[digitalradio] Re: QRL? PACTOR
Busy detection in my 8-year old Pactor II modem seems to be functioning fine with Winlink Classic. Perhaps it's only WL2K that is broke? Here is a portion of my recent log: 9/9/2007 9:21:18 AM 07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/9/2007 1:16:19 PM 07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/9/2007 1:21:20 PM 07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/9/2007 6:35:19 PM 10144.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/10/2007 8:31:19 AM07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/10/2007 3:49:29 PM14107.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/11/2007 8:15:20 AM07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/11/2007 1:45:26 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/11/2007 3:23:54 PM14107.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/11/2007 3:28:22 PM14107.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/12/2007 2:40:19 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/13/2007 1:16:20 AM10145.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/13/2007 8:15:19 AM07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/14/2007 2:56:25 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/14/2007 3:00:24 PM14107.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/14/2007 8:00:20 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/14/2007 8:05:25 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/14/2007 8:10:20 PM03594.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/15/2007 1:00:25 AM10145.00 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF 9/15/2007 8:15:28 AM07103.30 busy with TFC PctSCS:HF ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, it seems that these PACTOR III modem do have the ability to busy detect before a transmission. I was told recently however (from a knowledgeable source) that the person in charge of the Winlink system refused to incorporate busy detect in to the WINLINk PBO system. Anyone know if this is true ? Can a PACTOR III modem avoid a transmission if QRG is busy BUT AIRMAIL/WInlink refuses to use it ? Andy K3UK On 9/16/07, John Becker, WØJAB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unfortunately this statement is only half true. The one thing that concerns me a great deal is that the automated stations are not listening before transmitting and at least here in the U.S. are operating illegally. And they even are open about this with comments made by the administrator of Winlink 2000, that signal detection is not practical because they would never find an open frequency. This may be based upon their experiences with the SCAMP mode that they invented that clearly demonstrated a full ability to provide busy frequency detection. But the automatic users do not want to implement these technologies.
[digitalradio] 80M Automatic Sub Band Remains
No change to privileges, only the band segment. See pages 13 18: http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-06-178A1.pdf ... Duane N7QDN
[digitalradio] New ARRL Petition
They've submitted a new petition for partial reconsideration of WT Docket No. 04-140. http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2006/12/11/100/ I'm glad to see some action before the 15th rolls around. ... Duane N7QDN
[digitalradio] Re: New 80m USA Keyboarding Digi Frequencies
I've brought this conflict to the attention of the ARRL and the FCC a few times. They remain silent, so the contradiction remains. This error will hamper intrastate emergency operations who previously chose to exercise those privileges on 80 meters. This unresolved conflict may prevent unattended pactor III operation on any band for stations running Winlink (Classic) since it cannot be configured to prevent wideband connections on a specific band. In other words, run only pactor II or eliminate 80 meter operation in favor of pactor III on the other bands. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Dave Bernstein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 97.221 limits 80m automatic operation with more than 500 hz bandwidth to 3.620-3.635; for verification, see http://www.w5yi.org/page.php?id=136 As far as I know, 97.221 was not changed in the recent FCC action. Anyone have hard evidence to the contrary? If so, there will be no automatic or semi-automatic US stations running wideband digital protocols on 80m after December 15 -- reducing the contention for frequencies below 3600. I don't know how much automatic operation there is at 500 hz bandwidth, but 3595 to 3600 seems like a good spot for it. 73, Dave, AA6YQ --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Chris Jewell ae6vw- digitalradio@ wrote: expeditionradio writes: [snipped] Let's be blunt together, but let's focus on the topic instead of personality. The fact is, there's a proposed solution on the table. If you have a truly constructive suggestion, let's hear it. Sexist or condescending remarks do nothing to advance the discussion. Right on target. The other posters' remarks strike me as regrettably personal and non-constructive. Below are my comments on the proposal. [snipped] 80 meter Bandplan 2007 for USA: == 3500-3540 = CW 3540-3560 = Any Mode, 500Hz Bandwidth 3560-3600 = Any Mode Given what the FCC has done to 80 meters, nobody is going to get everything they'd like out of any new USA band plan. Still, it seems to me that as advocates for the data modes, we are more likely to obtain the cooperation and agreement of those with whom we share 3500-3600 KHz if our proposals leave half of the new band for the CW ops. Accordingly, while I can live with Bonnie's suggestion as presented, I suggest moving the boundaries up by 10 KHz. 3500-3550 = CW 3550-3570 = Any mode up to 500Hz bandwidth 3570-3600 = Any mode That gives general and advanced CW ops 25 KHz of mode-exclusive space instead of 15, and extras 50 KHz instead of 40. It still leaves room for about 12 concurrent 2.5 KHz-wide data-mode QSOs above 3570, or 10 if the wide mode operation are assumed to occupy 3KHz each. I think that's enough. (Of course, I *would* think that, since I'm not much interested in wide data modes below 10M. grin) Now let's move all of the keyboarding frequencies up by 10 Khz from Bonnie's proposals: PSK31 = 3545kHz USB (3545.3-3548.0 kHz) PSK31 = 3555kHz USB (3555.3-3558.0 kHz) QPSK31/PSK63/125 = 3547kHz USB (3547.3-3550.0 kHz) QPSK31/PSK63/125 = 3557kHz USB (3557.3-3560.0 kHz) MFSK = 3548kHz USB (3548.3-3551.0 kHz) MFSK = 3558kHz USB (3558.3-3561.0 kHz) OLIVIA500 = 3549kHz USB (3549.3-3553.0 kHz) OLIVIA500 = 3559kHz USB (3559.3-3563.0 kHz) CONTESTIA/DOMINO, etc = 3550kHz USB (3550.3-3554.0 kHz) CONTESTIA/DOMINO, etc = 3560kHz USB (3560.3-3564.0 kHz) HELL/FMHELL = 3552kHz USB (3552.3-3555 kHz) HELL/FMHELL = 3562kHz USB (3562.3-3565 kHz) RTTY/FSK = 3555+ (3555.3-3565 kHz) RTTY/FSK = 3565+ (3565.3-3575 kHz) PAX/MT63/OLIVIA1000 = 3560kHz USB (3560.5-3563) PAX/MT63/OLIVIA1000 = 3570kHz USB (3570.5-3573) As always, the CW folks, when they need elbow room, are free to move up the band, but we can at least hope that they will go fight it out with the Pactor3/Winlink crowd at the top of the band, rather with the experimenters and narrow-mode operators in between. Comments? -- 73 DE KW6H, ex-AE6VW, Chris Jewell Gualala CA USA
[digitalradio] Re: The Digital Radio Group
Thank you Andy. I believe this group on average is much better equiped to represent our interests than the ARRL is. This action appears very necessary, now and on an on-going basis. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have begun using the term The Digital Radio Group, when referring collectively to this email group. This group has almost 2,500 subscribed members , therefore I think the group represents an active constituency of data oriented radio operators. Hopefully this will not appear overly pretentious, but I have contacted the FCC about the revised data bandwidth rules and asked them for clarification. I did so as head of the Digital Radio Group. There may be other times when communication with national or international organizations would be helpful to our members. As an individual member, I would not express opinion on behalf of this group, but feel that it may be appropriate to occasionally ask organizations to clarify their positions. So, I have written to Bill Cross and Riley Hollingsworth on behalf of this group and shared with them some of the key points recently made by members of this group. I will share any response with the membership. Andy K3UK Owner.
[digitalradio] FCC Failure
Somehow, the Federal Register posting neglected to resolve the conflict concerning automatic digital forwarding on 80 meters. There is no change to section 97.221. Forwarding is allowed, but it isn't, yet it is? Raising the lower end for voice to 3.635 would fix a few problems. ... Duane N7QDN
[digitalradio] Re: NTS and traffic handling and digital
Amateur Operators add no value to emergency communications, unless we are able to provide a service where others cannot. I see this as being the focus of any discussion concerning use radio or use Sprint. Why in the world would any Incident Commander hand write a NTS Radiogram for one of those Ham guys when his wireless notebook has a fine internet connection? Please explain. I can't even imagine how many broadband engineers work 40+ hours a week maintaining, load-testing, expanding, improving and upgrading their systems around the US... so that I.C. and everyone else involved can have some level of assurance that commercial communications will be operational when needed. Now for the rest of the story... Commercial communications is down. Now what? What level of assurance do you think that I.C. has in his radio team that they can provide ANY sort of communications into and out of the disaster area? Does he have any evidence that the Hams have been: maintaining, load-testing, expanding, improving and upgrading their systems around the US? What? You mean they don't use their Emergency Backup System? They have to quickly build it and test it with other hams hundreds of miles away? What a joke. That Emergency Backup System is 95% dependant upon the very system that they are suppose to be backing up! Moral of the story: Any backup system (spare tire, UPS, emergency generator, Ham Radio) *MUST* be fully operational for the intended use, when its use is required. In other words, USE RADIO for radio traffic. Hams just may become valuable again some day. My pactor station has been doing a fine job of handling NTS into and out of the Pacific Northwest for the past 10+ years. Only because I use it. ... Duane N7QDN Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Pactor III Legal or Not?
Pactor III has been publicly documented here along with PSK31, Olivia and the rest: http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/regulations/techchar/ ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, palmdalesteve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone know if Pactor III is legal here in the US? Was on 20 meters around 14.107 or so and a booming ~2.5 KHz signal that could have only been Pactor III was cranking. Who knows what the station was doing, gotta have a PTIII decoder program. By the way, any hope of a Pactor III like decoder for one of these sound card programs? N6CRR Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~- Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Calling all experimenters ( A Proposal)
If you are speaking of semi-automatic stations, that's correct. They too are authorized to operate where you mentioned as long as the bandwidth is 500 Hz. The last known rouge automatic pactor station that I know of (in the mid west) shut down about a year ago. Again I ask, why is that narrow sub band selected? Is it preferred because that is the only band section authorized for fully automatic stations on 20 meters? If my math is correct, this section (excluding 1,000Hz at 14.100) is only 10.6% of the entire RTTY/Data sub band. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Joe Ivey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I guess because they are legal to operate there and the same reasons the automatic station operate in the RTTY and even below sub bands. Joe W4JSI - Original Message - From: dshults To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 8:50 PM Subject: [digitalradio] Re: Calling all experimenters ( A Proposal) Can someone please explain to me why manually operated digital experimenting takes place within the narrow 20 meter sub band where automatic forwarding systems are specifically limited to occupy? Is the rest of the digital band closed to these modes for some reason? Whether USB or LSB, the modulation still falls there. If Olivia and Contestia operate under full automatic control (the originating station) I can understand, but I don't believe this is the case. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, palmdalesteve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Calling all experimenters ( A Proposal) I'd like to propose a few experiments on HF to see how well Olivia and Contestia stack up. I'm looking for West Coast to Mid West stations to participate, as the propagation has been pretty bad at night to try this experiment to the East Coast. If someone on the East Coast wishes to try the same experiment, that would be great. Results, comments and suggestions can be posted under this thread. Here's the plan: Pick a time and band at an agreed to time for QSO's in various Olivia mode, report signal and see how it all stacks up. Of course this is all depending on propagation cooperation, which now days is not a sure thing. I think we can coordinate this experiment to allow for bands being open and try to run it during the day or in the evenings, most likely on 40 meters. Daytime would probably work best on 20 meters, 14.107 or 14.108. Here's the outline of the plan. Please feel free to edit and comment. 1 Pick a frequency and operating mode for the start of the test. 2 Something like 7.090 04:00 Z. Olivia 1000/32 tone mode. Power should be something like 30 to 40 watts maximum. What ever the power is, let others know what is you are running for power. 3 Establish contacts and or check in of stations able to copy. 4 Exchange signal reports using the MixW Olivia DLL standard tool. 5 The suggested exchange in a Macro would have: GET SN GET OFFSET GET RATE 6 Take check ins for stations who are receiving the signal, but who did not establish the QSO. Reports would be welcome. 7 Reduce power in 5 Watt steps down to 5 Watts, move power back up to starting point, pausing at each step for stations monitoring to record the signal using the Macro each step. I would suggest repeating the step down and up from both ends of the QSO. 8 Take received reports from stations who are listiting mode. 9 Change to Olivia Mode 500/16, then 500/8 and finally 500/4 repeating the power step down. 10 Change to Contestia Mode and repeat. The automated SN and other features does not work in the DLL I have, so the reading will have to be only on number of errors in text. If anyone can get the signal reporting to work, clue me in. For test text, here's an old test we used to use in the military DE N6CRR @ x Watts The quick brown fox jumps over the fence. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 DE N6CRR @ x Watts The quick brown fox jumps over the fence. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 etc etc So anyone want to play? N6CRR/Steve Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to telnet://208.15.25.196/ Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ Looking for digital mode software? Check the quick commerical free link below http://www.obriensweb.com/digimodes.html --- --- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group digitalradio on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] c.. Your
[digitalradio] Re: Message from tim ab0wr re: Winlink-winkink 2000
My Winlink Classic/PTC-IIe station IDs just fine after a failed forwarding attempt. Has for years. Though it would be nice to force an ID at any time, if I want to end the forward attempt before it times out. Don't recall if the Ident! button is ever active. Also, my autocall.log file has many Busy with TFC entries. I know it detects nearby pactor stations and asserts CD, but not sure about other modes. Need to keep a closer eye on it. ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Andrew J. O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My apologies, I pressed the wrong button and deleted a message from a new member, Tim ab0wr , rather than approved it. Sorry Tim, welcome to the group. Here is Tim's original message. == Rick, Please be very careful in accepting anything you read from the WL2K people about how Winlink Classic works. The problem with identification after a failed connection attempt is not trivial when you are using an older modem. It is not, however, a Winlink Classic problem, it is a *modem* problem. The AEA pk- 232mbx, one of the commonly used pactor I modems, does not provide a way to send an indentification after a failed connection attempt in pactor mode. The client software would have to put the modem in another mode, e.g. morse or packet, in order to send an identification string. It would then have to put it back into pactor listen mode. I believe the older Kantronics modems have the same problem. My guess is that WL2K won't work any better with these modems than Winlink Classic. Nor will Airmail. The answer would be to rewrite Winlink Classic to work with an SCS modem capable of doing the identification after a failed connect attempt. Bottom line, k4cjx is *really* advocating banning the use of AEA pk-232mbx modems and Kantronics all-mode modems from being used in pactor modes since they won't identify at the end of a *MANUAL* connection attempt that fails, let alone an automatic attempt. Of course, this will push everyone into buying SCS modems. If I can find it, there is a fellow in Europe that is developing a rival to WL2K using mfsk16 or mfsk32, I believe. It is set up to work with jnos or tnos or one of the variants and is written in Perl if I remember correctly. If I can find his web site, I'll post it. While it won't be quite as fast as pactor III it will be very robust, much cheaper, and open source. I suspect you will see a lot of people moving to this type of operation if he has time to publish it. tim ab0wr Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~- The K3UK DIGITAL MODES SPOTTING CLUSTER AT telnet://208.15.25.196/ More info at http:///www.obriensweb.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] Re: Olivia Hints
Not sure about packet, but pactor is still doing well in that sub band. I've been wondering why attended operation such as the modes discussed in this group, select channels within the narrow slice of band where unattended forwarding is limited to (14.1005-14.1120 MHz)? ... Duane N7QDN --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, John Becker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there not still packet BBS's operating from 14,101 to 14,108 (lsb) mode ? At 07:02 AM 9/30/05, you wrote: Olivia on Mixw seems to be runner. To avoid further chaos on 20 meter, here a few hints! Leave 14109.500 Khz free for MT63. (Some new MT63 stuff may be in the pipeline) Use channels from 14108.500 Khz down to 14101.500 Khz in exact 1 Khz steps. Make sure you have set 1000Hz frequency at the Mixw bottomline, when using 1000/32 mode. Avoid using Manuel tuning - not needed. Check your transceiver frequency accuracy. Use WWV or 14995.000 Khz USB to see a signal at 1000 Hz (Waterfall) Avoid tuning on the TRX dail during reception, just leave it fix. Mixw Olivia copys inbetween +/- 60 Hz perfect. Never transmit at 14108.000 Khz or any other odd frequency, or you jam two adjacent channels. When strong adjacent channels and AGC gave up, if possible, use a narrow 500 Hz filter. Olivia can copy 100% with only 50% channel information. (Try it out). The K3UK DIGITAL MODES SPOTTING CLUSTER AT telnet://208.15.25.196/ More info at http:///www.obriensweb.comhttp:///www.obriensweb.com SPONSORED LINKS http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=msk=Hobby+and+craft+supplyw1=Hobby+and+craft+supplyw2=Craft+hobb yw3=Hobbies+and+craftsw4=Ham+radioc=4s=84.sig=Sz5ebNg- ZsVyHTzaR4PnAgHobby and craft supply http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=msk=Craft+hobbyw1=Hobby+and+craft+supplyw2=Craft+hobbyw3=Hobbie s+and+craftsw4=Ham+radioc=4s=84.sig=_8V4kQCK4PEN_MzUUBx-hQCraft hobby http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=msk=Hobbies+and+craftsw1=Hobby+and+craft+supplyw2=Craft+hobbyw3 =Hobbies+and+craftsw4=Ham+radioc=4s=84.sig=J- __6L1W_lZQ58dekNdHLAHobbies and crafts http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=msk=Ham+radiow1=Hobby+and+craft+supplyw2=Craft+hobbyw3=Hobbies+ and+craftsw4=Ham+radioc=4s=84.sig=OzrEr-gq6h7guAFs73WsoQHam radio -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradiodigitalradio on the web. * * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] subject=Unsubscribe[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ELTolB/TM ~- The K3UK DIGITAL MODES SPOTTING CLUSTER AT telnet://208.15.25.196/ More info at http:///www.obriensweb.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
