Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  closed
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:  fixed
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Ready for
 |  checkin
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-
Changes (by Tim Graham ):

 * status:  assigned => closed
 * resolution:   => fixed


Comment:

 In [changeset:"3653466bdf211ca603ec976c28d4a8da566dc671" 3653466b]:
 {{{
 #!CommitTicketReference repository=""
 revision="3653466bdf211ca603ec976c28d4a8da566dc671"
 Fixed #24732 -- Reordered tutorial to cover basics before bells and
 whistles.
 }}}

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
The Web framework for perfectionists with deadlines.

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Ready for
 |  checkin
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-
Changes (by timgraham):

 * has_patch:  0 => 1
 * stage:  Accepted => Ready for checkin


Comment:

 Final review to be done tomorrow.

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
The Web framework for perfectionists with deadlines.

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by dirtycoder):

 Splitted the admin part in two so it's easier for the reader follow along
 without be intimidated by the admin customization, I also made a few minor
 changes to the text to reflect the new order and while I was there, also
 added some missing links.

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Django 
The Web framework for perfectionists with deadlines.

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by dirtycoder):

 @carljm the PR is here: https://github.com/django/django/pull/4665

 It's correct? I'll be off for two days, I'm back next week.

 Thank you for the tips and patience.

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Django 
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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by carljm):

 @dirtycoder Great! Can you make a pull request of your changes? It's OK if
 it's still a work-in-progress, you can note that in the title/description
 of the pull request; it just makes it easier to review and comment on the
 diff. You can always push more commits to the branch and the PR will
 automatically update. Thanks!

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by dirtycoder):

 @carljm My fork is at: https://github.com/dirtycoder/django

 Part 1 of the tutorial is "finished", I'm reading the whole tutorial again
 and following the instructions so it will take a few days to finish it.

 I needed to make some minor charges to reflect the new order of some
 parts. I also think the first introduction to the Admin should live
 somewhere before the tests part, leaving only the look and feel
 customization to the end. Thoughts?

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
-+-
 Reporter:  carljm   |Owner:
 Type:   |  dirtycoder
  Cleanup/optimization   |   Status:  assigned
Component:  Documentation|  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1|UI/UX:  0
-+-
Changes (by dirtycoder):

 * owner:  nobody => dirtycoder
 * status:  new => assigned


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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
--+
 Reporter:  carljm|Owner:  nobody
 Type:  Cleanup/optimization  |   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal|   Resolution:
 Keywords:| Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0 |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0 |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1 |UI/UX:  0
--+

Comment (by dirtycoder):

 Awesome, thanks for the reply.
 I'll start working on it today.


 If anyone does not appear contrary to that decision, I'll also move the
 simple request/response part before the database setup and add a note
 about the migration warning.

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
--+
 Reporter:  carljm|Owner:  nobody
 Type:  Cleanup/optimization  |   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal|   Resolution:
 Keywords:| Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0 |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0 |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1 |UI/UX:  0
--+

Comment (by carljm):

 Oh, I missed your comment about the unapplied migrations warning. Hmm.
 Maybe that is sufficient reason to do database stuff first. Though I also
 think a note saying "ignore the warning about unapplied database
 migrations for now; we'll deal with the database shortly" could be
 adequate.

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
The Web framework for perfectionists with deadlines.

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
--+
 Reporter:  carljm|Owner:  nobody
 Type:  Cleanup/optimization  |   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal|   Resolution:
 Keywords:| Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0 |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0 |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1 |UI/UX:  0
--+

Comment (by carljm):

 Yes, I'd be in favor of having the tutorial cover simple request/response
 processing before it even discusses database setup. I've heard from more
 than one person that having to figure out database setup right away
 (before even seeing how basic request handling works) turned them off the
 tutorial.

 With modern Django the startproject template generates a working SQLite
 config, so it's not necessary to dive into database setup before doing
 anything else, as it used to be.

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Ticket URL: 
Django 
The Web framework for perfectionists with deadlines.

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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
--+
 Reporter:  carljm|Owner:  nobody
 Type:  Cleanup/optimization  |   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal|   Resolution:
 Keywords:| Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0 |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0 |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1 |UI/UX:  0
--+

Comment (by dirtycoder):

 Great! :)

 @carljm I agree with your comment about part 3, as a beginner who also
 have pointed others beginners to the tutorial I was often asked about this
 point. Some questions about Django being *only* suited for applications
 using heavy database stuff.
 I think we should provide the first portion of gratification as soon as
 possible in the tutorial, so anyone starting will see the 'Hello World'
 message and feel more motivated to dive in.

 Maybe we could move this simple view part even before the 'Database
 setup'?

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Ticket URL: 
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Re: [Django] #24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles (was: Remove most admin customization details from the tutorial)

[Django]

#24732: Reorder tutorial to cover basics before bells and whistles
--+
 Reporter:  carljm|Owner:  nobody
 Type:  Cleanup/optimization  |   Status:  new
Component:  Documentation |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal|   Resolution:
 Keywords:| Triage Stage:  Accepted
Has patch:  0 |  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0 |  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  1 |UI/UX:  0
--+

Comment (by carljm):

 Re-titling the ticket to reflect the intent to reorder the tutorial, not
 remove content from it.

 While we're reordering the tutorial, I also think we should move the first
 bit of part 3 (writing your first simple view, without reference to
 templates or models) before diving into writing a model. Django is a web
 framework, which means its fundamental task is to take HTTP requests and
 return responses, so that should be the first thing covered in the
 tutorial. Models and templates are both secondary; they just provide
 assistance in performing the core task. Thoughts?

 @dirtycoder I wouldn't "reserve" the ticket (by assigning it to yourself)
 until you actually begin work on it. If someone comes along tomorrow and
 decides to tackle it, and you haven't started yet, they should be free to
 do so. But as aaugustin says, this is quite unlikely; chances are very
 good this ticket will still be sitting here waiting for you in a couple
 weeks :-)

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