Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
uhm...what about a scrolling feature that,if the user accelerates, gradually zoomes out? in this way, you would scroll but at the same time you'll need to scroll less, since the more you do that the more the pages is visible in its entire height-width . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=36058 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
Teehan Lax has a nice exploration in the iPhone paging and incorporates zooming in their method. It probably doesnt have much application elsewhere but its an interesting approach: http://www.teehanlax.com/blog/?p=818 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=36058 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
[IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
It's been a classic design principle that any scrollable view should auto-scroll when an object is dragged outside or close to boundary of the view. Here's what Alan Cooper wrote in his About Face book: Auto-scroll is a very important adjunct to drag-and-drop. Wherever the drop target can possibly be scrolled offscreen, the program needs to auto-scroll. Any scrollable drag-and-drop target must auto-scroll. However I've suddenly realized that I've never seen any implementation of auto-scrolling (including my own :) that would not SUCK. Auto-scrolling is perhaps the most awkward feature associated with drag-and-drop that I would name. IMHO, auto-scrolling sucks because: 1. It lacks control over precision. Variable auto-scroll rate sucks because when I want to scroll faster (and I always do :), I often over-scroll. Then I need to drag the object to the opposite side of the screen and auto-scroll back. 2. It is not informative nor it is flexible. At the beginning, you don't see how far you may need to scroll, so I usually pick the fastest rate and over-scroll, as in 1. or have to wait too long if I take a low scroll rate. The transition from lower to faster scroll rates appears abruptly and often cause over-scrolling. 3. It is slow. First, you have to wait until it starts in vicinity of the view border, then wait until it scrolls with a particular speed. This all ends up in that with auto-scrolling I never feel comfortable and confident, but often strained and lacking control. This made me think about good alternatives to auto-scrolling. What do you think? Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
Two quick ideas for alternatives: - a zooming user interface would remove the need to scroll. With a zoom out, both origin and target of the drag-and-drop can be viewed at the same time no matter the distance between them. This would lack accuracy in selecting the target position, though, unless some form of semantic zooming is used. - replacing autoscroll with a list of possible targets (list elements, chapter titles...) - hovering over a target would instantly scroll to show that item. Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
Hi I use the auto-scroll feature (as I understand your def.) every day and find it works well for me. In Thunderbird (email) I have quite a few folders for tracking many projects, jobs, etc. One of my subfolders itself expands well beyond the height of the screen. With auto scroll, it's very easy to take an email and drag it from the inbox folder to a local subfolder. I find this quite intuitive to use- bit I am a techie at heart. Perhaps you meant something else? 'mark Sent from my iPhone On Dec 1, 2008, at 5:05 AM, Oleg Krupnov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's been a classic design principle that any scrollable view should auto-scroll when an object is dragged outside or close to boundary of the view. Here's what Alan Cooper wrote in his About Face book: Auto-scroll is a very important adjunct to drag-and-drop. Wherever the drop target can possibly be scrolled offscreen, the program needs to auto-scroll. Any scrollable drag-and-drop target must auto-scroll. However I've suddenly realized that I've never seen any implementation of auto-scrolling (including my own :) that would not SUCK. Auto-scrolling is perhaps the most awkward feature associated with drag-and-drop that I would name. IMHO, auto-scrolling sucks because: 1. It lacks control over precision. Variable auto-scroll rate sucks because when I want to scroll faster (and I always do :), I often over-scroll. Then I need to drag the object to the opposite side of the screen and auto-scroll back. 2. It is not informative nor it is flexible. At the beginning, you don't see how far you may need to scroll, so I usually pick the fastest rate and over-scroll, as in 1. or have to wait too long if I take a low scroll rate. The transition from lower to faster scroll rates appears abruptly and often cause over-scrolling. 3. It is slow. First, you have to wait until it starts in vicinity of the view border, then wait until it scrolls with a particular speed. This all ends up in that with auto-scrolling I never feel comfortable and confident, but often strained and lacking control. This made me think about good alternatives to auto-scrolling. What do you think? Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
A solution to the variable scroll speed might be to add a speed indicator along the scrolling edge. When the scrolling starts, place a scrolling indicator just below the cursor, and let the users move position the mouse a little further up/down on the indicator to adjust the speed. Downside: users might have a hard thime figuring out what that thingy underneath the cursor is. Andreas . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=36058 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
Oleg, well spotted - all auto-scroll implementations indeed do suck. While I can't recall any such example of the top of my head, a good alternative would be along the OS X Dock (enlarging focused icons) or some kind of loupe UI - ie. keep the whole context in one page in a scaled down version, and zoom a selected partial area to full-resolution to allow the drop. This removes the variable speed and opposite end of window to reverse direction problems you outlined. Jakub On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Oleg Krupnov [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: It's been a classic design principle that any scrollable view should auto-scroll when an object is dragged outside or close to boundary of the view. Here's what Alan Cooper wrote in his About Face book: Auto-scroll is a very important adjunct to drag-and-drop. Wherever the drop target can possibly be scrolled offscreen, the program needs to auto-scroll. Any scrollable drag-and-drop target must auto-scroll. However I've suddenly realized that I've never seen any implementation of auto-scrolling (including my own :) that would not SUCK. Auto-scrolling is perhaps the most awkward feature associated with drag-and-drop that I would name. IMHO, auto-scrolling sucks because: 1. It lacks control over precision. Variable auto-scroll rate sucks because when I want to scroll faster (and I always do :), I often over-scroll. Then I need to drag the object to the opposite side of the screen and auto-scroll back. 2. It is not informative nor it is flexible. At the beginning, you don't see how far you may need to scroll, so I usually pick the fastest rate and over-scroll, as in 1. or have to wait too long if I take a low scroll rate. The transition from lower to faster scroll rates appears abruptly and often cause over-scrolling. 3. It is slow. First, you have to wait until it starts in vicinity of the view border, then wait until it scrolls with a particular speed. This all ends up in that with auto-scrolling I never feel comfortable and confident, but often strained and lacking control. This made me think about good alternatives to auto-scrolling. What do you think? Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
How about sticking to auto-scrolling but removing the acceleration component. Often the acceleration is what confuses people as the dragged items speed up too much and users lose control. What about two fixed scroll speeds. One could have a reasonable scroll speed assigned to the default drag operation. The other could be a bit faster, and could be activated during a HOLD SHIFT event, for the more advanced / hasty people. ;) Cheers, Jakub . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=36058 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Is Auto-Scrolling Good?
I like the auto-zoom-out idea. Here's how to refine it: When you approach the view border, zoom out. When the user slows down/stops his mouse movement (after a delay of, say, 200 msec), zoom back in to allow precision placement. It hews to the user's mental (well, physical?) model -- look at the whole sheet when doing major reorganization, then get in close to carefully position. Would work well in a Visio/Photoshop/Illustrator-type situation, with a well-defined canvas... less so with the Thunderbird folder organization example. -Jonathan On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:24 PM, Jakub Linowski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How about sticking to auto-scrolling but removing the acceleration component. Often the acceleration is what confuses people as the dragged items speed up too much and users lose control. What about two fixed scroll speeds. One could have a reasonable scroll speed assigned to the default drag operation. The other could be a bit faster, and could be activated during a HOLD SHIFT event, for the more advanced / hasty people. ;) Cheers, Jakub . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=36058 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
