[Elecraft] K4 IQ out.

[Dan Baker]

Good afternoon.
Will the IQ out of the K4 be analog or digital?

73,   Dan  KM6CQ
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] The Night of Nights

[Fred Jensen]

I'm pretty sure it was posted here on the Elecraft list as well as 
CWops, NASOTA, and many club lists. KPH and a number of other museum 
stations and ships gather on maritime MF and HF frequencies on the night 
of 12 July each year at 0001 GMT, one minute after the final broadcast 
~20 years ago.  One of the only nights you can hear activity on the Holy 
Frequency which is eerily silent the rest of the year.  K6KPH comes up 
on 3550 kcs, 7050 kcs, 14050 kcs, and several frequencies in the WARC 
bands and will accept traffic and signal reports.


KPH will accept messages addressed to anyone who has an email address.  
They send it as a PDF on an authentic radiogram form from KPH's heyday.  
You must format it in "commercial style" which is a bit different than 
amateur NTS format.  Check out the Marine Historical Radio Society 
[radiomarine.org] and look at the latest news letter.  It is formatted 
as a commercial message [note: CODH is one of several message classes, 
it means "company deadhead", a non-revenue message within the company.  
Your message would normally be class "P"].  Kind of a neat way to send 
birthday and other greetings.


KPH/K6KPH is staffed on most Saturday afternoons from about 1800 to 
2200-2300 GMT.  They begin with PX [press], and then start their wheel 
and look for ships.  K6KPH usually comes up when the PX finishes.


73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 7/13/2019 6:36 AM, Bill wrote:
It sure would have been nice to have heard about this before it became 
OLD NEWS. If there was an announcement made here, I never saw it.


Not everyone is plugged into to every nook and cranny of the radio 
world. A small timely announcement of this event would have been 
appreciated - by me and probably by others also.


I interviewed at WCC in the 70s and was offered a job. I declined - 
fortunately. I have to say the entire operation was a step back in 
time - even then. It was like being in the 40s as soon as you entered 
the door.


Sorry to have missed this event.

Bill W2BLC


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] The Night of Nights

[Brian Hunt]

They are also QRV each Saturday starting about 1830z. K6KPH is workable too. 
See www.radiomarine.org for times and frequencies. 

73,
Brian, K0DTJ
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] The Night of Nights

[KENT TRIMBLE]

Bill . . .

It's been going on for 20 years every July 12th, and I saw announcements 
on at least 4 reflectors.


Put it on your calendar for next year so you won't miss it.

Also, a donation to keep them on the air would also be appropriate (as 
many of us do).


73,

Kent  K9ZTV


On 7/13/2019 8:36 AM, Bill wrote:
It sure would have been nice to have heard about this before it became 
OLD NEWS. If there was an announcement made here, I never saw it.


Not everyone is plugged into to every nook and cranny of the radio 
world. A small timely announcement of this event would have been 
appreciated - by me and probably by others also.


I interviewed at WCC in the 70s and was offered a job. I declined - 
fortunately. I have to say the entire operation was a step back in 
time - even then. It was like being in the 40s as soon as you entered 
the door.


Sorry to have missed this event.

Bill W2BLC

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to k9...@socket.net





---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] ALC implementation

[K9MA]

I like to think of ALC as receiver AGC in reverse. Done properly, it 
results in minimal distortion while keeping the signal level nearly 
constant.  As far as I can tell, commercial transceivers have all been 
doing this pretty well for a long time.


What I've never been able to figure out is why it's so hard to close the 
ALC loop around an external amplifier. If it works with the 100 W 
amplifier built into the transceiver, why won't it work with a bigger 
amplifier? (And it seems about universally agreed that it won't.)


73,
Scott K9MA


On 7/12/2019 23:32, Wes wrote:
You do know that the K3(S) uses a slow ALC system for power control 
don't you?


Wes  N7WS

On 7/12/2019 8:53 PM, Brian Denley wrote:
Nothing when that’s what you want.  But using ALC to control xcvr 
power is uncontrolled compression that may or may not be desired.


Brian
KB1VBF
Sent from my iPad


On Jul 12, 2019, at 4:09 PM, Wes  wrote:

And what exactly is the problem with compression?  It's used all 
over the place.


Wes  N7WS


On 6/28/2019 11:38 AM, Brian Denley wrote:
I have always thought that ALC is not appropriate for power 
control.  It’s a protection system.  Over use of ALC acts like 
compression.  No?


Brian
KB1VBF
Sent from my iPad
__ 


--
Scott  K9MA

k...@sdellington.us

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

[Elecraft] Night of Nights XXI - 12 July 2020

[John Harper]

July 12 every year from 3 pm to midnight at the Historic RCA Coast Station
KPH.

Details here:
https://www.nps.gov/pore/planyourvisit/events_nightofnights.htm

John AE5X
https://ae5x.blogspot.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] The Night of Nights

[Bill]

It sure would have been nice to have heard about this before it became 
OLD NEWS. If there was an announcement made here, I never saw it.


Not everyone is plugged into to every nook and cranny of the radio 
world. A small timely announcement of this event would have been 
appreciated - by me and probably by others also.


I interviewed at WCC in the 70s and was offered a job. I declined - 
fortunately. I have to say the entire operation was a step back in time 
- even then. It was like being in the 40s as soon as you entered the door.


Sorry to have missed this event.

Bill W2BLC

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] ALC implementation

[Ian White GM3SEK]

The original concept of ALC was devised by Collins engineers as part of 
their development program for speech processing. Speech clipping 
flattens the peak amplitude, but also introduces some splatter which 
then has to be filtered out - but the filtering re-introduces a small 
amount of level variation (called 're-peaking'). Collins then added a 
very small amount of ALC, only 2-3dB, to keep the peak envelope power 
more constant. This mild ALC introduced very little additional splatter 
of its own, so the result was a large increase in intelligibility with 
very little increase in bandwidth.


Where ALC got a bad name was when other manufacturers started mis-using 
it for other purposes - in particular for manual power control from 100W 
down to 1W or less. ALC was also being used to compensate for variations 
in TX gain between different bands. All of this required much more gain 
in the control loop (20-30dB) which made teh ALC much more aggressive 
and created major problems with transient behavior - in other words, 
quite serious splatter due to the ALC system itself.


Then someone decided it would be a good idea to apply ALC from the power 
amplifier, thus wrapping an external control loop around the existing 
ALC loop within the transceiver, so the transient behavior became 
totally unpredictable. Add to this the tendency of many hams to 
perpetually overdrive their transmitters while *also* applying speech 
processing, and the result was that both ALC and speech processing got a 
very bad name.


Enter the K3. With a little persuasion from early adopters, Elecraft 
returned to the original Collins concept of applying only a small amount 
of ALC to minimise re-peaking *without* significantly re-introducing 
splatter. The SDR concept allowed other means to be used to implement 
the non-dynamic power control functions such as manual power setting and 
TX gain compensation. When correctly configured according to the User 
Manual, the K3 family of transceivers are capable of excellent speech 
processing without worrying about also creating splatter. (Also note 
that speech processing is automatically disabled for data modes.)


As far as I know, there is still no other manufacturer who is doing this.

References:

[1] W E Sabin and E O Schoenike (Collins), 'Single-Sideband Systems and 
Circuits'. McGraw-Hill Book Company 1987. ISBN 0-07-054407-7


[2] Leif Åsbrink, SM5BSZ (http://sm5bsz.com), ‘Real Life Dynamic Range 
of Modern Amateur Transceivers’ and ‘Speech Processing for SSB 
Transmitters’.


73 from Ian GM3SEK


On 13/07/2019 08:35, Richard Corfield wrote:

The compression modulates the signal. That will have a fourier transform of
its own. If we think of it as a simple amplitude modulation then, as for AM
signals, the spectrum of the original signal will be combined (convolved)
with upper and lower sidebands representing the spectrum of the compressor.
Our ears don't notice (unless we're sound guys listening to a pop song
thinking "They've squashed those dynamics to death" ;-) ) but maybe a
digital mode will.

The transmitted signal is constrained to the IF passband so you stay within
band. The compression frequencies and hopefully amplitude are both small so
the artefacts it introduces into the spectrum should also be both narrow
and small.

  - Richard



__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] ALC implementation

[Ian White GM3SEK]

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] ALC implementation

[Richard Corfield]

The compression modulates the signal. That will have a fourier transform of
its own. If we think of it as a simple amplitude modulation then, as for AM
signals, the spectrum of the original signal will be combined (convolved)
with upper and lower sidebands representing the spectrum of the compressor.
Our ears don't notice (unless we're sound guys listening to a pop song
thinking "They've squashed those dynamics to death" ;-) ) but maybe a
digital mode will.

The transmitted signal is constrained to the IF passband so you stay within
band. The compression frequencies and hopefully amplitude are both small so
the artefacts it introduces into the spectrum should also be both narrow
and small.

 - Richard


On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 at 22:01, Wes  wrote:

> What distortion?
>
> On 7/12/2019 1:15 PM, Jim Rhodes wrote:
> > Nothing when it is done correctly on a mode that can stand the
> distortion. I
> > personally won't use it on digital modes as my rigs tend to turn it off
> by
> > default.
> >
> > Jim Rhodes
> > K0XU
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 12, 2019, 15:10 Wes  > > wrote:
> >
> > And what exactly is the problem with compression?  It's used all
> over the
> > place.
> >
> > Wes  N7WS
> >
> > On 6/28/2019 11:38 AM, Brian Denley wrote:
> > > I have always thought that ALC is not appropriate for power
> control.
> > It’s a protection system.  Over use of ALC acts like compression.
> No?
> > >
> > > Brian
> > > KB1VBF
> > > Sent from my iPad
> >
> > __
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net  Elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to jimk...@gmail.com 
> >
>
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to richard.corfi...@gmail.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com