garcia]

Hey, in general I like what you are doing and I find it an improvement  
on the current site.


I quickly looked at your site and I notice the ubuntu logo. I really  
like their logo and what in represent (people holding hands,  
community, solidaridarity). Why don't we use something similar for  
inspiration for D's logo. For D we can use duality and have the two  
moons of mars represent that duality. For example these are dualities  
that are first class citizens in D: Functional vs OO, Stack (struct)  
vs heap (class), message passing (Tid) vs shared memory (shared),  
runtime polymorphism (inheritance and override)  vs compile time  
(template), etc.


I am currently unable to create an image for inspiration due to lack  
of access to a decent computer and lack of skill creating digital  
images. I'll try to play with the concept and submit some drafts.  
Maybe the yin-yang symbol can be of inspiration.


Note: I have noticed that I have an attraction/affinity to circles

Em 04/07/2011, às 07:50, James Fisher   
escreveu:



A second draft: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup2.png

Changes:

Swapped out logo for more conservative change.
Reduction in size of the tabs.
Search bar.
Quick-download thing.  Would have to use OS/arch detection to be  
effective.

Moved code down into page.  Could expand.

And important point that's not evident is that I'm designing for  
variable-width.  That image is for 1600px width, but that could  
shrink.


On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 8:42 AM, James Fisher  
 wrote:
On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Jonathan M Davis  
 wrote:
Overall, I'd say that I have to agree. I like the current look and  
feel of d-
programming-language.org, and I don't see anything wrong with its  
logo either
(and it looks _way_ better than any of the logos suggested here  
IMHO). I'm
sure that the site could be improved, but the kind of stuff being  
discussed in
this thread is incredibly subjective and it doesn't generally seem  
like much
of an improvement. d-programming-language.org is generally a step up  
from how
www.digitalmars.com looks, and the website situation has been  
improving. So
truth be told, I don't understand this discussion at all. It seems  
to me like
it's a bikeshedding argument on website and logo design. I'm sure  
that help on
d-programming-language.org would be appreciated, but working on  
redesigning
the website _again_ seems to me like a waste of time which would be  
better

spent elsewhere.

I'm not sure what gave the impression that the people in this thread  
want to start again from scratch, but that impression seems to be  
the source of some hostility.  At least in my case, that's *not*  
what I'm proposing.  Pretty much everything here can be categorized  
as formalizing, cleaning up, or improving work that's already been  
done.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 04.07.2011 12:50, schrieb James Fisher:
> A second draft: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup2.png
> 
> Changes:
> 
> Swapped out logo for more conservative change.
> Reduction in size of the tabs.
> Search bar.
> Quick-download thing.  Would have to use OS/arch detection to be effective.
> Moved code down into page.  Could expand.
> 
> And important point that's not evident is that I'm designing for
> variable-width.  That image is for 1600px width, but that could shrink.
> 

I think the old logo (maybe slightly modified) should be kept at the
homepage.
At least I see the proposed logo as a simpler version of the old logo
that should be used if the old logo is to shiny for the purpose or can't
be scaled down enough etc.

Cheers,
- Daniel

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Sat, 02 Jul 2011 03:42:42 -0400, James Fisher   
wrote:


On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 6:18 PM, Steven Schveighoffer  
wrote:



I think you are way overthinking this...



I've never quite understood what "overthinking" actually means.  If you  
mean

exploring all possible trains of thought the viewer, I'll take that as a
compliment.  By all means disagree with what I say -- it's either valid  
or

it's not (it may well not be!).


Then I disagree -- the case you bring up is obscure, plus it makes an  
assumption that having to explain historical references in the logo is a  
negative.


The main focus of the logo is the D, the moons might generate some trivia  
questions, but is that really a turnoff?




rule #1 -- the logo should have the letter 'D' in it.


and, um... that's it :)



That is most definitely *not* it.  By your specification, would you be  
happy

with just the 'D' from Comic Sans?


No.  But it would qualify as a D logo candidate -- it has a D in it.  I  
didn't imply that we should randomly select from all possible logos that  
have a D in it to be our logo.  I was saying that we should not make any  
other rules disqualifying a logo because of some obscure invented  
situation that might occur.  As long as there's a D in it, it can be  
considered as a logo, and if it generates quizzical looks, who cares?



There is a huge number of explicit and implicit rules and guidelines to
consider when creating the one image that will represent your project for
time immemorial.  That's why there are books, websites, careers forged on
this.


As a non-designer, this is the *only* rule I would go by to disqualify a  
logo for D -- if it doesn't have a D in it, I don't think it should be the  
logo for D.  I'll leave all the asthetics and other things up to the real  
designers.  I can only say what I like and don't like, I have no skill to  
design such things.


-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Sun, 03 Jul 2011 10:52:07 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu  
 wrote:



On 7/3/11 7:15 AM, James Fisher wrote:



On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg mailto:d...@me.com>> wrote:

On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:

So, here's a website mockup:
http://eegg.github.com/d-__brand/mockup.png


Comments appreciated.


In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You
could cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much
vertical space. You can easily cut off 30px above and below the text
in the tabs.


That is true, though I do have a few reasons for keeping 'em big:

- I think the composition works better with it being a half or a third
of the height of the sand-color banner.
- potentially, a second layer of links could be introduced.  (Though in
general I shy away from multi-level top-level links as over-engineered,
unless the site is really complex, which it's not.)
- on other pages, e.g. the docs, I'm considering having the logo in the
dark banner (at the same x-pos).  This would require some space.
- last but not least, it's the web, not paper, and we have all the space
we want for free!

I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language
reference and one from the library reference, for example:

http://d-programming-language.__org/lex.html

http://d-programming-language.__org/phobos/std_string.html



I'll come up with those when I stop playing around with Inkscape, and
mock up in HTML/CSS.


One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the  
site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this  
group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the  
page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it  
surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.


The page design hasn't changed very much.  As far as I recall (and I  
didn't participate a lick in the discussions), no major site design  
discussions occurred.  But maybe I just didn't look at any of the  
alternatives when they were posted.


If it's worth anything, I like the coloring and logo scheme of the current  
site, but I like the design of James' mockup better.


-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

A second draft: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup2.png

Changes:

Swapped out logo for more conservative change.
Reduction in size of the tabs.
Search bar.
Quick-download thing.  Would have to use OS/arch detection to be effective.
Moved code down into page.  Could expand.

And important point that's not evident is that I'm designing for
variable-width.  That image is for 1600px width, but that could shrink.

On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 8:42 AM, James Fisher  wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
>>
>> Overall, I'd say that I have to agree. I like the current look and feel of
>> d-
>> programming-language.org, and I don't see anything wrong with its logo
>> either
>> (and it looks _way_ better than any of the logos suggested here IMHO). I'm
>> sure that the site could be improved, but the kind of stuff being
>> discussed in
>> this thread is incredibly subjective and it doesn't generally seem like
>> much
>> of an improvement. d-programming-language.org is generally a step up from
>> how
>> www.digitalmars.com looks, and the website situation has been improving.
>> So
>> truth be told, I don't understand this discussion at all. It seems to me
>> like
>> it's a bikeshedding argument on website and logo design. I'm sure that
>> help on
>> d-programming-language.org would be appreciated, but working on
>> redesigning
>> the website _again_ seems to me like a waste of time which would be better
>> spent elsewhere.
>
>
> I'm not sure what gave the impression that the people in this thread want
> to start again from scratch, but that impression seems to be the source of
> some hostility.  At least in my case, that's *not* what I'm proposing.
>  Pretty much everything here can be categorized as formalizing, cleaning up,
> or improving work that's already been done.
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
>
> Overall, I'd say that I have to agree. I like the current look and feel of
> d-
> programming-language.org, and I don't see anything wrong with its logo
> either
> (and it looks _way_ better than any of the logos suggested here IMHO). I'm
> sure that the site could be improved, but the kind of stuff being discussed
> in
> this thread is incredibly subjective and it doesn't generally seem like
> much
> of an improvement. d-programming-language.org is generally a step up from
> how
> www.digitalmars.com looks, and the website situation has been improving.
> So
> truth be told, I don't understand this discussion at all. It seems to me
> like
> it's a bikeshedding argument on website and logo design. I'm sure that help
> on
> d-programming-language.org would be appreciated, but working on
> redesigning
> the website _again_ seems to me like a waste of time which would be better
> spent elsewhere.


I'm not sure what gave the impression that the people in this thread want to
start again from scratch, but that impression seems to be the source of some
hostility.  At least in my case, that's *not* what I'm proposing.  Pretty
much everything here can be categorized as formalizing, cleaning up, or
improving work that's already been done.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Andrej Mitrovic
wrote:

> I'd rather not have a website where I have to click on 10 links to get
> to the information I need. The current site has everything on its
> homepage, and that's a good thing. Fuck these iPad-friendly
> poser-sites.
>

My, aren't you unfriendly :-)

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu <
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org> wrote:

> On 7/3/11 12:35 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
>> > > >>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that
>>the site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people
>>in this group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme,
>>the fonts, the page design - pretty much all aspects of the website.
>>I find it surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.
>>
>>
>> I don't want to give the impression that I want to discard everything.
>>  What I and the others in this thread are currently doing definitely
>> builds on that work -- which is clear in the potential refinements of
>> the logo, the palette, and the font choice.  I imagine the contents of
>> the site will remain 95% the same, too.  My proposed page layout is
>> perhaps an overhaul, though.
>>
>> If you feel the proposals are a step back rather than forwards then I'm
>> happy to discuss that.
>>
>
> I'm not qualified to discuss aesthetic matters.


Sure you are; we all have eyes.


> I think once we're past fixing flaws, a lot of stuff is simply different
> without being either obviously better or worse. (All other things being
> equal, novelty and artistic je-ne-sais-quoi are definite assets.)
>
> On my agenda for the website there are several important things: (a) make
> the homepage more dynamic, e.g. with the latest posts etc; (b) propagate the
> look and feel of std.algorithm to the other modules; (c) integrate Adam
> Ruppe's "try now" button everywhere; (d) make a pass through the content to
> improve it, fix examples, add articles and links and so on. Fiddling once
> more with color scheme and layout minutiae is, well, not on that list.
>

That's fine, and those things are important too.  Content and presentation
are (theoretically) independent, so our working on separate things
independently shouldn't matter.

I didn't create either the current layout or the mockup at
> http://eegg.github.com/d-**brand/mockup.pngso
>  I can candidly compare the two. I like the current layout better.
>
> * The existing logo looks professional and well rounded. The proposed logo,
> with non-circular bubbles, the bare letter, and the color choice looks
> inferior to me.
>

I think I agree with you here, and I'm not convinced by it either.  It can
be swapped out.  Most people seem to agree with me that there are a couple
of problems with the current one, however: (1) the background looks like
someone's attacked it with a gradient gun, and (2) a border around the D
seems to be preferred.  If nothing else I'd like these fixed.

* The proposed menu at the top is disproportionately tall compared to the
> font size. It looks like someone chose the wrong font/menu height
> combination in a windowing system.
>

This seems to be source of divided opinion.

* I like the color palette of the current site with the nuances of gray and
> the surrounding border.


To each their own I suppose.  To my eye there the only colors in that
palette that matter are the deep red and the dark blue; the rest just look
like they've been chosen on the fly whenever a color was needed.


> * The mockup text is ragged right, whereas the current site has beautifully
> justified and hyphenated text.
>
>  * I prefer the blockquote indentation and color. In the proposed layout
> the blockquote is only distinguished with a crappy double quote sign to its
> left.
>

The above is pretty much just placeholder; It's not really part of any
proposed design.  Though FWIW I like ragged right, and hyphenation only
really adds to readability with columns of text a lot narrower than on the
current site (but I'm not saying remove it).

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jonathan M Davis]

On 2011-07-03 11:03, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
> On 7/3/11 12:35 PM, James Fisher wrote:
> > On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
> > mailto:seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org>>
> > 
> > wrote:
> > One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that
> > the site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people
> > in this group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme,
> > the fonts, the page design - pretty much all aspects of the website.
> > I find it surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.
> > 
> > I don't want to give the impression that I want to discard everything.
> > 
> >   What I and the others in this thread are currently doing definitely
> > 
> > builds on that work -- which is clear in the potential refinements of
> > the logo, the palette, and the font choice.  I imagine the contents of
> > the site will remain 95% the same, too.  My proposed page layout is
> > perhaps an overhaul, though.
> > 
> > If you feel the proposals are a step back rather than forwards then I'm
> > happy to discuss that.
> 
> I'm not qualified to discuss aesthetic matters. I think once we're past
> fixing flaws, a lot of stuff is simply different without being either
> obviously better or worse. (All other things being equal, novelty and
> artistic je-ne-sais-quoi are definite assets.)
> 
> On my agenda for the website there are several important things: (a)
> make the homepage more dynamic, e.g. with the latest posts etc; (b)
> propagate the look and feel of std.algorithm to the other modules; (c)
> integrate Adam Ruppe's "try now" button everywhere; (d) make a pass
> through the content to improve it, fix examples, add articles and links
> and so on. Fiddling once more with color scheme and layout minutiae is,
> well, not on that list.
> 
> I didn't create either the current layout or the mockup at
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png so I can candidly compare the
> two. I like the current layout better.
> 
> * The existing logo looks professional and well rounded. The proposed
> logo, with non-circular bubbles, the bare letter, and the color choice
> looks inferior to me.
> 
> * The proposed menu at the top is disproportionately tall compared to
> the font size. It looks like someone chose the wrong font/menu height
> combination in a windowing system.
> 
> * The mockup text is ragged right, whereas the current site has
> beautifully justified and hyphenated text.
> 
> * I like the color palette of the current site with the nuances of gray
> and the surrounding border.
> 
> * I prefer the blockquote indentation and color. In the proposed layout
> the blockquote is only distinguished with a crappy double quote sign to
> its left.
> 
> * I like the proposed brief code sample, but I'd rather integrate such
> within the current layout. (There have been discussions about that.)
> 
> There's nothing objective here, so anything could go either way.
> Furthermore some or all of these issues (subjective as they are) can be
> fixed, which takes us back to the question - what is wrong with the
> current design, and what is the next step towards improving it?
> Rehashing the layout into something different-yet-equivalent doesn't
> strike me as getting the best bang for the buck - it's not a step
> forward or backward, but a definite lateral one.

Overall, I'd say that I have to agree. I like the current look and feel of d-
programming-language.org, and I don't see anything wrong with its logo either 
(and it looks _way_ better than any of the logos suggested here IMHO). I'm 
sure that the site could be improved, but the kind of stuff being discussed in 
this thread is incredibly subjective and it doesn't generally seem like much 
of an improvement. d-programming-language.org is generally a step up from how 
www.digitalmars.com looks, and the website situation has been improving. So 
truth be told, I don't understand this discussion at all. It seems to me like 
it's a bikeshedding argument on website and logo design. I'm sure that help on 
d-programming-language.org would be appreciated, but working on redesigning 
the website _again_ seems to me like a waste of time which would be better 
spent elsewhere.

- Jonathan M Davis

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrej Mitrovic]

I'd rather not have a website where I have to click on 10 links to get
to the information I need. The current site has everything on its
homepage, and that's a good thing. Fuck these iPad-friendly
poser-sites.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrei Alexandrescu]

On 7/3/11 12:35 PM, James Fisher wrote:

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
mailto:seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org>>
wrote:

One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that
the site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people
in this group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme,
the fonts, the page design - pretty much all aspects of the website.
I find it surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.


I don't want to give the impression that I want to discard everything.
  What I and the others in this thread are currently doing definitely
builds on that work -- which is clear in the potential refinements of
the logo, the palette, and the font choice.  I imagine the contents of
the site will remain 95% the same, too.  My proposed page layout is
perhaps an overhaul, though.

If you feel the proposals are a step back rather than forwards then I'm
happy to discuss that.


I'm not qualified to discuss aesthetic matters. I think once we're past 
fixing flaws, a lot of stuff is simply different without being either 
obviously better or worse. (All other things being equal, novelty and 
artistic je-ne-sais-quoi are definite assets.)


On my agenda for the website there are several important things: (a) 
make the homepage more dynamic, e.g. with the latest posts etc; (b) 
propagate the look and feel of std.algorithm to the other modules; (c) 
integrate Adam Ruppe's "try now" button everywhere; (d) make a pass 
through the content to improve it, fix examples, add articles and links 
and so on. Fiddling once more with color scheme and layout minutiae is, 
well, not on that list.


I didn't create either the current layout or the mockup at 
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png so I can candidly compare the 
two. I like the current layout better.


* The existing logo looks professional and well rounded. The proposed 
logo, with non-circular bubbles, the bare letter, and the color choice 
looks inferior to me.


* The proposed menu at the top is disproportionately tall compared to 
the font size. It looks like someone chose the wrong font/menu height 
combination in a windowing system.


* The mockup text is ragged right, whereas the current site has 
beautifully justified and hyphenated text.


* I like the color palette of the current site with the nuances of gray 
and the surrounding border.


* I prefer the blockquote indentation and color. In the proposed layout 
the blockquote is only distinguished with a crappy double quote sign to 
its left.


* I like the proposed brief code sample, but I'd rather integrate such 
within the current layout. (There have been discussions about that.)


There's nothing objective here, so anything could go either way.
Furthermore some or all of these issues (subjective as they are) can be 
fixed, which takes us back to the question - what is wrong with the 
current design, and what is the next step towards improving it? 
Rehashing the layout into something different-yet-equivalent doesn't 
strike me as getting the best bang for the buck - it's not a step 
forward or backward, but a definite lateral one.



Thanks,

Andrei

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu <
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org> wrote:
>
> One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the
> site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this
> group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the
> page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it surprising
> that all that is now as if it never existed.


I don't want to give the impression that I want to discard everything.  What
I and the others in this thread are currently doing definitely builds on
that work -- which is clear in the potential refinements of the logo, the
palette, and the font choice.  I imagine the contents of the site will
remain 95% the same, too.  My proposed page layout is perhaps an overhaul,
though.

If you feel the proposals are a step back rather than forwards then I'm
happy to discuss that.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jimmy Cao]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu <
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org> wrote:

> On 7/3/11 7:15 AM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg >
>> > wrote:
>>
>>On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:
>>
>>So, here's a website mockup:
>>
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-__**brand/mockup.png
>>
>>
>> 
>> >
>>
>>Comments appreciated.
>>
>>
>>In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You
>>could cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much
>>vertical space. You can easily cut off 30px above and below the text
>>in the tabs.
>>
>>
>> That is true, though I do have a few reasons for keeping 'em big:
>>
>> - I think the composition works better with it being a half or a third
>> of the height of the sand-color banner.
>> - potentially, a second layer of links could be introduced.  (Though in
>> general I shy away from multi-level top-level links as over-engineered,
>> unless the site is really complex, which it's not.)
>> - on other pages, e.g. the docs, I'm considering having the logo in the
>> dark banner (at the same x-pos).  This would require some space.
>> - last but not least, it's the web, not paper, and we have all the space
>> we want for free!
>>
>>I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language
>>reference and one from the library reference, for example:
>>
>>http://d-programming-language.**__org/lex.html
>>
>> 
>> >
>>http://d-programming-language.**__org/phobos/std_string.html
>>
>>
>> 
>> >
>>
>>
>> I'll come up with those when I stop playing around with Inkscape, and
>> mock up in HTML/CSS.
>>
>
> One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the
> site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this
> group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the
> page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it surprising
> that all that is now as if it never existed.
>
>
> Andrei
>

Yep, the previous discussion was very helpful in that it shaped the current
site.
I don't believe that appreciating this discussion makes us discredit that
earlier discussion.  In a healthy open-source project, all kinds of efforts
from the community continually drive to improve the project as a whole.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 03.07.2011 16:52, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu:
> One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the
> site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this
> group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the
> page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it
> surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.
> 
> 
> Andrei

I personally like current design including the current logo.
But maybe a simpler version of that logo that can scale up and down (and
be used as program logos etc) is needed.

If this causes minor changes to the logo (like a clear border between D
and the moon or the moon being partly inside the D) it shouldn't be much
of an issue (and doesn't contradict the previous votes for that logo).
But I personally don't think that the website's design should be changed.

Cheers,
- Daniel

Re: D brand identity repository

[Alix Pexton]

On 03/07/2011 13:32, SimonM wrote:

Ooh, don't forget about the dsource logo:
http://www.dsource.org/chrome/dsource/img/dsource-logo.gif

and also the d-programming-language.org site's favicon:
http://d-programming-language.org/favicon.ico


Visual D has its own logo too, though it is partially inspired by that
of Visual Studio...


http://www.dsource.org/projects/visuald/browser/wiki/vd_logo.png?format=raw

I started to do a more Martian version and realised that it reminded me 
too much of the old netscape logo ><


The current logo (white on red) is still my favourite, though I think I 
see it differently to some of you. When I look at it, I see the letter D 
on a window that is looking out onto a view of 3 celestial bodies, but 
many of the new designs make the D into the planet. Of the new designs, 
I like Mafi's the most.


A...

Re: D brand identity repository

[Михаил Страшун]

Well, some just have completely missed that discussion and like this new 
mockup a lot more than current d-programming-language.org :)

Hope no harm done!

On 7/3/2011 5:52 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

On 7/3/11 7:15 AM, James Fisher wrote:



On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg mailto:d...@me.com>> wrote:

On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:

So, here's a website mockup:
http://eegg.github.com/d-__brand/mockup.png


Comments appreciated.


In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You
could cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much
vertical space. You can easily cut off 30px above and below the text
in the tabs.


That is true, though I do have a few reasons for keeping 'em big:

- I think the composition works better with it being a half or a third
of the height of the sand-color banner.
- potentially, a second layer of links could be introduced. (Though in
general I shy away from multi-level top-level links as over-engineered,
unless the site is really complex, which it's not.)
- on other pages, e.g. the docs, I'm considering having the logo in the
dark banner (at the same x-pos). This would require some space.
- last but not least, it's the web, not paper, and we have all the space
we want for free!

I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language
reference and one from the library reference, for example:

http://d-programming-language.__org/lex.html

http://d-programming-language.__org/phobos/std_string.html



I'll come up with those when I stop playing around with Inkscape, and
mock up in HTML/CSS.


One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the
site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this
group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the
page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it
surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.


Andrei

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrei Alexandrescu]

On 7/3/11 7:15 AM, James Fisher wrote:



On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg mailto:d...@me.com>> wrote:

On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:

So, here's a website mockup:
http://eegg.github.com/d-__brand/mockup.png


Comments appreciated.


In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You
could cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much
vertical space. You can easily cut off 30px above and below the text
in the tabs.


That is true, though I do have a few reasons for keeping 'em big:

- I think the composition works better with it being a half or a third
of the height of the sand-color banner.
- potentially, a second layer of links could be introduced.  (Though in
general I shy away from multi-level top-level links as over-engineered,
unless the site is really complex, which it's not.)
- on other pages, e.g. the docs, I'm considering having the logo in the
dark banner (at the same x-pos).  This would require some space.
- last but not least, it's the web, not paper, and we have all the space
we want for free!

I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language
reference and one from the library reference, for example:

http://d-programming-language.__org/lex.html

http://d-programming-language.__org/phobos/std_string.html



I'll come up with those when I stop playing around with Inkscape, and
mock up in HTML/CSS.


One thing that's going somewhat unnoticed in this discussion is that the 
site is at the end of a major redesign cycle during which people in this 
group gave extensive input on the logo, the color scheme, the fonts, the 
page design - pretty much all aspects of the website. I find it 
surprising that all that is now as if it never existed.



Andrei

Re: D brand identity repository

[SimonM]

Ooh, don't forget about the dsource logo:
http://www.dsource.org/chrome/dsource/img/dsource-logo.gif

and also the d-programming-language.org site's favicon:
http://d-programming-language.org/favicon.ico

On 2011/07/02 17:29 PM, James Fisher wrote:

I've vectorized the Digital Mars logo. http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/
(I think it's Arial in the original, but the M and S of my Arial is
different??)  Perhaps this'll be useful some day.

Barring the stretched text, there is something I like about the DM logo.
  The Mars there looks totally out of this world (hah).

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Jacob Carlborg mailto:d...@me.com>> wrote:

On 2011-07-01 18:02, James Fisher wrote:

A couple of things to keep in mind:

I see every suggestion so far, including mine, uses letterplay,
but a
logo does not *have* to do this.  Note that Python's logo is not the
word "python" made out of snakes, for example.  I see a lot of

ameteur-looking logos around that seem to think that forcing a
letter or
word into a shape is the only way to do it.  The end result is,
well, it
looks forced, and that's bad.  I'm not advocating discarding the "D"
route, but it's something to keep in mind.  This certainly opens up
possibilities for simplicity.  There are many logos out there
consisting
of a simple graphic and some well-set text, and they look
classy.  For
example, we could run with the Mars theme, and *just* have a
well-done
stylized image of Mars.  Example:
https://github.com/eegg/d-__brand/raw/master/d-logo-11.png
__.


I like that one.

--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg  wrote:

> On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> So, here's a website mockup: 
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-**brand/mockup.png
>>
>> Comments appreciated.
>>
>
> In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You could
> cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much vertical space. You
> can easily cut off 30px above and below the text in the tabs.
>

That is true, though I do have a few reasons for keeping 'em big:

- I think the composition works better with it being a half or a third of
the height of the sand-color banner.
- potentially, a second layer of links could be introduced.  (Though in
general I shy away from multi-level top-level links as over-engineered,
unless the site is really complex, which it's not.)
- on other pages, e.g. the docs, I'm considering having the logo in the dark
banner (at the same x-pos).  This would require some space.
- last but not least, it's the web, not paper, and we have all the space we
want for free!


> I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language reference
> and one from the library reference, for example:
>
> http://d-programming-language.**org/lex.html
> http://d-programming-language.**org/phobos/std_string.html


I'll come up with those when I stop playing around with Inkscape, and mock
up in HTML/CSS.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:53 PM, Matthias Pleh  wrote:

> Am 03.07.2011 00:00, schrieb James Fisher:
>
>>
>> WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
>> installation? This for Go  is one of my
>>
>> favourite features of their site (shame about the language itself).
>>  Such a thing for D would be a big attraction.
>>
>
>
> Adam Ruppe is working on that ... I thought, its already installed on
> d-p-l.org, but it seems not ...
>

Oh, cool.  Yeah, I knew I'd seen something.  Adam, any news?


> To your 'mockup.png' -> I already like your style, it's simple and
> beautiful. Keep up that great work.
>

Thank you.

>From the logos, I would prefer
> https://github.com/eegg/d-**brand/raw/master/d-logo-9.png


I plan to hold an informal vote on the logo in a few days once all the
entries are in.  :-)

I think the site design can proceed without that decision.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:22 PM, Torarin  wrote:
>
> Jumbo tabs great. Open Sans is pretty. I miss the colors in this:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-11.png.
> I even like the font you used on that one, but I don't know how well
> it would work in combination with Open Sans.


Probably badly.  Personally I think there's a line to tread between "fun"
and "serious", and the combination of that logo and font hurdles over that
line into "wacky".


> I think the code sample
> should go in the body of the page.


Sure thing, I'll try that.  Feels like there should be something filling
that space though.

Perhaps a prominent "download" option, though I'm not really convinced by
those: newbies won't be convinced to download straight away, and oldies
won't be coming back to the site to download the compiler every five
minutes, so I'm not sure who they cater to.


> Can you try one with the three
> colored celestial bodies by themselves and "The D Programming
> Language" more prominently sized in the header?
>

I'll try one with that logo.  As for the actual text, I'm wondering whether
it actually needs to be there at all.  The fact that D is a programming
language is made amply clear by context: code samples, massive text "D is a
programming language ..." (!) on the front page, and every other page on the
site will make that clear too.


> You're doing great work with this!
>

Thanks!

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sun, Jul 3, 2011 at 11:51 AM, Jacob Carlborg  wrote:

> On 2011-07-02 20:48, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> At the bottom of 
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-**brand/I'm 
>> working on a
>> palette.  You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org
>> .  If nothing else, this list can be massively
>> shortened.
>>
>
> I don't think the lime green color belongs in the palette.


You're right.

>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jacob Carlborg]

On 2011-07-02 20:48, James Fisher wrote:

At the bottom of http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ I'm working on a
palette.  You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org
.  If nothing else, this list can be massively shortened.


I don't think the lime green color belongs in the palette.

--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jacob Carlborg]

On 2011-07-02 23:01, James Fisher wrote:

So, here's a website mockup: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png

Comments appreciated.


In general I like it. I think the top tabs are a little too big. You 
could cut the height in half I think, it's wasting a too much vertical 
space. You can easily cut off 30px above and below the text in the tabs.


As others have said, I like this logo: 
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-11.png or at least the colors.


I would be nice to see a mouckup of one page from the language reference 
and one from the library reference, for example:


http://d-programming-language.org/lex.html
http://d-programming-language.org/phobos/std_string.html

--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[Matthias Pleh]

Am 03.07.2011 00:00, schrieb James Fisher:


WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
installation? This for Go  is one of my
favourite features of their site (shame about the language itself).
  Such a thing for D would be a big attraction.



Adam Ruppe is working on that ... I thought, its already installed on 
d-p-l.org, but it seems not ...


To your 'mockup.png' -> I already like your style, it's simple and 
beautiful. Keep up that great work.



From the logos, I would prefer
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-9.png

Re: D brand identity repository

[Torarin]

2011/7/3 James Fisher :
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Jimmy Cao  wrote:
>>
>> The mockup looks pretty good.
>> I think the current D website should incorporate the idea of having those
>> big tab-like links up at the top.
>> See:
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
>> http://ironpython.net/
>> http://cobra-language.com/
>> Right now there's just empty space.
>
> Sure thing.  Updated http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png, now with:
> - jumbo tabs
> - code sample
> - download links
> WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
> installation? This for Go is one of my favourite features of their site
> (shame about the language itself).  Such a thing for D would be a big
> attraction.

Jumbo tabs great. Open Sans is pretty. I miss the colors in this:
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-11.png.
I even like the font you used on that one, but I don't know how well
it would work in combination with Open Sans. I think the code sample
should go in the body of the page. Can you try one with the three
colored celestial bodies by themselves and "The D Programming
Language" more prominently sized in the header?

You're doing great work with this!

Torarin

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

Also, a big resource at D's disposal that's not properly exploited is
videos.  YouTube has quite a few that might make good advertising:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlVpPstLPEc (Google Tech talk)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZqWGfv7bxw (Andrei is a big name, anything
with him in is good)

Other recommendations?


On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:05 PM, James Fisher wrote:

> Incidentally, for the code sample, does anyone fancy coming up with the
> most interesting code they can in about 5 lines at 30 chars per line?  Hello
> World is pretty dull, but the sample at d-p-l.org is much too long for a
> 2-second glance.  The main things I think it should get across are:
>
> - that D is like C and C++
> - that D is better -- e.g., package/module system.  Not sure what else you
> can get across.
>
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:00 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Jimmy Cao  wrote:
>>
>>> The mockup looks pretty good.
>>>
>>> I think the current D website should incorporate the idea of having those
>>> big tab-like links up at the top.
>>>
>>> See:
>>> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
>>> http://ironpython.net/
>>> http://cobra-language.com/
>>>
>>> Right now there's just empty space.
>>>
>>
>> Sure thing.  Updated http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png, now with:
>>
>> - jumbo tabs
>> - code sample
>> - download links
>>
>> WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
>> installation? This for Go  is one of my
>> favourite features of their site (shame about the language itself).  Such a
>> thing for D would be a big attraction.
>>
>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

Incidentally, for the code sample, does anyone fancy coming up with the most
interesting code they can in about 5 lines at 30 chars per line?  Hello
World is pretty dull, but the sample at d-p-l.org is much too long for a
2-second glance.  The main things I think it should get across are:

- that D is like C and C++
- that D is better -- e.g., package/module system.  Not sure what else you
can get across.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:00 PM, James Fisher wrote:

> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Jimmy Cao  wrote:
>
>> The mockup looks pretty good.
>>
>> I think the current D website should incorporate the idea of having those
>> big tab-like links up at the top.
>>
>> See:
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
>> http://ironpython.net/
>> http://cobra-language.com/
>>
>> Right now there's just empty space.
>>
>
> Sure thing.  Updated http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png, now with:
>
> - jumbo tabs
> - code sample
> - download links
>
> WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
> installation? This for Go  is one of my
> favourite features of their site (shame about the language itself).  Such a
> thing for D would be a big attraction.
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Jimmy Cao  wrote:

> The mockup looks pretty good.
>
> I think the current D website should incorporate the idea of having those
> big tab-like links up at the top.
>
> See:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
> http://ironpython.net/
> http://cobra-language.com/
>
> Right now there's just empty space.
>

Sure thing.  Updated http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png, now with:

- jumbo tabs
- code sample
- download links

WRT the code sample, I think I remember seeing somewhere a web-hosted D
installation? This for Go  is one of my
favourite features of their site (shame about the language itself).  Such a
thing for D would be a big attraction.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jimmy Cao]

The mockup looks pretty good.

I think the current D website should incorporate the idea of having those
big tab-like links up at the top.

See:
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
http://ironpython.net/
http://cobra-language.com/

Right now there's just empty space.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 4:09 PM, James Fisher  wrote:

> My main concerns are
>
> - genericity
> - corporo-whore-ness
> - (the logo is pretty much a placeholder; I'm not pushing that over any
> others without approval)
>
> Things I like:
>
> - palette.  IMO it's clean, not too dull, and faithful to the original.
> - Big Words.  I think every site should have a one-sentence introduction
> (perhaps I have a short attention span).
> - navigation at the top.  One reason for this is that it makes it very easy
> to maintain consistency over multiple subsites (e.g. main, docs, forum,
> etc): you just shove it in at the top.
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:01 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> So, here's a website mockup: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
>>
>> Comments appreciated.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 7:48 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>>
>>> At the bottom of http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ I'm working on a
>>> palette.  You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org.  If
>>> nothing else, this list can be massively shortened.
>>>
>>> I've also got my own suggestion there.  The orangered is faithful to the
>>> original Digital Mars logo rather than to the current D logo.  IMO the
>>> current palette is a little dull; some sparse uses of this color could bring
>>> a page to life.  The two main other colors there are a very dark blue
>>> similar to that on d-p-l.org, and white.  The two others are different
>>> saturation and value of that dark blue.  All blues and the red are
>>> complements on the color wheel.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:59 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>>>
 You'll find descriptions of D at the bottom of
 http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  I'd appreciate anyone with a knack
 for editing or promotion to contribute.


 On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:52 PM, bearophile wrote:

> Jimmy Cao:
>
> > What about this?
> >
> > http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png
>
> The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think
> (just as before).
>
> Bye,
> bearophile
>


>>>
>>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

My main concerns are

- genericity
- corporo-whore-ness
- (the logo is pretty much a placeholder; I'm not pushing that over any
others without approval)

Things I like:

- palette.  IMO it's clean, not too dull, and faithful to the original.
- Big Words.  I think every site should have a one-sentence introduction
(perhaps I have a short attention span).
- navigation at the top.  One reason for this is that it makes it very easy
to maintain consistency over multiple subsites (e.g. main, docs, forum,
etc): you just shove it in at the top.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 10:01 PM, James Fisher wrote:

> So, here's a website mockup: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png
>
> Comments appreciated.
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 7:48 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> At the bottom of http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ I'm working on a
>> palette.  You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org.  If
>> nothing else, this list can be massively shortened.
>>
>> I've also got my own suggestion there.  The orangered is faithful to the
>> original Digital Mars logo rather than to the current D logo.  IMO the
>> current palette is a little dull; some sparse uses of this color could bring
>> a page to life.  The two main other colors there are a very dark blue
>> similar to that on d-p-l.org, and white.  The two others are different
>> saturation and value of that dark blue.  All blues and the red are
>> complements on the color wheel.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:59 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>>
>>> You'll find descriptions of D at the bottom of
>>> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  I'd appreciate anyone with a knack for
>>> editing or promotion to contribute.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:52 PM, bearophile wrote:
>>>
 Jimmy Cao:

 > What about this?
 >
 > http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png

 The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think (just
 as before).

 Bye,
 bearophile

>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

So, here's a website mockup: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/mockup.png

Comments appreciated.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 7:48 PM, James Fisher  wrote:

> At the bottom of http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ I'm working on a palette.
>  You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org.  If nothing
> else, this list can be massively shortened.
>
> I've also got my own suggestion there.  The orangered is faithful to the
> original Digital Mars logo rather than to the current D logo.  IMO the
> current palette is a little dull; some sparse uses of this color could bring
> a page to life.  The two main other colors there are a very dark blue
> similar to that on d-p-l.org, and white.  The two others are different
> saturation and value of that dark blue.  All blues and the red are
> complements on the color wheel.
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:59 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> You'll find descriptions of D at the bottom of
>> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  I'd appreciate anyone with a knack for
>> editing or promotion to contribute.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:52 PM, bearophile wrote:
>>
>>> Jimmy Cao:
>>>
>>> > What about this?
>>> >
>>> > http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png
>>>
>>> The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think (just
>>> as before).
>>>
>>> Bye,
>>> bearophile
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

At the bottom of http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ I'm working on a palette.
 You'll find a list of the colors currently at d-p-l.org.  If nothing else,
this list can be massively shortened.

I've also got my own suggestion there.  The orangered is faithful to the
original Digital Mars logo rather than to the current D logo.  IMO the
current palette is a little dull; some sparse uses of this color could bring
a page to life.  The two main other colors there are a very dark blue
similar to that on d-p-l.org, and white.  The two others are different
saturation and value of that dark blue.  All blues and the red are
complements on the color wheel.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:59 PM, James Fisher  wrote:

> You'll find descriptions of D at the bottom of
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  I'd appreciate anyone with a knack for
> editing or promotion to contribute.
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:52 PM, bearophile wrote:
>
>> Jimmy Cao:
>>
>> > What about this?
>> >
>> > http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png
>>
>> The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think (just
>> as before).
>>
>> Bye,
>> bearophile
>>
>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

You'll find descriptions of D at the bottom of
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  I'd appreciate anyone with a knack for
editing or promotion to contribute.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 5:52 PM, bearophile  wrote:

> Jimmy Cao:
>
> > What about this?
> >
> > http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png
>
> The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think (just as
> before).
>
> Bye,
> bearophile
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[bearophile]

Jimmy Cao:

> What about this?
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png

The white border around the biggest moon is too much thin, I think (just as 
before).

Bye,
bearophile

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jimmy Cao]

What about this?

http://i.imgur.com/toykT.png

The main problem with the current logo is the gradient/faded background.
When the D letter is in white, the extra white in the background just makes
the whole thing look too bright and non-solid.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 11:21 AM, bearophile wrote:

> Daniel Gibson:
>
> > Like this: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5_2.png ? ;)
>
> The white border around Phobos is too much thin, I think.
>
> Bye,
> bearophile
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[bearophile]

Daniel Gibson:

> Like this: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5_2.png ? ;)

The white border around Phobos is too much thin, I think.

Bye,
bearophile

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 02.07.2011 17:43, schrieb bearophile:
> James Fisher:
> 
>> I've vectorized the Digital Mars logo.  http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/  (I
>> think it's Arial in the original, but the M and S of my Arial is
>> different??)  Perhaps this'll be useful some day.
> 
> I like this most:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/dlogo.png
> 
> I like this too, but I think it's better to draw Phobos (the larger moon) a 
> bit larger:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5.png

Like this: http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5_2.png ? ;)

Cheers,
- Daniel

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

I've also been thinking about font choice.  High up on my list of goals for
a primary face are:

   - Transition.  The D sites I've seen show a preference for a simple,
   common sans; there's no obvious reason to sway from that.
   - Legibility and "dont-get-in-the-way-of-the-content"-ness.
   - Large character set.  The D community is international and all faces
   should respect this.
   - Free.  Having to purchase the face is a huge barrier to adoption.
   - Web-font embeddable.  Web fonts have gone past the point of being
   bleeding edge web tech by now and there's no reason not to use them to
   secure a cross-browser, cross-platform consistency.  Zero accessibility
   worries as the browser will just fall back to, say, Arial.

I've gone through the Google Web Font
Directory with
these criteria.  The outstanding choice here is Open
Sans,
which IMO has superb legibility and is also attractive, has a big character
set, is under the Apache License, and (bonus) has 10 variants for most
conceivable use from massive headings to smallprint (meaning it has
potential as a choice for our heading face as well).

(BTW, when considering these, look at the font at 16px.  That's the browser
default, and for good accessibility and legibility reasons, so there's no
reason to change it, so that's the size I think we'll be looking at it.)

You can see Open Sans in use at http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/


On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM, bearophile  wrote:

> James Fisher:
>
> > I've vectorized the Digital Mars logo.  http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/ (I
> > think it's Arial in the original, but the M and S of my Arial is
> > different??)  Perhaps this'll be useful some day.
>
> I like this most:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/dlogo.png
>
> I like this too, but I think it's better to draw Phobos (the larger moon) a
> bit larger:
> http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5.png
>
> Bye,
> bearophile
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[bearophile]

James Fisher:

> I've vectorized the Digital Mars logo.  http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/  (I
> think it's Arial in the original, but the M and S of my Arial is
> different??)  Perhaps this'll be useful some day.

I like this most:
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/dlogo.png

I like this too, but I think it's better to draw Phobos (the larger moon) a bit 
larger:
http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/d-logo-5.png

Bye,
bearophile

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

I've vectorized the Digital Mars logo.  http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/  (I
think it's Arial in the original, but the M and S of my Arial is
different??)  Perhaps this'll be useful some day.

Barring the stretched text, there is something I like about the DM logo.
 The Mars there looks totally out of this world (hah).

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Jacob Carlborg  wrote:

> On 2011-07-01 18:02, James Fisher wrote:
>
>> A couple of things to keep in mind:
>>
>> I see every suggestion so far, including mine, uses letterplay, but a
>> logo does not *have* to do this.  Note that Python's logo is not the
>> word "python" made out of snakes, for example.  I see a lot of
>>
>> ameteur-looking logos around that seem to think that forcing a letter or
>> word into a shape is the only way to do it.  The end result is, well, it
>> looks forced, and that's bad.  I'm not advocating discarding the "D"
>> route, but it's something to keep in mind.  This certainly opens up
>> possibilities for simplicity.  There are many logos out there consisting
>> of a simple graphic and some well-set text, and they look classy.  For
>> example, we could run with the Mars theme, and *just* have a well-done
>> stylized image of Mars.  Example:
>> https://github.com/eegg/d-**brand/raw/master/d-logo-11.png
>> **.
>>
>
> I like that one.
>
> --
> /Jacob Carlborg
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jacob Carlborg]

On 2011-07-01 18:02, James Fisher wrote:

A couple of things to keep in mind:

I see every suggestion so far, including mine, uses letterplay, but a
logo does not *have* to do this.  Note that Python's logo is not the
word "python" made out of snakes, for example.  I see a lot of
ameteur-looking logos around that seem to think that forcing a letter or
word into a shape is the only way to do it.  The end result is, well, it
looks forced, and that's bad.  I'm not advocating discarding the "D"
route, but it's something to keep in mind.  This certainly opens up
possibilities for simplicity.  There are many logos out there consisting
of a simple graphic and some well-set text, and they look classy.  For
example, we could run with the Mars theme, and *just* have a well-done
stylized image of Mars.  Example:
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-11.png.


I like that one.

--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

I'm keeping this organized at http://eegg.github.com/d-brand/.  Feedback and
additions (or subtractions) welcome.

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 8:51 AM, James Fisher  wrote:

> On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 1:50 AM, Daniel Gibson wrote:
>>
>> [...] I think it's important that the logo makes sense for
>>
>> somebody who is not deeply familiar with D and its (digital)mars origin.
>>
>
> I definitely agree, and that was kinda my point.  Of two options,
>
> (1) a half-baked abstraction of Mars, where the representation is only
> clear to the community inner circle and where an outsider would think "What
> are those balls/warts?",
>
> (2) a clear representation of Mars, where the worst the outsider can think
> is "what does Mars have to do with D?" (a question that would also follow
> your explanation of the abstract representation),
>
> I'd take the latter.  If that's still not good enough because the Mars
> theme doesn't make sense, then the only real option is to scrap the Mars
> theme altogether.  I wouldn't want to do that.
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 1:50 AM, Daniel Gibson  wrote:
>
> [...] I think it's important that the logo makes sense for
> somebody who is not deeply familiar with D and its (digital)mars origin.


I definitely agree, and that was kinda my point.  Of two options,

(1) a half-baked abstraction of Mars, where the representation is only clear
to the community inner circle and where an outsider would think "What are
those balls/warts?",

(2) a clear representation of Mars, where the worst the outsider can think
is "what does Mars have to do with D?" (a question that would also follow
your explanation of the abstract representation),

I'd take the latter.  If that's still not good enough because the Mars theme
doesn't make sense, then the only real option is to scrap the Mars theme
altogether.  I wouldn't want to do that.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 6:18 PM, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

> I think you are way overthinking this...
>

I've never quite understood what "overthinking" actually means.  If you mean
exploring all possible trains of thought the viewer, I'll take that as a
compliment.  By all means disagree with what I say -- it's either valid or
it's not (it may well not be!).

rule #1 -- the logo should have the letter 'D' in it.
>
> and, um... that's it :)
>

That is most definitely *not* it.  By your specification, would you be happy
with just the 'D' from Comic Sans?

There is a huge number of explicit and implicit rules and guidelines to
consider when creating the one image that will represent your project for
time immemorial.  That's why there are books, websites, careers forged on
this.

I'm not a designer by trade either, but in the absence of D being able to
hire a design company we're trying to do it ourselves, rather than just
dismissing the need for the job being done.



BTW, your comparison isn't correct.  I'd compare:  "Why does the python logo
> contain snakes" to "Why does the D logo contain the letter D", and "Why does
> the D logo contain balls" to "Why does the python logo look like a + sign".
>

This is fair; that is a strange stylistic decision and I'm not sure what it
means.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 6:09 PM, %u  wrote:

> related
>
> http://www.blog.spoongraphics.co.uk/articles/a-guide-to-creating-professional-quality-logo-designs
> maybe that help
>

Perhaps, but not if their logo is anything to go by :-) ... good points
nonetheless.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 01.07.2011 18:02, schrieb James Fisher:
> Note that Python's logo is not the word
> "python" made out of snakes, for example. 

Python's logo is a (pair of stylized) python(s), and D's logo contains a
"D", so whats the difference?
It's not like we spell out "Dee" or something (although this may be
doable with the moons as 'e's).
If the languages name was "Mars" (like originally intended) just having
mars as a logo (like digitalmars) would make sense, but not for a
language named "D". I think it's important that the logo makes sense for
somebody who is not deeply familiar with D and its (digital)mars origin.

Cheers,
- Daniel

Re: D brand identity repository

[Mafi]

Am 01.07.2011 19:21, schrieb Mafi:

Am 01.07.2011 18:08, schrieb James Fisher:

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 8:35 PM, Mafi mailto:m...@example.org>> wrote:

This is my try.
What do you guys think about it?


So, I do think yours has merit. The one gripe I have with it is a lack
of obviousness. Compare:

New Python user: "say, why's your logo made of snakes?"
Pythoneer: "..."

where "..." is "Well, the creator of the language was a fan of Monty
Python. So he decided to call the language python. Now, when they needed
a logo, they just decieded to reinterpret 'python' and made the logo out
of snakes. When now somebody sees a snake in programming context he
thinks of 'python', the only language whose name *sounds* like the name
of a snake."

But you're right. With 'python' it's anyways a lot more obvious than
with 'D'.

In the last sentence I mean the D logo and the python logo and the 
planets and snakes respectively.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Mafi]

Am 01.07.2011 18:08, schrieb James Fisher:

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 8:35 PM, Mafi mailto:m...@example.org>> wrote:

This is my try.
What do you guys think about it?


So, I do think yours has merit.  The one gripe I have with it is a lack
of obviousness.  Compare:

New Python user: "say, why's your logo made of snakes?"
Pythoneer: "..."
where "..." is "Well, the creator of the language was a fan of Monty 
Python. So he decided to call the language python. Now, when they needed 
a logo, they just decieded to reinterpret 'python' and made the logo out 
of snakes. When now somebody sees a snake in programming context he 
thinks of 'python', the only language whose name *sounds* like the name 
of a snake."


But you're right. With 'python' it's anyways a lot more obvious than 
with 'D'.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Fri, 01 Jul 2011 12:08:17 -0400, James Fisher   
wrote:



On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 8:35 PM, Mafi  wrote:


This is my try.
What do you guys think about it?



So, I do think yours has merit.  The one gripe I have with it is a lack  
of

obviousness.  Compare:

New Python user: "say, why's your logo made of snakes?"
Pythoneer: "..."

New D user: "say, why's your logo got two balls in it?"
D programmer: "Well, hear me out.  Originally, the language was going to  
be
called Mars.  But then it was called D, and it's too late to change it  
back.
 Now, the two balls are Mars' two moons.  That's right, the D is Mars.   
Yes,
the D is see-through, but it was ugly to have the moons on the side, so  
you

just have to stretch to see the illusion.  And yes, the moons should be
irregular shapes, but that was ugly too."

Not sure if that gets my point across but I'm just trying to think from  
the
perspective of someone outside the community.  Which, of course, is what  
we

should be doing.


I think you are way overthinking this...

rule #1 -- the logo should have the letter 'D' in it.

and, um... that's it :)

BTW, your comparison isn't correct.  I'd compare:  "Why does the python  
logo contain snakes" to "Why does the D logo contain the letter D", and  
"Why does the D logo contain balls" to "Why does the python logo look like  
a + sign".


-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[%u]

related
http://www.blog.spoongraphics.co.uk/articles/a-guide-to-creating-professional-quality-logo-designs
maybe that help

Re: D brand identity repository

[Nick Sabalausky]

"James Fisher"  wrote in message 
news:mailman.1364.1309536134.14074.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
>A couple of things to keep in mind:
>
> I see every suggestion so far, including mine, uses letterplay, but a logo
> does not *have* to do this.  Note that Python's logo is not the word
> "python" made out of snakes, for example.  I see a lot of ameteur-looking
> logos around that seem to think that forcing a letter or word into a shape
> is the only way to do it.  The end result is, well, it looks forced, and
> that's bad.  I'm not advocating discarding the "D" route, but it's 
> something
> to keep in mind.  This certainly opens up possibilities for simplicity.
> There are many logos out there consisting of a simple graphic and some
> well-set text, and they look classy.  For example, we could run with the
> Mars theme, and *just* have a well-done stylized image of Mars.  Example:
> https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-11.png.
>
> Second thing: scalability of the image.  The logo should scale well down 
> to
> a 16x16px icon:
> https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-12-icon.png (this, for
> example, does not).
>
>

Certainly good points. Although since the name of the language is a letter, 
I think a letter-based logo makes a lot of sense in this case.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Adam D. Ruppe]

James Fisher wrote:
> For example, we could run with the
> Mars theme, and *just* have a well-done stylized image of Mars.

This made me think of Digital Mars:

http://digitalmars.com/dmlogo.gif

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 8:35 PM, Mafi  wrote:

> This is my try.
> What do you guys think about it?
>

So, I do think yours has merit.  The one gripe I have with it is a lack of
obviousness.  Compare:

New Python user: "say, why's your logo made of snakes?"
Pythoneer: "..."

New D user: "say, why's your logo got two balls in it?"
D programmer: "Well, hear me out.  Originally, the language was going to be
called Mars.  But then it was called D, and it's too late to change it back.
 Now, the two balls are Mars' two moons.  That's right, the D is Mars.  Yes,
the D is see-through, but it was ugly to have the moons on the side, so you
just have to stretch to see the illusion.  And yes, the moons should be
irregular shapes, but that was ugly too."

Not sure if that gets my point across but I'm just trying to think from the
perspective of someone outside the community.  Which, of course, is what we
should be doing.

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

A couple of things to keep in mind:

I see every suggestion so far, including mine, uses letterplay, but a logo
does not *have* to do this.  Note that Python's logo is not the word
"python" made out of snakes, for example.  I see a lot of ameteur-looking
logos around that seem to think that forcing a letter or word into a shape
is the only way to do it.  The end result is, well, it looks forced, and
that's bad.  I'm not advocating discarding the "D" route, but it's something
to keep in mind.  This certainly opens up possibilities for simplicity.
 There are many logos out there consisting of a simple graphic and some
well-set text, and they look classy.  For example, we could run with the
Mars theme, and *just* have a well-done stylized image of Mars.  Example:
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-11.png.

Second thing: scalability of the image.  The logo should scale well down to
a 16x16px icon:
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-12-icon.png (this, for
example, does not).


On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 1:21 PM, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

> On Thu, 30 Jun 2011 18:58:38 -0400, Daniel Gibson 
> wrote:
>
>  Am 01.07.2011 00:44, schrieb Daniel Gibson:
>>
>>> Am 30.06.2011 19:25, schrieb James Fisher:
>>>
 On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeff Nowakowski 
 wrote:

  On 06/30/2011 12:28 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>
>
>> Something like this? https://github.com/eegg/d-**
>> brand/raw/master/d-logo-3.png<**https://github.com/eegg/d-**
>> brand/raw/master/d-logo-3.png
>> >
>>
>>
> I think having the separator is good (that first planet/moon always
> looked
> like some kind of tumorous growth on D to me). However, instead of
> taking a
> bite out of D, I think you should keep the current design where D
> eclipses
> the first circle.
>
>
 https://github.com/eegg/d-**brand/raw/master/d-logo-5.pngLike
  this?

 Note that the z-order is actually ambiguous in the current design :)


>>> I like this one best so far (probably because I really like the original
>>> logo), but the white border between the D and the bigger moon should be
>>> thinner. Maybe this moon should be a bit more to the right so it's more
>>> of a circle.
>>> Or maybe it should be bigger so part of it can be seen inside the D.
>>>
>>> (I don't like the other one with the small d very much, btw)
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> - Daniel
>>>
>>
>> I just modified the svg from your git accordingly, see attachement.
>>
>
> I like these, especially the ones with the planet being seen inside the D.
>  I agree the separating line works better as a thinner line.
>
> -Steve
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Thu, 30 Jun 2011 18:58:38 -0400, Daniel Gibson   
wrote:



Am 01.07.2011 00:44, schrieb Daniel Gibson:

Am 30.06.2011 19:25, schrieb James Fisher:
On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeff Nowakowski   
wrote:



On 06/30/2011 12:28 PM, James Fisher wrote:



Something like this? https://github.com/eegg/d-**
brand/raw/master/d-logo-3.png



I think having the separator is good (that first planet/moon always  
looked
like some kind of tumorous growth on D to me). However, instead of  
taking a
bite out of D, I think you should keep the current design where D  
eclipses

the first circle.



https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-5.png Like this?

Note that the z-order is actually ambiguous in the current design :)



I like this one best so far (probably because I really like the original
logo), but the white border between the D and the bigger moon should be
thinner. Maybe this moon should be a bit more to the right so it's more
of a circle.
Or maybe it should be bigger so part of it can be seen inside the D.

(I don't like the other one with the small d very much, btw)

Cheers,
- Daniel


I just modified the svg from your git accordingly, see attachement.


I like these, especially the ones with the planet being seen inside the  
D.  I agree the separating line works better as a thinner line.


-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[Steven Schveighoffer]

On Thu, 30 Jun 2011 17:41:30 -0400, bearophile   
wrote:



Tyro[a.c.edwards]:


Now there's an Idea. Simple yet elegant... no boobs and retains the
historical reference to Mars and her two moons. I like it. I'll even
take the italics.

++ Vote

Oh wait, I only have one vote.


But Deimos is not so round :-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deimos_%28moon%29


I found this amusing from the wikipedia article:

"Deimos, like Mars' other moon Phobos, has spectra, albedos and densities  
similar to those of a C- or D-type asteroid."


:)

-Steve

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jacob Carlborg]

On 2011-07-01 04:06, Adam Richardson wrote

Hi,

Just for comparisons, I've added some more variations, just playing
around with the text that might be in proximity (hash tag, couple
variations including "programming language".)

http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft-2.png

Adam


I think it looks best with a sans-serif font.

--
/Jacob Carlborg

Re: D brand identity repository

[Mafi]

Am 01.07.2011 00:39, schrieb Chris Molozian:

It's a great logo Mafi, is it possible to try it without the italics and
see what that looks like?


Here are a non-italic and it's corresponding as-path version.
I think I like the italic version a little bit more.

Mafi
<><>

Re: D brand identity repository

[James Fisher]

All images so far are in https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/

On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 5:10 AM, Jimmy Cao  wrote:

> Those are too shiny.
> The current logo looks faded to me (would give me the impression that D is
> a non-serious for-fun language).
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 10:45 PM, Caligo  wrote:
>
>> I like the current D logo, but I found these two:
>>
>
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Jimmy Cao]

Those are too shiny.
The current logo looks faded to me (would give me the impression that D is a
non-serious for-fun language).

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 10:45 PM, Caligo  wrote:

> I like the current D logo, but I found these two:
>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Caligo]

I like the current D logo, but I found these two:
<><>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Walter Bright]

On 6/30/2011 1:13 PM, Adam Richardson wrote:

You can use this:
http://svg-edit.googlecode.com/svn/branches/2.5.1/editor/svg-editor.html



Thanks!

Re: D brand identity repository

[Михаил Страшун]

Second one is pretty stylish.

On 7/1/2011 5:06 AM, Adam Richardson wrote:


On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 3:38 AM, James Fisher mailto:jameshfis...@gmail.com>> wrote:

(For the moment, I'm leaving the can of worms I've opened in the
other thread, in favour of getting something done.)

I'm proposing that D needs some form of official brand identity.
  This would include things like:

  * An official logo.  I've seen a bazillion around.  Something in
SVG, appropriate all the way down from posters to icons, would
be nice.  Variations including a logotype (i.e., including the
words "D Programming Language"), at a couple of aspect ratios,
would be highly useful.
  * A color palette.  Most obviously, D seems to identify with the
dark, Mars red, and a few other colors are floating around.  It
would be good to get these down in HSL.  And RGB, Pantone, whatever.
  * Font choice.  Arial and Verdana are around as body fonts, Times
and Georgia as titling.  Obviously this choice should agree with
the choice of face for the logotype.
  * Descriptions at a few different word lengths.  With any
organization on the web, you have a "brief description" in a
million different places.  With an evolving project like D,
those will get out of date.  From experience, I know how useful
it is to decide on a promotional description at say, 250 words,
100 words, 25 words, 10 words in length.
  * Any necessary guidelines on how the above should be used.

What I'm not proposing includes:

  * Anything revolutionary.  D does have a kind of identity built
around the Mars theme.  It would be a shame to lose heritage here.
  * Me making executive decisions.  This is a collaborative effort
as with any other.

I anticipate this brand identity to be used in at least:

  * The official website.
  * The official documentation.
  * Any satellite sites -- Twitter, etc.
  * Any printed promotional material.  (Does any exist?)

I propose this content be maintained in a GH repository,
github.com/D-Programming-Language/D-brand-identity
.  Other
repos such as d-programming-language.org
 can then include it as a git
submodule.


Hi,

Just for comparisons, I've added some more variations, just playing
around with the text that might be in proximity (hash tag, couple
variations including "programming language".)

http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft-2.png

Adam

Re: D brand identity repository

[Adam Richardson]

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 3:38 AM, James Fisher wrote:

> (For the moment, I'm leaving the can of worms I've opened in the other
> thread, in favour of getting something done.)
>
> I'm proposing that D needs some form of official brand identity.  This
> would include things like:
>
>- An official logo.  I've seen a bazillion around.  Something in SVG,
>appropriate all the way down from posters to icons, would be nice.
> Variations including a logotype (i.e., including the words "D Programming
>Language"), at a couple of aspect ratios, would be highly useful.
>- A color palette.  Most obviously, D seems to identify with the dark,
>Mars red, and a few other colors are floating around.  It would be good to
>get these down in HSL.  And RGB, Pantone, whatever.
>- Font choice.  Arial and Verdana are around as body fonts, Times and
>Georgia as titling.  Obviously this choice should agree with the choice of
>face for the logotype.
>- Descriptions at a few different word lengths.  With any organization
>on the web, you have a "brief description" in a million different places.
> With an evolving project like D, those will get out of date.  From
>experience, I know how useful it is to decide on a promotional description
>at say, 250 words, 100 words, 25 words, 10 words in length.
>- Any necessary guidelines on how the above should be used.
>
> What I'm not proposing includes:
>
>- Anything revolutionary.  D does have a kind of identity built around
>the Mars theme.  It would be a shame to lose heritage here.
>- Me making executive decisions.  This is a collaborative effort as
>with any other.
>
> I anticipate this brand identity to be used in at least:
>
>- The official website.
>- The official documentation.
>- Any satellite sites -- Twitter, etc.
>- Any printed promotional material.  (Does any exist?)
>
> I propose this content be maintained in a GH repository,
> github.com/D-Programming-Language/D-brand-identity.  Other repos such as
> d-programming-language.org can then include it as a git submodule.
>

Hi,

Just for comparisons, I've added some more variations, just playing around
with the text that might be in proximity (hash tag, couple variations
including "programming language".)

http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft-2.png

Adam

Re: D brand identity repository

[Nick Sabalausky]

"Daniel Gibson"  wrote in message 
news:iuivc5$1uqs$1...@digitalmars.com...
>
> I just modified the svg from your git accordingly, see attachement.
>

Your #2 is pretty nice. I think the best thing would be some sort of cross 
between that and Mafi's. Either that or the craters, I like that one too :)

Re: D brand identity repository

[Nick Sabalausky]

"Torarin"  wrote in message 
news:mailman.1330.1309466229.14074.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
>2011/6/30 James Fisher :
>> On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 8:02 PM, Steven Schveighoffer 
>> 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Also, that looks like a sideways snowman :)
>>
>> Here, have some cartoon
>> craters https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-9.png
>>
>
>I love this! I normally prefer minimalistic logos, like Haskell's, but
>this one is so fun. It's balanced and it works.

Yea. And it's the only D logo I've seen that really makes the whole "planet" 
concept clear. Well, this one and Mafi's, too. But this one even moreso.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Tyro[a.c.edwards]]

On 7/1/2011 7:39 AM, Chris Molozian wrote:

It's a great logo Mafi, is it possible to try it without the italics and
see what that looks like?

IMHO it's between:

https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-7.png
AND
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/dlogo-mafi.png


Though I like d-logo-7, I think the logical choices rest between these two:

http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft.png
AND
http://imgur.com/J1pbr


Thanks for the hard work guys, beauty surrounding the D language is just
as important (arguably more important) as the beauty of the language
itself.

Chris

Re: D brand identity repository

[Tyro[a.c.edwards]]

On 7/1/2011 5:37 AM, James Fisher wrote:

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 9:27 PM, Tyro[a.c.edwards] mailto:nos...@home.com>> wrote:

On 7/1/2011 12:38 AM, James Fisher wrote:

https://github.com/eegg/d-__brand/raw/master/d-logo-1.png



That explains it! The Devil's religion. Nope... Definitely not
interested.


IC ... ಠ_ಠ


Don't get me wrong... It looks good... but it's the wrong clothing for D 
the Language.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 01.07.2011 00:44, schrieb Daniel Gibson:
> Am 30.06.2011 19:25, schrieb James Fisher:
>> On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeff Nowakowski  wrote:
>>
>>> On 06/30/2011 12:28 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>>>

 Something like this? https://github.com/eegg/d-**
 brand/raw/master/d-logo-3.png

>>>
>>> I think having the separator is good (that first planet/moon always looked
>>> like some kind of tumorous growth on D to me). However, instead of taking a
>>> bite out of D, I think you should keep the current design where D eclipses
>>> the first circle.
>>>
>>
>> https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-5.png Like this?
>>
>> Note that the z-order is actually ambiguous in the current design :)
>>
> 
> I like this one best so far (probably because I really like the original
> logo), but the white border between the D and the bigger moon should be
> thinner. Maybe this moon should be a bit more to the right so it's more
> of a circle.
> Or maybe it should be bigger so part of it can be seen inside the D.
> 
> (I don't like the other one with the small d very much, btw)
> 
> Cheers,
> - Daniel

I just modified the svg from your git accordingly, see attachement.

Cheers,
- Daniel
<><><><>

Re: D brand identity repository

[Adam Richardson]

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 3:38 AM, James Fisher wrote:

> (For the moment, I'm leaving the can of worms I've opened in the other
> thread, in favour of getting something done.)
>
> I'm proposing that D needs some form of official brand identity.  This
> would include things like:
>
>- An official logo.  I've seen a bazillion around.  Something in SVG,
>appropriate all the way down from posters to icons, would be nice.
> Variations including a logotype (i.e., including the words "D Programming
>Language"), at a couple of aspect ratios, would be highly useful.
>- A color palette.  Most obviously, D seems to identify with the dark,
>Mars red, and a few other colors are floating around.  It would be good to
>get these down in HSL.  And RGB, Pantone, whatever.
>- Font choice.  Arial and Verdana are around as body fonts, Times and
>Georgia as titling.  Obviously this choice should agree with the choice of
>face for the logotype.
>- Descriptions at a few different word lengths.  With any organization
>on the web, you have a "brief description" in a million different places.
> With an evolving project like D, those will get out of date.  From
>experience, I know how useful it is to decide on a promotional description
>at say, 250 words, 100 words, 25 words, 10 words in length.
>- Any necessary guidelines on how the above should be used.
>
> What I'm not proposing includes:
>
>- Anything revolutionary.  D does have a kind of identity built around
>the Mars theme.  It would be a shame to lose heritage here.
>- Me making executive decisions.  This is a collaborative effort as
>with any other.
>
> I anticipate this brand identity to be used in at least:
>
>- The official website.
>- The official documentation.
>- Any satellite sites -- Twitter, etc.
>- Any printed promotional material.  (Does any exist?)
>
> I propose this content be maintained in a GH repository,
> github.com/D-Programming-Language/D-brand-identity.  Other repos such as
> d-programming-language.org can then include it as a git submodule.
>

James, can you toss my version in the repo, too, just for comparison
purposes?
http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft.png

Thanks,

Adam

Re: D brand identity repository

[Daniel Gibson]

Am 30.06.2011 19:25, schrieb James Fisher:
> On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeff Nowakowski  wrote:
> 
>> On 06/30/2011 12:28 PM, James Fisher wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Something like this? https://github.com/eegg/d-**
>>> brand/raw/master/d-logo-3.png
>>>
>>
>> I think having the separator is good (that first planet/moon always looked
>> like some kind of tumorous growth on D to me). However, instead of taking a
>> bite out of D, I think you should keep the current design where D eclipses
>> the first circle.
>>
> 
> https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-5.png Like this?
> 
> Note that the z-order is actually ambiguous in the current design :)
> 

I like this one best so far (probably because I really like the original
logo), but the white border between the D and the bigger moon should be
thinner. Maybe this moon should be a bit more to the right so it's more
of a circle.
Or maybe it should be bigger so part of it can be seen inside the D.

(I don't like the other one with the small d very much, btw)

Cheers,
- Daniel

Re: D brand identity repository

[Chris Molozian]

It's a great logo Mafi, is it possible to try it without the italics and 
see what that looks like?


IMHO it's between:

https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/d-logo-7.png
AND
https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/dlogo-mafi.png

Thanks for the hard work guys, beauty surrounding the D language is just 
as important (arguably more important) as the beauty of the language itself.


Chris


On 06/30/11 21:58, Mafi wrote:

Am 30.06.2011 22:39, schrieb James Fisher:

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 9:29 PM, Andrej Mitrovic
mailto:andrej.mitrov...@gmail.com>> wrote:

On 6/30/11, James Fisher mailto:jameshfis...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Here's Mafi's suggestion in PNG:
> https://github.com/eegg/d-brand/raw/master/dlogo-mafi.png

Odd, in my browser the D letter looked really thin when I viewed the
SVG. Maybe it was a rendering bug.


GP -- Mafi left it in Verdana, which I don't have here, so that PNG is
actually DejaVu Sans.  Heh.  Mafi, if you could convert to a path?


Sometimes svg behaves odd...
I've attached the path-version.
I've also uploaded a rendering at http://imgur.com/J1pbr because the 
above looks a bit different than mine.


Mafi

PS: I license these images with CC-0.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Andrej Mitrovic]

On 6/30/11, Timon Gehr  wrote:
> Same for Phobos ;).
>
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/aa/Phobos.jpg
>

LOL, that rock looks like a big flying turd!

Anyway, my vote goes to Mafi's logo: http://imgur.com/J1pbr

I'll definitely use this in GUI-enabled projects.

Re: D brand identity repository

[Timon Gehr]

bearophile wrote:
> Tyro[a.c.edwards]:
>
>> Now there's an Idea. Simple yet elegant... no boobs and retains the
>> historical reference to Mars and her two moons. I like it. I'll even
>> take the italics.
>>
>> ++ Vote
>>
>> Oh wait, I only have one vote.
>
> But Deimos is not so round :-)
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deimos_%28moon%29
>
> Bye,
> bearophile


Same for Phobos ;).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/aa/Phobos.jpg

Re: D brand identity repository

[Adam Richardson]

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 3:38 AM, James Fisher wrote:

> (For the moment, I'm leaving the can of worms I've opened in the other
> thread, in favour of getting something done.)
>
> I'm proposing that D needs some form of official brand identity.  This
> would include things like:
>
>- An official logo.  I've seen a bazillion around.  Something in SVG,
>appropriate all the way down from posters to icons, would be nice.
> Variations including a logotype (i.e., including the words "D Programming
>Language"), at a couple of aspect ratios, would be highly useful.
>- A color palette.  Most obviously, D seems to identify with the dark,
>Mars red, and a few other colors are floating around.  It would be good to
>get these down in HSL.  And RGB, Pantone, whatever.
>- Font choice.  Arial and Verdana are around as body fonts, Times and
>Georgia as titling.  Obviously this choice should agree with the choice of
>face for the logotype.
>- Descriptions at a few different word lengths.  With any organization
>on the web, you have a "brief description" in a million different places.
> With an evolving project like D, those will get out of date.  From
>experience, I know how useful it is to decide on a promotional description
>at say, 250 words, 100 words, 25 words, 10 words in length.
>- Any necessary guidelines on how the above should be used.
>
> What I'm not proposing includes:
>
>- Anything revolutionary.  D does have a kind of identity built around
>the Mars theme.  It would be a shame to lose heritage here.
>- Me making executive decisions.  This is a collaborative effort as
>with any other.
>
> I anticipate this brand identity to be used in at least:
>
>- The official website.
>- The official documentation.
>- Any satellite sites -- Twitter, etc.
>- Any printed promotional material.  (Does any exist?)
>
> I propose this content be maintained in a GH repository,
> github.com/D-Programming-Language/D-brand-identity.  Other repos such as
> d-programming-language.org can then include it as a git submodule.
>

Well, here's one more logo. It attempts to:

   - Be simple and iconic (could you close your eyes and reproduce it after
   a quick glance.)
   - Hints at the 2 moon heritage (white outline is second moon.)
   - Utilize a modern, practical, although still very beautiful font (I
   think of Verdana like the font version of D.)
   - Remain legible across a broad range of media.

http://envisionic.com/images/d-logo-draft.png

Just an idea.

Adam

Re: D brand identity repository

[bearophile]

Tyro[a.c.edwards]:

> Now there's an Idea. Simple yet elegant... no boobs and retains the 
> historical reference to Mars and her two moons. I like it. I'll even 
> take the italics.
> 
> ++ Vote
> 
> Oh wait, I only have one vote.

But Deimos is not so round :-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deimos_%28moon%29

Bye,
bearophile