Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  closed
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:  wontfix
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Aymeric Augustin):

 For future reference, I think Jon's analysis was interesting and I could
 support a well-designed plan to remove all dummy backends (if there are
 tangible benefits).

 Yes, there's an expectations that developers will install test
 requirements. I've seen most contributors do so easily at sprints. The
 "run tests without dependencies" argument is obsolete.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  closed
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:  wontfix
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-
Changes (by Jon Dufresne):

 * status:  new => closed
 * resolution:   => wontfix


Comment:

 It sounds like there is a preference for keeping the backend. I'll close
 this and the PR to reflect this.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Tim Graham):

 I think the dummy backends have some usefulness. It seems to me we need
 some way to represent "nothing configured" for things like database,
 email, and cache.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Jon Dufresne):

 > ensuring consistency with other pluggable backends, as explained by
 Adam; if we're going to remove it, we should also remove other dummy
 backends;

 These other dummy backends are currently either documented or used.

 The dummy cache backend is documented at:

 {{{
 ./docs/ref/settings.txt:151:*
 ``'django.core.cache.backends.dummy.DummyCache'``
 ./docs/topics/cache.txt:336:Dummy caching (for development)
 }}}

 On these pages the backend is recommended for use in development/testing.
 Personally, I'm a bit unconvinced that using a different cache backend for
 development/testing is the best idea -- for the same reasons that using a
 different database backend is bad idea -- as subtle implementation
 differences won't be noticed until deployed to production. I guess that is
 besides the point. However, I think this development/testing use case
 could easily be replaced by the locmem backend in the documentation.
 Therefore, if its removal is also desired, I think it could be safely
 deprecated and removed in time.


 The dummy email backend is documented at:

 {{{
 ./docs/topics/email.txt:552:Dummy backend
 }}}

 Upon inspection, its purpose seems mostly -- if not entirely -- a
 duplicate of the locmem backend. Therefore, if its removal is also
 desired, I think it could be safely deprecated and removed in time.


 The dummy database backend is used at:

 {{{
 ./django/db/utils.py:151:'ENGINE':
 'django.db.backends.dummy',
 ./django/db/utils.py:155:
 self._databases[DEFAULT_DB_ALIAS]['ENGINE'] = 'django.db.backends.dummy'
 ./django/db/utils.py:173:conn.setdefault('ENGINE',
 'django.db.backends.dummy')
 ./django/db/utils.py:175:conn['ENGINE'] =
 'django.db.backends.dummy'
 }}}

 The dummy database backend looks to be used to replace a configuration of
 no databases. I could investigate what removing this would mean. I would
 have to dive deeper before knowing if this is viable.


 So, after that quick research, I'm open to the idea of deprecating and
 removing these other dummy backends. WDYT? I can investigate what the
 concrete code changes will mean first if that'll help make a decision.

 > 2. providing a good starting point for people wanting to understand how
 template backends work; of course it's hard to say if it actually helped
 contributors.

 I think there is some value here, but I think it would ultimately be
 better served through documentation. The current version is:

 https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/templates/#custom-backends

 Is this known to be lacking anywhere? If so, I can try to improve it.


 > In addition, the dummy backend made it possible to test multiple
 template engines without external dependencies ...

 I find this to be the most convincing reason to keep it. If we feel test
 dependencies should be reduced or kept to a minimum, I understand. On the
 other hand, is there an expectation that developers will install
 `test/requirements/py3.txt` before running tests? The
 [https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/internals/contributing/writing-code
 /unit-tests/#running-the-unit-tests documentation suggests this is so].

 > I'm not seeing a lot of value in removing this bit of code ...

 Ok, no worries. I wanted to highlight undocumented and unused code
 (outside of tests). I think there is value in removing unused code and
 shifting the tests towards the more representative configuration scenarios
 of mixing Jinja2 with Django templates. If the decision is to keep it,
 that is fine.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Aymeric Augustin):

 I added the dummy backend for two reasons:

 1. ensuring consistency with other pluggable backends, as explained by
 Adam; if we're going to remove it, we should also remove other dummy
 backends;
 2. providing a good starting point for people wanting to understand how
 template backends work; of course it's hard to say if it actually helped
 contributors.

 In addition, the dummy backend made it possible to test multiple template
 engines without external dependencies — when we were still trying to keep
 a good chunk of Django functionality without dependencies. I think that
 argument has weakened since then.

 I'm not seeing a lot of value in removing this bit of code, but if there's
 a strong desire to ship 42 fewer low-maintenance SLoCs, why not, I'm not
 married to this code :-)

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Adam (Chainz) Johnson):

 We have dummy backends for all the other swappable backends such as cache,
 db, and mail. But I guess since this was only in the DEP, and there don't
 seem to be many alternative template backends being made, it's not
 providing much value and removing it is simpler.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Jon Dufresne):

 [https://github.com/django/deps/pull/49 Multiple Template Engines DEP PR]

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-

Comment (by Tim Graham):

 It was added as part of
 [https://github.com/django/deps/blob/master/final/0182-multiple-template-
 engines.rst#dummy-backend Multiple Template Engines] project. I guess you
 would need to propose revising the DEP before making a proposal here.

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Re: [Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
-+-
 Reporter:  Jon Dufresne |Owner:  nobody
 Type:   |   Status:  new
  Cleanup/optimization   |
Component:  Template system  |  Version:  master
 Severity:  Normal   |   Resolution:
 Keywords:   | Triage Stage:
 |  Unreviewed
Has patch:  1|  Needs documentation:  0
  Needs tests:  0|  Patch needs improvement:  0
Easy pickings:  0|UI/UX:  0
-+-
Changes (by Jon Dufresne):

 * has_patch:  0 => 1


Comment:

 [https://github.com/django/django/pull/10474 PR]

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[Django] #29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend

[Django]

#29820: Remove unused, undocumented, and unnecessary dummy template backend
+
   Reporter:  Jon Dufresne  |  Owner:  nobody
   Type:  Cleanup/optimization  | Status:  new
  Component:  Template system   |Version:  master
   Severity:  Normal|   Keywords:
   Triage Stage:  Unreviewed|  Has patch:  0
Needs documentation:  0 |Needs tests:  0
Patch needs improvement:  0 |  Easy pickings:  0
  UI/UX:  0 |
+
 The dummy backend is undocumented.

 The dummy backend is unused except for testing multiple backend scenarios.
 For those testing purposes, can use the Jinja2 template engine as a 2nd
 engine.

 Further, the dummy backend isn't providing any other purpose such that the
 Django or Jinja2 engine wouldn't work as a replacement.

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