Re: [drakelist] R7(A) SL500, 500 Hz filter

[Lars E. Pettersson]

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On Tue, 2004-12-07 at 05:02, Rein A. Smit wrote:
 I am looking for the specs of a SL500 filter crystal for the R7/R7a
 
 How many crystals?

8 poles.

 Form factor  6 dB/ 60 dB bandwidth

See the TR7 manual,
http://www.wb4hfn.com/DrakeManuals/TR7/Drake_TR7_12.jpg

6dB 500 Hz
60 dB 1100 Hz

 In and output impeadance

50 ohm

 Ultimate rejection.

Do not know...

73 de Lars, sm6rpz
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Re: [drakelist] R7(A) SL500, 500 Hz filter

[Rein A. Smit]

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Hi Lars,
Thanks. I should have waited with the question as I found I believe
another side with a partial R7 manual, no schematics. And there, the
auxiliary filters were listed. The ultimate rejection is around
-80/-90 dB.
Thanks again es 73
Rein W6/PA0ZN
Lars E. Pettersson wrote:
Lars E. Pettersson [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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On Tue, 2004-12-07 at 05:02, Rein A. Smit wrote:
I am looking for the specs of a SL500 filter crystal for the R7/R7a
How many crystals?

8 poles.

Form factor  6 dB/ 60 dB bandwidth

See the TR7 manual,
http://www.wb4hfn.com/DrakeManuals/TR7/Drake_TR7_12.jpg
6dB 500 Hz
60 dB 1100 Hz

In and output impeadance

50 ohm

Ultimate rejection.

Do not know...
73 de Lars, sm6rpz
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[drakelist] Dayton hamvention 05

[Don]

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Hello Drake fans,and others;
Its time to set up our Drake Forum once again,just wondering what points of 
interest all of you may want us to put in the agenda.
Hopefully this year we can get everyone mentioned in the Hamvention 
program,had probelms getting it done before..
Also do we need two hours again???
Due to the several deaths in the family,I could not attend last year,but if 
all goes well,I will be the moderator next year,along with some help...
Thanks for reading,all replies welcome..Don,w8ns 

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Re: [drakelist] Expensive R-4C

[Jason Buchanan]

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Eric Webner wrote:
Agreed. Without getting into too much technical speak, the R-4C lends 
itself to becoming a top-notch competition grade receiver. With the 
proper roofing filter and the mixer mods, etc., this rig will hear 
stuff that many modern rigs won't. The dynamic range is even up there 
with the Yaesu FT-1000 series.
 
A couple weeks ago, a completely hot-rod R-4C went for $1075. The 
cost of the mods was advertised as being over $800.

I saw one top almost $1100 - I had to re-read it twice - hi
I think I will invest the money instead in TLC for my B line - any 
recommendations for where I could send my B line for recalibration?

73 Jason N1SU
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Re: [drakelist] Expensive R-4C

[Ron Wagner]

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This discussion makes me wonder.  How bad is the R4B and TR7 vs say a 
modified up R4C?  I know that I have read about the R4C and the close-in 
5Kc signals with out a roofing filter.  What about the other two?  Is 
there some teaching reading on the web?  Does the passive up conversion on 
the TR7 avoid issues?  I would think that distortion and mixing would be a 
problem any time you do not have a filter to cut the signals before you 
hit an amplifier and or mixer.

I have been hamming for over 25 years, and honestly do not understand all 
the numbers, but would like a better understanding.

Agreed. Without getting into too much technical speak, the R-4C lends 
itself to becoming a top-notch competition grade receiver. With the 
proper roofing filter and the mixer mods, etc., this rig will hear stuff 
that many modern rigs won't. The dynamic range is even up there with the 
Yaesu FT-1000 series.
And speaking of R4B mods, how good of an idea is the crystal filter mod? 
The one where you sacrifice a T4XB for a IF can and xtal filters.  Is it 
worth getting a basket case T4XB to perform the addition?  Was thinking Al 
Parker has spoken of this mod before.  I have a copy of the doc, but have 
never gone any further.

I think I will invest the money instead in TLC for my B line - any
73,
Ron
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[drakelist] TR-7 Receiver Noise

[vmilam]

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Greetings.
I recently put a TR-7 on the air that I purchased several months ago. All is 
fine except that there is what I can best describe as a low frequency rumble 
noise that is most noticable when using headphones. It is very audible even 
with the RF gain set to max and the audio gain set to min. I have listed with 
another receiver and do not hear this noise, so I don't think I have any 
interference in the shack. 
When tuning in signals, there does not appear to be any distortion, but the 
background noise is very noticable.
Any suggestions greatly appreciated.
Vic K5TAG 
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Re: [drakelist] Dayton hamvention 05

[Eric Webner]

I've not participated in the past (only recently got into Drake equipement), but definately sign me up! 

Don't know what the format usually is, but maybe if there was a theme such as how to get the most out of the various Drake models, sources for parts  mods, that kind of thing.

Eric
KA8FAN
Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
"Don" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>made an utterence to the drakelist gang--Hello Drake fans,and others;Its time to set up our Drake Forum once again,just wondering what points of interest all of you may want us to put in the agenda.Hopefully this year we can get everyone mentioned in the Hamvention program,had probelms getting it done before..Also do we need two hours again???Due to the several deaths in the family,I could not attend last year,but if all goes well,I will be the moderator next year,along with some help...Thanks for reading,all replies welcome..Don,w8ns --On Behalf of "Don" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Submissions: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -
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Re: [drakelist] Expensive R-4C

[Garey Barrell]

Garey Barrell [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Ron -
The main difference between the R-4C and the earlier models is the 
change in the second IF filters from L-C to Crystal Filters.  The 
difference comes in the skirt selectivity or how steep the sides of 
the filter passband are.  All this means is that as you listen to a 
particular signal, nearby signals drop faster down the steeper skirts.  
If you compare the filter curves in the R-4B manual with those in the 
R-4C manual, you'll see the difference.

You are correct in wanting the filters as near the front of the receiver 
as possible.  The roofing filter limits the amount of RF that reaches 
the second mixer.  The Preselector also helps to limit how much of the 
band the receiver first mixer is subjected to.  The R-4B has an 8 kHz 
wide roofing filter in the first IF, but it is only a 4 pole filter.  
The number of poles determines the steepness of the skirts, more poles = 
steeper skirts.  The R-4C has an 8 kHz wide 8 pole roofing filter, and 
so has steeper skirts.

The TR-7 is somewhat better, in that it's first mixer is passive, with a 
large LO signal, allowing it to handle larger signals without 
overloading and generating spurious garbage.  On the other hand, the 
first mixer is subjected to the entire band (no preselector).  The 
advantage is not so much the up conversion as it is being a passive 
mixer able to handle large signals without overloading.

Generally speaking all this isn't critical in day-to-day hamming.  Where 
it really becomes important is in contesting where you have wall-to-wall 
STRONG signals and you're trying to pick one weak one out of all that 
mess.  Personally, I prefer the gentler slope of the LC filters as I can 
hear other signals nearby, but at reduced levels.  If I get a really 
strong interfering signal, I can use the passband tuning to shove him 
further down the skirt.  I get claustrophobic with narrow, sharp filters!

I don't think adding the crystal filters to the R-4B is a particularly 
good idea.  Why tear up one of the best receivers Drake ever made?  You 
are altering the gain distribution of the receiver, and not really 
gaining all that much in skirt selectivity.  I admit to being prejudiced 
though, I much prefer to use this equipment the way it was designed.  If 
you want crystal filters, get an R-4C.   By the way, the T-4X filters 
are only 4 pole filters and aren't all that much steeper than the LC 
filters!  The T-4XB and C have 8 pole filters.

73, Garey - K4OAH
Atlanta
Ron Wagner wrote:
Ron Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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This discussion makes me wonder.  How bad is the R4B and TR7 vs say 
a modified up R4C?  I know that I have read about the R4C and the 
close-in 5Kc signals with out a roofing filter.  What about the other 
two?  Is there some teaching reading on the web?  Does the passive up 
conversion on the TR7 avoid issues?  I would think that distortion and 
mixing would be a problem any time you do not have a filter to cut the 
signals before you hit an amplifier and or mixer.

I have been hamming for over 25 years, and honestly do not understand 
all the numbers, but would like a better understanding.

Agreed. Without getting into too much technical speak, the R-4C 
lends itself to becoming a top-notch competition grade receiver. 
With the proper roofing filter and the mixer mods, etc., this rig 
will hear stuff that many modern rigs won't. The dynamic range is 
even up there with the Yaesu FT-1000 series.

And speaking of R4B mods, how good of an idea is the crystal filter 
mod? The one where you sacrifice a T4XB for a IF can and xtal 
filters.  Is it worth getting a basket case T4XB to perform the 
addition?  Was thinking Al Parker has spoken of this mod before.  I 
have a copy of the doc, but have never gone any further.

I think I will invest the money instead in TLC for my B line - any

73,
Ron
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Re: [drakelist] Tubes for R4c

[Mark Gilger]

Mark Gilger [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Go to the following resource page.
http://www.wb4hfn.com/DrakeParts.htm
73's, Mark
At 11:51 AM 12/07/04, RMarch wrote:
RMarch [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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I am looking for 6EJ7's my drake R4C; also a 6BE6.  Does anyone know of a
good place to buy such tubes?  I once bought tubes from a place in Victoria
BC, but can't remember there name.
I was also thinking of converting the second mixer to a solid state mixer
(relax the need for retubing and perhaps improve performance).  Does anyone
have experience with doing that.  I would like to use diode ring dbm, but
the impedance's don't match well.Tnx,  Bob
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Re: [drakelist] Expensive R-4C

[Rein A. Smit]

Rein A. Smit [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Hi Ron,
 There are many texts on the internet about roofing filters, mixers,
high and low level ones, active and passive, high first IF vs low first 
IF etc., NF vs overload problems and pay-offs and so on.

   Here is a link, that I just ran into by:
  http://www2.arrl.org/tis/info/pdf/020708qex035.pdf
I ma not sure whether ARRL membership is required for this paper?
In relation to the R4C, you might search on Google for W8JI and again
you will find lots of papers, notes, remarks.
Also Bob Sherwood has published a number of papers over the years on
the R4C and its RF path.
QEX magazine is also an excellent source for this subject, in general
modern receiver design
Also the old hamradio magazine publish quite a few articles, look for
Ulrich Rohde There is an excellent book from the ARRL
 Experimental methods in RF design  and also an older
 Solid State design See also articles and design by KK7B
I hope this helps
73 Rein W6/PA0ZN

Ron Wagner wrote:
Ron Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
--
This discussion makes me wonder.  How bad is the R4B and TR7 vs say a 
modified up R4C?  I know that I have read about the R4C and the close-in 
5Kc signals with out a roofing filter.  What about the other two?  Is 
there some teaching reading on the web?  Does the passive up conversion 
on the TR7 avoid issues?  I would think that distortion and mixing would 
be a problem any time you do not have a filter to cut the signals before 
you hit an amplifier and or mixer.

I have been hamming for over 25 years, and honestly do not understand 
all the numbers, but would like a better understanding.

Agreed. Without getting into too much technical speak, the R-4C lends 
itself to becoming a top-notch competition grade receiver. With the 
proper roofing filter and the mixer mods, etc., this rig will hear 
stuff that many modern rigs won't. The dynamic range is even up there 
with the Yaesu FT-1000 series.

And speaking of R4B mods, how good of an idea is the crystal filter mod? 
The one where you sacrifice a T4XB for a IF can and xtal filters.  Is it 
worth getting a basket case T4XB to perform the addition?  Was thinking 
Al Parker has spoken of this mod before.  I have a copy of the doc, but 
have never gone any further.

I think I will invest the money instead in TLC for my B line - any

73,
Ron
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[drakelist] Drake cables

[Jason Buchanan]

Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the inter-connections 
between R-4B and T-4XB?  I got a generous performance increase by using 
the original Drake cables that I have - unfortunately the ones I have 
work only when twisted in a certain shape and that's not a way to run a 
railroad.  I'd prefer to get the real thing or equivalent.

73 Jason N1SU
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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[Mike Williams]

Mike Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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I see sets for sale on e-bay quite often, although I would avoid that source 
if at all possible.  I purchased a set from a member of this group some time 
ago when I couldn't locate my original set.  Paid around $30.00

Good luck,
Mike  W4DL
- Original Message - 
From: Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 2:38 PM
Subject: [drakelist] Drake cables


Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the inter-connections 
between R-4B and T-4XB?  I got a generous performance increase by using 
the original Drake cables that I have - unfortunately the ones I have work 
only when twisted in a certain shape and that's not a way to run a 
railroad.  I'd prefer to get the real thing or equivalent.

73 Jason N1SU
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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[Eric Webner]

If the supply of these cables ever dries up, can they be made, perhaps using RG-174 cable? Does anyone know any specs for these cables?

Eric
KA8FANe Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
"Mike Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>made an utterence to the drakelist gang--I see sets for sale on e-bay quite often, although I would avoid that source if at all possible. I purchased a set from a member of this group some time ago when I couldn't locate my original set. Paid around $30.00Good luck,Mike W4DL- Original Message - From: "Jason Buchanan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 2:38 PMSubject: [drakelist] Drake cables Jason Buchanan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>made an utterence to the drakelist gang -- Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the inter-connections 
 between R-4B and T-4XB? I got a generous performance increase by using  the original Drake cables that I have - unfortunately the ones I have work  only when twisted in a certain shape and that's not a way to run a  railroad. I'd prefer to get the real thing or equivalent. 73 Jason N1SU -- On Behalf of Jason Buchanan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Submissions: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - unsubscribe drakelist in  body Hopelessly Lost: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - help in body of message Zerobeat Web Page: http://www.zerobeat.net Brought to you courtesy of TLCHost.net http://www.tlchost.net/ -- --On Behalf of "Mi!
ke
 Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Submissions: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - unsubscribe drakelist in bodyHopelessly Lost: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - help in body of messageZerobeat Web Page: http://www.zerobeat.netBrought to you courtesy of TLCHost.net http://www.tlchost.net/--
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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[Ron Wagner]

Ron Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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You can use RG-62 cable and make them about the length of the original. 
www.zerobeat.net has very basic info.  Use RG-62 for injection, use 
micro-8 for antenna, and any old thing for mute and anti-vox.

This brings up a thought.  Anyone with the scoop, can you create 
some data for Thom and Ron to put on their web sites?  I know that the 
reason is the capacitance of the cable and the length might vary some 
compared to the original cables.  I am fairly sure I have seen the 
complete layout of RG cables capacitance and the Drake cables, but I can 
not find it.

Thanks to anyone who steps up and gathers the data for the web pages.
73,
Ron
Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the inter-connections 
between R-4B and T-4XB?  I got a generous performance increase by using the 
original Drake cables that I have - unfortunately the ones I have work only
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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[Don and Diana Cunningham]

You'll get better answers than this, probably, but 
from memory, the only "special" cable on the R4B/T4XB is the "injection" 
cable. It can be made from RG-62 cable and some microphone cables that are 
approx 12-14 pf per ft, if memory serves me tonight. All the others are 
simple, good quality, audio cables.
73,
Don, WB5HAK

Re: [drakelist] Expensive R-4C

[Rein A. Smit]

Rein A. Smit [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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  Hi Ron and others,
Another short note:
In 1999 May/June QEX, there was an article by DK4SX  that really 
connects the dots and points to the requirements for today's and future 
HF receivers. It is written in a straight forward way with little math 
and covers all the angles..

 Enjoy es 73
 Rein, W6/PA0ZN

Ron Wagner wrote:
Rein,
Thanks.  I do understand many of the ideas, just that my training is 25 
years old and I have done computers instead of electronics all my 
working career.  I do need to connect the dots more, as I never fully 
understood any of the figures.  I think my biggest problem is that I 
have all the theory (that I never used) and no real world experience.

I am ARRL life member, so I will be able to find the document.  Thanks 
for your reply.

73,
Ron

Visit my astronomy home page.   http://www.dma.org/~wagner
Amateur Radio Station: WD8SBB - Ron  and  KB8NRP - Joann


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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[Garey Barrell]

Garey Barrell [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Jason -
The original Drake supplied cables were all standard microphone
shielded wire, with the exception of the INJ cable.  All but the INJ
cable were similar to what is used in audio patch cables today.
All cables were 38 long tip-to-tip.
The INJ cable used a foam inner dielectric and phono connectors with a
white insulation.  This cable measures 60 pF total capacity.
All other cables used the standard for the day clear polyethelene inner
dielectric and phenolic (brown) insulated phono connectors and measures
~100 pF.
Original Drake INJ Cable = 19 pF/ft = .160 o.d. (foam poly)
RG-62 = 93R = 13.5 pF/ft = 0.240 o.d.
RG-59 = 75R = 14.8 pF/ft = 0.242 o.d.
RG-6 = 75R = 16.2 pF/ft = 0.270 o.d.
RG-174= 50R = 30.8 pF/ft = 0.110 o.d.
Mic Cable (Belden 8410) = Hi-Z = 33 pf/ft = 0.160 o.d. (foam poly)
Mic Cable (Belden 8421) = Hi-Z = 16 pf/ft = 0.180 o.d. (foam poly)
R/S Audio Patch Cable = 28 pF/ft = 0.165 o.d. (poly)
The best choice is the Belden 8421 Audio cable from their Brilliance
line.  It looks just like the other cables, and is very flexible.  The
RG-62 is OK, but it is 50% larger and far less flexible.  RG-62 is also
prone to shorting if bent over too small a radius.  The only pertinent
factor is the total capacity, impedance and loss are not important.
Actually the standard R/S audio patch cable will work ok in the INJ role
as long as the Injection alignment is done with the R-4 and T-4X cabled
together.
73, Garey - K4OAH
Atlanta
Jason Buchanan wrote:
Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
--
Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the 
inter-connections between R-4B and T-4XB?  I got a generous 
performance increase by using the original Drake cables that I have - 
unfortunately the ones I have work only when twisted in a certain 
shape and that's not a way to run a railroad.  I'd prefer to get the 
real thing or equivalent.

73 Jason N1SU
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Re: [drakelist] Drake cables

[k5vkl]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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Jason, 
Check on this website: 
wb4hln.com/Drake parts.htm
There are several links to sites./sources for Parts, Repair and services
for 
Drake equipment.

Good luck and
73.

Bill Flowers,   [EMAIL PROTECTED]

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 14:38:21 -0500 Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
 
 Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist 
 gang
 --
 
 Anyone know where to get good RCA phono cables for the 
 inter-connections 
 between R-4B and T-4XB?  I got a generous performance increase by 
 using 
 the original Drake cables that I have - unfortunately the ones I 
 have 
 work only when twisted in a certain shape and that's not a way to 
 run a 
 railroad.  I'd prefer to get the real thing or equivalent.
 
 73 Jason N1SU
 --
 On Behalf of Jason Buchanan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Submissions:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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[drakelist] L4B and L7 PS 0.82 ohm resistor

[K9SQG]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] made an utterence to the drakelist gang
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From Danny, WA4SDE...

Tell the guys to email me I have the correct resistor for the amp P/S..

I sold some to Jeff at DaytonDanny..WA4SDE,  [EMAIL PROTECTED]

My thanks to Danny for this effort.

73s,

Evan
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