Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
I'm a 99% cw op, mine are 2.7 (soon 2.8) 2.1, 500, 400, 200. Sub is 2.7, 500. The 400 I use always for contesting. Doing CQ WW RTTY as a low power multi single, this weekend as first time ever on this mode have WinTest es mmtty es setup for AFSK A. What is the preferred filter width min es max in these crowded bands. Hopefully the P3 will give me an edge squeezing in somewhere. Ken..G0ORH CW4EVER Sent from my iPhone On 21 Sep 2010, at 23:07, Wayne Burdick n...@elecraft.com wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Ken, You wmay get a number of different answers on this, but mine would be: max filter width 500 Hz while tuning around, and minimum width 250 Hz. A normal operating setting might be 350-400 Hz. I believe your 200 Hz roofing filter will be too narrow to be useful for RTTY. More importantly, I believe you should turn AFC off in MMTTY. MMTTY does its own filtering, so if AFC is off, changing the filter width setting may not make as much difference as you might have expected, but if AFC is on, narrow filtering will be essential to try to stop the receive decoder from being pulled away by nearby signals. In AFSK, you can simply operate with AFC off and NET on all the time. When you are CQing, you can use RIT to copy off-frequency callers and embed a clear RIT command in your CQ message, the same as you would in CW. Alternatively, when you are CQing you can turn AFC on and NET off and have your CQ message invoke the HAM default (MMTTY's software equivalent to clearing RIT); when you are SPing, you would turn AFC off and NET on. I don't know about WinTest, but N1MM Logger has settings to automate all of this. 73, Rich VE3KI G0ORH wrote: Doing CQ WW RTTY as a low power multi single, this weekend as first time ever on this \ mode have WinTest es mmtty es setup for AFSK A. What is the preferred filter width min es max in these crowded bands. Hopefully the P3 will give me an edge squeezing in somewhere. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Karl, I can only speak for myself, although apparently some have agreed with me. I have ordered one, and when Gary first suggested it, I encouraged him. I do not operate many CW contests, and do not chase DX with a fervor as some do. My preferred width for general CW tuning is 700 Hz. The DSP filtering will take care of the rest for me. If there are so many undesired CW signals on the band that the DSP cannot handle, I am likely not to be operating there anyway. So it gives me a good general purpose CW filter of a width I normally use. Others are free to agree or disagree, but that is what I like. 73, Don W3FPR On 9/21/2010 4:18 PM, Karl Marderian wrote: Why are these so popular? Please don't tell me they are being used for ssb. Just asking. N6XVT Karl __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
They should be a pretty good choice for the wider digital modes (e.g. Olivia 500/16). 73 -- Joe KB8AP On Sep 21, 2010, at 1:18 PM, Karl Marderian wrote: Why are these so popular? Please don't tell me they are being used for ssb. Just asking. N6XVT Karl Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
The Inrad 500 Hz filter works for Olivia 500. Dunc, W5DC On 9/21/2010 2:42 PM, Joe Planisky wrote: They should be a pretty good choice for the wider digital modes (e.g. Olivia 500/16). 73 -- Joe KB8AP __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
KARL MARDERIAN wrote: Why are these so popular? 10/4500 = 0.2% of K3s shipped. Popular? 73, Bill -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/700-Hz-roofing-filters-tp5556478p5556720.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
10/4500 = 0.2% of K3s shipped. Popular? They were never offered with the K3s; this is a first run of this type of filter available for the K3. 10/10 * 100 = 100%;) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
More to the point. Examine the filter shape AFTER installation and measure the actual skirt and width installed. I think this will tell what benefit it will be. 73's Gary On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 7:39 AM, Andrew Moore andrew.n...@gmail.com wrote: 10/4500 = 0.2% of K3s shipped. Popular? They were never offered with the K3s; this is a first run of this type of filter available for the K3. 10/10 * 100 = 100%;) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/ K3 #679 For everything else there's Mastercard!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Hi Don, I agree. That is why I bought a 1 Khz filter when I got my K3 in 2008. I just use the DSP set between 500 and 1000 Hz. My CW operating is about the same as yours. If I need to use a sharper filter than that, it is likely due to QRN rather than QRM, and the DSP works fine for that. Including the NR section. I don't close the blinds unless I need to! 73, Rick Dettinger K7MW I do not operate many CW contests, and do not chase DX with a fervor as some do. My preferred width for general CW tuning is 700 Hz. The DSP filtering will take care of the rest for me. If there are so many undesired CW signals on the band that the DSP cannot handle, I am likely not to be operating there anyway. So it gives me a good general purpose CW filter of a width I normally use. Others are free to agree or disagree, but that is what I like. 73, Don W3FPR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
I have the same configuration as Wayne it would appear and use the same settings I think. YMMV 73's Gary On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 8:07 AM, Wayne Burdick n...@elecraft.com wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/ K3 #679 For everything else there's Mastercard!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
wayne burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR Personally, I follow the K3ZO school of filtering. I prefer using my neuronal network for filtering, especially when running in a contest. As my operation is mostly CW, I have the stock SSB, the 1 kHz, and 400 Hz filters. I find myself using 1 kHz most of the time and have always done it this way, going back to my Drake R4B days. I suspect Wayne got a better deal on his filter options than I did :.) 73, Barry W2UP -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/700-Hz-roofing-filters-tp5556478p5557003.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Barry wrote: Personally, I follow the K3ZO school of filtering. I prefer using my neuronal network for filtering, especially when running in a contest. As my operation is mostly CW, I have the stock SSB, the 1 kHz, and 400 Hz filters. I find myself using 1 kHz most of the time and have always done it this way, going back to my Drake R4B days. I suspect Wayne got a better deal on his filter options than I did :.) 73, Barry W2UP I can do that on 10m but you won't get away with it on a crowded band. I once had a 1 kHz filter but quickly discovered in casual DXing on 160m that adjacent signals were pumping my AGC. I prefer a low pitch for weak signal DXing (my preference is 270 Hz but the K3's 300 Hz is acceptable). Because the K3's MCU shifts roofing filter passbands such that the low end always cuts off at 200 Hz, if you use a 1000 Hz filter with a 300 Hz pitch, the actual passband is 200-1200 Hz, so a signal 900 Hz away (1200-300) will pump your AGC. If you use 500 Hz pitch, the passband remains 200-1200 Hz, so a signal 700 kHz away will pump the AGC. In a crowded contest or large pileup, this simply doesn't cut it. 73, Bill -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/700-Hz-roofing-filters-tp5556478p5557079.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Hi Joe et al, I'm going to hazzard a guess here as to why Elecraft dont allow the 13KHz filter for AM/ESSB TX. Because it's illegal. SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. The F.C.C. in the US of A and here in Australia, A.C.M.A. both allow a maximum of 3KHz for SSB TX bandwidth on any HF band. So it would be a fair bet then that because the K3 is a FCC type approved radio that part of that type approval includes that it must not transmit SSB bandwidths that are wider than permitted. My $0.02c worth (Plus GST/VAT/Sales Tax as applicable) Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF Innisfail, QLD, Australia Elecraft K3# 4257 - Original Message - From: Joe Subich, W4TV To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters [END of Thread]
End of thread. 73, Eric Elecraft List Moderator __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
On Sep 21, 2010, at 5:19 PM, Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF wrote: SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) The 3 in A3J has nothing to do with bandwidth -- the 3 stands for a single channel containing analog information. 73 Chen, W7AY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
I feel compelled to state my objection to any TX capability from ALL amateur transceiver manufacturers to NEVER allow TX bandwidth in excess of 3Khz..period. ESSB is unwarranted and a waste of bandwidth and creates havoc wherever it is used. In VK we have a small minority who insist on ESSB operation and whilst we can all find alternative frequencies not suffering from QRM it should be no surprise to all that sure enough, on 17M were two stations running ESSB on 18.130 or right in about the centre of the SSB portion of the band. We all love to experiment with different modes but I have to admit I must be pretty darn slow (or worse) as I do not see why EESB is worth experimenting with. But then I may be just too slow..or worse..to understand. My 2c worth...keep the change (Flame Suit on) 73's Gary On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF vk4bof.elecr...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Joe et al, I'm going to hazzard a guess here as to why Elecraft dont allow the 13KHz filter for AM/ESSB TX. Because it's illegal. SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. The F.C.C. in the US of A and here in Australia, A.C.M.A. both allow a maximum of 3KHz for SSB TX bandwidth on any HF band. So it would be a fair bet then that because the K3 is a FCC type approved radio that part of that type approval includes that it must not transmit SSB bandwidths that are wider than permitted. My $0.02c worth (Plus GST/VAT/Sales Tax as applicable) Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF Innisfail, QLD, Australia Elecraft K3# 4257 - Original Message - From: Joe Subich, W4TV To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/ K3 #679 For everything else there's Mastercard!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Jeff, Because it's illegal. The roofing filter does not set the transmitted bandwidth - that is controlled in the DSP modulator. The only purpose for roofing filter in transmit is to remove the image of the IF and the FM filter has more than sufficient skirt selectivity for that job (the image is 30 KHz away). Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. Incorrect in the USA. There is no statutory maximum bandwidth though my personal opinion is that anything more than 2.8KHz (200 Hz - 3000 Hz audio) is bad practice. Double sideband AM will require twice the highest modulating frequency so 6 KHz is appropriate. However, again, it's the DSP that sets that bandwidth *not* the roofing filter. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 8:19 PM, Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF wrote: Hi Joe et al, I'm going to hazzard a guess here as to why Elecraft dont allow the 13KHz filter for AM/ESSB TX. Because it's illegal. SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. The F.C.C. in the US of A and here in Australia, A.C.M.A. both allow a maximum of 3KHz for SSB TX bandwidth on any HF band. So it would be a fair bet then that because the K3 is a FCC type approved radio that part of that type approval includes that it must not transmit SSB bandwidths that are wider than permitted. My $0.02c worth (Plus GST/VAT/Sales Tax as applicable) Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF Innisfail, QLD, Australia Elecraft K3# 4257 - Original Message - From: Joe Subich, W4TV To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters [Thread REALLY closed]
Guys - this thread has been formally closed. (both the 700 hz and ESSB sub threads). Please take further discussion off list. 73, Eric Elecraft List Moderator - really! www.elecraft.com _..._ On Sep 21, 2010, at 6:43 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV li...@subich.com wrote: Jeff, Because it's illegal. The roofing filter does not set the transmitted bandwidth - that is controlled in the DSP modulator. The only purpose for roofing filter in transmit is to remove the image of the IF and the FM filter has more than sufficient skirt selectivity for that job (the image is 30 KHz away). Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. Incorrect in the USA. There is no statutory maximum bandwidth though my personal opinion is that anything more than 2.8KHz (200 Hz - 3000 Hz audio) is bad practice. Double sideband AM will require twice the highest modulating frequency so 6 KHz is appropriate. However, again, it's the DSP that sets that bandwidth *not* the roofing filter. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 8:19 PM, Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF wrote: Hi Joe et al, I'm going to hazzard a guess here as to why Elecraft dont allow the 13KHz filter for AM/ESSB TX. Because it's illegal. SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. The F.C.C. in the US of A and here in Australia, A.C.M.A. both allow a maximum of 3KHz for SSB TX bandwidth on any HF band. So it would be a fair bet then that because the K3 is a FCC type approved radio that part of that type approval includes that it must not transmit SSB bandwidths that are wider than permitted. My $0.02c worth (Plus GST/VAT/Sales Tax as applicable) Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF Innisfail, QLD, Australia Elecraft K3# 4257 - Original Message - From: Joe Subich, W4TV To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters
Are you sure that's not J3E for AM, Single sideBand, surpressed carrier, one analoge channel with telephony? ...bc -Original Message- From: Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF [mailto:vk4bof.elecr...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 8:19 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters Hi Joe et al, I'm going to hazzard a guess here as to why Elecraft dont allow the 13KHz filter for AM/ESSB TX. Because it's illegal. SSB is called mode A3J in most of the legal documents that govern our hobby. The reason why the mode is called A3J in all the legal stuff is that the 3 is the maximum bandwidth in khz that is permitted.) Thus, anything more than the 3KHz SSB bandwidth is against the laws that govern us. The F.C.C. in the US of A and here in Australia, A.C.M.A. both allow a maximum of 3KHz for SSB TX bandwidth on any HF band. So it would be a fair bet then that because the K3 is a FCC type approved radio that part of that type approval includes that it must not transmit SSB bandwidths that are wider than permitted. My $0.02c worth (Plus GST/VAT/Sales Tax as applicable) Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF Innisfail, QLD, Australia Elecraft K3# 4257 - Original Message - From: Joe Subich, W4TV To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 700 Hz roofing filters In general I agree with Wayne although I prefer to have a more narrow bandwidth option for SSB (1.8 or 1.5 KHz). In order to make room for the 1.5/1.8 KHz filter, I deleted the AM filter and use only the FM filter for the low priority modes wider than 2.8 KHz. However, it continues to frustrate me that Elecraft have *STILL* not allowed us to use the 13 KHz filter for AM/ESSB transmit (officially). In any case, given the measured performance of the INRAD/Elecraft 250 Hz filter (about 350 to 375 Hz), I can certainly see the utility of something like: FL1 13 kHz (FM/AM/ESSB) FL2 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL3 1.8 or 1.5 KHz (Narrow SSB and wide data modes) FL4 700 Hz (casual/normal CW/DATA) FL5 350 Hz (Narrow CW/RTTY in heavy QRM) While the 350 Hz filter would lack the absolute selectivity of the Elecraft 200 Hz 5-pole filter, it would be nearly optimum for 45.45 baud RTTY and still provide a useful narrow CW option. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 9/21/2010 6:07 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: 700 Hz is a useful CW/DATA filter bandwidth, certainly. I'm not surprised that some K3 owners are interested in this. Personally, I prefer much narrow CW/DATA bandwidths, and I use all modes. The lineup I use (and generally recommend) is: FL1 13 kHz (FM) FL2 6 kHz (AM/ESSB) FL3 2.7 or 2.8 kHz (SSB and casual CW/DATA tuning) FL4 400 or 500 Hz (normal CW/DATA) FL5 200 Hz (CW/DATA in heavy QRM) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
