Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Web Architect]

Hi,

Thanks for the approach. On our site, customers have option to do guest 
checkout wherein users can make a purchase without getting 
registered/signing up. We are still using session information for such 
users. Hence, the session is kind of combined for logged in and not logged 
in users. The challenge is to figured out the sessions for logged in users 
(atleast I am not aware of how to do that in Django).  
Typically in businesses, users (specifically the masses and who aren't that 
tech savvy) prefer a flow that's smooth and hassle free though security 
definitely becomes an important aspect. Hence, the challenge is to combine 
the both.

I would certainly look into the approach you have suggested. 

Thanks. 

On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 2:08:30 PM UTC+5:30, Michal Petrucha wrote:
>
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- 
> Hash: SHA512 
>
> On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 05:44:22AM -0700, Web Architect wrote: 
> > Hi, 
> > 
> > We are using persistent django sessions for our website where in the 
> > session information is stored in MySQL. Over last couple of years, the 
> > session data has grown to a huge number and we were planning to clean it 
> up. 
> > I know that there is a django management command 'clearsessions' and we 
> are 
> > using the same as a daily cronjob. 
> > But our challenge is we have long expiry timelines of like 100 years so 
> > that our users are never logged out (unless they clear their cookies 
> etc). 
> > Hence, the clearsessions won't help. 
> > 
> > The solution we are looking for are removing the sessions which are 
> never 
> > used for a long period. Let's say a user never came to our site for 3 
> > months after last logging in. We would like to purge those sessions. 
> Would 
> > really appreciate if anyone could suggest any such solution - be it in 
> > Django or if we need to custom build it. 
> > 
> > Thanks. 
>
> There is another de-facto standard solution to this problem, which 
> does not involve setting the session expiry to years – it's usually 
> referred to as “persistent authentication cookie”. That way, sessions 
> would expire after the usual short period of time, and it also makes 
> the persistent login feature optional for your users. 
>
> I haven't found a maintained package that would implement this for 
> Django applications, but you can find a bunch of material on this 
> topic. For example, this article seems to consider a lot of potential 
> attack vectors: 
>
> https://paragonie.com/blog/2015/04/secure-authentication-php-with-long-term-persistence#title.2
>  
>
> Michal 
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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Web Architect]

Hi Avraham,

Thanks for the recommendation. Will take a look at the package. 

Thanks.

On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 1:00:03 PM UTC+5:30, Avraham Serour wrote:
>
> maybe something like this could be useful for your use case:
> https://pypi.org/project/django-session-timeout/
> it has an option for SESSION_EXPIRE_AFTER_LAST_ACTIVITY
>
>
> maybe this could also be useful for you: 
> https://django-session-security.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 20, 2018 at 8:34 AM Web Architect  > wrote:
>
>> Hi Jason,
>>
>> Thanks for your response.
>>
>> As mentioned in my earlier post...I have a long expiry date for the 
>> sessions (and hence, the cookies)  as we want our users to be always logged 
>> in or in session (till they clear their cookies). And that's what is 
>> causing the issue. 
>>
>> The goal is to keep the regular users logged in whereas flush out the non 
>> active users (even if their sessions haven't expired). Hence, was looking 
>> for a solution for the same. 
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 5:39:19 PM UTC+5:30, Jason wrote:
>>>
>>> With database sessions out of the box, no.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/base_session.py
>>>
>>> You can see there are three attributes for a session model: key, data 
>>> and expire_date
>>>
>>> That said, since sessions are backed by browser cookies, django's 
>>> default is two weeks for session cookies as you can see at 
>>> https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/ref/settings/#std:setting-SESSION_COOKIE_AGE,
>>>  
>>> which are used here:  
>>> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/backends/base.py#L225-L244
>>>
>>> So if you haven't altered that, all sessions expire in two weeks, and 
>>> you can just delete those expired sessions by using the clearsessions 
>>> management command 
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>> if you have changed that, then what Hemendra suggested above seems like 
>>> a reasonable approach, but one that is not backwards compatible if you 
>>> don't have a timestamp field for last access 
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
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>> .
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-users/4794450f-ad83-4a00-96e3-f354745b322b%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>

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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Michal Petrucha]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 05:44:22AM -0700, Web Architect wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> We are using persistent django sessions for our website where in the 
> session information is stored in MySQL. Over last couple of years, the 
> session data has grown to a huge number and we were planning to clean it up.
> I know that there is a django management command 'clearsessions' and we are 
> using the same as a daily cronjob.
> But our challenge is we have long expiry timelines of like 100 years so 
> that our users are never logged out (unless they clear their cookies etc). 
> Hence, the clearsessions won't help. 
> 
> The solution we are looking for are removing the sessions which are never 
> used for a long period. Let's say a user never came to our site for 3 
> months after last logging in. We would like to purge those sessions. Would 
> really appreciate if anyone could suggest any such solution - be it in 
> Django or if we need to custom build it.
> 
> Thanks.

There is another de-facto standard solution to this problem, which
does not involve setting the session expiry to years – it's usually
referred to as “persistent authentication cookie”. That way, sessions
would expire after the usual short period of time, and it also makes
the persistent login feature optional for your users.

I haven't found a maintained package that would implement this for
Django applications, but you can find a bunch of material on this
topic. For example, this article seems to consider a lot of potential
attack vectors:
https://paragonie.com/blog/2015/04/secure-authentication-php-with-long-term-persistence#title.2

Michal
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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Avraham Serour]

maybe something like this could be useful for your use case:
https://pypi.org/project/django-session-timeout/
it has an option for SESSION_EXPIRE_AFTER_LAST_ACTIVITY


maybe this could also be useful for you:
https://django-session-security.readthedocs.io/en/latest/



On Mon, Aug 20, 2018 at 8:34 AM Web Architect  wrote:

> Hi Jason,
>
> Thanks for your response.
>
> As mentioned in my earlier post...I have a long expiry date for the
> sessions (and hence, the cookies)  as we want our users to be always logged
> in or in session (till they clear their cookies). And that's what is
> causing the issue.
>
> The goal is to keep the regular users logged in whereas flush out the non
> active users (even if their sessions haven't expired). Hence, was looking
> for a solution for the same.
>
> Thanks.
>
> On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 5:39:19 PM UTC+5:30, Jason wrote:
>>
>> With database sessions out of the box, no.
>>
>>
>> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/base_session.py
>>
>> You can see there are three attributes for a session model: key, data and
>> expire_date
>>
>> That said, since sessions are backed by browser cookies, django's default
>> is two weeks for session cookies as you can see at
>> https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/ref/settings/#std:setting-SESSION_COOKIE_AGE,
>> which are used here:
>> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/backends/base.py#L225-L244
>>
>> So if you haven't altered that, all sessions expire in two weeks, and you
>> can just delete those expired sessions by using the clearsessions
>> management command
>> 
>> .
>>
>> if you have changed that, then what Hemendra suggested above seems like a
>> reasonable approach, but one that is not backwards compatible if you don't
>> have a timestamp field for last access
>>
>>
>> --
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> 
> .
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Web Architect]

Hi Jason,

Thanks for your response.

As mentioned in my earlier post...I have a long expiry date for the 
sessions (and hence, the cookies)  as we want our users to be always logged 
in or in session (till they clear their cookies). And that's what is 
causing the issue. 

The goal is to keep the regular users logged in whereas flush out the non 
active users (even if their sessions haven't expired). Hence, was looking 
for a solution for the same. 

Thanks.

On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 5:39:19 PM UTC+5:30, Jason wrote:
>
> With database sessions out of the box, no.
>
>
> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/base_session.py
>
> You can see there are three attributes for a session model: key, data and 
> expire_date
>
> That said, since sessions are backed by browser cookies, django's default 
> is two weeks for session cookies as you can see at 
> https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/ref/settings/#std:setting-SESSION_COOKIE_AGE,
>  
> which are used here:  
> https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/backends/base.py#L225-L244
>
> So if you haven't altered that, all sessions expire in two weeks, and you 
> can just delete those expired sessions by using the clearsessions 
> management command 
> 
> .
>
> if you have changed that, then what Hemendra suggested above seems like a 
> reasonable approach, but one that is not backwards compatible if you don't 
> have a timestamp field for last access 
>
>
>

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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Web Architect]

Hi Hemendra, 

Thanks for the workaround. Would look at it's feasibility in our existing 
scenario. 

Thanks.

On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 3:58:10 PM UTC+5:30, HEMENDRA SINGH HADA 
wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I can suggest one thing it might be useful for you. For this you need to 
> create one more attribute in session table like *last activity,* which 
> will update every time when user is logged in and perform some action. 
> Write one middle-ware which will check the activity of each user and update 
> *last 
> activity *field in request repose cycle.
>
> I am not sure will this approach is acceptable for your current scenario.
>
> Thanks,
> Hemendra Singh
>
>
>

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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Mike Dewhirst]

On 18/08/2018 6:33 PM, Web Architect wrote:

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your response.

Ours is an ecommerce site and forcing logouts especially for our 
regular users, might not be desirable from business point of view .


I wasn't suggesting forcing logouts on a regular basis. I was thinking 
that doing so once would permit a clearing of the entire slate as you 
seemed to be thinking and only real users would create new sessions.


That might be appropriate after you implement one or other of the 
technical suggestions.


There is more to consider too. If it is an ecommerce site security is 
particularly important. Personally I wouldn't hesitate to let regular 
users know you have security at top-of-mind and that is behind any minor 
inconvenience. It might even be seen as a business bonus!







Hence, ideally we would like to keep sessions where users's last 
activity should be within a given time period like 3 months. We can 
force out the users who aren't active since last 3 months.


Is there a way to do that in django?

Thanks.

On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 5:11:23 AM UTC+5:30, Mike Dewhirst wrote:

On 17/08/2018 10:44 PM, Web Architect wrote:
> Hi,
>
> We are using persistent django sessions for our website where in
the
> session information is stored in MySQL. Over last couple of
years, the
> session data has grown to a huge number and we were planning to
clean
> it up.
> I know that there is a django management command 'clearsessions'
and
> we are using the same as a daily cronjob.
> But our challenge is we have long expiry timelines of like 100
years
> so that our users are never logged out (unless they clear their
> cookies etc). Hence, the clearsessions won't help.
>
> The solution we are looking for are removing the sessions which are
> never used for a long period. Let's say a user never came to our
site
> for 3 months after last logging in. We would like to purge those
> sessions. Would really appreciate if anyone could suggest any such
> solution - be it in Django or if we need to custom build it.

What are the consequences of deleting all sessions and forcing a new
login for everyone?


>
> Thanks.
> --
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> .
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.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-users/57001ae7-1361-43ed-98e3-a9ec072444fe%40googlegroups.com



>

>.

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.

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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Jason]

With database sessions out of the box, no.

https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/base_session.py

You can see there are three attributes for a session model: key, data and 
expire_date

That said, since sessions are backed by browser cookies, django's default 
is two weeks for session cookies as you can see at 
https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/ref/settings/#std:setting-SESSION_COOKIE_AGE,
 
which are used here:  
https://github.com/django/django/blob/master/django/contrib/sessions/backends/base.py#L225-L244

So if you haven't altered that, all sessions expire in two weeks, and you 
can just delete those expired sessions by using the clearsessions 
management command 

.

if you have changed that, then what Hemendra suggested above seems like a 
reasonable approach, but one that is not backwards compatible if you don't 
have a timestamp field for last access 


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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[HEMENDRA SINGH HADA]

Hi,

I can suggest one thing it might be useful for you. For this you need to 
create one more attribute in session table like *last activity,* which will 
update every time when user is logged in and perform some action. Write one 
middle-ware which will check the activity of each user and update *last 
activity *field in request repose cycle.

I am not sure will this approach is acceptable for your current scenario.

Thanks,
Hemendra Singh


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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Web Architect]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your response. 

Ours is an ecommerce site and forcing logouts especially for our regular 
users, might not be desirable from business point of view . 

Hence, ideally we would like to keep sessions where users's last activity 
should be within a given time period like 3 months. We can force out the 
users who aren't active since last 3 months. 

Is there a way to do that in django?

Thanks.

On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 5:11:23 AM UTC+5:30, Mike Dewhirst wrote:
>
> On 17/08/2018 10:44 PM, Web Architect wrote: 
> > Hi, 
> > 
> > We are using persistent django sessions for our website where in the 
> > session information is stored in MySQL. Over last couple of years, the 
> > session data has grown to a huge number and we were planning to clean 
> > it up. 
> > I know that there is a django management command 'clearsessions' and 
> > we are using the same as a daily cronjob. 
> > But our challenge is we have long expiry timelines of like 100 years 
> > so that our users are never logged out (unless they clear their 
> > cookies etc). Hence, the clearsessions won't help. 
> > 
> > The solution we are looking for are removing the sessions which are 
> > never used for a long period. Let's say a user never came to our site 
> > for 3 months after last logging in. We would like to purge those 
> > sessions. Would really appreciate if anyone could suggest any such 
> > solution - be it in Django or if we need to custom build it. 
>
> What are the consequences of deleting all sessions and forcing a new 
> login for everyone? 
>
>
> > 
> > Thanks. 
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> > To view this discussion on the web visit 
> > 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-users/57001ae7-1361-43ed-98e3-a9ec072444fe%40googlegroups.com
>  
> > <
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-users/57001ae7-1361-43ed-98e3-a9ec072444fe%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
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Re: How to delete least recently used not expired django sessions?

[Mike Dewhirst]

On 17/08/2018 10:44 PM, Web Architect wrote:

Hi,

We are using persistent django sessions for our website where in the 
session information is stored in MySQL. Over last couple of years, the 
session data has grown to a huge number and we were planning to clean 
it up.
I know that there is a django management command 'clearsessions' and 
we are using the same as a daily cronjob.
But our challenge is we have long expiry timelines of like 100 years 
so that our users are never logged out (unless they clear their 
cookies etc). Hence, the clearsessions won't help.


The solution we are looking for are removing the sessions which are 
never used for a long period. Let's say a user never came to our site 
for 3 months after last logging in. We would like to purge those 
sessions. Would really appreciate if anyone could suggest any such 
solution - be it in Django or if we need to custom build it.


What are the consequences of deleting all sessions and forcing a new 
login for everyone?





Thanks.
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