Re: [DNG] https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html

2019-09-08 Thread Ismael L. Donis Garcia 
- Original Message - 
From: NCW RC via Dng

To: dng
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2019 2:25 PM
Subject: [DNG] 
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html


I hope I did this maillist reply correctly.  I am doing it with webmail, 
not an email client.



libpam-systemd depends systemd-sysv. libpam-systemd also depends
systemd. Devuan's libpam-elogind provides libpam-systemd but conflicts 
with

systemd which must be removed first.

However, to get systemd uninstalled we first have to replace systemd-sysv 
with

sysvinit-core (leaving systemd installed) and reboot. systemd and elogind
conflict so we cannot use libpam-elogind to replace libpam-systemd *yet*.

This is the point we need a transitional package to temporarily satisfy
libpam-systemd's systemd-sysv dependency whilst the system is rebooted.

After reboot, systemd is no longer PID1 so can be removed and we can then
complete the transition replacing libpam-systemd with libpam-elogind, 
removing

systemd and installing elogind.

I hope that is clearer.



I can get the general grasp of this information as I think a similar shim 
was used in devuan when it was first forked.


What I found to get sysvinit-core installed was to

-boot into the debian install, and before changing the sources list to 
point to devuan,

-run "apt install sysvinit-core"


then,  alter the sources.list to point to beowulf and,
"apt update"
"apt upgrade"
"reboot"

No errors were noted and upon a reboot, sysvinit is running as PID1 and the 
migration can continue in a manner similar to what it has been in the past.


Trying to install sysvinit-core after the sources.list pointed to beowulf 
caused many problems and I never could get it done that way.


I documented my test migration of a buster Xfce install at:
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=17716#p17716



You did not try the following order:
- modify sources.list
- apt-get update
- apt-get install devuan-keyring
- apt-get install sysvinit-core
- reboot
- apt-get upgrade

Best Regards
--
Ismael


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Re: [DNG] https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html

2019-09-08 Thread Mark Hindley 
On Sat, Sep 07, 2019 at 11:16:20PM -0400, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> > > This is the point we need a transitional package to temporarily satisfy
> > > libpam-systemd's systemd-sysv dependency whilst the system is rebooted.
> 
> It it there yet?  If not, could you let us know when it arrives?  I could 
> delay my test upgrade in case it might test whether these changes work 
> properly.

I hope to have one for initial testing later today.

Mark
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Re: [DNG] https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html

2019-09-08 Thread Mark Hindley 
On Sat, Sep 07, 2019 at 06:25:02PM +, NCW RC via Dng wrote:
>I documented my test migration of a buster Xfce install at:
> 
>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=17716#p17716

Thanks.

Yes, that mirrors my experience. I am hoping that I have a way to avoid the
removal and reinstallation of policykit, lightdm etc that you found.

I would also love to understand why dbus is slow after the reboot.

Mark

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Re: [DNG] https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html

2019-09-07 Thread Hendrik Boom 
On Sat, Sep 07, 2019 at 06:25:02PM +, NCW RC via Dng wrote:
> I hope I did this maillist reply correctly.  I am doing it with webmail, not 
> an email client.
> 
> > libpam-systemd depends systemd-sysv. libpam-systemd also depends
> > systemd. Devuan's libpam-elogind provides libpam-systemd but conflicts with
> > systemd which must be removed first.
> >
> > However, to get systemd uninstalled we first have to replace systemd-sysv 
> > with
> > sysvinit-core (leaving systemd installed) and reboot. systemd and elogind
> > conflict so we cannot use libpam-elogind to replace libpam-systemd *yet*.
> >
> > This is the point we need a transitional package to temporarily satisfy
> > libpam-systemd's systemd-sysv dependency whilst the system is rebooted.

It it there yet?  If not, could you let us know when it arrives?  I could 
delay my test upgrade in case it might test whether these changes work 
properly.

> >
> > After reboot, systemd is no longer PID1 so can be removed and we can then
> > complete the transition replacing libpam-systemd with libpam-elogind, 
> > removing
> > systemd and installing elogind.
> >
> > I hope that is clearer.
> >
> 
> I can get the general grasp of this information as I think a similar shim was 
> used in devuan when it was first forked.
> 
> What I found to get sysvinit-core installed was to
> -boot into the debian install, and before changing the sources list to point 
> to devuan,
> -run "apt install sysvinit-core"
> 
> then,  alter the sources.list to point to beowulf and,
> "apt update"
> "apt upgrade"
> "reboot"
> 
> No errors were noted and upon a reboot, sysvinit is running as PID1 and the 
> migration can continue in a manner similar to what it has been in the past.
> 
> Trying to install sysvinit-core after the sources.list pointed to beowulf 
> caused many problems and I never could get it done that way.
> 
> I documented my test migration of a buster Xfce install at:
> https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=17716#p17716
> 
> 
> 
> 

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[DNG] https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190907.165012.d27df505.en.html

2019-09-07 Thread NCW RC via Dng 
I hope I did this maillist reply correctly.  I am doing it with webmail, not an 
email client.

> libpam-systemd depends systemd-sysv. libpam-systemd also depends
> systemd. Devuan's libpam-elogind provides libpam-systemd but conflicts with
> systemd which must be removed first.
>
> However, to get systemd uninstalled we first have to replace systemd-sysv with
> sysvinit-core (leaving systemd installed) and reboot. systemd and elogind
> conflict so we cannot use libpam-elogind to replace libpam-systemd *yet*.
>
> This is the point we need a transitional package to temporarily satisfy
> libpam-systemd's systemd-sysv dependency whilst the system is rebooted.
>
> After reboot, systemd is no longer PID1 so can be removed and we can then
> complete the transition replacing libpam-systemd with libpam-elogind, removing
> systemd and installing elogind.
>
> I hope that is clearer.
>

I can get the general grasp of this information as I think a similar shim was 
used in devuan when it was first forked.

What I found to get sysvinit-core installed was to
-boot into the debian install, and before changing the sources list to point to 
devuan,
-run "apt install sysvinit-core"

then,  alter the sources.list to point to beowulf and,
"apt update"
"apt upgrade"
"reboot"

No errors were noted and upon a reboot, sysvinit is running as PID1 and the 
migration can continue in a manner similar to what it has been in the past.

Trying to install sysvinit-core after the sources.list pointed to beowulf 
caused many problems and I never could get it done that way.

I documented my test migration of a buster Xfce install at:
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=17716#p17716




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