Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  closed
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:  fixed
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by Tim Graham ):

 In [changeset:"5c7406b236b641ac1802d1471f04b27166909121"]:
 {{{
 #!CommitTicketReference repository=""
 revision="5c7406b236b641ac1802d1471f04b27166909121"
 [1.5.X] Fixed #16671 - Added a tutorial on reuseable apps

 Thank-you Katie Miller and Ben Sturmfels for the initial draft,
 as well as Russ and Carl for the reviews.

 Backport of 08cf54990a from master
 }}}

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  closed
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:  fixed
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by Tim Graham ):

 * status:  new => closed
 * resolution:   => fixed


Comment:

 In [changeset:"08cf54990ae112083b159aa4e263c1f64f396f39"]:
 {{{
 #!CommitTicketReference repository=""
 revision="08cf54990ae112083b159aa4e263c1f64f396f39"
 Fixed #16671 - Added a tutorial on reuseable apps

 Thank-you Katie Miller and Ben Sturmfels for the initial draft,
 as well as Russ and Carl for the reviews.
 }}}

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by timo):

 * needs_better_patch:  1 => 0


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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 Updates:

 * Updated language for setuptools vs. distribute per Carl's suggestion
 * Removed link to "state of python packaging" due to inaccuracies.
 * Removed `install_requires=['distribute']` from setup.py
 * Updated `open('README.txt')` to allow executing setup.py from any
 directory
 * Made language regarding what files are included by default more specific
 per Carl's suggestion

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by carljm):

 Looks like even distutils itself is built to assume that setup.py is in
 the current working directory. Interesting, I didn't realize that. I think
 I'd never tried to actually run sdist or install from a different
 directory, only simple metadata-getting commands (`python setup.py
 egg_info` or e.g. `python setup.py --long-description`).

 That definitely reduces the importance of point 4, but I still think it's
 worth doing this the robust way, because at least then a few more (simple)
 uses of setup.py will work from a different directory. I've definitely
 seen real bugs filed against real packages because the handling of
 `README.txt` wasn't robust against execution from a different directory.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 With `packages=['polls']`:
 {{{
 sudo python django-polls-0.1/setup.py install
 running install
 Checking .pth file support in /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/
 /usr/bin/python -E -c pass
 TEST PASSED: /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ appears to support
 .pth files
 running bdist_egg
 running egg_info
 creating django_polls.egg-info
 writing django_polls.egg-info/PKG-INFO
 writing top-level names to django_polls.egg-info/top_level.txt
 writing dependency_links to django_polls.egg-info/dependency_links.txt
 writing manifest file 'django_polls.egg-info/SOURCES.txt'
 warning: manifest_maker: standard file 'setup.py' not found

 error: package directory 'polls' does not exist
 }}}

 It may be a path issue.  For example, if I rename `django-polls-0.1` to
 `django-polls` and then modify setup.py to `packages=['django-
 polls/polls']` it works; of course, this breaks it when running setup.py
 in the django-polls directory.

 Yes, if I add:
 {{{
 my_path = os.path.abspath(__file__)
 os.chdir(os.path.normpath(os.path.join(my_path, os.pardir)))
 }}}

 after `here=os.path.dirname...` in setup.py, I can run setup.py from any
 path. Fun, fun.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by carljm):

 Replying to [comment:30 timo]:
 > In trying to address the fourth bullet point, I updated long_description
 as you suggested but the package still doesn't install properly when
 running setup.py outside django-polls-0.1:
 > ...
 > A directory is created: /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-
 packages/django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg
 > but the polls subdirectory is missing.

 Interesting, I've never seen that. My first guess would be that it's a bug
 in `find_packages`? I generally don't use that, even when using
 setuptools/distribute, I just list packages explicitly. Does removing
 `find_packages` fix it?

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 In trying to address the fourth bullet point, I updated long_description
 as you suggested but the package still doesn't install properly when
 running setup.py outside django-polls-0.1:

 {{{
 $ sudo python django-polls-0.1/setup.py install
 running install
 Checking .pth file support in /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/
 /usr/bin/python -E -c pass
 TEST PASSED: /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ appears to support
 .pth files
 running bdist_egg
 running egg_info
 writing django_polls.egg-info/PKG-INFO
 writing top-level names to django_polls.egg-info/top_level.txt
 writing dependency_links to django_polls.egg-info/dependency_links.txt
 warning: manifest_maker: standard file 'setup.py' not found

 reading manifest file 'django_polls.egg-info/SOURCES.txt'
 writing manifest file 'django_polls.egg-info/SOURCES.txt'
 installing library code to build/bdist.linux-i686/egg
 running install_lib
 warning: install_lib: 'build/lib.linux-i686-2.7' does not exist -- no
 Python modules to install

 creating build/bdist.linux-i686/egg
 creating build/bdist.linux-i686/egg/EGG-INFO
 copying django_polls.egg-info/PKG-INFO -> build/bdist.linux-i686/egg/EGG-
 INFO
 copying django_polls.egg-info/SOURCES.txt -> build/bdist.linux-i686/egg
 /EGG-INFO
 copying django_polls.egg-info/dependency_links.txt ->
 build/bdist.linux-i686/egg/EGG-INFO
 copying django_polls.egg-info/top_level.txt -> build/bdist.linux-i686/egg
 /EGG-INFO
 zip_safe flag not set; analyzing archive contents...
 creating 'dist/django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg' and adding
 'build/bdist.linux-i686/egg' to it
 removing 'build/bdist.linux-i686/egg' (and everything under it)
 Processing django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg
 creating /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg
 Extracting django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg to /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-
 packages
 Adding django-polls 0.1 to easy-install.pth file

 Installed /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-
 packages/django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg
 Processing dependencies for django-polls==0.1
 Finished processing dependencies for django-polls==0.1
 }}}

 A directory is created: /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-
 packages/django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg
 but the polls subdirectory is missing.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by carljm):

 Some comments on the updated draft:

 * Per its author, setuptools is not defunct, and he has made fixes in it
 since the distribute fork, so I think it's needlessly partisan to refer to
 it as "defunct" and claim that it has "bugs which will never be fixed." I
 recommend this alternative description of distribute: "It's a community-
 maintained fork of the older setuptools project." (Also, there's a
 mismatched parenthesis at the end of that sentence currently).

 * I'm -0.5 on linking to the "state of Python packaging" diagram from the
 Hitchhiker's Guide, as it has some factual errors (pip doesn't work
 directly with distutils, it relies on setuptools/distribute) and makes
 assertions which at this point remain far from clear (i.e. that
 setuptools/distribute are headed for the dustbin, even though today they
 remain by far the most-used Python packaging tools, or even that
 distutils2 is headed for the stdlib - it was removed from Python 3.3 and
 so far there's been no movement to reintroduce it for Python 3.4, rather
 pieces of it are being rewritten under yet another name, "distlib"). On
 the other hand, I appreciate the attractiveness of having something simple
 to link to that demonstrates just how muddled things are, and I don't have
 a replacement link target to recommend in that role.

 * Including distribute (or setuptools) in the `install_requires` in
 `setup.py` is wrong (unless your package actually imports and uses
 "setuptools" or "pkg_resources" at runtime - not in setup.py but in the
 actual packaged code - which the "polls" app does not). The note below
 claims that "the install_requires line ensure that distribute will be
 installed for anyone who is installing our package" but this is not true -
 if someone doesn't have setuptools or distribute installed to begin with,
 setup.py won't even run long enough to get to the `install_requires`,
 it'll raise `ImportError` on the first line. And having `distribute` in
 `install_requires` means that if a user has setuptools installed,
 installing your package will forcibly replace it with distribute, which is
 really unfriendly - the point of distribute being a drop-in replacement is
 that your package should work equally well for people using setuptools or
 distribute, and should not enforce one choice or the other on your users.

 * Using `open('README.txt').read()` as the value of `long_description`
 will break if `setup.py` is executed from outside the current directory
 (e.g. `python django-polls/setup.py install`). For this to be reliable, an
 `import os` is needed up top, then a `here =
 os.path.dirname(os.path.abspath(__file__))`, then
 `long_description=open(os.path.join(here, 'README.txt')).read()`.

 * The line "only a limited set of files are included in the package by
 default" could be made more specific: "only Python modules and packages
 are included in the package by default."

 Otherwise, looks good to me!

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by BinaryKhaos):

 * cc: BinaryKhaos (added)


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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by russellm):

 I'm happy keeping the link to djangopackages.com; it's a reasonably robust
 part of the community, and we can start negotiations with Danny about
 making the arrangement a little more formal.

 And yes, my objection was to the tutorial05 part in the URL. If that's
 just a build artefact, that's fine - I just raising it in case it was the
 proposed location in the source tree.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 Updates:
 * Added a note in tutorial 3 regarding app-level template directories.
 * Added an example of how template names could collide to the "Why nested"
 note.
 * Changed from distutils to distribute and pip.
 * Added a step of creating a license file
 * Added trove classifiers to setup.py
 * Removed link to Eric's blog post - if someone wants to add documentation
 on best practices it can be a separate ticket.

 Other Notes:
 * Since we switched to using distribute, it looks like Carl's point about
 redundancy between MANIFEST.in and package_data is moot.
 * The updated doc is http://techytim.com/django/tutorial05/intro/reusable-
 apps.html

 Todo:
 * Should we keep the link to djangopackages.com?
 * Russ, regarding the URL, I'm assuming you didn't like the 'intro' bit?
 Since this follows from tutorial 4, I felt like moving it to a whole new
 top level like /advanced-tutorials/reuseable-apps/ might be a bit too much
 (we won't get any next/previous links to and from tutorial 4) so I opted
 for /intro/reusable-apps/. I'm open to suggestions if you still don't like
 it.  (And I just realized that maybe you saw tutorial05 in the url where I
 posted the built docs which is just a folder on my server where I put
 this.)

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by timo):

 * needs_better_patch:  0 => 1


Comment:

 Thanks for the feedback, I'll work to incorporate these suggestions.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by russellm):

 One other piece of feedback - I'm in complete agreement that this is
 really "advanced tutorial 1" rather than "tutorial 5"; so when committed,
 the tutorial URL should probably reflect that.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by carljm):

 Agreed, this is looking great.

 I don't have clarity on how best to both keep it simple and recommend best
 practices in the morass of confusion that is Python packaging, when it
 comes to recommending distutils vs distribute. You can't really recommend
 distribute without explaining that it's a third-party package, not part of
 the Python standard library, meaning that you're preventing people who
 don't have it from installing your package - but at the same time, in
 practice everybody has it, so that's not really a problem. But that's an
 awful lot of extra potentially-very-confusing information to try to
 squeeze in (not to mention explaining _why_ you'd use distribute rather
 than the stdlib option), all of which argues for just using distutils.

 The main problem I see is in recommending distutils and recommending
 "python setup.py install" in the same tutorial - because that's the one
 path that means no useful metadata is installed along with the package,
 and therefore automated uninstall is not possible (pip is not able to
 uninstall packages installed in this way). When you add in "sudo", it
 means our tutorial is telling people to install a test package as the root
 user, to their system site-packages, in such a way that it can't be
 removed without manually sudoing and using "rm -rf". That's...
 unfortunate. We have three choices (use distutils, demonstrate "python
 setup.py install", default to "sudo" rather than virtualenv) which I think
 are all individually the right choice for simplicity's sake, but the
 combination has a sub-optimal result. If we had to change any of those
 three, I'd probably go for switching from distutils to distribute.

 Regardless, if the tutorial tells them to "sudo python setup.py install",
 I think we need to tell them how they can uninstall it. If we use
 distribute, we can just link to pip and say "pip can uninstall this." If
 we stick with distutils, we have to tell them they'd need to manually
 "sudo rm -rf" the polls directory (which they can find as demonstrated, by
 importing polls and checking `polls.__file__`).

 One other note - in Python 2.7 it is no longer necessary to redundantly
 add files to MANIFEST.in that are listed in `package_data` (in this case,
 the templates). That was a bug in distutils in Python 2.6 and previous
 that was fixed in Python 2.7. I guess as long as we support 2.6 we should
 probably demonstrate a 2.6-compatible technique, but I wonder if it's
 worth a brief aside to note the redundancy, and that you don't need it if
 generating the sdist using Python 2.7. In any case, whenever Django drops
 2.6 support this should be changed.

 And lastly: if we keep the link to Eric's article, his last name is
 spelled "Holscher".

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by russellm):

 Another good looking documentation addition. Some notes:

  * The shoutout to djangopackages.com -- I agree this is the best resource
 in this particular space at the moment -- but that's *at the moment*.
 There have been others in the past, and as a project, we dont' have any
 guarantees that djangopackages will be around next week. This may be a
 case of something that we need to fix at a project level by formalizing
 the relationship with djangopackages, rather than changing the text here.

  * In crossover from my comments on #18715; The introduction of app-level
 template directories seems more appropriate here, but it might still be
 worth a shoutout in Tutorial 3 letting people know that this option exists
 (even if you don't go into details)

  * The "Why nested" note -- an example would help here. Show how a
 template name like "base.html" would easily collide between apps.

  * Regarding distutils vs distribute: This is one of those areas where I
 think Django has a responsibility to be a community leader. The
 [http://guide.python-distribute.org Hitchhikers guide to Python Packaging]
 (which is itself worth a callout in the docs) recommends distribute; and
 everything I've seen says that the features of distribute will ultimately
 become part of distutils2; it seems to me that recommending distribute is
 the right thing to do here. AFAIK, the only reason Django itself doesn't
 use distribute is historical; setuptools had some pathological behavior
 back in the day, and nobody has had enough of an itch to make the change.
 Call this a +0 for distribute from me.

  * The packaging says to create a README; it doesn't say create a LICENSE
 file. We *must* say this. Code without a license is *useless*. Simliarly,
 the setup.py file doesn't specify a license definition. By way of
 communtiy guidance, we can say "Django, and many Django-compatible apps
 are distributed under the BSD license; however, you're free to pick your
 own license. However, be aware that your licensing choice will affect who
 is able to use your code".

  * The setup.py also doesn't mention any trove classifiers. It should. At
 the very least, we should be able to say:
 {{{
 'Environment :: Web Environment',
 'Framework :: Django',
 'Intended Audience :: Developers',
 'License :: OSI Approved :: BSD License',
 'Operating System :: OS Independent',
 'Programming Language :: Python',
 'Programming Language :: Python :: 2.6',
 'Programming Language :: Python :: 2.7',
 'Topic :: Internet :: WWW/HTTP',
 'Topic :: Internet :: WWW/HTTP :: Dynamic Content',
 }}}

  * Again, I'm a little hesitant to link out to third-party blogs and
 projects in the "more about" section. If we need to elaborate best
 practices, I'd say we should distil Eric's blog post into a couple of
 paragraphs of best practices; if we need to link to a list of packages,
 djangopackages.com would seem a better candidate (with the caveat from
 above).

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by timo):

 * cc: timograham@… (added)
 * needs_better_patch:  1 => 0


Comment:

 Thanks for the feedback guys.  I've updated the patch in the following
 ways:

 * Included this as a separate "Advanced tutorial" rather than simply
 "Tutorial 5"
 * Added text and/or links to answer questions like:
   * What's the purpose of setup.py?
   * What does the MANIFEST.in file do and why is it there?
   * Does every reusable app for Django have to have django- in front of
 the directory name?

 * Added a note that discusses naming conventions of packages.

 * Added links to a couple more resources like readthedocs and
 djangopackages.com

 You can view the HTML here:
 http://techytim.com/django/tutorial05/intro/reusable_apps.html

 Since Django itself uses distutils and we have a tested patch using that,
 I think it makes to stick with that over distribute, although I am open to
 +1/-1 from any core devs.

 The patch is based on the patch for #18715 Tutorial 3 refactor. Would
 appreciate a second set of eyes on that as well if you are interested.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  1
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by timo):

 * needs_better_patch:  0 => 1


Comment:

 I think positioning this as an "advanced tutorial" and incorporating some
 of the feedback above, as well as from the thread on django-developers*
 makes sense.

 * https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/django-
 developers/I3uUlt2UdT4

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by akaariai):

 I can see the problem of putting this into Tutorial 5. This stuff is
 really advanced if all you wanted was creating a simple web app. For that
 purpose "Tutorial 5: How to use reusable apps others wrote" would be much
 better.

 So, could this be "Advanced tutorial: How to write reusable apps" or
 something like that.

 One sign of problem is that I can't actually review the content of this
 tutorial for correctness, as I don't know the stuff this tutorial is
 introducing (I probably should, but that is another matter). Is this
 really something a newbie needs to be exposed on day 1?

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by danols):

 * cc: ognajd@… (added)


Comment:

 I am +1 on this. One of the biggest challenges I faced when starting with
 Django is figuring out how to structure my projects/app and this tutorial
 clearly helps with that. Thank you to the authors working on this.

 I suggest it ought to use `distribute` which is a replacement for
 `setup_tools` which was a successor for `distuitls` - python package
 installation landscape is hairy to say the least:
 [http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6344076/differences-between-
 distribute-distutils-and-setuptools Differences between distribute,
 distutils and setuptools?]. I suggest the following `setup.py`.
 {{{
 from setuptools import setup, find_packages

 setup(
 install_requires=['distribute'], # let's require the successor to
 setuptools
 name='django-polls',
 version='0.1',
 packages=find_packages(),
 include_package_data=True, # this will use MANIFEST.in during install
 where we specify additional files
 license='',
 description=package.__doc__.strip(),
 long_description=open('README.txt').read(),
 url='http://www.example.com/',
 author='Your Name',
 author_email='yourn...@example.com',
 )
 }}}
 I am torn between using very explicit `package_data` or the
 `include_package_data` and `MANIFEST.in` to specify additional directories
 files. Former is more python however personally and from
 [http://danielsokolowski.blogspot.ca/2012/08/setuptools-
 includepackagedata-option.html experience] I settled on the latter as that
 is the only way to include root package files like `README.txt` and is the
 simplest - [http://packages.python.org/distribute/setuptools.html
 #including-data-files Including Data Files].

 {{{
 include LICENSE
 include README.rst
 recursive-include polls/templates *
 recursive-include docs *
 }}}

 Also let's link to http://packages.python.org/distribute/index.html in the
 tutorial

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by tswicegood):

 Just read through the tutorial.  It looks good, but I don't know if it's
 the right thing to be teaching to someone at this point in their Django
 career.  Reusable apps are something I would consider an advanced topic to
 be included as the final tutorial entry, if the topic belongs there at
 all.  If you look at who the tutorial is geared at (someone definitely new
 to Django, but probably also new to Python), this tutorial is going to
 leave them scratching their head.  What does in to the `setup.py`?  (Can I
 include my own URL, or does it have to be example.com?  Does every
 reusable app for Django have to have `django-` in front of the directory
 name?)  What does the `MANIFEST.in` file do and why is it there?  (Do
 `.in` files have some special meaning in Python in general?  Can they do
 other things?)

 In it's current state, I'm -1.  I think this is a good foundation, but it
 needs to be fleshed out quiet a bit before it should be merged.  I'm also
 -0 on whether reusable apps should be part 5 of the tutorial.  I think
 tutorial 4's current list of next topics provides a really good starting
 point for further tutorials and that this is best left to a final spot or
 possibly even as part of the main documentation rather than the tutorial.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Very minor additional changes:

 * use url function in README rather than tuple - seems this is now the
 default approach for new projects
 * change "cd django-polls" to "cd django-polls-0.1"

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 Looks good.  Trying again, yes, it looks like the TEMPLATE_DIRS change
 isn't needed.

 Made a couple tweaks:
 "In the Tutorial 3" -> "In Tutorial 3"
 Under the virtualenv section, it says "This has some" and looks like
 "disadvantages" got lost (added back).

 I've built this and stuck it up a server temporarily for review.  I'm
 going to email django-developers so we can get some final feedback.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Replying to answer my own question - the following looks like a neater
 approach:


 {{{
 from distutils.core import setup

 setup(
 name='django-polls',
 version='0.1',
 packages=['polls'],
 package_data={'polls': ['templates/polls/*']},
 license='',
 long_description=open('README.txt').read(),
 url='http://www.example.com/',
 author='Your Name',
 author_email='yourn...@example.com',
 )
 }}}

 Please let me know if there's a better approach.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Also, I just noticed that while the templates directory is included in the
 package, it's not installed when I run `python setup.py install`.

 After some hunting, I learnt that one way to ensure the templates are
 installed is to use `packages=setuptools.find_packages()` and
 `include_package_data=True` in my setup.py file as follows:

 {{{
 from distutils.core import setup
 from setuptools import find_packages

 setup(
 name='django-polls',
 version='0.1',
 packages=find_packages(),
 license='',
 long_description=open('README.txt').read(),
 url='http://www.example.com/',
 author='Your Name',
 author_email='yourn...@example.com',
 include_package_data=True,
 )
 }}}

 Is this the approach you would recommend? I'm not very experienced with
 packaging and noticed that the install behaved differently using after
 making these changes -- the installed files ended up in
 `django_polls-0.1-py2.7.egg` and `easy-install.pth` rather than the
 previous `polls` and `django_polls-0.1.egg-info`.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Thanks for your notes Tim. Also looking forward to getting this in!

 Regarding 1: I've just run through the dev version tutorials 1-4 and
 didn't find I needed to modify `settings.TEMPLATE_DIRS`. If you have
 `'django.template.loaders.app_directories.Loader',` in your
 `settings.TEMPLATE_LOADERS` (the default), the templates should be found
 by Django when moved inside `polls/templates/polls`. Have I missed
 something?

 Regarding 2: I've added a note about the `docs` directory not being
 included if empty, thanks.

 Regarding 3: I've used the example you mentioned in comment 11 to describe
 how to find package files to delete.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 I'll add that for dist-packages the command in the link I noted above
 output "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages" while polls was actually
 installed in "/usr/local/lib/python2.7".  I discovered the actual location
 by running this command:

 {{{
 >>> import polls
 >>> polls
 
 }}}

 So perhaps that should be recommended as an alternative?

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by timo):

 Hey Ben & Katie,

 This has sat for a long while and I'd like to try to get this committed!
 Couple of comments:

 1. When I move the templates polls directory into the app folder, I had to
 add '/dir/to/mysite/' to settings.TEMPLATE_DIRS, previously I had only
 /path/to/mysite/mytemplates/ there.

 2. The django-polls/docs isn't included in the package even though it's
 included in MANIFEST.in unless it has a file in it.  Perhaps a note could
 be added about that.

 3. Rather than suggest possible directories for dist/site-packages, use
 the command noted here:
 https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/install/#remove-any-old-
 versions-of-django

 Nice work!

 Tim

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Just spoken to Russell at PyCon Australia sprints. He suggests that
 testing should be a separate tutorial of its own, rather than extending
 this one.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  SVN
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 Regarding tests, a doc test or unit test on
 `models.Poll.was_published_today` might be a useful example. What other
 tests do you think should be added?

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  SVN
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+

Comment (by stumbles):

 I've added necessary instructions to include templates directory in the
 package. For illustrative purposes, I think it is useful to show the
 reader how to include the templates.

 The alternative would be to:

 * remove the templates directory
 * remove the "Completing your reusable app" section of the tutorial
 * explain to the reader that people may find the templates too site-
 specific and difficult to override and that it may be better not to
 include them at all
 * get the reader to add instructions to the package on how to write
 templates

 Plus it's no longer self-contained, so not quite as satisfying.

 Sure it may not be best practise to include templates, but to teach the
 basic concepts, I think this is an acceptable compromise.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  SVN
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by kmike):

 * cc: kmike84@… (added)


Comment:

 Good work! Some notes:

 * Templates won't be included in distribution (they should be added to
 package_data in setup.py);
 * but I think it is bad idea to include templates in polls app because
 they usually tend to be too site-specific and overriding bundled templates
 is not always obvious;
 * a couple of simple tests are must for a reusable app.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  SVN
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by stumbles):

 * version:  1.3 => SVN


Comment:

 I've now updated the project layout of this tutorial to match the changes
 in Django 1.4. I also repeated the previous tutorials again myself which
 helped clarify a few issues, such as where the project-wide templates
 directory will be after completing tutorials 1-4.

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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+
 Reporter:  stumbles   |Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  New feature|   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation  |  Version:  1.3
 Severity:  Normal |   Resolution:
 Keywords: | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  1  |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0  |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0  |UI/UX:  0
---+
Changes (by stumbles):

 * needs_better_patch:  1 => 0


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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+---
   Reporter:  stumbles |  Owner:  ben@…
   Type:  New feature  | Status:  new
  Milestone:   |  Component:  Documentation
Version:  1.3  |   Severity:  Normal
 Resolution:   |   Keywords:
   Triage Stage:  Accepted |  Has patch:  1
Needs documentation:  0|Needs tests:  0
Patch needs improvement:  1|  Easy pickings:  0
  UI/UX:  0|
---+---
Changes (by taavi223):

 * cc: taavi@… (added)


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Re: [Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+---
   Reporter:  stumbles |  Owner:  ben@…
   Type:  New feature  | Status:  new
  Milestone:   |  Component:  Documentation
Version:  1.3  |   Severity:  Normal
 Resolution:   |   Keywords:
   Triage Stage:  Accepted |  Has patch:  1
Needs documentation:  0|Needs tests:  0
Patch needs improvement:  1|  Easy pickings:  0
  UI/UX:  0|
---+---
Changes (by aaugustin):

 * needs_better_patch:   => 1
 * stage:  Unreviewed => Accepted
 * type:  Uncategorized => New feature
 * needs_tests:   => 0
 * needs_docs:   => 0


Comment:

 This is a good addition to the docs.

 I skimmed through the patch and I suggest the following improvements:

 - Remove the TODO (to the best of my knowledge, the answer is "it can't be
 done")
 - Warn before installing the app globally, since it can be unsettling for
 beginners to remove it directly from site-packages, and explain how to
 uninstall it.
 - Remove the "Coming soon" section — those additional parts have been
 "coming soon" for years and nobody's about to write them.

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[Django] #16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app

[Django]

#16671: 5th tutorial on turning Polls into a reusable app
---+---
 Reporter:  stumbles   |  Owner:  ben@…
 Type:  Uncategorized  | Status:  new
Milestone: |  Component:  Documentation
  Version:  1.3|   Severity:  Normal
 Keywords: |   Triage Stage:  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1  |  Easy pickings:  0
UI/UX:  0  |
---+---
 Katie Miller and I have been sprinting to create a tutorial to cover:

 * reusable apps
 * turning Polls into a reusable app
 * Python packaging
 * publishing your package

 First draft attached.

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