Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
Hi 2009/4/24 firasmail2...@yahoo.com: An easier path would be to look small processor boards such as those that support embedded Linux. For instance the web page for the Gumstix Overo Earth says it has a USB HS Host and a micro SD slot. (Not micro SDHC - so you are limited to, I think, 4Gb cards.) See: http://gumstix.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=31roducts_id=211 Thank you for your suggestion, but I'm looking for cheep and simple method to load USRP firmware. First I think you should verify that the USRP cannot permanently store firmware in some way, maybe even contact Matt Ettus? Programming for USB Host is unfortunately not simple, as it needs a whole comms stack. It requires several months programming to get all the functionality, though you can probably skip some parts for your dedicated support for a single device. But take it from someone who has done this you will have problems, and sooner or later you will need to purchase or rent a USB Analyser to debug the comms. (This cost was something like $2 the last time I needed one!) I think approx $150 for a board that runs Linux and you can be confident will do the job is a bargain. ;-) Probably there are lots of suppliers of boards for embedded Linux, I only mentioned one brand because I have heard good comments about their products. If you still decide you want to build your own USB Host you should at least get Jan Axelson's USB Complete book, which covers many of the practicalities. If you can find it, the Mindshare book on USB System Architecture by Don Anderson is easier to read than the official standards at the USB Implementers Forum (www.usb.org). Regards, Tony ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
First I think you should verify that the USRP cannot permanently store firmware in some way, maybe even contact Matt Ettus? There is no way to store the FPGA image on there. You can store only a very tiny cut down version of the FX2 firmware. Matt ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
Hi I don't yet know a lot about the USRP, but I do know about USB. The short answer is that the PIC 18F4550 processor will not help. USB needs a host (typically a PC) that times controls each data packet and a device to talk to. Optionally a hub is both a device and relay of timing data to further devices. Both the PIC processor and the USRP are devices, and cannot talk to each other. Also the USRP documentation says it needs USB2, which I think means it needs the High Speed data transfer of USB2. Whereas the PIC 18F4550 only supports the lower transfer speeds of USB1.1, and is USB2 compatible in the sense that it works with USB2 Hosts. Some of the 16-bit and 32-bit PIC processors have a USB Host port, or at least can operate a USB On-The-Go (OTG) port in host mode - but I'm not sure if they support High Speed (HS) mode, and you will need a lot of software to control the USB. An easier path would be to look small processor boards such as those that support embedded Linux. For instance the web page for the Gumstix Overo Earth says it has a USB HS Host and a micro SD slot. (Not micro SDHC - so you are limited to, I think, 4Gb cards.) See: http://gumstix.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=31products_id=211 Cheers, Tony 2009/4/24 Firas A. firasmail2...@yahoo.com: Hi, Has anyone tried to run USRP1 without PC? I have an application where a friend supported me with a standalone USRP FPGA image. I used the PC only to load this image to the USRP using gnuradio blocks/tools. After that I can plug-off (disconnect) the USB cable from the PC and USRP continue to operate standalone. My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? What it takes/need to do so? Best Regards, Firas -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Standalone-USRP1-Operation-tp23210804p23210804.html Sent from the GnuRadio mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
Hi, On Fri, 4/24/09, Tony Naggs tony.na...@googlemail.com wrote: The short answer is that the PIC 18F4550 processor will not help. USB needs a host (typically a PC) that times controls each data packet and a device to talk to. Optionally a hub is both a device and relay of timing data to further devices. Both the PIC processor and the USRP are devices, and cannot talk to each other. So USB device can only talk to USB Hub.Thanks for this clarification. Also the USRP documentation says it needs USB2, which I think means it needs the High Speed data transfer of USB2. Whereas the PIC 18F4550 only supports the lower transfer speeds of USB1.1 I mentioned PIC16F4550 as an example for mcu that has a USB port. Actually, I didn't checked whether it supports HS or FS (Sorry for bad example). An easier path would be to look small processor boards such as those that support embedded Linux. For instance the web page for the Gumstix Overo Earth says it has a USB HS Host and a micro SD slot. (Not micro SDHC - so you are limited to, I think, 4Gb cards.) See: http://gumstix.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=31roducts_id=211 Thank you for your suggestion, but I'm looking for cheep and simple method to load USRP firmware. Best Regards, Firas ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
Firas- Has anyone tried to run USRP1 without PC? I have an application where a friend supported me with a standalone USRP FPGA image. I used the PC only to load this image to the USRP using gnuradio blocks/tools. After that I can plug-off (disconnect) the USB cable from the PC and USRP continue to operate standalone. My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? What it takes/need to do so? Altera and Xilinx FPGAs can boot from a variety of small, cheap Flash devices. I haven't looked at the USRP1 schematic in a while, but my guess is that it would take only a few mods to deadbug an appropriate Flash device and jumper as needed. Looking at the board, I don't see that Matt has left a place for the typical header with the required signals, but there are only a few and they should be available on the CY7C680 pins. Programming the Flash device is another question: one way is a socket on the USRP1 and a cheap Flash programmer (connect to PC serial port or parallel port). -Jeff ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 23:43 -0700, Firas A. wrote: Hi, Has anyone tried to run USRP1 without PC? I have an application where a friend supported me with a standalone USRP FPGA image. I used the PC only to load this image to the USRP using gnuradio blocks/tools. After that I can plug-off (disconnect) the USB cable from the PC and USRP continue to operate standalone. My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? What it takes/need to do so? What should be possible is to load the FPGA image and/or the FX2 image using JTAG. I think I remember that the JTAG lines are accessible on the USRP1. It might also be possible to use a dedicated serial FPGA eeprom and connect it directly to the FPGA. This would require hardware modification of the USRP board. Just look at the cyclone datasheet and application notes on the altera site. I don't know if all the required pins for setting the FPGA load operation are physically reachable on the USRP1 board. If you don't want to solder on your board, your only option is using a USB2 host in some kind of form. Martin Best Regards, Firas ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 11:43:19PM -0700, Firas A. wrote: Hi, Has anyone tried to run USRP1 without PC? I have an application where a friend supported me with a standalone USRP FPGA image. I used the PC only to load this image to the USRP using gnuradio blocks/tools. After that I can plug-off (disconnect) the USB cable from the PC and USRP continue to operate standalone. My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? What it takes/need to do so? Best Regards, Firas Firas, This might work. The control end point works in both USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 mode. As long as you were only using that, you could probably get the FX2 image and the FPGA image loaded. It's worth a try. Eric ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Eric Blossom e...@comsec.com wrote: On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 11:43:19PM -0700, Firas A. wrote: My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? This might work. The control end point works in both USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 mode. As long as you were only using that, you could probably get the FX2 image and the FPGA image loaded. It's worth a try. Atmel has a similar part (AT90USB1287) and has a devkit, AT90USBKEY, that might save you some work. It's a USB OTG 2.0 device, $30, has the right dongle, and has a pair of 64Mbit flash chips on board. The power supply is spec'd to 8-15V, but might be coaxed to run off something lower. Digikey/Mouser/Arrow stocks 'em. R C ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Standalone USRP1 Operation
Robert Cicconetti wrote: On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Eric Blossom e...@comsec.com wrote: On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 11:43:19PM -0700, Firas A. wrote: My question is, has anyone tried to load USRP FPGA image without a PC? For example using a micro-controller (Like Microchip PIC 18F4550 which has USB 2.0 port) with SD memory holding the image? This might work. The control end point works in both USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 mode. As long as you were only using that, you could probably get the FX2 image and the FPGA image loaded. It's worth a try. Atmel has a similar part (AT90USB1287) and has a devkit, AT90USBKEY, that might save you some work. It's a USB OTG 2.0 device, $30, has the right dongle, and has a pair of 64Mbit flash chips on board. The power supply is spec'd to 8-15V, but might be coaxed to run off something lower. Digikey/Mouser/Arrow stocks 'em. You might find a lower cost solution, but by the time you get it working, you may have been better off using the over. I have downloaded firmware from the Overo to the USRP via USB. The bonus is you can run gnuradio on the Overo if needed. Philip smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature ___ Discuss-gnuradio mailing list Discuss-gnuradio@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
