Re: [doctrine-user] Immutable Entities and Uuids - what should i do ?

[djuckfomla]

This is the answer i was hoping for. Thank you.

On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 8:54:33 AM UTC+2, Marco Pivetta wrote:
>
> I talked about 100M+, at which point I'd question if operations should 
> ever go through a serialisation layer (Doctrine) anyway.
>
> Basically: is an 8 times larger (than a smallint) column really the 
> problem here?
>
> Even then you can replace UUID generator with a global identifier 
> generator producing INT(8) (sequence-alike - use a DB that has sequences, 
> not MySQL).
>
> Even then, your processes depend on the speed of a centralised generator.
>
> Going back to the initial AUTO_INCREMENT scenario, when dealing with that 
> data amount you probably want to batch inserts, and fetching the last 
> insert id when batching is not really supported.
>
>
> On 10 Oct 2017 02:38,  wrote:
>
> Although i get your point of view, and i appreciate your answer, i don't 
> like to design my database on the assumption that there will be 100 records 
> in it. If that would be the case, i wouldn't even bother asking for your 
> advice/opinion in the first place.  
>
>
> On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 1:17:16 AM UTC+2, Marco Pivetta wrote:
>
>> Why is everyone stuck with this silly performance question?
>>
>> Let's talk again when we have 100M+ records, shall we? Until then, it's 
>> 16b vs 2b.
>>
>> The fact that you are using PHP is your first performance/memory 
>> bottleneck.
>>
>> Marco Pivetta 
>>
>> http://twitter.com/Ocramius  
>>
>> http://ocramius.github.com/
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 9, 2017 at 10:44 PM,  wrote:
>>
>>> I've recently stumbled on a Marco Pivetta's PHP Conf speech about 
>>> Doctrine Best Practices and Tricks,
>>> and i really like solutions and the whole idea of immutability.
>>>
>>> Even tho, if one wants to achieve Immutability, he cant use 
>>> auto-incremented integer strategy anymore, because it would break the 
>>> immutability concept, and Uuid's come in handy here i understand it, but my 
>>> concern is how it will affect my database performance, *and at the end 
>>> of the day, would it be worth of implementing Uuid's just for the sake of 
>>> immutability.*
>>>
>>> I don't have much experience in Uuid's but recently i've been 
>>> researching this topic, and im aware that Sequenced Uuids exist, and they 
>>> are much easier to index than totally random ones, but its still unclear to 
>>> me, should i take this as solution to my business logic or not, because 
>>> there are a lot of debate's on this topic on forums going back and forth, 
>>> too many opinions and im unable to make decision.
>>>
>>> *Anyway, question is, is there big performance issues when it comes to 
>>> reading and inserting data, also when working with joins and 
>>> relationships,if i use Uuids, and also, what would be ideal implementation 
>>> of them for sake of better performance ?*
>>>
>>> Btw im working in MySql, if that helps. Even tho i would really like to 
>>> see Pivetta's answer, any help or answer would be highly appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "doctrine-user" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to doctrine-use...@googlegroups.com.
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>>>
>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/doctrine-user.
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>>
>>
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Re: [doctrine-user] Immutable Entities and Uuids - what should i do ?

[Marco Pivetta]

I talked about 100M+, at which point I'd question if operations should ever
go through a serialisation layer (Doctrine) anyway.

Basically: is an 8 times larger (than a smallint) column really the problem
here?

Even then you can replace UUID generator with a global identifier generator
producing INT(8) (sequence-alike - use a DB that has sequences, not MySQL).

Even then, your processes depend on the speed of a centralised generator.

Going back to the initial AUTO_INCREMENT scenario, when dealing with that
data amount you probably want to batch inserts, and fetching the last
insert id when batching is not really supported.


On 10 Oct 2017 02:38,  wrote:

Although i get your point of view, and i appreciate your answer, i don't
like to design my database on the assumption that there will be 100 records
in it. If that would be the case, i wouldn't even bother asking for your
advice/opinion in the first place.


On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 1:17:16 AM UTC+2, Marco Pivetta wrote:

> Why is everyone stuck with this silly performance question?
>
> Let's talk again when we have 100M+ records, shall we? Until then, it's
> 16b vs 2b.
>
> The fact that you are using PHP is your first performance/memory
> bottleneck.
>
> Marco Pivetta
>
> http://twitter.com/Ocramius
>
> http://ocramius.github.com/
>
> On Mon, Oct 9, 2017 at 10:44 PM,  wrote:
>
>> I've recently stumbled on a Marco Pivetta's PHP Conf speech about
>> Doctrine Best Practices and Tricks,
>> and i really like solutions and the whole idea of immutability.
>>
>> Even tho, if one wants to achieve Immutability, he cant use
>> auto-incremented integer strategy anymore, because it would break the
>> immutability concept, and Uuid's come in handy here i understand it, but my
>> concern is how it will affect my database performance, *and at the end
>> of the day, would it be worth of implementing Uuid's just for the sake of
>> immutability.*
>>
>> I don't have much experience in Uuid's but recently i've been researching
>> this topic, and im aware that Sequenced Uuids exist, and they are much
>> easier to index than totally random ones, but its still unclear to me,
>> should i take this as solution to my business logic or not, because there
>> are a lot of debate's on this topic on forums going back and forth, too
>> many opinions and im unable to make decision.
>>
>> *Anyway, question is, is there big performance issues when it comes to
>> reading and inserting data, also when working with joins and
>> relationships,if i use Uuids, and also, what would be ideal implementation
>> of them for sake of better performance ?*
>>
>> Btw im working in MySql, if that helps. Even tho i would really like to
>> see Pivetta's answer, any help or answer would be highly appreciated.
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "doctrine-user" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to doctrine-use...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to doctri...@googlegroups.com.
>>
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/doctrine-user.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>
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Re: [doctrine-user] Immutable Entities and Uuids - what should i do ?

[djuckfomla]

Although i get your point of view, and i appreciate your answer, i don't 
like to design my database on the assumption that there will be 100 records 
in it. If that would be the case, i wouldn't even bother asking for your 
advice/opinion in the first place.  

On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 1:17:16 AM UTC+2, Marco Pivetta wrote:
>
> Why is everyone stuck with this silly performance question?
>
> Let's talk again when we have 100M+ records, shall we? Until then, it's 
> 16b vs 2b.
>
> The fact that you are using PHP is your first performance/memory 
> bottleneck.
>
> Marco Pivetta 
>
> http://twitter.com/Ocramius  
>
> http://ocramius.github.com/
>
> On Mon, Oct 9, 2017 at 10:44 PM,  wrote:
>
>> I've recently stumbled on a Marco Pivetta's PHP Conf speech about 
>> Doctrine Best Practices and Tricks,
>> and i really like solutions and the whole idea of immutability.
>>
>> Even tho, if one wants to achieve Immutability, he cant use 
>> auto-incremented integer strategy anymore, because it would break the 
>> immutability concept, and Uuid's come in handy here i understand it, but my 
>> concern is how it will affect my database performance, *and at the end 
>> of the day, would it be worth of implementing Uuid's just for the sake of 
>> immutability.*
>>
>> I don't have much experience in Uuid's but recently i've been researching 
>> this topic, and im aware that Sequenced Uuids exist, and they are much 
>> easier to index than totally random ones, but its still unclear to me, 
>> should i take this as solution to my business logic or not, because there 
>> are a lot of debate's on this topic on forums going back and forth, too 
>> many opinions and im unable to make decision.
>>
>> *Anyway, question is, is there big performance issues when it comes to 
>> reading and inserting data, also when working with joins and 
>> relationships,if i use Uuids, and also, what would be ideal implementation 
>> of them for sake of better performance ?*
>>
>> Btw im working in MySql, if that helps. Even tho i would really like to 
>> see Pivetta's answer, any help or answer would be highly appreciated.
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "doctrine-user" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to doctrine-use...@googlegroups.com .
>> To post to this group, send email to doctri...@googlegroups.com 
>> .
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/doctrine-user.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>
>

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Re: [doctrine-user] Immutable Entities and Uuids - what should i do ?

[Marco Pivetta]

Why is everyone stuck with this silly performance question?

Let's talk again when we have 100M+ records, shall we? Until then, it's 16b
vs 2b.

The fact that you are using PHP is your first performance/memory bottleneck.

Marco Pivetta

http://twitter.com/Ocramius

http://ocramius.github.com/

On Mon, Oct 9, 2017 at 10:44 PM,  wrote:

> I've recently stumbled on a Marco Pivetta's PHP Conf speech about Doctrine
> Best Practices and Tricks,
> and i really like solutions and the whole idea of immutability.
>
> Even tho, if one wants to achieve Immutability, he cant use
> auto-incremented integer strategy anymore, because it would break the
> immutability concept, and Uuid's come in handy here i understand it, but my
> concern is how it will affect my database performance, *and at the end of
> the day, would it be worth of implementing Uuid's just for the sake of
> immutability.*
>
> I don't have much experience in Uuid's but recently i've been researching
> this topic, and im aware that Sequenced Uuids exist, and they are much
> easier to index than totally random ones, but its still unclear to me,
> should i take this as solution to my business logic or not, because there
> are a lot of debate's on this topic on forums going back and forth, too
> many opinions and im unable to make decision.
>
> *Anyway, question is, is there big performance issues when it comes to
> reading and inserting data, also when working with joins and
> relationships,if i use Uuids, and also, what would be ideal implementation
> of them for sake of better performance ?*
>
> Btw im working in MySql, if that helps. Even tho i would really like to
> see Pivetta's answer, any help or answer would be highly appreciated.
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "doctrine-user" group.
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> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/doctrine-user.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

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[doctrine-user] Immutable Entities and Uuids - what should i do ?

[djuckfomla]

I've recently stumbled on a Marco Pivetta's PHP Conf speech about Doctrine 
Best Practices and Tricks,
and i really like solutions and the whole idea of immutability.

Even tho, if one wants to achieve Immutability, he cant use 
auto-incremented integer strategy anymore, because it would break the 
immutability concept, and Uuid's come in handy here i understand it, but my 
concern is how it will affect my database performance, *and at the end of 
the day, would it be worth of implementing Uuid's just for the sake of 
immutability.*

I don't have much experience in Uuid's but recently i've been researching 
this topic, and im aware that Sequenced Uuids exist, and they are much 
easier to index than totally random ones, but its still unclear to me, 
should i take this as solution to my business logic or not, because there 
are a lot of debate's on this topic on forums going back and forth, too 
many opinions and im unable to make decision.

*Anyway, question is, is there big performance issues when it comes to 
reading and inserting data, also when working with joins and 
relationships,if i use Uuids, and also, what would be ideal implementation 
of them for sake of better performance ?*

Btw im working in MySql, if that helps. Even tho i would really like to see 
Pivetta's answer, any help or answer would be highly appreciated.


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