Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On 10/10/18 at 22:13, Bruce Perens wrote: > I think this discussion is now so astronomically far from the purpose > of DNG that it serves no further purpose. Indeed! > Perhaps moderation is called for? I'll give this thread another 12 hours chance to die out on it's own accord, then I'll second your call. Alessandro -- Alessandro Selli VOIP SIP: dhatarat...@ekiga.net Chiave firma e cifratura PGP/GPG signing and encoding key: BA651E4050DDFC31E17384BABCE7BD1A1B0DF2AE ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] [OT] Restricting user capabilities after ssh login
Il 10/10/18 18:51, Lars Noodén ha scritto: > On 10/10/18 7:30 PM, Alessandro Selli wrote: >> Works for me: > ...> [root@wrkstn02 ~]# lsb_release -d ; uname -r >> Description: Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii) >> 4.18.0-0.bpo.1-amd64 > Hmmm. I'm using just the stock kernel. Maybe that is the difference: > > $ lsb_release -d; uname -r > Description:Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii) > 4.9.0-8-amd64 Could be. Mine in from the backports. But I also use custom kernels, and my own 4.9.131 kernel works, too. I should install the linux-image-4.9.0-8-amd64 package and try that to make sure. I might do that, but now now. Alessandro -- Alessandro Selli VOIP SIP: dhatarat...@ekiga.net Chiave firma e cifratura PGP/GPG signing and encoding key: BA651E4050DDFC31E17384BABCE7BD1A1B0DF2AE signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 13:13:57 -0700 Bruce Perens wrote: > I think this discussion is now so astronomically far from the purpose > of DNG that it serves no further purpose. Perhaps moderation is > called for? It never was on topic, but then many posts aren't ;-) I gave up on it when I decided the OP was an idiot. Rowland ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
I think this discussion is now so astronomically far from the purpose of DNG that it serves no further purpose. Perhaps moderation is called for? ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On 10.10.2018 14:29, Rowland Penny wrote:
> Are you trying to tell me that Junker etc are leftist ? pull the other> one,
> its got bells on.
No, I just see some patterns. Anyways, I don't put anybody in those
categories, until there is actual strong evidence for that. And I
believe, people should be careful not to declare themselves into
such categories - it's too easily abused for device-and-conquer games.
>> This guy even declared burning down large citites - including their>> civil,
>> unarmed, inhabitants - a 'comparatively humane method',
because>> he claimed to have saved some British soldiers.> > So blitzing
London wasn't the same ?
Don't you think there's a difference between few bombings w/ maybe
few thousands kills and the systematic extermination of cities,
at a time where already was almost defeated ?
For the war criminal, extreme racist, white-supremacist churchill,
who already ordered use of chemical weapons in British the near east,
("I do not understand the squeamishness about the use of gas. I am
strongly in favour of using poisonous gas against uncivilised tribes." -
Churchill, writing as president of the Air Council (1919)) Germans
belong to sub-humans, who had to be eliminated.
He made sure that all the peaceful proposals from Germany (including the
many peace offers during the war) had failed - he *wanted* the war, and
made sure that it happened. So, in fact, he is *guilty* of engineering
the worst war in modern history.
During WW1 he said: "Perhaps the next time round the way to do it will
be to kill women, children and the civilian population."
He also openly said himself, what both wars had been about:
"Should Germany merchandise again in the next 50 years we have led this
war (WW1) in vain." (1919)
"I will crunch Germany." - Roosevelt 1932(!)
Winston Churchill: "We will force this war upon Hitler, if he wants it
or not." (1936)
"This war is an English war and its goal is the destruction of Germany."
(1939)
"Germanys unforgivable crime before WW2 was its attempt to loosen its
economy out of the world trade system and to build up an own exchange
system from which the world-finance couldnt profit anymore" (1960)
Churchill should have been the first to be prosecuted in the Nuremberg
trials.
But Rosevelt wasn't much better: "I will crunch Germany." (1932 !)
> The first world war was a 'family' argument, pity the family were the> royal
> houses of Europe.
No, it was engieered to destroy the upcoming central power, Germany,
which had a massive economic growth after uniting the individual
states to the empire.
One of the biggest German 'atrocities' at that time - from British
Imperialist view, was the attempted construction of the transcontinental
railway, from the near east straight to Berlin and Hamburg. This would
have made the British Imperial navy largely obsolete. That's way they
engineered this war and ignited it with the assasination of the Serb
prince.
> The second world war was caused by a little dictator that wanted the> whole
> of Europe (including most of Russia).
First, the dictator wouldn't have gotten the power, if there wasn't:
* massive atrocities by the (British backed) polish nationalists/racists
/imperialists. Before WW1, there was no state of Poland - it was
created in 1918. But this wasn't enough for these radicals, who also
couped and killed elected leaders - Piłsudski and his murder gangs
demanded the territory of former polish state, that was dissolved
centuries ago. These forced also waged hunger war against the cut off
German territories, eg. Danzig and did many raids on Germany.
* the engieered stock and monetary crisis (by massive credit and money
supply manipulation by FED and RBE), which lead to the 'great
depression'.
* the assassination of Rathenau (by british imperial intelligence)
* atrocities by French occupation
* the (angloamerican financed) Bolschewic Coup in Russia, which brought
the mass murderer and imperialist Stalin to power, who planned to
attack and destroy Germany.
* the completely insane reparations the German people should pay for
several generations - for a war which was *NOT* engineered by Germany.
(but against Germany).
* the massive exploitation of Germany's economy, and the raid of vital
resources like coal (especially in very cold winter) that lead to
massive poverty, starvation and cold deaths.
It shouldn't be any surprise that in such a situation people will stand
behind anybody who gives a chance to improve this horrible situation.
> Lets be perfectly honest here, Germany started both world wars.
WW1 was clearly *NOT* started by Germany - the only mistake of the
Emperor was officially declaring a war, that was already going
undeclared. And WW2 was forced upon Germany, and the allied
rejected all the numerous peace offerings from the German side.
>> Over here in Germany, anybody who talks about that, is automatically>>
>> declared 'Nazi' by the leftists (those who call yet for
Re: [DNG] [OT] Restricting user capabilities after ssh login
On 10/10/18 7:30 PM, Alessandro Selli wrote: > Works for me: ...> [root@wrkstn02 ~]# lsb_release -d ; uname -r > Description: Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii) > 4.18.0-0.bpo.1-amd64 Hmmm. I'm using just the stock kernel. Maybe that is the difference: $ lsb_release -d; uname -r Description:Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii) 4.9.0-8-amd64 /Lars ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] How to build your own distro
On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 15:02:38 +0200, aitor_czr wrote in message <4e738388-701d-c2ec-1cfd-c0c00eb2a...@gnuinos.org>: > Hi, > > El 07/10/18 a las 17:15, aitor_czr escribió: > > > > Hi again, > > > > On 10/07/2018 05:12 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: > >> On Sat, Oct 06, 2018 at 09:39:42AM +0200, aitor_czr wrote: > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> , i'll start working on a tutorial about how to build you own > >>> distro. > >>> > >>> This tutorial will contain three chapters: > >>> > >>> 1) How to build your packages using git-buildpackage, > >>> pristine-tar and quilt. > >>> > >>> 2) How to build the repository using amprolla. > >>> > >>> 3) How to build the images of the system taking your own > >>> repository as a base. > >>> > >>> I'll start by the second one. At first, the tutorial will be > >>> written in spanish. > >> On Sat, 6 Oct 2018 09:39:42 +0200 > >> aitor_czr wrote: > >>> Is very cool news. I am translating this for portuguese. > >> I hope someone will transpate it to English. > >> > >> -- hendrik > > I'm finishing the part concerning to Amprolla: > > https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=12177#p12177 ...and for the impatient no habla español crowd: ;o) https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto=en=y=_t=en=UTF-8=https%3A%2F%2Fdev1galaxy.org%2Fviewtopic.php%3Fpid%3D12177%23p12177= > > Cheers, > > Aitor. > > -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] [OT] Restricting user capabilities after ssh login
Il 10/10/18 06:28, Lars Noodén ha scritto: > On 10/10/18 12:38 AM, taii...@gmx.com wrote: >> You can use apparmor to do this quite easily - afaik there are a few >> tutorials for it. > Last I checked, apparmor does not function with Devuan: > > # /etc/init.d/apparmor start > /etc/init.d/apparmor: 130: /etc/init.d/apparmor: > systemd-detect-virt: not found > > Starting AppArmor profiles:AppArmor not available as kernel > LSM.. failed! > > > /Lars Works for me: [root@wrkstn02 ~]# /etc/init.d/apparmor status apparmor module is loaded. 19 profiles are loaded. 17 profiles are in enforce mode. /usr/lib/cups/backend/cups-pdf /usr/sbin/cups-browsed /usr/sbin/cupsd /usr/sbin/cupsd//third_party /usr/sbin/libvirtd /usr/sbin/libvirtd//qemu_bridge_helper /usr/sbin/named system_tor thunderbird thunderbird//browser_java thunderbird//browser_openjdk thunderbird//gpg thunderbird//sanitized_helper torbrowser_firefox torbrowser_plugin_container torbrowser_tor virt-aa-helper 2 profiles are in complain mode. /usr/bin/i2prouter system_i2p 2 processes have profiles defined. 2 processes are in enforce mode. /usr/sbin/named (11896) thunderbird (20717) 0 processes are in complain mode. 0 processes are unconfined but have a profile defined. [root@wrkstn02 ~]# [root@wrkstn02 ~]# lsb_release -d ; uname -r Description: Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii) 4.18.0-0.bpo.1-amd64 [root@wrkstn02 ~]# Alessandro -- Alessandro Selli VOIP SIP: dhatarat...@ekiga.net Chiave firma e cifratura PGP/GPG signing and encoding key: BA651E4050DDFC31E17384BABCE7BD1A1B0DF2AE signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
[DNG] Spamassassin uninstallable in ceres
Looking at CVE-2018-11780 i decided to move spamassassin to ceres, which gave: The following packages have unmet dependencies: spamassassin : Depends: init-system-helpers (>= 1.51) but 1.48+devuan2.0 is tobe installed Recommends: spamc Recommends: sa-compile but it is not going to be installed E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages. (502) aw@anhrefn $ apt policy spamassassin [...] Version table: 3.4.2-1 60 60 http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged ceres/main amd64 Packages [...] This looks like a bug. cu AW -- [...] If you don't want to be restricted, don't agree to it. If you are coerced, comply as much as you must to protect yourself, just don't support it. Noone can free you but yourself. (crag, on Debian Planet) Arne Wichmann (a...@saar.de) signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] systemd and ssh-server
On 25.07.2018 10:20, Joel Roth wrote: Hi, > Most of those "alarming" files are just systemd units files, put there> by > daemons/packages/utilities who "also" support systemd in a way or> another. So they are not alarming but just *totally* *harmless* if you> don't have a running systemd as PID 1, since only systemd understands> and can run them. At least that's the theory. I'm waiting for some yerk upstreams coming around and doing some other silly things with them. Yes: in Lennartware world, I've learned to expect those things :o > It would be *totally* *useless* (and utterly> *stupid* IMHO) to fork, > rebuild, and maintain a few more hundred> packages only because they happen to provide a systemd unit file for> those systems where systemd is used. I don't think so. I agree that this eats resources with minimal gain. BTW: we don't need to do that for all at once. Start with picking a few important packages and then learn how to handle that really efficiently. My wish is having a (technical and organisational) infrastructure which allows us to quickly/easily fork and maintain any package. (on distro side as well as individual operator). Certainly, we'd have to learn a lot for that, but IMHO a good thing. > libsystemd0 is used by some daemons to verify if systemd is running or > not. If it's not, libsystemd is *totally* *harmless*. I haven't read the code for quite some time, so I'm not trusting it. Too much happened in that area. I just don't want that code anywhere near to any of my systems, I couldn't sleep well. I would have to carefully review the code w/ my own eyes, but then I could also patch out the systemd dependencies. --mtx ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] systemd and ssh-server
On 25.07.2018 09:11, Hleb Valoshka wrote: > It's required just to notify systemd that sshd is running, so in > systemd-less system it's nop. So mostly libsystemd0 is harmless. Is it that the original libsystemd0, which tries to talk to systemd via desktop-bus ? Or is it a patched version, where functions like sd_notify() are really noop ? > Currently Devuan team doesn't have enough man power to fork every > single package just to cleanup its dependencies. Just had a quick look at the deb src. It's just a simple patch added by debian. Shouldn't be a big deal to fix that. The only thing, IMHO, we need to do is monitoring new deb releases (eg. some automatic notification), re-apply our systemd-removal package and rebuild that thing. Am I missing something ? --mtx ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] How to build your own distro
Hi, El 07/10/18 a las 17:15, aitor_czr escribió: Hi again, On 10/07/2018 05:12 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: On Sat, Oct 06, 2018 at 09:39:42AM +0200, aitor_czr wrote: Hi all, , i'll start working on a tutorial about how to build you own distro. This tutorial will contain three chapters: 1) How to build your packages using git-buildpackage, pristine-tar and quilt. 2) How to build the repository using amprolla. 3) How to build the images of the system taking your own repository as a base. I'll start by the second one. At first, the tutorial will be written in spanish. On Sat, 6 Oct 2018 09:39:42 +0200 aitor_czr wrote: Is very cool news. I am translating this for portuguese. I hope someone will transpate it to English. -- hendrik I'm finishing the part concerning to Amprolla: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=12177#p12177 Cheers, Aitor. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
[DNG] OT: Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 13:29:05 +0100, Rowland wrote in message <20181010132905.29252...@devstation.samdom.example.com>: > On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 14:04:15 +0200 > "Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult" wrote: ... > > Over here in Germany, anybody who talks about that, is automatically > > declared 'Nazi' by the leftists (those who call yet for another > > Bomber Harris) and risk being hunted down on the street. > > You should be free to discuss anything you like, it is some actions > that need to be banned. ...as OT here on DNG. ;o) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 14:04:15 +0200 "Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult" wrote: > On 10.10.2018 13:20, Rowland Penny wrote: > > Hi, > > > You could just have said: > > * people against shall be banned/silenced, as they're > >discriminating/against . > > > > Instead of that long list. > > I did this to illustrate that can quickly become a very > long list. By the way, the list in the Kernel CoC is also very > incomplete (and it didn't even define what terms like > 'discrimination' etc actually should mean there - just a bunch of > rubber rules). > > >> Those demands usually come from 'leftist' groups (mostly > >> beaurocrats, > > > > Most bureaucrats are, in my opinion, rightist > > Not my experience. Despite the fact that those categories are *very* > context-sensitive, most beaurocrats I had to cope with are actually > great fans of "Gleichschaltung" (can't really translate this - means > something along force everything into the same structure/mindset, make > force individual to be small, replacable, pieces of a big machinery), > IOW: enemies of indivudualism. A bad example of this, here in Germany, > was the era of (National)*Socialism*. Most big corporations I've seen > so far are actually socialistic inside. Are you trying to tell me that Junker etc are leftist ? pull the other one, its got bells on. > > > This totally depends on your point of view, it could be said that > > Harris was just responding to things like the Blitz, the V1 and V2 > > etc, > > No. He already did this long before WW2 in other countries, eg. > against tribal villages in Iraq, Arabia, Palestine, etc. (where he > also used chemical weapons). And he enjoyed this (said this himself!). > > In WW2 he deliberately bombed militarily insignificant cities. There > was no military value in that - ist was just a direct mass termination > of (often wounded and sick) civilians - mothers, children, old people. > In short: a genocide. > > Forbidden eg. by the Washington Treaty and Hague Conventions ! > > This guy even declared burning down large citites - including their > civil, unarmed, inhabitants - a 'comparatively humane method', because > he claimed to have saved some British soldiers. So blitzing London wasn't the same ? > > > You also have to accept it was a part of the largest war this world > > has ever seen. > > Yes, it was part of that horrible war. We also have to accept, that > also the allied, who still declare themselves as 'the only good > people', did massive genocide. And we have to accept the fact that > their goal wasn't 'freeing Germany and Europe from National > Socialism', but the total destruction of Germany as a central power. > (actually, this was already the goal of WW1). It's written in their > own documents. The first world war was a 'family' argument, pity the family were the royal houses of Europe. The second world war was caused by a little dictator that wanted the whole of Europe (including most of Russia). Lets be perfectly honest here, Germany started both world wars. > > Over here in Germany, anybody who talks about that, is automatically > declared 'Nazi' by the leftists (those who call yet for another Bomber > Harris) and risk being hunted down on the street. You should be free to discuss anything you like, it is some actions that need to be banned. > > >> With that background, things like 'CoC's make my alarm bells ring > >> very louldly. Of course, I don't believe that any of the kernel > >> maintainers belong to those groups. But it feels they might be > >> somewhat under some 'social pressure'. > > > > A CoC shouldn't be needed, ever. > > ACK. The kernel community worked very well for the last decades. > > And I don't think that any FOSS project should be some 'social > justice' playground. If people wanna have that, they can easily > create their own projects for such purposes. > We have a saying: Do unto others as you would have done unto you. Basically treat others as you would like to be treated, you don't need a Coc for that. Rowland ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On 10.10.2018 13:20, Rowland Penny wrote: Hi, > You could just have said: > * people against shall be banned/silenced, as they're >discriminating/against . > > Instead of that long list. I did this to illustrate that can quickly become a very long list. By the way, the list in the Kernel CoC is also very incomplete (and it didn't even define what terms like 'discrimination' etc actually should mean there - just a bunch of rubber rules). >> Those demands usually come from 'leftist' groups (mostly beaurocrats, > > Most bureaucrats are, in my opinion, rightist Not my experience. Despite the fact that those categories are *very* context-sensitive, most beaurocrats I had to cope with are actually great fans of "Gleichschaltung" (can't really translate this - means something along force everything into the same structure/mindset, make force individual to be small, replacable, pieces of a big machinery), IOW: enemies of indivudualism. A bad example of this, here in Germany, was the era of (National)*Socialism*. Most big corporations I've seen so far are actually socialistic inside. > This totally depends on your point of view, it could be said that > Harris was just responding to things like the Blitz, the V1 and V2 etc, No. He already did this long before WW2 in other countries, eg. against tribal villages in Iraq, Arabia, Palestine, etc. (where he also used chemical weapons). And he enjoyed this (said this himself!). In WW2 he deliberately bombed militarily insignificant cities. There was no military value in that - ist was just a direct mass termination of (often wounded and sick) civilians - mothers, children, old people. In short: a genocide. Forbidden eg. by the Washington Treaty and Hague Conventions ! This guy even declared burning down large citites - including their civil, unarmed, inhabitants - a 'comparatively humane method', because he claimed to have saved some British soldiers. > You also have to accept it was a part of the largest war this world has > ever seen. Yes, it was part of that horrible war. We also have to accept, that also the allied, who still declare themselves as 'the only good people', did massive genocide. And we have to accept the fact that their goal wasn't 'freeing Germany and Europe from National Socialism', but the total destruction of Germany as a central power. (actually, this was already the goal of WW1). It's written in their own documents. Over here in Germany, anybody who talks about that, is automatically declared 'Nazi' by the leftists (those who call yet for another Bomber Harris) and risk being hunted down on the street. >> With that background, things like 'CoC's make my alarm bells ring very >> louldly. Of course, I don't believe that any of the kernel maintainers >> belong to those groups. But it feels they might be somewhat under >> some 'social pressure'. > > A CoC shouldn't be needed, ever. ACK. The kernel community worked very well for the last decades. And I don't think that any FOSS project should be some 'social justice' playground. If people wanna have that, they can easily create their own projects for such purposes. --mtx ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 13:01:42 +0200 "Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult" wrote: > On 01.10.2018 07:28, taii...@gmx.com wrote: > > Hi, > > > On 09/27/2018 05:11 PM, Bruce Perens wrote: > >> I'm that Social Justice Warrior that you don't like. > > > > I can almost guarantee you aren't. > > > > There is a big difference between being for social justice which any > > reasonable person is, and being a SJW. > > I can follow this way of thinking ... we should be careful not get > into conflicts by just different interpretation of some terminology. > > I've seen a lot of self-declared 'social justice warriors', who > finally did more harm than anything useful. Those who really did many > good things, tend to not calling themselves that way. > > These CoC issues remind me to things happening in other (eg. the > political) field. For example here in Germany (in other European > countries, too) certain movements try to establish certain CoCs to > most areas of daily life, that just shall prohibit them from speaking > their mind, eg.: > > * people against abortion shall be banned/silenced, as they're > discriminating women. > * people against gay marriage shall be banned/silenced, as they're > discriminating gays. > * people against child marriage shall be banned/silenced, as they're > discriminating certain religions / cultures. > * people who speak about crimal immigrants or refugees shall be > banned/ silenced, as they're discriminating them > * people who speak about costs of immigration shall be banned/silenced > as they're discriminating immigrants > * people who differenciate between immigrants and refugees shall be > banned/silenced, as they're discriminating refuguees You could just have said: * people against shall be banned/silenced, as they're discriminating/against . Instead of that long list. > > Those demands usually come from 'leftist' groups (mostly beaurocrats, Most bureaucrats are, in my opinion, rightist > who never contributed anything actually useful, heavily sponsored by > multi-billionares) who try to take over the whole society (smells like > a 2nd wave of the 68'ers, who turned our schools into indoctrination > camps). And the very same people applaude to officials and party > leaders who openly spill anti-white or anti-German racism - eg. the > "bomber- harris-do-it-again"-faction" (remember: Arthur Harris was a > very brutal war criminal, who deliberately slaughtered at least a > million civilians) This totally depends on your point of view, it could be said that Harris was just responding to things like the Blitz, the V1 and V2 etc, You also have to accept it was a part of the largest war this world has ever seen. > > With that background, things like 'CoC's make my alarm bells ring very > louldly. Of course, I don't believe that any of the kernel maintainers > belong to those groups. But it feels they might be somewhat under > some 'social pressure'. A CoC shouldn't be needed, ever. > > A practical look on the actual text: > > * they're trying to introduce a kind of legal system into a tech > project > * the text is so extremly vague, that it just isn't usable for any > serious legal purpose. given enough phantasy, one can interpret > anything into it. therefore: great chance of failing the original > good intent, and high risk of abuse > > And the argument, the maintainers will take good decisions anyways, > isn't pro the CoC - actually it's a very strong con. Because, if it's > really the case (IMHO, indeed had been so for the last decades), this > codex isn't needed at all - it's been obsolete decades before it's > inception. Instead it's just introducing new, completely unnecessary > conflicts. > > The whole purpose of any codex is a formalization of social rules, > that aren't followed automatically the responsible people, and are > neutral on the personal views of the individuals who're subjected to > it or have to execute/enforce it. Just intended to control those > individuals who do not inherently follow the unwritten moral rules. > Anything else would be just destructive bureaucracy or even a > social/legal weapon. > > If these FOSS projects really wanted to establish a properly working > CoC, they'd also need to establish their own complete legal system, > including lawmakers, courts, police. Is that really the goal ? You know what, that sounds very like what the EU is trying to become, thank your deity we are getting out of it. Rowland ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] OT: firefox, privacy etc.
On 06.09.2018 09:21, Martin Steigerwald wrote: > My Firefox never forced me to use Pocket or Sync or anything. The start > page had some Pocket recommendations after some update, but I just > disabled those. You can even configure the start page after starting > Firefox or opening a new tab to be completely empty. by the way: did anyone of you guys already look into building it w/o that cloud crap ? Last time I checked is >1yr ago (IIRC esr52) and it was pretty ugly to do a (actually working) customized build, eg. also w/o any DRM crap. --mtx ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: GPL version 2 is a bare license. Recind. (Regarding (future) linux Code of Conduct Bannings).
On 01.10.2018 07:28, taii...@gmx.com wrote: Hi, > On 09/27/2018 05:11 PM, Bruce Perens wrote: >> I'm that Social Justice Warrior that you don't like. > > I can almost guarantee you aren't. > > There is a big difference between being for social justice which any > reasonable person is, and being a SJW. I can follow this way of thinking ... we should be careful not get into conflicts by just different interpretation of some terminology. I've seen a lot of self-declared 'social justice warriors', who finally did more harm than anything useful. Those who really did many good things, tend to not calling themselves that way. These CoC issues remind me to things happening in other (eg. the political) field. For example here in Germany (in other European countries, too) certain movements try to establish certain CoCs to most areas of daily life, that just shall prohibit them from speaking their mind, eg.: * people against abortion shall be banned/silenced, as they're discriminating women. * people against gay marriage shall be banned/silenced, as they're discriminating gays. * people against child marriage shall be banned/silenced, as they're discriminating certain religions / cultures. * people who speak about crimal immigrants or refugees shall be banned/ silenced, as they're discriminating them * people who speak about costs of immigration shall be banned/silenced as they're discriminating immigrants * people who differenciate between immigrants and refugees shall be banned/silenced, as they're discriminating refuguees Those demands usually come from 'leftist' groups (mostly beaurocrats, who never contributed anything actually useful, heavily sponsored by multi-billionares) who try to take over the whole society (smells like a 2nd wave of the 68'ers, who turned our schools into indoctrination camps). And the very same people applaude to officials and party leaders who openly spill anti-white or anti-German racism - eg. the "bomber- harris-do-it-again"-faction" (remember: Arthur Harris was a very brutal war criminal, who deliberately slaughtered at least a million civilians) With that background, things like 'CoC's make my alarm bells ring very louldly. Of course, I don't believe that any of the kernel maintainers belong to those groups. But it feels they might be somewhat under some 'social pressure'. A practical look on the actual text: * they're trying to introduce a kind of legal system into a tech project * the text is so extremly vague, that it just isn't usable for any serious legal purpose. given enough phantasy, one can interpret anything into it. therefore: great chance of failing the original good intent, and high risk of abuse And the argument, the maintainers will take good decisions anyways, isn't pro the CoC - actually it's a very strong con. Because, if it's really the case (IMHO, indeed had been so for the last decades), this codex isn't needed at all - it's been obsolete decades before it's inception. Instead it's just introducing new, completely unnecessary conflicts. The whole purpose of any codex is a formalization of social rules, that aren't followed automatically the responsible people, and are neutral on the personal views of the individuals who're subjected to it or have to execute/enforce it. Just intended to control those individuals who do not inherently follow the unwritten moral rules. Anything else would be just destructive bureaucracy or even a social/legal weapon. If these FOSS projects really wanted to establish a properly working CoC, they'd also need to establish their own complete legal system, including lawmakers, courts, police. Is that really the goal ? --mtx ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Contents available at packages.devuan.org and *.mirror.devuan.org
On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 06:10:20AM +1100, Ozi Traveller wrote: > I was just wondering whether the changes/updates/improvments with regard to > the repos, will also include the regular updating of the Packages.gz files. > > http://deb.devuan.org/merged//dists/jessie/main/debian-installer/binary-amd64/Packages.gz > > The whole mirror is now served by the new amprolla. HTH KatolaZ -- [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - Devuan -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
