Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
"how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations?" It's called generalization. Compare it with Newton's law for gravity - even though the size, shape, and movement of objects does play its role the law is not concerned with them and still adequately describes the effect of gravity. (Let's not start comparison between Newton's law and general relativity.) So, too many unknowns are needed when one wants to calculate the precise effect of something. But they might not be important when one wants to express the relationship between effects, so why not to hide them where they are not needed until the moment comes? On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 2:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in > twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do > you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > has been lost in the translation? >Kevin. KD5ONS > -- Alexey Kats (neko) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Nothing is being hidden away! The 20 quantities you mention are not independent, and by a bit of manipulation one can set up the description in terms of a set of equations which contain the same information but not redundantly. John Ragle -- W1ZI = On 3/6/2011 5:56 PM, Alexey Kats wrote: > "how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations?" > > It's called generalization. Compare it with Newton's law for gravity - even > though the size, shape, and movement of objects does play its role the law > is not concerned with them and still adequately describes the effect of > gravity. (Let's not start comparison between Newton's law and general > relativity.) > > So, too many unknowns are needed when one wants to calculate the precise > effect of something. But they might not be important when one wants to > express the relationship between effects, so why not to hide them where they > are not needed until the moment comes? > > On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 2:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >> has been lost in the translation? >> Kevin. KD5ONS >> __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Kevin and all, Check out the wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equations and about halfway down look for the section named "A Dynamical Theory of the Electromagnetic Field" where it talks a little about it. In short, Cartesian vs vector! 73, Mike ab3ap On 03/06/11 17:37, Kevin Rock wrote: > I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in > twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do > you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > has been lost in the translation? > Kevin. KD5ONS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I could not find the original equations on that site. Just the normal sets which are beaten into us as undergrads. Where are the twenty quaternion equations which Maxwell created initially? Not the ones by Gibbs and Heaviside but the ones crafted by Maxwell? Kevin. KD5ONS On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 16:06:50 -0800, Mike Markowski wrote: > Kevin and all, > > Check out the wiki page > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equations > > and about halfway down look for the section named "A Dynamical Theory of > the Electromagnetic Field" where it talks a little about it. In short, > Cartesian vs vector! > > 73, > Mike ab3ap > > On 03/06/11 17:37, Kevin Rock wrote: >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how >> do >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >> has been lost in the translation? >> Kevin. KD5ONS > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Just FYI, http://www.amazon.com/Students-Guide-Maxwells-Equations/dp/0521701473/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1299458530&sr=8-1 if you are looking for a reference, this is one I purchased last summer. On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > I could not find the original equations on that site. 73, Byron N6NUL - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2011 Cal QSO Party 1-2 Oct 2011 - www.cqp.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I found the original, 1873 version of Maxwell's equations. The four space quaternion versions not the Gibbs - Heaviside mapping on to three space. Yes, something was lost in translation. Very interesting book. http://posner.library.cmu.edu/Posner/books/pages.cgi?call=537_M46T_1873_VOL._1 and http://posner.library.cmu.edu/Posner/books/book.cgi?call=537_M46T_1873_VOL._2 An interesting winter's read. 73, Kevin. KD5ONS On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 16:06:50 -0800, Mike Markowski wrote: > Kevin and all, > > Check out the wiki page > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equations > > and about halfway down look for the section named "A Dynamical Theory of > the Electromagnetic Field" where it talks a little about it. In short, > Cartesian vs vector! > > 73, > Mike ab3ap > > On 03/06/11 17:37, Kevin Rock wrote: >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how >> do >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >> has been lost in the translation? >> Kevin. KD5ONS > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Alexey Kats wrote: > "how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations?" > > It's called generalization... > > Well, it's true that Maxwell had a tendency to generalize, but we mustn't condemn him: he had Demons we can't understand. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
The amazing thing is he didn't have the electron! Everything he did was based on mechanical wave models until he reached radiation. That's where Maxwell's imagination AND understanding of the body of electrical knowledge lead to the more than twenty equations that made up his electromagnetic theory. His orginal equations can be found in his own words in the following: Maxwell on the Electromagnetic Field: A Guided Study Thomas K. Simpson Before warned that this is not an easy read!! It took me four attempts before I understood what Maxwell was saying and I have all the modern prereqs that are belived to be required to understand electromagnetic theory. It is worth the effort, though, as his thought process can be followed. Have fun!! Herb/WR9H herbc...@msn.com > Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 18:57:45 -0600 > From: estept...@gmail.com > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Alexey Kats wrote: > > > "how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations?" > > > > It's called generalization... > > > > > Well, it's true that Maxwell had a tendency to generalize, but we mustn't > condemn him: he had Demons we can't understand. > > Tony KT0NY > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
How right you are, Kevin! I went through part of the Principia with my physics professor as an independent study. Newton's version of calculus is nearly impossible to understand and I wonder how many "natural philosphers" in his day could read it. Of course try introducing diff equations to the uninitiated and see what happens!! WR9H Herb > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > From: kev...@coho.net > Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 18:07:05 -0800 > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > Reading the Principia is also a chore. Interesting though. > Kevin. > > > On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:03:29 -0800, Herb Case wrote: > > > > > The amazing thing is he didn't have the electron! Everything he did was > > based on mechanical wave models until he reached radiation. That's where > > Maxwell's imagination AND understanding of the body of electrical > > knowledge lead to the more than twenty equations that made up his > > electromagnetic theory. > > His orginal equations can be found in his own words in the following: > > Maxwell on the Electromagnetic Field: A Guided Study > > Thomas K. Simpson > > Before warned that this is not an easy read!! It took me four attempts > > before I understood what Maxwell was saying and I have all the modern > > prereqs that are belived to be required to understand electromagnetic > > theory. It is worth the effort, though, as his thought process can be > > followed. > > Have fun!! > > > > Herb/WR9H > > herbc...@msn.com > > > > > > > > > >> Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 18:57:45 -0600 > >> From: estept...@gmail.com > >> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > >> > >> On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Alexey Kats > >> wrote: > >> > >> > "how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four > >> equations?" > >> > > >> > It's called generalization... > >> > > >> > > >> Well, it's true that Maxwell had a tendency to generalize, but we > >> mustn't > >> condemn him: he had Demons we can't understand. > >> > >> Tony KT0NY > >> __ > >> Elecraft mailing list > >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > >> > >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > __ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > -- > Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
This is an outstanding reference and it is written by a disciple of the great antenna guru, John Kraus (also an amateur op and a very famous radio astronomer). WR9H Herb > Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 16:44:56 -0800 > From: by...@n6nul.org > To: kev...@coho.net > CC: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > Just FYI, > > http://www.amazon.com/Students-Guide-Maxwells-Equations/dp/0521701473/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1299458530&sr=8-1 > > if you are looking for a reference, this is one I purchased last summer. > > > On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > > I could not find the original equations on that site. > > > 73, Byron N6NUL > > - Northern California Contest Club > - CU in the 2011 Cal QSO Party 1-2 Oct 2011 > - www.cqp.org > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Reading the Principia is also a chore. Interesting though. Kevin. On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:03:29 -0800, Herb Case wrote: > > The amazing thing is he didn't have the electron! Everything he did was > based on mechanical wave models until he reached radiation. That's where > Maxwell's imagination AND understanding of the body of electrical > knowledge lead to the more than twenty equations that made up his > electromagnetic theory. > His orginal equations can be found in his own words in the following: > Maxwell on the Electromagnetic Field: A Guided Study > Thomas K. Simpson > Before warned that this is not an easy read!! It took me four attempts > before I understood what Maxwell was saying and I have all the modern > prereqs that are belived to be required to understand electromagnetic > theory. It is worth the effort, though, as his thought process can be > followed. > Have fun!! > > Herb/WR9H > herbc...@msn.com > > > > >> Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 18:57:45 -0600 >> From: estept...@gmail.com >> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. >> >> On Sun, Mar 6, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Alexey Kats >> wrote: >> >> > "how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four >> equations?" >> > >> > It's called generalization... >> > >> > >> Well, it's true that Maxwell had a tendency to generalize, but we >> mustn't >> condemn him: he had Demons we can't understand. >> >> Tony KT0NY >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. 73.14159..., Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Nut!! On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:47:11 -0800, Wayne Burdick wrote: > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same > size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll > give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most > plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working > basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological > constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered > before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I learned the answer from one of my students: 42 73/72 - Mike WA8BXN ---Original Message--- From: Wayne Burdick Date: 3/6/2011 9:47:17 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. 73.14159..., Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
And the answer is: "Maybe" (it always works). 73, Don W3FPR On 3/6/2011 9:47 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size > as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of > these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
God created everything! Slam dunk, I winhihi WR9H Herb > From: n...@elecraft.com > Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 18:47:11 -0800 > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size > as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of > these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Wasn't that the answer Slarty Bartfast found? Ron AC7AC -Original Message- I learned the answer from one of my students: 42 73/72 - Mike WA8BXN __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Indeed, it was. Still seems the best answer to the question posed! 73/72 - Mike WA8BXN ---Original Message--- From: Ron D'Eau Claire Date: 3/6/2011 10:36:19 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. Wasn't that the answer Slarty Bartfast found? Ron AC7AC -Original Message- I learned the answer from one of my students: 42 73/72 - Mike WA8BXN __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
FM. The second word in FM is "magic", btw. On Sun, 6 Mar 2011, Wayne Burdick wrote: > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size > as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of > these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Hisashi T Fujinaka - ht...@twofifty.com BSEE(6/86) + BSChem(3/95) + BAEnglish(8/95) + MSCS(8/03) + $2.50 = latte __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
The two volumes of Maxwell's "A Treatise on Electricity and Magnetism" were reprinted by Dover, bound as one (very thick) volume. It does make for interesting reading! Now it gathers dust on my shelves next to another fabulous classic "The Theory of Sound", by Lord Raleigh (also two volumes bound as one by Dover), a great source for solutions of eigenvalue problems. Another huge volume by Dover is "The Scientific Papers of James Clerk Maxwell". These books are probably still available in one form or another. Jerry AI6L -Original Message- From: Kevin Rock [mailto:kev...@coho.net] Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2011 4:41 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. I found the original, 1873 version of Maxwell's equations. The four space quaternion versions not the Gibbs - Heaviside mapping on to three space. Yes, something was lost in translation. Very interesting book. http://posner.library.cmu.edu/Posner/books/pages.cgi?call=537_M46T_1873_VOL. _1 and http://posner.library.cmu.edu/Posner/books/book.cgi?call=537_M46T_1873_VOL._ 2 An interesting winter's read. 73, Kevin. KD5ONS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
This is not fair. You know it cannot be done without imposing that parity... 73, Igor, N1YX -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2011 9:47 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. 73.14159..., Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I only know of three Maxwells. One had a silver hammer, one was a spy who talked into his shoe, and the third made coffee with a guy named House (possibly related to the doctor on TV). I've got a loonie (Canadian dollar coin) that says it's an L/C meter in a package that size. The world doesn't need another DVM and it's too small to be a scope! 73, Ken Alexander VE3HLS --- On Sun, 3/6/11, Wayne Burdick wrote: > From: Wayne Burdick > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > To: "Elecraft" > Date: Sunday, March 6, 2011, 9:47 PM > Interesting discussion. Gives me an > idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument > (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related > to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can > suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to > 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological > constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is > discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw > in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations
This book seemed very helpful and interesting to me as a total ignoramus. Newer editions have come out since. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Introducing-Quantum-Theory-J-P-McEvoy/dp/1840460571/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1299498489&sr=8-3 73 to all Geoff G3UCK - Original Message - From: "Phil Hystad" To: "Jim Miller" Cc: Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 6:17 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Why I won't purchase K3 >I would say to start with first principles and then Quantum >Electrodynamics. Maxwell's equations do not tell you what nature is really >doing. > > phil > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
This requires some lateral thinking. The answer is: 2 hectares. This will accommodate: T-Ball, Little League Baseball, Ruth League Baseball, and Baseball Football (American) and Football (everywhere else); Football (Australian) Cricket Rugby Lacrosse Field Hockey Bocce, Lawn Bowling Tennis, Badminton, Croquet, Lawn Darts, Horseshoes Build a field house on one corner for: Basketball, Curling, Volley Ball Oh, I'm getting tired. One field for all sports - a unified field. See? Monty, K2DLJ On Mar 6, 2011, at 9:47 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size > as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of > these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
No need to limit ourselves to only 11 dimensions, Occam's razor be damned. I would simply resort to Shannon's trick and employ the fact that in a hypershpere of VERY high dimensionality nearly all of the volume lies very close to the surface... Only, I'm quite busy at the moment trying to figure out how to hook up this big screen tv so will leave the details as an exercise for the reader. 73.579545 Drew AF2Z On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:47:11 -0800, you wrote: >Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > >We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size >as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of >these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative >to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field >theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose >R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product >announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > >73.14159..., > >Wayne >N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Sounds to me like a rectal-cranial inversion would do the trick. Bill K9YEQ -Original Message- On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:47:11 -0800, you wrote: >Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > >We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > >73.14159..., > >Wayne >N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Bill, This is the first posting on this subject that I understand. hi,hi 73, Bob K6UJ On Mar 7, 2011, at 9:04 AM, Bill wrote: > Sounds to me like a rectal-cranial inversion would do the trick. > > Bill > K9YEQ > > -Original Message- > > On Sun, 06 Mar 2011 18:47:11 -0800, you wrote: > >> Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. >> >> We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same > size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give > one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. >> >> 73.14159..., >> >> Wayne >> N6KR > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Wayne's post reminds me of a story from my past. Early in my broadcasting career, I wanted to rid our station of the little jaggies that plauged the edges of Chroma Keys, the process that is used to put the weather man in front of the map using a blue or green screen as the background that "disapears" in the process. The jaggies were prevalent in the "good old analog days" of TV and looked just awful to my young, inexperienced eyes. As I searched for an answer over countless weeks, the wise old station senior engineer watched with amusement at my experiments in futility with lighting, colored gels on the backlight, camera enhancer adjustments, background paint color tweaks and production switcher keyer tweaks but offered no clue to my inquisitiveness, just smiles and head nods. Finally, I summoned the courage to personally approach him and ask if knew the reason why this was the way it was. He nodded yes; his charge for the answer was lunch at the local eatery down the street, a local bar-b-cue place which, had a name, but everyone at our station called it "The Pig Bar" due to the sign hanging on a pole above the door... A red outline of a pig with the word "BAR" in white block letters within. After downing several pulled pork sandwiches, some Halupki and an Iron City Beer, the wise old engineer grinned and said "I admire your perseverance, kid, but everybody knows that that condition is caused by the algebraic sum of the diverging vector". >From that moment on, anything that mere mortals like me could not understand was always refered to as being caused by the algebraic sum of the diverging vector. -lu-w4lt- K3 # 3192 > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. If that boson IS discovered... we won't need a 9V battery! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Hi Kevin, Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in > twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do > you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > has been lost in the translation? > Kevin. KD5ONS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Just look it up in "Quantum Electrodynamics for Dummies" --Lenny W2BVH > > ---Original Message--- > > From: Wayne Burdick > Date: 3/6/2011 9:47:17 PM > To: Elecraft > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. > > We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size > as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of > these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible > alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a > unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and > cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new > product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. > > 73.14159..., > > Wayne > N6KR > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. Interesting. David G3UNA > Hi Kevin, > > Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. > Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory > in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. > > Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > > > On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >> has been lost in the translation? >> Kevin. KD5ONS > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily they are proliferating online these days. Kevin. KD5ONS On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter wrote: > I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. > Interesting. > > David > G3UNA > > >> Hi Kevin, >> >> Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. >> Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory >> in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. >> >> Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. >> >> 73, tom n4zpt >> >> >> >> On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: >>> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations >>> in >>> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >>> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >>> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how >>> do >>> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >>> has been lost in the translation? >>> Kevin. KD5ONS >> > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
"What Descartes did was a good step. You have added much several ways, and especially in taking the colours of thin plates into philosophical consideration. If I have seen a little further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants." (Isaac Newton) On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 3:31 PM, David Cutter wrote: > I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. > Interesting. > > David > G3UNA > > > > Hi Kevin, > > > > Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. > > Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory > > in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. > > > > Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. > > > > 73, tom n4zpt > > > > > > > > On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in > >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how > do > >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > >> has been lost in the translation? > >> Kevin. KD5ONS > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Alexey Kats (neko) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Hi Kevin, What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating the older forms. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: > There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced > to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried > out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved > into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and > finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the > Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the > quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily > they are proliferating online these days. > Kevin. KD5ONS > > > On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter > wrote: > >> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. >> Interesting. >> >> David >> G3UNA >> >> >>> Hi Kevin, >>> >>> Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. >>> Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory >>> in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. >>> >>> Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. >>> >>> 73, tom n4zpt >>> >>> >>> >>> On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What has been lost in the translation? Kevin. KD5ONS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this represent to the average K3 user? . On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > Hi Kevin, > > What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the > middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his > particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. > Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? > Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the > papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating > the older forms. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: >> There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced >> to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried >> out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved >> into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and >> finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the >> Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the >> quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily >> they are proliferating online these days. >> Kevin. KD5ONS >> >> >> On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter >> wrote: >> >>> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. >>> Interesting. >>> >>> David >>> G3UNA >>> >>> Hi Kevin, Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations > in > twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how > do > you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > has been lost in the translation? > Kevin. KD5ONS > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html JIM ROGERS, W4ATK w4...@bellsouth.net http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk K3/100 P3 K2/10 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do with the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 builder). Talking about the actual equations and the history of their development seems to me to be of general interest to many of the readers of this list given the other responses. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/10/2011 10:06 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: > Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this represent > to the average K3 user? . > On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > >> Hi Kevin, >> >> What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the >> middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his >> particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. >> Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? >> Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the >> papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating >> the older forms. >> >> 73, tom n4zpt >> >> On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: >>> There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced >>> to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried >>> out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved >>> into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and >>> finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the >>> Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the >>> quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily >>> they are proliferating online these days. >>> Kevin. KD5ONS >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter >>> wrote: >>> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. Interesting. David G3UNA > Hi Kevin, > > Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. > Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory > in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. > > Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > > > On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: >> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations >> in >> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how >> do >> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >> has been lost in the translation? >> Kevin. KD5ONS >> >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > JIM ROGERS, W4ATK > w4...@bellsouth.net > http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk > K3/100 P3 > K2/10 > > > > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I am sure what you say has value Tom. It just seems this one has been going on a while. It did prompt me to go out and look up Maxwells equations just to see what you were all talking about and it is interesting but the math is certainly over my head. I hope my comments did not offend anyone. If so, I apologize, sincerely. 73s Jim On Mar 10, 2011, at 9:42 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. > > Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do with > the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 builder). > Talking about the actual equations and the history of their development > seems to me to be of general interest to many of the readers of this > list given the other responses. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > On 3/10/2011 10:06 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: >> Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this represent >> to the average K3 user? . >> On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: >> >>> Hi Kevin, >>> >>> What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the >>> middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his >>> particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. >>> Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? >>> Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the >>> papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating >>> the older forms. >>> >>> 73, tom n4zpt >>> >>> On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily they are proliferating online these days. Kevin. KD5ONS On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter wrote: > I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. > Interesting. > > David > G3UNA > > >> Hi Kevin, >> >> Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. >> Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory >> in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. >> >> Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. >> >> 73, tom n4zpt >> >> >> >> On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: >>> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations >>> in >>> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used >>> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he >>> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how >>> do >>> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What >>> has been lost in the translation? >>> Kevin. KD5ONS >>> >>> __ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> >> JIM ROGERS, W4ATK >> w4...@bellsouth.net >> http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk >> K3/100 P3 >> K2/10 >> >> >> >> >> > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html JIM ROGERS, W4ATK w4...@bellsouth.net http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk K3/100 P3 K2/10 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I for one have been enjoying the thread. Gary W2CS > -Original Message- > From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft- > boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Tom Azlin N4ZPT > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 10:42 AM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations. > > Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. > > Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do with > the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 builder). > Talking about the actual equations and the history of their development > seems to me to be of general interest to many of the readers of this > list given the other responses. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > On 3/10/2011 10:06 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: > > Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this represent > to the average K3 user? . > > On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > > > >> Hi Kevin, > >> > >> What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the > >> middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his > >> particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. > >> Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? > >> Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the > >> papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating > >> the older forms. > >> > >> 73, tom n4zpt > >> > >> On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: > >>> There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he was forced > >>> to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of the work was carried > >>> out by others but for him to publish he needed peer review so he caved > >>> into the larger group. I am reading his original work from 1873 and > >>> finding it very enlightening. Even though I have studied the > >>> Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times the > >>> quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard to find. Luckily > >>> they are proliferating online these days. > >>> Kevin. KD5ONS > >>> > >>> > >>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David Cutter > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read it again. > >>>> Interesting. > >>>> > >>>> David > >>>> G3UNA > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Hi Kevin, > >>>>> > >>>>> Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. > >>>>> Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory > >>>>> in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. > >>>>> > >>>>> Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. > >>>>> > >>>>> 73, tom n4zpt > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > >>>>>> I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations > >>>>>> in > >>>>>> twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used > >>>>>> initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he > >>>>>> needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how > >>>>>> do > >>>>>> you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What > >>>>>> has been lost in the translation? > >>>>>> Kevin. KD5ONS > >> > >> __ > >> Elecraft mailing list > >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > >> > >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > JIM ROGERS, W4ATK > > w4...@bellsouth.net > > http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk > > K3/100 P3 > > K2/10 > > > > > > > > > > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
> I for one have been enjoying the thread. Ditto! It is, unfortunately, somewhat rare that there is an interesting discussion on here. 73 de dave ab9ca/4 On 3/10/11 9:58 AM, Gary Ferdinand wrote: > I for one have been enjoying the thread. > > Gary W2CS > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Does not offend me Jim! Was just puzzled. The math is hard having forgotten most of that myself especially as I only barely understood it back in college 40 years ago. The book I am reading, "The Maxwellians," is more a science history book than a book on the equations themselves. Interesting reading about the scientists and how they worked this out. How some ideas survived and some did not. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/10/2011 10:56 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: > I am sure what you say has value Tom. It just seems this one has been > going on a while. It did prompt me to go out and look up Maxwells > equations just to see what you were all talking about and it is > interesting but the math is certainly over my head. I hope my > comments did not offend anyone. If so, I apologize, sincerely. > > 73s Jim On Mar 10, 2011, at 9:42 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > >> Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. >> >> Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do >> with the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 >> builder). Talking about the actual equations and the history of >> their development seems to me to be of general interest to many of >> the readers of this list given the other responses. >> >> 73, tom n4zpt >> >> On 3/10/2011 10:06 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: >>> Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this >>> represent to the average K3 user? . On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, >>> Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: >>> Hi Kevin, What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in the middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a controversy on his particle (or little eddies?) form of the equations for a field approach. Perhaps that new version would have dropped the use of quaternions? Have not studied the equations since college, perhaps will go find the papers after I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating the older forms. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: > There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he > was forced to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of > the work was carried out by others but for him to publish he > needed peer review so he caved into the larger group. I am > reading his original work from 1873 and finding it very > enlightening. Even though I have studied the > Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times > the quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard > to find. Luckily they are proliferating online these days. > Kevin. KD5ONS > > > On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David > Cutter wrote: > >> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read >> it again. Interesting. >> >> David G3UNA >> >> >>> Hi Kevin, >>> >>> Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand >>> original theory. Was some his disciples, aka "The >>> Maxwellians," that finished the theory in the present >>> form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. >>> >>> Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this >>> story. >>> >>> 73, tom n4zpt >>> >>> >>> >>> On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: I have always wondered how he condensed the original twenty equations in twenty unknowns down to just four of them. The quaternions he used initially were out a favor with the physics community of the day so he needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a good job but how do you characterize a system with twenty unknowns in four equations? What has been lost in the translation? Kevin. KD5ONS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>> >>> JIM ROGERS, W4ATK w4...@bellsouth.net >>> http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk K3/100 P3 K2/10 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list Home: >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: >> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: >> mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this >> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > JIM ROGERS, W4ATK w4...@bellsouth.net > http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk K3/100 P3 K2/10 > > > > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted b
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
For those who might have an interest, there is a brief paper that summarizes Maxwell's equations and shows the connection between the different notations used: differential form, original form, quaternion form, and so on. http://www.zpenergy.com/downloads/Orig_maxwell_equations.pdf On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:34 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > Does not offend me Jim! > > Was just puzzled. > > The math is hard having forgotten most of that myself especially as I > only barely understood it back in college 40 years ago. The book I am > reading, "The Maxwellians," is more a science history book than a book > on the equations themselves. Interesting reading about the scientists > and how they worked this out. How some ideas survived and some did not. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > > > > On 3/10/2011 10:56 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: >> I am sure what you say has value Tom. It just seems this one has been >> going on a while. It did prompt me to go out and look up Maxwells >> equations just to see what you were all talking about and it is >> interesting but the math is certainly over my head. I hope my >> comments did not offend anyone. If so, I apologize, sincerely. >> >> 73s Jim On Mar 10, 2011, at 9:42 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: >> >>> Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. >>> >>> Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do >>> with the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 >>> builder). Talking about the actual equations and the history of >>> their development seems to me to be of general interest to many of >>> the readers of this list given the other responses. >>> >>> 73, tom n4zpt >>> >>> On 3/10/2011 10:06 AM, JAMES ROGERS wrote: Enough with the Maxwell Equations What in the world does this represent to the average K3 user? . On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > Hi Kevin, > > What was asserted in "The Maxwellians" was that Maxwell died in > the middle of a rewrite. It did sound like there was a > controversy on his particle (or little eddies?) form of the > equations for a field approach. Perhaps that new version would > have dropped the use of quaternions? Have not studied the > equations since college, perhaps will go find the papers after > I finish this history book. Thanks for the tip on locating the > older forms. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > On 3/10/2011 1:46 AM, Kevin Rock wrote: >> There was a group which disliked his use of quaternions so he >> was forced to rewrite the system into other systems. Most of >> the work was carried out by others but for him to publish he >> needed peer review so he caved into the larger group. I am >> reading his original work from 1873 and finding it very >> enlightening. Even though I have studied the >> Heaviside-Gibb's version of the Maxwell equations many times >> the quaternions he used in the original paper were very hard >> to find. Luckily they are proliferating online these days. >> Kevin. KD5ONS >> >> >> On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 15:31:18 -0800, David >> Cutter wrote: >> >>> I don't recall that from his biography, I'll have to read >>> it again. Interesting. >>> >>> David G3UNA >>> >>> Hi Kevin, Was not Maxwell that condensed the hard to understand original theory. Was some his disciples, aka "The Maxwellians," that finished the theory in the present form. FitzGerald, Lodge, and Heavyside plus others. Am just now reading "The Maxwellians" that has this story. 73, tom n4zpt On 3/6/2011 5:37 PM, Kevin Rock wrote: > I have always wondered how he condensed the original > twenty equations in twenty unknowns down to just four > of them. The quaternions he used initially were out a > favor with the physics community of the day so he > needed to get them into vector form. Heaviside did a > good job but how do you characterize a system with > twenty unknowns in four equations? What has been lost > in the translation? Kevin. KD5ONS > > __ > Elecraft mailing list Home: > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: > http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: > mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support > this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html JIM ROGERS, W4ATK w4...@bellsouth.net http://web.me.com/jimrogers_w4atk K3/100 P3 K2/10 >>> >>> __ >>> Elecraft mailing list Home: >>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: >>> http://mailman.qth.net/mmf
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I remember JFK saying (and I paraphrase) "... we do it not because it is easy, but because it is hard ..." Do any of you think the K3 was designed in a week? From what little I was told it was a matter of four or five years and it still being developed as we sit. We did not get to the moon because it was a simple problem. We got there through the efforts of many thousands of hard working engineers who had a dream. Whenever I feel bored or depressed I sit with a book on fluid dynamics or learn some new methods in mathematics. It has taken years but I still need to keep learning more. Each small step opens up a new vista for my exploration to continue. As was stated earlier: "I see so far because I stand on the shoulders of giants." 73, Kevin. KD5ONS On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 08:34:22 -0800, Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote: > Does not offend me Jim! > > Was just puzzled. > > The math is hard having forgotten most of that myself especially as I > only barely understood it back in college 40 years ago. The book I am > reading, "The Maxwellians," is more a science history book than a book > on the equations themselves. Interesting reading about the scientists > and how they worked this out. How some ideas survived and some did not. > > 73, tom n4zpt __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
I also have been enjoying this discussion. And the thread is nicely described in the subject line, making it easy to filter for those not interested. It would be nice if this was always the case, on this reflector and others. 73, Rick Dettinger K7MW On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:25 AM, dave wrote: >> I for one have been enjoying the thread. > > Ditto! > > It is, unfortunately, somewhat rare that there is an interesting > discussion on here. > > > 73 de dave > ab9ca/4 > > > > > > On 3/10/11 9:58 AM, Gary Ferdinand wrote: >> I for one have been enjoying the thread. >> >> Gary W2CS >> >> __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
On 3/10/2011 1:14 PM, Rick Dettinger wrote: > I also have been enjoying this discussion. And the thread is nicely > described in the subject line, making it easy to filter for those not > interested. It would be nice if this was always the case, on this > reflector and others. > It would be even nicer if we didn't NEED to filter off-topic discussions perpetuated by a small minority of list members who don't seem to care what the list focus is 73, Ross N4RP > 73, > Rick Dettinger K7MW > > > > > > On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:25 AM, dave wrote: > >>> I for one have been enjoying the thread. >> Ditto! >> >> It is, unfortunately, somewhat rare that there is an interesting >> discussion on here. >> >> >> 73 de dave >> ab9ca/4 >> >> >> >> >> >> On 3/10/11 9:58 AM, Gary Ferdinand wrote: >>> I for one have been enjoying the thread. >>> >>> Gary W2CS >>> >>> > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- FCC Section 97.313(a) “At all times, an amateur station must use the minimum transmitter power necessary to carry out the desired communications.” __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
James, we will soon seen an end to this thread when Eric "pulls the plug" to keep the message rate under control. As list moderator Eric makes that decision to keep the total traffic under some semblance of control ;-) Note that this is *not* just a "K3" list. It covers all Elecraft gear, the uses of that gear *and* assorted discussions of interest to Hams in all aspects of the hobby and the evolution of the technology, past and present, according to what I've followed over the past decade here. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do with the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 builder). Talking about the actual equations and the history of their development seems to me to be of general interest to many of the readers of this list given the other responses. 73, tom n4zpt __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
Also a lot has to do with the "tone" of the discussion. Pleasant discussions that open a subject well to new understanding seem to be tolerated for a longer string of posts than others that get personal or confrontational. This thread has been interesting and entertaining. 73, Guy. On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 1:40 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > James, we will soon seen an end to this thread when Eric "pulls the plug" > to > keep the message rate under control. As list moderator Eric makes that > decision to keep the total traffic under some semblance of control ;-) > > Note that this is *not* just a "K3" list. It covers all Elecraft gear, the > uses of that gear *and* assorted discussions of interest to Hams in all > aspects of the hobby and the evolution of the technology, past and present, > according to what I've followed over the past decade here. > > 73, > > Ron AC7AC > > -Original Message- > > Sorry you are not enjoying the thread James. > > Seems like many of the email on this reflector has nothing to do with > the K3. I'm an average user of the K3 (and an in progress K2 builder). > Talking about the actual equations and the history of their development > seems to me to be of general interest to many of the readers of this > list given the other responses. > > 73, tom n4zpt > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations
When I'm using my K3, it's M-theory. When I'm using my K2, it's Modified Newtonian Dynamics (MOND). But when I'm using my HW-16, it's definitely a steady-state universe ala Fred Hoyle, et al. :-) 72.1415926535, Eric WD6DBM (snip) Interesting discussion. Gives me an idea. We'll soon be announcing a very cool new test instrument (it's the same size as our T1 antenna tuner but not related to it in any way). We'll give one of these to whoever can suggest, by next Thursday, the most plausible alternative to 11-dimensional supersymmetry as the working basis for a unified field theory. You may assume a negative cosmological constant and cannot impose R-parity. If the Higgs boson is discovered before the new product announcement, we'll throw in a spare 9-V battery. 73.14159..., Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Maxwell's Equations.
> Guy states my moderation position perfectly :-) > > 73, > Eric WA6HHQ > List Moderator and modulator.. > > www.elecraft.com > _..._ > > > > On Mar 10, 2011, at 7:56 PM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote: > >> Also a lot has to do with the "tone" of the discussion. Pleasant >> discussions that open a subject well to new understanding seem to be >> tolerated for a longer string of posts than others that get personal or >> confrontational. This thread has been interesting and entertaining. 73, >> Guy. >> >> On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 1:40 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: >> >>> James, we will soon seen an end to this thread when Eric "pulls the plug" >>> to >>> keep the message rate under control. As list moderator Eric makes that >>> decision to keep the total traffic under some semblance of control ;-) >>> __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
