Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
If option -shared is selected, will it automatically generate as PIC, or do you have to also specify -fPIC? When I used gfortran, it was -shared only on windows, on linux both options: -shared and -fPIC. Was obtained empirically.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/8/2013 6:19 PM, Iain Buclaw wrote: On 7 Feb 2013 20:21, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com mailto:newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work We should probably discuss implemetation ideas when you next have the opportunity. :) Sure. I want to get the next release out, first, and then we'll get the shared library thing working.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
Am 08.02.2013 08:18, schrieb Walter Bright: On 2/7/2013 10:36 PM, Oleg Kuporosov wrote: That is cool, but what is the target platform - Win/Lin, 32/64? Initially, Linux. Once that is worked out, doing the others should be straightforward. Well windows will be quite some work because DLLs are not really fully supported yet. Starting with these two issues: http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3956 http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=6673 I will make bug reports for all the dll issues I found in the next few days. Kind Regards Benjamni Thaut
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2013-02-07 21:16, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work We want to have this on all platforms but is there a platform that is prioritized for them? -- /Jacob Carlborg
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2013-02-07 22:01, Maxim Fomin wrote: On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. This is nice. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work Wasn't this realized before? By the way, last weeks there seems to be increasing dynamic linking loading buzz like it was not an issue for ages. As far as I know and if nothing has changed in the recent days shared libraries to not work, at least not on Posix. -- /Jacob Carlborg
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2013-02-07 21:16, Walter Bright wrote: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work I'm willing to help on this one, especially for Mac OS X. I have wanted this for quite a long time. -- /Jacob Carlborg
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work AFAIK Martin Nowak has done first part for you. Pull requests only needs to be merged to druntime I guess :) (b) improve language safety without degrading efficiency (c) improve quality as always Of course, these things benefit pretty much all D users anyway. Initially, (a) is the most important.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work Which platform? Loading a single dynamic D library or multiple libraries? What language will the hosting app be written in? What are the parameters for the dynamic library interface? ie. extern C? D functions? UDTs as well? Might exceptions be thrown across the library boundary? Portions of this work better than others and it would help to know where to focus our efforts.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work (b) improve language safety without degrading efficiency (c) improve quality as always Of course, these things benefit pretty much all D users anyway. Initially, (a) is the most important. Consider that there are apparently problems when linking and loading D libs into C/C++ apps. I was told that the GC won't work correctly, but I'm no longer sure exactly why. If we can safely link+load shared D libs into C/C++ apps, it is not only useful to have right now, but it also opens up a safe migration path for C/C++ users to start using D with their existing C/C++ apps, and if it works well, they may start using D fully. --rt
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/8/2013 12:29 PM, Sean Kelly wrote: On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work Which platform? linux. Loading a single dynamic D library or multiple libraries? What language will the hosting app be written in? What are the parameters for the dynamic library interface? ie. extern C? D functions? UDTs as well? Might exceptions be thrown across the library boundary? Portions of this work better than others and it would help to know where to focus our efforts. A D app consisting of a main D exe with multiple D DLLs that can be loaded/unloaded at runtime will work.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 7 Feb 2013 20:21, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work We should probably discuss implemetation ideas when you next have the opportunity. :) Iain Buclaw *(p e ? p++ : p) = (c 0x0f) + '0';
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
The compiler currently has an option -shared for generating a shared library. It also has an option -fPIC for generating position independent code. If option -shared is selected, will it automatically generate as PIC, or do you have to also specify -fPIC? --rt
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/7/2013 12:34 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote: What do you mean by design win? You mean we'd win another company over to D? Yes (for a project of theirs).
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/7/13, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 2/7/2013 12:34 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote: What do you mean by design win? You mean we'd win another company over to D? Yes (for a project of theirs). Can you give us a teaser on generally what kind of work they do?
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. This is nice. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work Wasn't this realized before? By the way, last weeks there seems to be increasing dynamic linking loading buzz like it was not an issue for ages. (b) improve language safety without degrading efficiency This is vague. Language safety (meaning design improvement) or implementation (fixing bugs)? How you can measure such improvement? (c) improve quality as always This is also vague. Quality of what: dmd/druntime/phobos? Of course, these things benefit pretty much all D users anyway. Initially, (a) is the most important. I guess recent patches dedicated to the issue came at right time.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/7/2013 1:01 PM, Maxim Fomin wrote: I guess recent patches dedicated to the issue came at right time. The timing is indeed fortuitous. As for your comments about vagueness, yes, it is vague. The DLL support is clear, though, it either works or it doesn't. The other issues are a work in progress, and they understand that. We just have to make progress.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 21:11:18 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 2/7/2013 1:01 PM, Maxim Fomin wrote: I guess recent patches dedicated to the issue came at right time. The timing is indeed fortuitous. As for your comments about vagueness, yes, it is vague. The DLL support is clear, though, it either works or it doesn't. The other issues are a work in progress, and they understand that. We just have to make progress. I know this is off-topic, but can/do companies purchase D support from you/Digital Mars ? Nick
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
Am 07.02.2013 22:11, schrieb Walter Bright: On 2/7/2013 1:01 PM, Maxim Fomin wrote: I guess recent patches dedicated to the issue came at right time. The timing is indeed fortuitous. As for your comments about vagueness, yes, it is vague. The DLL support is clear, though, it either works or it doesn't. The other issues are a work in progress, and they understand that. We just have to make progress. Well, 110 open pull requests on DMD, awaiting their merge, look like progress to me And Phobos has 43! Lot's of progress
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: No, I can't say who it is at this time. Sorry. But it is a huge opportunity for us. To get the design win, we need to: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work (b) improve language safety without degrading efficiency (c) improve quality as always Of course, these things benefit pretty much all D users anyway. Initially, (a) is the most important. That is cool, but what is the target platform - Win/Lin, 32/64? Oleg.
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
Am Thu, 07 Feb 2013 22:01:10 +0100 schrieb Maxim Fomin ma...@maxim-fomin.ru: On Thursday, 7 February 2013 at 20:16:03 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: (a) get dynamic linking and loading to work Wasn't this realized before? By the way, last weeks there seems to be increasing dynamic linking loading buzz like it was not an issue for ages. It is like the news: Things boil up, get covered for a week and disappear from public sight for a year. It has been an issue but people have probably arranged with static linking for now or not started to write a particular program in D. I remember I've tried to use structs with const members for a while for example, but arranged with making every field mutable. Now the topic showed up again after months. -- Marco
Re: Another opportunity for a major design win has presented itself
On 2/7/2013 10:36 PM, Oleg Kuporosov wrote: That is cool, but what is the target platform - Win/Lin, 32/64? Initially, Linux. Once that is worked out, doing the others should be straightforward.
