[digitalradio] Re: [multipsk] Re: Tests in ARQ FAE
Hi Patrick, What about trying 10.136,500 later this evening ? The 30m is a lovely band free from contest qrm . 73 de LA5VNA Steinar Patrick Lindecker skrev: Hello to all, As there is a WW RTTY contest, the 14109.5 frequency is and will not be free. So this ARQ FAE test will be done another day. 73 Patrick - Original Message - *From:* Patrick Lindecker mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ; digitalradio@yahoogroups.com mailto:digitalradio@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Friday, September 28, 2007 11:21 PM *Subject:* Tests in ARQ FAE Hello to all, I will be QRV for tests to-morrow saturday morning in 14109.5 KHz USB at 10h00 UTC, for the ones interested. I will call CQ in ARQ FAE up to 10h30 UTC. A 4.4.2 Multipsk test version in a ZIP test package is available in my site. It contains the Multipsk test version (with ARQ FAE bugs fixed). http://f6cte.free.fr/MULTIPSK_TEST_22_09_2007.ZIP http://f6cte.free.fr/MULTIPSK_TEST_22_09_2007.ZIP Paste this adress in your Internet Explorer or equivalent. Download the file. Create a tempory folder (C:\TEST, for example), unzip the file in it and start C:\TEST\Multipsk.exe (the auxiliary files will be created automatically). 73 Patrick
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
If the S/N ratios are measuring above the noise, the numbers indicate a very good link. As I have found out the hard way, when we tested SCAMP, it was not easy to even maintain 10 dB above noise. I am not clear on the amount of data you are sending as it appeared to be used more as a chat mode? Or did you send large files too? Did the path drop out rather suddenly? The S/N levels seemed to be holding up quite well. If you had switched to Olivia, MFSK16, etc., do you think you could have continued communicating? The 8PSK ALE modes are the same or very similar waveforms to what is used in RFSM2400 and the advantage of PC-ALE is that it now supports CAT PTT switching which is something I expect in a modern digital program. When I use the term ALE, I am mostly referring to the various modulation schemes as one thing. I personally have minimal interest in the Link Establishment part of ALE as I don't see this as being used much except for some longer distance alerting on HF for sudden emergencies. What I do see more useful is that the modulation schemes are available as a more open standard and can compete with Pactor modes. The fastest modes in RFSM are not as fast as the fastest modes in ALE since they can go about double that speed but do require ISB I think and that will not be used on HF amateur radio bands. Again, maybe we need to change the terminology to the appropriate MIL-STD or STANAG such as we do with Multipsk calling the slow speed 8FSK125 waveform 141A? 73, Rick, KV9U Les Keppie wrote: Hi Rick Yes relative S/N reports are given for each paket - but what they relate to is any ones guess and since I have no really good test equipment that would do this cant really answer - but yes good data can still be passed with signal levels just above 0db according to what we see - and the higher the S/N R the faster speeds can be acheived as you should see from the email I sent it is adaptive in speed to the S/N R report it gets back from the receiving station If you study the logs I sent you can see it changing speed to adapt to the changing S/N R reports it gets It keeps a record of all exchanges it makes (except the actual data) in four seperate logs No I havent tried the faster Ale modes - whilst I have PC-Ale running on my computer I do not fancy it all that much Ale may well be good at finding openings at various times on various frequencies but mostly they are too poor and too short to pass much useful data anyway - and to get decent thruput of data using a comparable waveform it probably requires similar S/N R figures as RFSM8000 Using Amateur bandwith- (ie. the nonstandard mode in RFSM8000) the maximum capable speed is bits per second which is quite a bit faster than that of Ale I will attach all four logs to cover this mornings test transfers between VK2DSG and TEST4 - You can now work out if you think it works The tests were done on 7196 usb over a distance of 400 klm TEST4 was using 200 watts and I using 100 watts pep Band faded out at end with no transfer possible Regards Les
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
Rick wrote: If the S/N ratios are measuring above the noise, the numbers indicate a very good link. As I have found out the hard way, when we tested SCAMP, it was not easy to even maintain 10 dB above noise. I am not clear on the amount of data you are sending as it appeared to be used more as a chat mode? Or did you send large files too? I DONT THINK YOU LOOKED AT THE FILE SIZES AND THE TRANSFER TIMES OF THE FILES LISTED BELOW READ ALL OF BELOW THROUGH FOR FILE SIZES AND TIMES TAKEN(Copied from previous email) Connecting to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM RFSM-8000, version 0.508, user license: BETA-TESTER - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM Maximum supported connection speed - 8000 bit/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM Connected to 'TEST4' - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM 'TEST4' accept FTP-requests. - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM 'TEST4' accept MAIL-requests. - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM Receiving file 'ATT00017.jpg', size 28623 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:20:10 AM File 'ATT00017.jpg' received succesfully, all time 173 sec, average speed 1322 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:23:20 AM Receiving file 'ATT00023.jpg', size 39781 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:24:18 AM File 'ATT00023.jpg' received succesfully, all time 259 sec, average speed 1225 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:28:55 AM Receiving file 'ATT00011.jpg', size 16126 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:29:40 AM File 'ATT00011.jpg' received succesfully, all time 45 sec, average speed 2846 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:30:42 AM Receiving file 'ATT00020.jpg', size 35064 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:31:37 AM File 'ATT00020.jpg' received succesfully, all time 257 sec, average speed 1090 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:11 AM 'TEST4' request to read download directory 'C:\RFSM8000\TRANSMIT'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:19 AM Request for sending file 'filelist' to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:19 AM Sending file 'filelist', size 643 bytes, to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:29 AM File 'filelist' sended succesfully, all time 14 sec, average speed 350 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:44 AM 'TEST4' request to get file 'C:\RFSM8000\TRANSMIT\#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:37:47 AM Request for sending file '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg' to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:37:48 AM Sending file '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg', size 67971 bytes, to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:38:09 AM File '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg' sended succesfully, all time 405 sec, average speed 1342 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:44:54 AM Receiving file 'ATT00017.jpg', size 28623 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:45:36 AM File 'ATT00017.jpg' received succesfully, all time 90 sec, average speed 2531 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:47:24 AM Receiving file 'ATT00035.jpg', size 32482 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:48:12 AM File 'ATT00035.jpg' received succesfully, all time 117 sec, average speed 2214 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:50:26 AM Receiving file 'Hi-Q Hat + Hot Rodz addition.JPG', size 1089463 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:51:39 AM If you look at the transfer times you can see they go up and down in relation to band conditions Did the path drop out rather suddenly? The S/N levels seemed to be holding up quite well. If you had switched to Olivia, MFSK16, etc., do you think you could have continued communicating? Yes the path did drop out completely - and we maybe would have been able to continue with Olivia - but of course it would only have been good enough to chat - and maybe small service messages The 8PSK ALE modes are the same or very similar waveforms to what is used in RFSM2400 and the advantage of PC-ALE is that it now supports CAT PTT switching which is something I expect in a modern digital program. Read capabilities of RFSM8000 below When I use the term ALE, I am mostly referring to the various modulation schemes as one thing. I personally have minimal interest in the Link Establishment part of ALE as I don't see this as being used much except for some longer distance alerting on HF for sudden emergencies. What I do see more useful is that the modulation schemes are available as a more open standard and can compete with Pactor modes. The Freeware version of RFSDM2400 working at max speed of 3200 bits per second is available to all The fastest modes in RFSM are not as fast as the fastest modes in ALE since they can go about double that speed but do require ISB I think and that will not be used on HF amateur radio bands. The fastest speed avail to registered users - using the non standard mode (.3 TO 2.7 KHZ will be bits per second and for those that can use the .3 to 3.3 khz version will be 8000 bits per second Again, maybe we need to change the terminology to the appropriate MIL-STD or STANAG such as we do with Multipsk calling the slow speed 8FSK125 waveform 141A? 73, Rick, KV9U
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
So, Rick...am I correct in assuming RFSM is legal in the USA if you got to the image sub-bands ?
Re: [digitalradio] 30 Meter PropNet Weekend October 6/7
Is this 30 meter beacon activity legal? Can you reference where Part 97 permits this here in the U.S. below 28.0 MHz? Appreciate your help in understanding this. 73, Rick, KV9U Don wrote: Please join us to promote 30m PSK and Propagation Study on 30 meters (PropNet anchor freq= 10.1395 USB PSK +1500 and 30m PSK call freq=10.140 USB). This event will be the weekend of October 6th 7th (z 10/6/07 -Sat until 2359z 10/7/07 -Sun). Any station welcome to participate be it a PropNet PSK Beacon (tx rx) or a PropNet `lurker mode' (rx only). SWL stations or others not wanting to be a beacon (tx rx) please note PropNet has `lurker mode' (rx only) function so anyone can participate. Please go here and download and try PropNet and get on 30 meters October 6th 7th: http://www.propnet.org/ http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/main.html http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/download.html http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/faq.html de kb9umt Don – promoting 30 meter digital activity (30m our only low power digital band) http://www.projectsandparts.com/30m/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/30meterPSKGroup/ http://www.30meterdigital.com Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/drsked/drsked.php Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] 30 Meter PropNet Weekend October 6/7
Please join us to promote 30m PSK and Propagation Study on 30 meters (PropNet anchor freq= 10.1395 USB PSK +1500 and 30m PSK call freq=10.140 USB). This event will be the weekend of October 6th 7th (z 10/6/07 -Sat until 2359z 10/7/07 -Sun). Any station welcome to participate be it a PropNet PSK Beacon (tx rx) or a PropNet `lurker mode' (rx only). SWL stations or others not wanting to be a beacon (tx rx) please note PropNet has `lurker mode' (rx only) function so anyone can participate. Please go here and download and try PropNet and get on 30 meters October 6th 7th: http://www.propnet.org/ http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/main.html http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/download.html http://www.n7yg.net/propnetpsk/faq.html de kb9umt Don promoting 30 meter digital activity (30m our only low power digital band) http://www.projectsandparts.com/30m/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/30meterPSKGroup/ http://www.30meterdigital.com
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
I am convinced that the MIL-STD-188-110A and similar high speed 8PSK2400 modes are legal on the voice/image portions of the bands. Being a fairly conservative type person, my plan is to contact the FCC and get a better read out. In fact, I am working on a request for a response from FCC on several digital issues that I think should be examined. If anyone has a specific item that they would like me to ask, please contact me or suggest something on this group. Some wanted me to not ask certain questions, but it seems that it is better to ask and be told no, than to do nothing and find out later that you could have been doing something legally all along. I do want to ask about how they view the operation of automatic stations that do not listen before transmitting, particularly the ALE sounding and calling and the various mail systems. 73, Rick, KV9U Andrew O'Brien wrote: So, Rick...am I correct in assuming RFSM is legal in the USA if you got to the image sub-bands ?
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
The speeds look similar to Pactor 3 if the S/N ratios are as high as they seem to be. By the time you reach 15 dB S/N P3 should be close to maxing out at 2722 bps uncompressed, therefore throughput of around 5000 bps or 5000 wpm at maximum. The MIL-STD-188-110A (older) specification has speeds up to 4800 bps. The MIL-STD-188-110B (3G) specification adds speeds up to 9600 bps. The STANAG 4539 specifications have three waveforms include three levels: - a very robust low speed 75 bps that uses the STANAG 4415 PSK data modem waveform - a medium speed MIL-STD-188-110B waveform - a high speed waveform from MIL-STD-188-110B, Appendix C, providing 3200 to 12800 bps There are others including a QAM modem approach (Reference my ALE Protocols and Terms document on the hfdec yahoogroup site for more details). Overall it sounds pretty exciting to me as I know how well 1000 bps worked with SCAMP and I was quite surprised and pleased how well it worked with good signals. It will be interesting for you to provide us with more information with the weaker signals, especially those below zero dB S/N since that is the where the difficulty lies. 73, Rick, KV9U Les Keppie wrote: I DONT THINK YOU LOOKED AT THE FILE SIZES AND THE TRANSFER TIMES OF THE FILES LISTED BELOW READ ALL OF BELOW THROUGH FOR FILE SIZES AND TIMES TAKEN(Copied from previous email) Connecting to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM RFSM-8000, version 0.508, user license: BETA-TESTER - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM Maximum supported connection speed - 8000 bit/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:09 AM Connected to 'TEST4' - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM 'TEST4' accept FTP-requests. - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM 'TEST4' accept MAIL-requests. - 29/09/2007 - 11:19:17 AM Receiving file 'ATT00017.jpg', size 28623 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:20:10 AM File 'ATT00017.jpg' received succesfully, all time 173 sec, average speed 1322 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:23:20 AM Receiving file 'ATT00023.jpg', size 39781 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:24:18 AM File 'ATT00023.jpg' received succesfully, all time 259 sec, average speed 1225 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:28:55 AM Receiving file 'ATT00011.jpg', size 16126 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:29:40 AM File 'ATT00011.jpg' received succesfully, all time 45 sec, average speed 2846 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:30:42 AM Receiving file 'ATT00020.jpg', size 35064 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:31:37 AM File 'ATT00020.jpg' received succesfully, all time 257 sec, average speed 1090 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:11 AM 'TEST4' request to read download directory 'C:\RFSM8000\TRANSMIT'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:19 AM Request for sending file 'filelist' to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:19 AM Sending file 'filelist', size 643 bytes, to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:29 AM File 'filelist' sended succesfully, all time 14 sec, average speed 350 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:36:44 AM 'TEST4' request to get file 'C:\RFSM8000\TRANSMIT\#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:37:47 AM Request for sending file '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg' to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:37:48 AM Sending file '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg', size 67971 bytes, to 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:38:09 AM File '#70726153230- de VK2KDK-birds and bee.jpg' sended succesfully, all time 405 sec, average speed 1342 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:44:54 AM Receiving file 'ATT00017.jpg', size 28623 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:45:36 AM File 'ATT00017.jpg' received succesfully, all time 90 sec, average speed 2531 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:47:24 AM Receiving file 'ATT00035.jpg', size 32482 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:48:12 AM File 'ATT00035.jpg' received succesfully, all time 117 sec, average speed 2214 bits/sec - 29/09/2007 - 11:50:26 AM Receiving file 'Hi-Q Hat + Hot Rodz addition.JPG', size 1089463 bytes, from 'TEST4'... - 29/09/2007 - 11:51:39 AM Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/drsked/drsked.php Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] RFSM2400 vs. PC-ALE
Howard Brown wrote: Les, can you comment on Rick's question about PTT via CAT? I know that RFSM2400 keys my PTT via my Rigblaster but I guess Rick wants it to key the rig via the data port??? Howard K5HB Some Kenwood models already catered for - and there is a user defined setup for other radios Dmitry does not have the various parameters for keying Yaesu and Icom radios at this time but I am very certain if someone were to send him this information he would soon put it in the current program In an earlier email I did ask if anyone could send him the information for both Yaesu and Icom radios he would put it in the program for Ptt on and off This is an evolving program and to quote him from the webpage Current version is 0.508(beta). (In reference to RFSM8000) Program is not available for all yet, but will be very soon – in October/November 2007. We will respectfully accept any suggestions about new features from all (e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]). I do think this program will be quite a good rival for Pactor 3 in the registered form - and also a good addition to anyones data capabilities in the Freeware form Les VK2DSG Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/drsked/drsked.php Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] See previous post
Hi All Sorry - forgot to put this bit in de les 'TEST1' complete current part of file, new part: 2 - 30/09/2007 - 1:34:59 PM File 'AERO 101.JPG' received succesfully, all time 495 sec, average speed 4123 bits/sec - 30/09/2007 - 1:35:50 PM Disconnected from 'TEST1' - 30/09/2007 - 1:36:06 PM
