Re: [DNG] Advice sought on kernel upgrade

[terryc]

On Thu, 12 Aug 2021 17:45:47 -0500
o1bigtenor via Dng  wrote:

> Greetings
> 
> I am running a fairly old rig on debian testing with 2 gpus and want
> to run 5 monitors.
> The 5th is hdmi connected and is a 4k monitor with the other 4 all
> being 1920x1080.
> After I installed the 4k monitor I had regular graphics sub-system
> freezes (won't come out of suspend typically) with a normal being a
> system reboot at least once every 24 hours.
> I filed a bug report. Have subsequently unplugged the 4k monitor - -
> - - a lot of headache rebooting and setting up the machine at least
> 1x per day.

Setting up? As in reallocating desktops?

I'd be more inclined to look at HW/Sw problems when you are adding
something like a 4K screen. Is there sufficient ram?
Are you using the same driver for both GPUs?
Under beowulf, I couldn't load both the amdgpu and radeon drivers. 
Have you tried the other way around by setting up 4K, then add the
other monitors one by one?

Although they are rare, there are some odd problems affecting
different HW combos under Linux.

I have a problem where my gpu will not boot with two x 2k monitors on
DisplayPort cables. It is actually the amdgpu that stack crashes.
 
> 
> Recommendation is to download and install even a 5.14 (still in beta)
> kernel.
> 
> The newest kernel (changed just yesterday) for debian in debian
> experimental is a 5.13.?? version.
> 
> Dunno if I want to try a beta kernel (sorta scared to in fact).

IME, the worst that will happen is a entirely black screen; thus ssh
in to inspect or big red button to restart and then VERY Fast on boot
up to intercept the bios(set max timeout prior) to uninstall, or your
grub should give the option to go to a prior boot image. Note, at one
stage it accumulated them, but now it only keeps current and
previous boot image.

> Suggestions from y'all?
> (Y'all, or at least quite a number of you, have a lot more experience
> at this than I do.)
> 
> Please advise.

2c above.

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[DNG] Advice sought on kernel upgrade

[o1bigtenor via Dng]

Greetings

I am running a fairly old rig on debian testing with 2 gpus and want to run
5 monitors.
The 5th is hdmi connected and is a 4k monitor with the other 4 all being
1920x1080.
After I installed the 4k monitor I had regular graphics sub-system freezes
(won't come out of suspend typically) with a normal being a system reboot
at least once every 24 hours.
I filed a bug report. Have subsequently unplugged the 4k monitor - - - - a
lot of headache rebooting and setting up the machine at least 1x per day.

Recommendation is to download and install even a 5.14 (still in beta)
kernel.

The newest kernel (changed just yesterday) for debian in debian
experimental is a 5.13.?? version.

Dunno if I want to try a beta kernel (sorta scared to in fact).

Suggestions from y'all?
(Y'all, or at least quite a number of you, have a lot more experience at
this than I do.)

Please advise.
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Re: [DNG] Microsoft: Really? Yes. It's all about vapour

[Steve Litt]

Bernard Rosset via Dng said on Thu, 12 Aug 2021 19:22:28 +0200

>Foreseable, foreseen, and now happening.
>It is the logical and predictable move away from local installed 
>instances on own hardware to everything "cloud"/vapourous.

I agree.

>
>Said move is *not* user-focused (despite marketing - aka "bullshit" - 
>about "simplicity" that will ensue), but is operator-focused... as the 
>whole "cloud" thing is: it eases things for the service provider on
>many levels.

I agree.

>
>Welcome to the Software-as-a-Service world.
>This has been the go-to cash cow for 10-15 years or so: you do not own 
>things anymore, as you rent them.

I agree 1000%. I was just bitching about this a few days ago in regard
to that estupido Pelaton exercise machine. $49/month for life.

>Almost guaranteed continuous income as the vendor lock-in is even more 
>violently ensured: stop to pay and you lose everything.
>The longer you stay, the more effective the effect, as habits and
>stored data grow.

Yes!

>Rents. Coercion by attrition of other means. No need to add value when 
>people cannot go around your scam.
>Invented by <...> ages ago. Adoption growing each and every day.

Unfortunately true.

>
>On a M$ business roadmap note, it was a foreseeable move from the CEO 
>which has pushed for unification and cloud-based since his arrival.
>- Azure
>- End of Windows Phone (it will come back, with a unified Windows)
>- Office 365
>- Windows 365

Which is why I'm sooo glad I use Linux.

>
>The gap is ever groing between people who understand what they are
>doing and ask for budget control and the mass consumer who has no idea
>nor who cares about what (s)he consumes, provided it's easy,
>immediate, and resonates well with his/her most immediate wishes.

Yes! Whether it's Red Hat pushing systemd, or Microsoft pushing OS as
a service, user ignorance is the vendor's friend.

SteveT

Steve Litt 
Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful
Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques
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Re: [DNG] Microsoft: Really? Yes. It's all about vapour

[Bernard Rosset via Dng]

Foreseable, foreseen, and now happening.
It is the logical and predictable move away from local installed 
instances on own hardware to everything "cloud"/vapourous.


Said move is *not* user-focused (despite marketing - aka "bullshit" - 
about "simplicity" that will ensue), but is operator-focused... as the 
whole "cloud" thing is: it eases things for the service provider on many 
levels.


Welcome to the Software-as-a-Service world.
This has been the go-to cash cow for 10-15 years or so: you do not own 
things anymore, as you rent them.
Almost guaranteed continuous income as the vendor lock-in is even more 
violently ensured: stop to pay and you lose everything.
The longer you stay, the more effective the effect, as habits and stored 
data grow.


Rents. Coercion by attrition of other means. No need to add value when 
people cannot go around your scam.

Invented by <...> ages ago. Adoption growing each and every day.

On a M$ business roadmap note, it was a foreseeable move from the CEO 
which has pushed for unification and cloud-based since his arrival.

- Azure
- End of Windows Phone (it will come back, with a unified Windows)
- Office 365
- Windows 365

The gap is ever groing between people who understand what they are doing 
and ask for budget control and the mass consumer who has no idea nor who 
cares about what (s)he consumes, provided it's easy, immediate, and 
resonates well with his/her most immediate wishes.

Bernard (Beer) Rosset
https://rosset.net/
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Re: [DNG] Microsoft: Really?

[Simon Hobson]

Mark Rousell  wrote:

> As I see it there are only two USPs for a service like this:
> 
> (1) It's accessible for anywhere you have Internet access and a computing 
> device.
> 
> (2) It is (I presume) backed up so you don't need to run your own backups... 
> well, in theory. In practice that should not be relied upon but people 
> definitely will give up doing their own backups due to systems like this.

You missed what is possibly the most important for many businesses :

(3) It's able to be bought as Opex rather than Capex.

Put another way, someone, somewhere, in the organisation can buy this on their 
expenses and cut out the IT department. They don't need to create a business 
case and go through an approvals process to spend on a capital asset - it just 
hides away in the operating budget for the department.
That in part is behind the rapid rise of a number of "something as a service" 
offerings - they can be hidden in departmental operating budgets instead of 
having to go and get capital approval, and allowing the IT dept to veto it.

So some middle manager somewhere who's got a crappy old PC can get themselves a 
nice juicy one in the cloud as long as they can cover the cost in their 
expenses. The fact that it ends up costing the company more than if they 
actually bought him a better one is besides the point - he's presumably doing 
this because they asked for a better PC and that request was turned down.

Simon

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Re: [DNG] Nasty Linux systemd security bug revealed

[Steve Litt]

aitor said on Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:41:44 +0200

>On 12/8/21 13:12, aitor wrote:
>>     struct sbuf s  __cleanbuf__(free_buf);  
>I rectify:
>
>struct sbuf s  __cleanbuf__;
>
>being:
>
>#define __cleanbuf__ __attribute__((cleanup(free_buf)))

I see the attraction, Aitor, but doing this has some downsides:

1) GCC only. Everything going into the Void distro must be MUSL also,
   so the question is whether MUSL can accommodate it.

2) You'd better do *a lot* of commenting to explain that, because
   nobody learned about it in K In your comments I'd have pointers
   to other resources like
   http://unixwiz.net/techtips/gnu-c-attributes.html as well as
   something you author yourself.

So the question becomes whether this barrier to forgetting to free() is
worth those downsides, which complicate your code and get the
programmer in the habit of NOT free()ing when needed.

SteveT

Steve Litt 
Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful
Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques
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Re: [DNG] Microsoft: Really?

[Arnt Karlsen]

On Thu, 12 Aug 2021 05:59:38 -0500, o1bigtenor wrote in message 
:

> On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 9:57 PM Mark Rousell
>  wrote:
> 
> > On 12/08/2021 03:49, Steve Litt wrote:
> >
> > Check out this article:
> > https://www.computerworld.com/article/3628169/windows-365-costs-how-much.html
> >
> > Windows 365...
> >
> > So let me get this straight:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > Of course the real effect of this is that Mocrosoft takes
> > possession of every single bit of your computing experience, making
> > it extremely hard for you to ever escape.
> >
> > Yup, all that and you still need some sort of computing device to
> > connect to their cloud service.
> >  
> 
> No mention of the added availability for any taxation service to
> 'really' check out everything that a 
> business is doing - - - you know - - - just to 'make sure' that
> everything is legit! (Don't forget you'll get to pay for this added service 
> too!)
> 
> I'm worried about using a web hosting service - - - - this offering -
> - - -
> - over my dead body!

..you guys have biometric passports?  :o)  I don't. ;o)
Imagine where those data get to go playing...  ;oD

> My present computer - - - wasn't cheap to setup some 9.5 years ago
> but its stats would still
> blow the doors off that offering!
> Oh well - - -- the sheeple will 'love' the convenience
> The desire for cheap is going to destroy our society (if it hasn't
> already!!!).
> 
> Regards


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
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Re: [DNG] Nasty Linux systemd security bug revealed

[aitor]

On 12/8/21 13:12, aitor wrote:

    struct sbuf s  __cleanbuf__(free_buf);

I rectify:

struct sbuf s  __cleanbuf__;

being:

#define __cleanbuf__ __attribute__((cleanup(free_buf)))



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Re: [DNG] Nasty Linux systemd security bug revealed

[aitor]

Hi,

On 31/7/21 11:20, aitor wrote:

On 31/7/21 3:02, Bruce Perens via Dng wrote:
If you want this, it's easy enough to allocate your own stack, and 
write functions that allocate from it and release the allocation.


Sometimes I use the following buffer struct for dynamic allocation:

https://gitea.devuan.dev/aitor_czr/libnetaid/src/branch/master/backend_src/sbuf.c 



A tiny version of the one developed by Johan Malm (bunsenlabs):

https://github.com/johanmalm/jgmenu/blob/master/src/sbuf.c 



I added a variadic function enabling the concatenation of several strings:

sbuf_concat(, N, string1, string2, ..., stringN);

I added a new feature to the sbuf struct using the *cleanup* common 
variable attribute [*] which runs automatically the function:


void free_buf(struct sbuf *s)
{
    free(s->buf);
}

when the variable goes out of the scope.

You can test this behavior (the complete example is here: 
https://www.gnuinos.org/sbuf/ ) running 
the following program:


#include 
#include "sbuf.h"

int main(int argc, char **argv)
{
    struct sbuf s  __cleanbuf__(free_buf);
    sbuf_init();
    sbuf_addstr(, "oo");

    return 0;
}

When the memory is deallocated, the program will print:

Cleaning up->"oo"

Cheers,

Aitor.

[*] 
https://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc/Common-Variable-Attributes.html#Common-Variable-Attributes 






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Re: [DNG] Microsoft: Really?

[o1bigtenor via Dng]

On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 9:57 PM Mark Rousell 
wrote:

> On 12/08/2021 03:49, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> Check out this article:
> https://www.computerworld.com/article/3628169/windows-365-costs-how-much.html
>
> Windows 365...
>
> So let me get this straight:
>
> [...]
>
> Of course the real effect of this is that Mocrosoft takes possession of
> every single bit of your computing experience, making it extremely hard
> for you to ever escape.
>
> Yup, all that and you still need some sort of computing device to connect
> to their cloud service.
>

No mention of the added availability for any taxation service to 'really'
check out everything that a
business is doing - - - you know - - - just to 'make sure' that everything
is legit! (Don't forget you'll
get to pay for this added service too!)

I'm worried about using a web hosting service - - - - this offering - - - -
- over my dead body!

My present computer - - - wasn't cheap to setup some 9.5 years ago but its
stats would still
blow the doors off that offering!
Oh well - - -- the sheeple will 'love' the convenience
The desire for cheap is going to destroy our society (if it hasn't
already!!!).

Regards
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Re: [DNG] malfunctioning graphical application

[g4sra via Dng]

<--snip-->
> The problem with mouse-drag does not occur on the other disk.

<--snip-->
> Of note is that when I start /usr/games/sol as root the problem
> disappars---I can drag cards just fine.

This implies that your issue is 'user' based.
One of the re-occurring issues with (GUI) applications after an update can be 
traced to the 'user's personal configuration files for the previous application 
version.

It runs as 'root' but not as 'user'-> it is either a permission issue or a 
'user' configuration issue.

Two steps you could try...
Create a new 'user' and login. See if the app runs as non-root (no prior use of 
the application - no stale personal configuration files, rules out a 
permissions issue).

For the user that cannot run the app, purge all personal configuration files 
for the application, these can be tricky to find.
Your desktop will determine where they are placed..

E.g.
.kde
.trinity
.config
.cache

A good punt is to purge all of '.cache' and then strip out anything in 
'.config' (if it exists, or look elsewhere).

[user@localhost:~]$ rm -fr .cache/*
[user@localhost:~]$ find .config -iname "aisleriot"
.config/gnome-games/aisleriot

[user@localhost:~]$ rm -fr .config/gnome-games/aisleriot






publickey - g4sra@protonmail.com - 0x42E94623.asc
Description: application/pgp-keys


signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature
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Re: [DNG] malfunctioning graphical application

[Hendrik Boom]

On Thu, Aug 12, 2021 at 04:25:09AM -0400, Haines Brown wrote:
> 
> I had trouble understanding your suggestion to use ps with -o cmd. 
> For me, the -o option for the ps command is to specify format. Were you 
> suggesting that I do: $ ps -o aisleriot ?

I think he meant
ps -o cmd
instead of
ps -o aisleriot

-- hendrik
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Re: [DNG] malfunctioning graphical application

[Haines Brown]

On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 10:22:35AM +, g4sra via Dng wrote:
> <--snip-->
> 
> When you really have no idea where to start (after looking through 
> all logs, obviously)... 
>
> Use 'ps' with the '-o cmd' option to find out *exactly* how the 
> executable is being invoked. After killing everything, paste the 
> command in a terminal window and execute it from there. Watch the 
> text that scrolls by in that terminal window for anything erroneous!

Thanks for the response. I tried pulling keyboard and substituting 
another mouse, but that had no effect. Since I have no other odd 
behaviors using mouse to drag I'm not surprised.

I powered down and then could not log beck in when I rebooted. Ran 
update-grub from Cimaera on another disk and for some obscure reason 
I could then log in. 

The problem with mouse-drag does not occur on the other disk disk.

Purging aisleriot and reinstalling did not help

I checked .xsession-errors and other logs and found no signs of 
trouble. 

I had trouble understanding your suggestion to use ps with -o cmd. 
For me, the -o option for the ps command is to specify format. Were you 
suggesting that I do: $ ps -o aisleriot ?

Of note is that when I start /usr/games/sol as root the problem 
disappars---I can drag cards just fine. 

-- 
Haines Brown  
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