[digitalradio] Here is the Olivia-Contestia-RTTM Band Plan
Here are is the European bandplan as extracted from a German language document and roughly translated by me. Frequencies Should be the same in the USA except for 40M. Standard Frequency and Parameters kHz kHZ Tone Hz 7038,5703916/32500/1000 ,5 10138.5 10139 16/32 500/1000 14108,5 14109 321000 Call Frequency 14107,5 14108 321000 14106,5 14107 321000 14106,5 14106 321000 14076,5 14077 8/16 250/500 Alternative DX Channel 14090,5 14091 8 250 Narrow Band - Frequency 21129,5 21130 32 1000 And these notes from Pawel. Contestia Main differences: Contestia Olivia block , twice more speed against limited charset and a little worse S/N limit. I hope this mode can be a replacement for RTTY in contests. RttyM: It is still based on Olivia and Contestia but reduced block size. Live experiment made during a long QSO between UT2UZ, K2DSO andUT5UBB/QRP achived non-predictable result. Contestia worked much better for QRP. So we decided to continue with shortening data block. New mode is based on 5 bit data code, so it's logical to use existing RTTY data tables for coding and that's why I gave it a name RttyM.Perhaps the name is not too original but my fantasy has a limit. Main differences: RttyM Contestia Olivia block size 16 32 64S/N (1000/32) -15 dB -16 dB -17 dBCharset RTTY 64 symbols 128 symbols A-Z,0-9, punct. ASCII 7TX speed 586 CPM 293 CPM 146 CPMTests Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Techinical Differences : Contestia-Olivia-RTTM
Per Pawel, Contestia Olivia RTTYM Block size32 64 16 S/N -16 -17 -15 Character Set64 Symbols 128 RTTY Contestia (A-Z, 0-9, punctuation) Olivia(ASCII 7) Transmit Speed293 CPM146 CPM 586 CPM Andy K3UK Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> 1.2 million kids a year are victims of human trafficking. Stop slavery. http://us.click.yahoo.com/WpTY2A/izNLAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] Techinical Differences : Contestia-Olivia-RTTM
Thank you! On Mon, 5 Dec 2005 5:02 am, obrienaj wrote: > Per Pawel Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> AIDS in India: A "lurking bomb." Click and help stop AIDS now. http://us.click.yahoo.com/VpTY2A/lzNLAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Some thing we've talked about.
Title: Some thing we've talked about. Here are some excerpts from E-Mail between individuals deeply involved in FEMA and NDMS communications. From a FEMA Incident Commander who is an active amateur radio operator... "The subject of this email is Communications and it is from the Southern Mississippi FEMA Incident Manager. He was without cell phone, and Internet capability. He cornered a State Police Car and asked them to be his commo. They said fine but they had no commo too. Jim was at wits end when an Army Captain came to him and asked if he had any commo. Jim said no commo and it's a big problem. The Captain said no problem, and got on his radio and ordered an Army Communications Van to be placed at Jim's disposal. Two hours later a van arrived and it had 4 guys that set up a big dish antenna and then asked Jim how many telephones he needed and what computers needed the Internet? Jim ordered 5 telephones and the Internet for his laptop. Soon Jim was on the phone to FEMA letting them know about the situation and giving them his telephone number. Jim was found by the Salvation Army. They said they can set up 85 soup kitchens but needed $560,000 fast to stock the kitchens. Jim called FEMA requesting the funding and the Salvation Army had the money in 3 hours." "Due to this success story from Katrina, we are all told to use the Army for communications support and I have the phone number to call when needed. I fear that what we can do with Ham Radio is too little and far too late. We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not done by the official part of an Incident." From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on a DMAT (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a FL3-DMAT team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, members of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were advised this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be brought to a deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is observed by FEMA, the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what they can, short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to push Amateur Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success doing to, they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license privileges." This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to offer emergency and disaster relief communications. While I like nothing more than a good rag chew on 40 or 75 with my amateur radio friends of 40+ years, I believe that those days of me being able to do so are rapidly coming to and end. Today ones community service is evaluated as "value to the community, state, nations." Funding for groups is based on that. With the money set aside for Katrina and Rita relief, you should have been able to purchase complete new HF dual band stations of every ham in Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida...plus a few other states. But that is hardly the amount given to the ARRL. The more value you bring to the table, the better your position of survival is. This doesn't make it right or anything else...it is just the way it is. Survival of the "righteous and just" is not assured. Survival of the "performers" is. What can amateur radio being to the table? No quick answers or answers at all...we just need to think long and hard about how we can be of significant value to emergency and disaster relief operations. 73, Walt/K5YFW Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[digitalradio] Can't we just say we will show up?
Title: Can't we just say we will show up? An off list questions was asked concerning participation in emergency communications deals with an individuals/organizations commitment to emergency communications. First I think that having the ability to send several common and "proven" digital modes is desirable. The Second is that there needs to be stations you can pass traffic to or who can really information/ traffic for you on one or more of the common modes. Third, you really need to use the most robust and error free mode for emergency traffic. If there is a need for a "chat mode" or "net control mode" as I call it, then the choice is the net control stations. But again, if you move off frequency or pass traffic on the net frequency, then use the most robust and error free mode you have available. In the "net control mode", you typing speed it the limiting factor. But not so in a traffic handling mode. I suppose the big question is can't we just tell we will show up? If you have emergency organizations who are going to depend on you for communications, they really need to know who, how many people they can depend on and what your communications capability is. You cannot afford, in an emergency situation you want as few variables as possible. It gives emergency managers a warm fuzzy feeling to know if they can depend on X number of hams/communicators at their disposal during emergencies. It certainly wouldn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling if the fire department said..."if you have a fire AND we have fireman who want to respond, we can put out your fire...and we'll try to have a fire truck on the scene." I have such little time to actually get on the air that I have perhaps missed out...has a digital net been started already? 73, Walt/K5YFW Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 !
Pawel's description of Contestia says " I hope this mode can be a replacement for RTTY in contests" . OK, so let's test it under contest conditions. How about a mini - sprint or Contestia Two-Legged Rush. I propose that we try a 30 minutes sprint using Contestia on UTC December 6, at 0100 UTC and again at 1300 UTC on December 7th. Any bands, except WARC bands. Just a total time of 1 hour, in two 30 minute segments, that will provide differing propagation conditions. Since we want to simulate contest conditions, does anyone want to propose a simple scoring system?Scores/logs published here. Andy K3UK Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 !
Confusing on the dates, I see. UTC Dec 6th is what I meant! --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, "obrienaj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Pawel's description of Contestia says " I hope this mode can be a > replacement for RTTY in contests" . > > OK, so let's test it under contest conditions. How about a mini - > sprint or Contestia Two-Legged Rush. I propose that we try a 30 > minutes sprint using Contestia on UTC December 6, at 0100 UTC and > again at 1300 UTC on December 7th. Any bands, except WARC bands. > > Just a total time of 1 hour, in two 30 minute segments, that will > provide differing propagation conditions. Since we want to simulate > contest conditions, does anyone want to propose a simple scoring > system?Scores/logs published here. > > > Andy K3UK > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Some thing we've talked about.
One presumes that the big dish on the Army's van was pointed at a geosynchronous satellite. It seems unlikely that anything we conspire to do on HF will come within a order of magnitude of what can be done with a broadband satellite link, Walt. What amateur radio has to offer here is a geographically-dispersed pool of skilled, dedicated operators; if you want to provide a "competitive" service, you'll need to provide those operators with a lot more bandwidth than is practical via HF. As for this threat of frequency swiping you keep attempting to use as motiviation, consider this (admittedly oversimplified) analysis: The decision to swipe HF amateur frequencies will either be made by a competent person, or an incompetent person. If the person is incompetent, it doesn't matter what we do; our only defense is the "hey look, the incompetent bureaucrats are screwing up the only emergency communications that actually work" gambit, hoping that between the media and the politicians someone sees red meat. If, on the other thand, the decision is made by a competent person, then he or she will quickly realize that HF frequencies are not the solution. Walt, I suggest that you apply your considerable energy and persuasiveness to obtaining access to a couple geosynchronous transponders. Attempting to solve the problem with HF is, as Sagan said, "Like trying to get to stars by climbing a tree. You can make progress for awhile, but you'll never actually get there". 73, Dave, AA6YQ --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Here are some excerpts from E-Mail between individuals deeply involved in > FEMA and NDMS communications. > > From a FEMA Incident Commander who is an active amateur radio operator... > > "The subject of this email is Communications and it is from the > Southern Mississippi FEMA Incident Manager. He was without cell phone, > and Internet capability. He cornered a State Police Car and asked them > to be his commo. They said fine but they had no commo too. Jim was at > wits end when an Army Captain came to him and asked if he had any commo. > Jim said no commo and it's a big problem. The Captain said no problem, > and got on his radio and ordered an Army Communications Van to be placed > at Jim's disposal. Two hours later a van arrived and it had 4 guys that > set up a big dish antenna and then asked Jim how many telephones he > needed and what computers needed the Internet? Jim ordered 5 telephones > and the Internet for his laptop. Soon Jim was on the phone to FEMA > letting them know about the situation and giving them his telephone > number. Jim was found by the Salvation Army. They said they can set up > 85 soup kitchens but needed $560,000 fast to stock the kitchens. Jim > called FEMA requesting the funding and the Salvation Army had the money > in 3 hours." > > "Due to this success story from Katrina, we are all told to use the > Army for communications support and I have the phone number to call when > needed. I fear that what we can do with Ham Radio is too little and far > too late. We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not done > by the official part of an Incident." > > From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on a DMAT > (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... > > "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a FL3-DMAT > team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, members > of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were advised > this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be brought to a > deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is observed by FEMA, > > the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" > > "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what they can, > short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to push Amateur > > Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success doing to, > they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license > privileges." > > This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to offer > emergency and disaster relief communications. > > While I like nothing more than a good rag chew on 40 or 75 with my amateur > radio friends of 40+ years, > I believe that those days of me being able to do so are rapidly coming to > and end. > > Today ones community service is evaluated as "value to the community, state, > nations." Funding for groups is based on that. > > With the money set aside for Katrina and Rita relief, you should have been > able to purchase complete new HF dual band stations of every ham in Texas, > Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida...plus a few other states. But > that is hardly the amount given to the ARRL. > > The more value you bring to the table, the better your position of
Re: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 !
Andy, I don't think Contestia will replace RTTY. To get the rate up you have to go to a higher bandwidth. 8 tone at 250 Hz is about as close as you can get to RTTY speed without going to a higher bandwidth and that will not be good for contesting. Just my thoughts. Joe W4JSI - Original Message - From: obrienaj To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 3:37 PM Subject: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 ! Pawel's description of Contestia says " I hope this mode can be a replacement for RTTY in contests" .OK, so let's test it under contest conditions. How about a mini -sprint or Contestia Two-Legged Rush. I propose that we try a 30 minutes sprint using Contestia on UTC December 6, at 0100 UTC and again at 1300 UTC on December 7th. Any bands, except WARC bands. Just a total time of 1 hour, in two 30 minute segments, that will provide differing propagation conditions. Since we want to simulate contest conditions, does anyone want to propose a simple scoring system? Scores/logs published here.Andy K3UK Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 !
I was thinking that if you want to make this test fly, you may want to specify a bandwidth and number of tones. I think a band(s) should be specified as well, but that's just me. On 12/5/05, Joe Ivey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Andy, I don't think Contestia will replace RTTY. To get the rate up you have to go to a higher bandwidth. 8 tone at 250 Hz is about as close as you can get to RTTY speed without going to a higher bandwidth and that will not be good for contesting. Just my thoughts. Joe W4JSI - Original Message - From: obrienaj To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 3:37 PM Subject: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 ! Pawel's description of Contestia says " I hope this mode can be a replacement for RTTY in contests" .OK, so let's test it under contest conditions. How about a mini -sprint or Contestia Two-Legged Rush. I propose that we try a 30 minutes sprint using Contestia on UTC December 6, at 0100 UTC and again at 1300 UTC on December 7th. Any bands, except WARC bands. Just a total time of 1 hour, in two 30 minute segments, that will provide differing propagation conditions. Since we want to simulate contest conditions, does anyone want to propose a simple scoring system? Scores/logs published here.Andy K3UK Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/Other areas of interest:The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- 73, Craig Cook - N7OR in Sandy, OR Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html SPONSORED LINKS Craft hobby Hobby and craft supply Ham radio YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 !
Yep, I will specify a bandwidth. - Original Message - From: Craig Cook To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:23 PM Subject: Re: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 ! I was thinking that if you want to make this test fly, you may want to specify a bandwidth and number of tones. I think a band(s) should be specified as well, but that's just me. On 12/5/05, Joe Ivey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Andy, I don't think Contestia will replace RTTY. To get the rate up you have to go to a higher bandwidth. 8 tone at 250 Hz is about as close as you can get to RTTY speed without going to a higher bandwidth and that will not be good for contesting. Just my thoughts. Joe W4JSI - Original Message - From: obrienaj To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 3:37 PM Subject: [digitalradio] Contestia "Sprint " December 6/7 ! Pawel's description of Contestia says " I hope this mode can be a replacement for RTTY in contests" .OK, so let's test it under contest conditions. How about a mini -sprint or Contestia Two-Legged Rush. I propose that we try a 30 minutes sprint using Contestia on UTC December 6, at 0100 UTC and again at 1300 UTC on December 7th. Any bands, except WARC bands. Just a total time of 1 hour, in two 30 minute segments, that will provide differing propagation conditions. Since we want to simulate contest conditions, does anyone want to propose a simple scoring system? Scores/logs published here.Andy K3UKNeed a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/Other areas of interest:The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link belowhttp://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- 73, Craig Cook - N7OR in Sandy, OR Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html SPONSORED LINKS Craft hobby Hobby and craft supply Ham radio YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[digitalradio] Re: Some thing we've talked about.
I assume this was a single point occurrence? Or... were there 200 such stations set up? If a single point, did it satisfactorily support the needs of the entire region? If as many satellite uplinks were provided as were required, the initial and on-going costs necessary to support such a response just might be beyond the scope of reasonable planning. I'm not sure about military satellites, but I believe commercial sats require operational ground-based control stations. It's not simply point-to-point communications. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Here are some excerpts from E-Mail between individuals deeply involved in > FEMA and NDMS communications. > > From a FEMA Incident Commander who is an active amateur radio operator... > > "The subject of this email is Communications and it is from the > Southern Mississippi FEMA Incident Manager. He was without cell phone, > and Internet capability. He cornered a State Police Car and asked them > to be his commo. They said fine but they had no commo too. Jim was at > wits end when an Army Captain came to him and asked if he had any commo. > Jim said no commo and it's a big problem. The Captain said no problem, > and got on his radio and ordered an Army Communications Van to be placed > at Jim's disposal. Two hours later a van arrived and it had 4 guys that > set up a big dish antenna and then asked Jim how many telephones he > needed and what computers needed the Internet? Jim ordered 5 telephones > and the Internet for his laptop. Soon Jim was on the phone to FEMA > letting them know about the situation and giving them his telephone > number. Jim was found by the Salvation Army. They said they can set up > 85 soup kitchens but needed $560,000 fast to stock the kitchens. Jim > called FEMA requesting the funding and the Salvation Army had the money > in 3 hours." > > "Due to this success story from Katrina, we are all told to use the > Army for communications support and I have the phone number to call when > needed. I fear that what we can do with Ham Radio is too little and far > too late. We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not done > by the official part of an Incident." > > From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on a DMAT > (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... > > "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a FL3-DMAT > team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, members > of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were advised > this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be brought to a > deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is observed by FEMA, > > the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" > > "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what they can, > short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to push Amateur > > Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success doing to, > they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license > privileges." > > This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to offer > emergency and disaster relief communications. > > While I like nothing more than a good rag chew on 40 or 75 with my amateur > radio friends of 40+ years, > I believe that those days of me being able to do so are rapidly coming to > and end. > > Today ones community service is evaluated as "value to the community, state, > nations." Funding for groups is based on that. > > With the money set aside for Katrina and Rita relief, you should have been > able to purchase complete new HF dual band stations of every ham in Texas, > Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida...plus a few other states. But > that is hardly the amount given to the ARRL. > > The more value you bring to the table, the better your position of survival > is. This doesn't make it right or anything else...it is just the way it is. > > Survival of the "righteous and just" is not assured. Survival of the > "performers" is. > > What can amateur radio being to the table? > > No quick answers or answers at all...we just need to think long and hard > about how we can be of significant value to emergency and disaster relief > operations. > > 73, > > Walt/K5YFW > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/di
Re: [digitalradio] Some thing we've talked about.
On Monday 05 December 2005 09:04, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA wrote: > >From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on a DMAT > > (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... > > "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a FL3-DMAT > team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, members > of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were advised > this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be brought to a > deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is observed by > FEMA, > > the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" > > "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what they can, > short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to push > Amateur > > Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success doing to, > they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license > privileges." > > This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to offer > emergency and disaster relief communications. Yep, the professionals sure learned a lot from Katrina, didn't they? These people should all be given a copy of the QST where the FEMA guy had to go back to his hotel room to get his HT when his team found out that was the only reliable communication in New Orleans immediately after the disaster. And these are the folks we are depending upon to save us in a disaster? They can be the best trained emergency medicine professionals in the world but if they can't find out where to go because ham radio is all there is and they don't have that capability, they may as well have stayed home. Who's going to pull FEMA'S funding for decisions like this? Take our spectrum and the problems won't change. There just won't be a volunteer provided fall-back solution any longer. Someone needs a big boot up their hind parts, I'd say. tim ab0wr Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] Some thing we've talked about.
On Monday 05 December 2005 09:04, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA wrote: > We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not done > by the official part of an Incident." What's wrong with this? This used to be an IMPORTANT part of our service! And it was recognized by the public. And that *public* is who is going to help us protect our spectrum. It won't be the "customers" we are trying to serve as telecomm vendors that help us. They will just want to take over whatever we provide. Does anyone here remember the Alaskan earthquake in 1964? I can remember getting H&W messages coming OUT of the disaster area letting relatives know that they were ok. Does anyone remember handling any of these? Does anyone remember how relieved the relatives were to get word? I do!! When did this take such a backseat in the Amateur Radio Service that the ARRL lets the American Red Cross tell us that we can't handle outgoing H&W traffic for people in their shelters? When did this take such a back seat that we, as a service, won't take the bull by the horns and set up H&W stations outside the ARS shelters to handle outgoing H&W messages? Why doesn't the ARRL *push* this as a service we need to provide? You want to talk about how digital modes can help in emergencies? What would we do if another Alaskan earthquake happens? Just sit back and do nothing except try to act as telecomm vendors for the emergency agencies? I know we still have CW and SSB nets that could handle outgoing H&W traffic from Alaska. Do we have any established digital links or nets that meet on a regular basis so that command structures are established and equipment readiness is tested regularly? If not, why not? It's nice to talk about all these new modes with S/N ratios of -15db or so but when and how do we put them to use for emergency comms? Or do we? (WL2K could help with some of this but they can't handle messages to recipients that don't have email addresses or with messages where the originator can't remember an email address. And the Digital NTS has only one station in Alaska, will that be enough to handle all the H&W trafic?) When did serving the public get redefined into serving public agencies? tim ab0wr Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Some thing we've talked about.
Yes, a ground-based control station is required for access to a geosynchronous satellite. One could build such a station around an SUV, with appropriate off-grid power sources: generator, solar, and/or deployable wind turbine. WIFI under part 97 with a mesh topology would make for a flexible, resilient, rapidly-deployable WAN. As for health and welfare traffic, a picocell would be convenient, but cellphones won't stay powered for more than a day. Offering public access to laptops around the SUV would support voice (VOIP), email, and IM traffic. 73, Dave, AA6YQ --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, "dshults" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I assume this was a single point occurrence? Or... were there 200 > such stations set up? If a single point, did it satisfactorily > support the needs of the entire region? If as many satellite uplinks > were provided as were required, the initial and on-going costs > necessary to support such a response just might be beyond the scope > of reasonable planning. > > I'm not sure about military satellites, but I believe commercial > sats require operational ground-based control stations. It's not > simply point-to-point communications. > >... Duane N7QDN > > > --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Here are some excerpts from E-Mail between individuals deeply > involved in > > FEMA and NDMS communications. > > > > From a FEMA Incident Commander who is an active amateur radio > operator... > > > > "The subject of this email is Communications and it is from the > > Southern Mississippi FEMA Incident Manager. He was without cell > phone, > > and Internet capability. He cornered a State Police Car and asked > them > > to be his commo. They said fine but they had no commo too. Jim was > at > > wits end when an Army Captain came to him and asked if he had any > commo. > > Jim said no commo and it's a big problem. The Captain said no > problem, > > and got on his radio and ordered an Army Communications Van to be > placed > > at Jim's disposal. Two hours later a van arrived and it had 4 guys > that > > set up a big dish antenna and then asked Jim how many telephones he > > needed and what computers needed the Internet? Jim ordered 5 > telephones > > and the Internet for his laptop. Soon Jim was on the phone to FEMA > > letting them know about the situation and giving them his telephone > > number. Jim was found by the Salvation Army. They said they can > set up > > 85 soup kitchens but needed $560,000 fast to stock the kitchens. > Jim > > called FEMA requesting the funding and the Salvation Army had the > money > > in 3 hours." > > > > "Due to this success story from Katrina, we are all told to use the > > Army for communications support and I have the phone number to > call when > > needed. I fear that what we can do with Ham Radio is too little > and far > > too late. We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not > done > > by the official part of an Incident." > > > > From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on > a DMAT > > (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... > > > > "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a > FL3-DMAT > > team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, > members > > of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were > advised > > this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be > brought to a > > deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is > observed by FEMA, > > > > the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" > > > > "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what > they can, > > short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to > push Amateur > > > > Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success > doing to, > > they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license > > privileges." > > > > This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to > offer > > emergency and disaster relief communications. > > > > While I like nothing more than a good rag chew on 40 or 75 with my > amateur > > radio friends of 40+ years, > > I believe that those days of me being able to do so are rapidly > coming to > > and end. > > > > Today ones community service is evaluated as "value to the > community, state, > > nations." Funding for groups is based on that. > > > > With the money set aside for Katrina and Rita relief, you should > have been > > able to purchase complete new HF dual band stations of every ham > in Texas, > > Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida...plus a few other > states. But > > that is hardly the amount given to the ARRL. > > > > The more value you bring to the table, the better your position of > survival > > is. This doesn't make it right or anything
Re: [digitalradio] Some thing we've talked about.
As hams, one of the best things we can do for ourselves is to dispel the myth that a amateur radio license and a 2 meter handi-talkie makes for a certified disaster communications expert. Its a hobby. Don't make it a job for me. I've RETIRED! I'm not a superhero anymore. I don't do tall buildings in a single bound. Arthritis is getting' to me. Fun and volunteer don't link well anymore. Max-out-credit-card and volunteer seem a better fit these days. Up here in the north woods we say it this way ... "want and a buck-n-a-half gets you a cup of coffee". I don't really give the northern most parts of a south bound rat , what FEMA wants or what DHS wants or the ARRL wants. Tell 'em all to start waving their check books instead of their patriotic flag wrapped wands when they give us their pronouncements of what ought to be. My bank account is pretty small and that's about the only disaster relief I really give a shit about. "want and a buck-n-a-half gets you a cup of coffee". Want and half-a-billion dollars gets you a communications system and trained people to run it. (Note to the republican functionaries among us: Unfortunately, you'll have to pay those trained specialists that run it.) When I talk with disaster types up here EMS, Fire, Police, etc, And ask how many hams would be needed for this or that situation. Most often the answer is none ... But, if you can find a couple dozen big kids who really know how to handle a chain saw and keep it sharpened ... that'd be pretty cool. Dismount soapbox Harv, AI9NL Washburn, WIOn 12/5/05, DuBose Walt Civ AETC CONS/LGCA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Here are some excerpts from E-Mail between individuals deeply involved in FEMA and NDMS communications. From a FEMA Incident Commander who is an active amateur radio operator... "The subject of this email is Communications and it is from the Southern Mississippi FEMA Incident Manager. He was without cell phone, and Internet capability. He cornered a State Police Car and asked them to be his commo. They said fine but they had no commo too. Jim was at wits end when an Army Captain came to him and asked if he had any commo. Jim said no commo and it's a big problem. The Captain said no problem, and got on his radio and ordered an Army Communications Van to be placed at Jim's disposal. Two hours later a van arrived and it had 4 guys that set up a big dish antenna and then asked Jim how many telephones he needed and what computers needed the Internet? Jim ordered 5 telephones and the Internet for his laptop. Soon Jim was on the phone to FEMA letting them know about the situation and giving them his telephone number. Jim was found by the Salvation Army. They said they can set up 85 soup kitchens but needed $560,000 fast to stock the kitchens. Jim called FEMA requesting the funding and the Salvation Army had the money in 3 hours." "Due to this success story from Katrina, we are all told to use the Army for communications support and I have the phone number to call when needed. I fear that what we can do with Ham Radio is too little and far too late. We can help with Health and Welfare traffic which is not done by the official part of an Incident." From an amateur radio operator who works closely with NDMS and on a DMAT (Disaster Medical Assistance Team)... "Your posting this morning was most timely and coincided with a FL3-DMAT team meeting I was attending. To underscore the points you made, members of the Comms unit, all of whom hold an Amateur Radio license, were advised this morning that NO Amateur Radio, FRS or GMRS gear may be brought to a deployment, effective immediately. If any of the above is observed by FEMA, the DMAT unit will lose its funding for the next twelve months!" "It is becoming more and more apparent the Feds are doing what they can, short of taking our frequency allocations and licenses away, to push Amateur Radio out of the picture. I fear once they have achieved success doing to, they will use it to justify a revocation of spectrum and license privileges." This should be a wake-up call...amateur radio has less and less to offer emergency and disaster relief communications. While I like nothing more than a good rag chew on 40 or 75 with my amateur radio friends of 40+ years, I believe that those days of me being able to do so are rapidly coming to and end. Today ones community service is evaluated as "value to the community, state, nations." Funding for groups is based on that. With the money set aside for Katrina and Rita relief, you should have been able to purchase complete new HF dual band stations of every ham in Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida...plus a few other states. But that is hardly the amount given to the ARRL. The more value you bring to the table, the better your position of survival is. This doesn't make it right or anything else...it is just the way it is. Survival of the "righteous and just" is not as
[digitalradio] Re: Some thing we've talked about.
Hi Walt, > What can amateur radio being to the table? Unfortunately, I think the answer is 'less and less' as time goes by. As communication technology advances, the simple fact is that people will grow more accustomed to reasonably fast Internet access connected to their commodity laptops, voice communications via cell phones, etc. All of this requires significant infrastructure (geosynchronous satellites aren't cheap!), and hence MONEY. There's no way for a bunch of hams who might be willing to spend a couple thousand bucks on gear for themselves can compete with multi-million dollar military communication systems. And when you think about it, since we -- the taxpayers -- are the ones paying for that infrastructure, shouldn't we fully expect that folks like FEMA or the Red Cross will be using it during disasters? I do encourage hams to do whatever they can to assist in emergency communications, and there's plenty of scenarios where they'll continue to be a great asset, but if I were a FEMA director I'd be pretty hesitant to have an official policy of relying on volunteers with little or no funding if I thought I could instead rely on the military. I don't think that the declining use of hams for emergency communication particularly threatens the bands themselves (i.e., the FCC taking the HF bands and reallocating them). Instead, I think the simple metric of whether or not the bands continue to be well used will have a much larger impact as to their continued existance -- a lot of the idealism of the amateur radio service somehow existing for the good of the public (rather than just as a cool little resource for a bunch of hobbyists to use for their own enjoyment) went away years ago (about the same time that people like Howard Stern started convincing much of the public that the FCC trying to regulate the content of the public airwaves was somehow an inherently bad idea). ---Joel Kolstad Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] Some things we've talked about.
I think one of the problems that the emergency service agencies have run into is reflected in posts to this reflector over the past week or so, with great theoretical discussions as to how many bauds will fit on the head of a pin, rather than a practical solution to communications problems. It would seem that the ARRL leadership has also taken this "big picture" approach, losing credibility with the served agencies. Instead of building strong relationships during non-emergent times, they go on and on about what could be rather than what realistic service could be offered. A wise old emergency planner once said that the last thing that should happen are agencies exchanging business cards at the scene of a disaster. Of course hams will be told that they are not needed when they show up at an emergency, since it is lilkely that none of these agencies have ever trained with these same hams, and therefore have no idea what service they can provide. An overweight, middle-aged man wearing sandals and a HT clipped to his belt is not a confidence builder. Our role in an emergency is to be the duct tape which connects these agencies together during comms overload or comms failure. We do that by working with these agencies, providing information as to what we can do and demonstrating this at every opportunity in training sessions. We should be working hard to make inroads to these agencies. Rather than talking in techonese about the kazillion dollar modems we need and the rate at which we can talk, we need to talk in their terms, posing "what if" questions and solutions and being able to show how we can operate when systems fail. Our solutions have to be simple, and effective. Finally, this is directed to the "owner " of this reflector. why not start up another called policies and predictions, and take all these long winded arguments elsewhere this is like a debating society run amok!! Right now we have to wade through lots of theory to find a few kernels of practical wisdom ! my 2 cents John VE5MU Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html SPONSORED LINKS Craft hobby Hobby and craft supply Ham radio YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[digitalradio] strong 40m open from east coast to ZL
right now! (0715Z). 73, Dave, AA6YQ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~-> Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
