[directfb-dev] GTK1 and DirectFB
Hi. I am the project leader for GTK1 on the Windows and Mac platforms. I've never used DirectFB. May I ask some questions about DirectFB and GTK? On your web site it mentions you use DirectFB under GTK2. How is that implemented? Did you write a DirectFb GDK layer? Is there a GTK1 version? Do you think it would it be hard to backport to GTK1? The Linux, Windows, and Mac versions of GTK1 are all separate codebases. I may want to combine those and perhaps add DirectFB support, too. How would you feel about GTK1 including DirectFB? Where are the directions for building DirectFB for GTK? Thanks! Robin --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hollywood, California www.CinePaint.org Free motion picture and still image editing software -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Hi Robin, "Robin Rowe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I am the project leader for GTK1 on the Windows and Mac platforms. The GTK+ 1.2 codebase is dead and unmaintained; you are wasting your time. The GTK+-2.x platform provides a large number of substantial improvements over GTK+-1.2 and it would be stupid to ignore this fact. > On your web site it mentions you use DirectFB under GTK2. How is > that implemented? Did you write a DirectFb GDK layer? Is there a > GTK1 version? Do you think it would it be hard to backport to GTK1? As you might know already, the GTK+-2.x platform provides a backend abstraction on the GDK layer. This makes it easy to port it to other windowing systems. The GTK+-1.x platform doesn't provide such an abstraction layer and any port would be substantially more effort. Since the GTK+-1.x API is basically not in use any longer, I'd consider any port DirectFB port for gtk+-1.2 a waste of time and effort. > Where are the directions for building DirectFB for GTK? There's a README included in the gdk-directfb tarball. This README is also part of the patched GTK+-DirectFB tarball. It's located in the gdk/directfb directory. Sven -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Sven, For any DirectFB folks who may not know who you are, Sven is a GIMP maintainer who frequently posts remarks critical of me personally and my projects. Whenever a question regarding my projects is posted to a public forum it seems Sven is there ready to offer his opinion that my projects should cease to exist and to advise others not to work with me on open source. Whether his unfriendly advice is motivated by self-interest, incompetence, officiousness, or malice I can't tell. Unless Sven is officially speaking for DirectFB I would like to hear from others. > The GTK+ 1.2 codebase is dead and unmaintained; you are wasting your > time. GTK1 is not dead, not unmaintained, and how I spend my time is my business. I'm not working on GTK 1.2. The current version on Windows is 1.3. I'm working on the new version, GTK 1.4. Although the GTK project group has gone on to GTK2, Owen Taylor at gtk.org tells me he is still the maintainer for GTK 1.2 for Linux. Tor Lillqvist of GIMP for Windows was the maintainer of GTK 1.3 for Windows, but that responsibility recently passed to me. I have been the project leader for GTK+OSX since last year. That is at version 0.5, though based on GTK 1. www.gtk.org http://sourceforge.net/projects/gtk1-win/ http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/index.html > As you might know already, the GTK+-2.x platform provides a backend > abstraction on the GDK layer. This makes it easy to port it to other > windowing systems. The GTK+-1.x platform doesn't provide such an > abstraction layer and any port would be substantially more effort. The GDK is an abstraction layer. GTK1 has been ported to many platforms. People sometimes advise me that it could be easier to do something using GTK2, Qt, FLTK, Wx, or some other window API they prefer. I can't do everything. > There's a README included in the gdk-directfb tarball. Thanks, Sven. Cheers, Robin --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hollywood, California www.CinePaint.org Free motion picture and still image editing software -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
On Mon, 2003-10-06 at 18:57, Robin Rowe wrote: > > For any DirectFB folks who may not know who you are, Sven is a GIMP > maintainer who frequently posts remarks critical of me personally and my > projects. Whenever a question regarding my projects is posted to a public > forum it seems Sven is there ready to offer his opinion that my projects > should cease to exist and to advise others not to work with me on open > source. Whether his unfriendly advice is motivated by self-interest, > incompetence, officiousness, or malice I can't tell. > > Unless Sven is officially speaking for DirectFB I would like to hear from > others. I can't speak officially for DirectFB (AFAIK Sven would be more entitled there), but I agree with him on GTK+ 2 vs. 1, so hadn't he beaten me to it, I would have asked: why on Earth do you bother with GTK+ 1 instead of 2? -- Earthling Michel Dänzer \ Debian (powerpc), XFree86 and DRI developer Software libre enthusiast \ http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=daenzer -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Hi, "Robin Rowe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Unless Sven is officially speaking for DirectFB I would like to hear > from others. Robin, I am a co-author of DirectFB and did large parts of the GTK+-DirectFB port. If someone can officially speak for GTK+-DirectFB than it's Dok and me. > > The GTK+ 1.2 codebase is dead and unmaintained; you are wasting your > > time. > > GTK1 is not dead, not unmaintained, and how I spend my time is my business. > > I'm not working on GTK 1.2. The current version on Windows is 1.3. The current stable version on Windows is the official GTK+-2.2.4 tarball. The people who wrote, improved and maintained GTK+-1.x declared it as dead and unmaintained. Of course you are free to pick up the project but you will have to accept that people have a hard time to understand why someone would want to do that. > > As you might know already, the GTK+-2.x platform provides a backend > > abstraction on the GDK layer. This makes it easy to port it to other > > windowing systems. The GTK+-1.x platform doesn't provide such an > > abstraction layer and any port would be substantially more effort. > > The GDK is an abstraction layer. GTK1 has been ported to many platforms. Sure, but GTK+-2.x provides a platform abstraction on the GDK level. If you ever looked at the GTK+-2.x code, you should have noticed that. Sven -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Michel, >... I agree with [Sven] on GTK+ 2 vs. 1, so hadn't he beaten me to > it, I would have asked Sven didn't beat you to it. He wasn't asking and doesn't care what I think. He is trying to tell people what projects not to work on. > ...why on Earth do you bother with GTK+ 1 instead of 2? Isn't this off-topic? Since you ask, my projects use GTK1 because that is what I inherited. None of the reasons offered for adopting GTK2 are compelling reasons for my situation. In fact, Sven advises abandoning all my projects. By that logic, I wouldn't need GTK2 or any toolkit. A couple months ago I tried to build GIMP 1.3 from source. I spent an entire Saturday on it, but did not suceed. I couldn't track down all the dependencies. Judging from the discussion on gimp-developer I am not alone. Folks there recently put forth the suggestion of distributing GIMP 1.3 binaries because so many people can't build it. That I can't even build the project that is its namesake doesn't encourage me to embrace GTK2. Many advise me to abandon GTK entirely, that Qt would be much more elegant. How would you feel if whenever you posted a technical question you got the same unsought advice from some nut telling you and everyone to abandon GTK? How many episodes would it take for that behavior to make your blood start to boil? For a year Sven has been saying to anyone who will listen that I should quit. It isn't as though my projects lack users or developers. We're growing rapidly. Where does Sven get off trying to tell me or anyone what open source projects to work on? What sort of person deliberately tries to kill someone else's open source project? And, why does the open source community put up with it? Cheers, Robin --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hollywood, California www.CinePaint.org Free motion picture and still image editing software -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Hi, "Robin Rowe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Since you ask, my projects use GTK1 because that is what I inherited. None > of the reasons offered for adopting GTK2 are compelling reasons for my > situation. In fact, Sven advises abandoning all my projects. By that logic, > I wouldn't need GTK2 or any toolkit. You must have misunderstood my points completely. I have always wished cine-paint all luck and I am following it's development with interest. I am however disappointed with the technical directions it is taking and I don't see why I shouldn't be allowed to state my opinion on this. The fact that cinepaint is sticking to an old version of GTK+ means basically makes it impossible to share any user interface code between GIMP and cine-paint. This is a pity since most probably both projects could benefit from this. I also don't understand why you prefer to reinvent the wheels instead of using the much advanced, well-maintained and widely used GTK+-2 platform. This diversion does IMO not do any good to the open source community. Since this is getting rather off-topic, I would suggest we stop this here. If you like to discuss any of this, I suggest we do so on the cinepaint-developer mailing-list. I am subscribed to it, so feel free to raise the topic there. Sven -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
According to your website you already have GTK 1.3 DirectFB integration. http://www.directfb.org/news/dok/gtk-contrib.xml Where do I get the source for that? By the way, when I try to download I notice there are many dead links on your downloads pages. Cheers, Robin --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hollywood, California www.CinePaint.org Free motion picture and still image editing software -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Hi, "Robin Rowe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > According to your website you already have GTK 1.3 DirectFB integration. The DirectFB port was developed based on the late GTK+-1.3 releases. The unstable 1.3 version were prereleases and are not any longer available on our web server. > http://www.directfb.org/news/dok/gtk-contrib.xml > > Where do I get the source for that? http://www.directfb.org/gtk.xml lists all current links. The source is available from our CVS server and there are snapshots at http://www.directfb.org/download/GTK+-DirectFB/. Sven -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
[directfb-dev] Re: GTK1 and DirectFB
Sven, > You must have misunderstood my points completely. I have always wished > cine-paint all luck and I am following it's development with > interest. So I misunderstand? Were you wishing us luck on September 10th in your post to gimp-user? Here's what you said, quoted in full: "All I can say is that this application (now called cine-paint) is based on film-gimp which was forked from GIMP around version 1.0. GIMP-1.0 is a piece of code from the stone age. Lacking an overall design concept, this code is full of bugs, depends on unmaintained and outdated libraries and lacks any features that have been introduced to The GIMP during the last five years. In my opinion it is a shame that some good hackers are wasting their time on this codebase." Sure you wish us luck, bad luck! > I am however disappointed with the technical directions it > is taking and I don't see why I shouldn't be allowed to state my > opinion on this. Stating your opinion, especially when sought, is free speech. Someone who provides relentless criticism is a critic. Someone who persists after being asked to stop is a heckler. Someone who tries to push others around is a bully. Robin --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hollywood, California www.CinePaint.org Free motion picture and still image editing software -- Info: To unsubscribe send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe directfb-dev" as subject.
