[PSES] Interior lighting for large control panels

2017-04-20 Thread Doug Powell 
All,

I just finished reviewing older editions of UL 508 (2005) and UL 508A
(2003) for any requirements specifically for interior lighting of large
cabinets.  This would be for cabinets large enough to be a container with
personnel doors.  I do see requirements for how to implement "maintenance
lighting" if provided but not a requirement specifically stating
maintenance lighting "shall be provided". Also, if the latest editions of
the UL standards now include sections on risk assessment, I can see how a
maintenance person who is inadvertently entrapped (e.g. wind closed the
door) would then could become disoriented and egress lighting would be
important to mitigate the hazard.

Any guidance on mandatory lighting requirements for maintenance is greatly
appreciated.

​Thanks,  Doug

​

-- 

Douglas E Powell

doug...@gmail.com
http://www.linkedin.com/in/dougp01

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Re: [PSES] EN55024 - conducted immunity on 28VDC powered equipment

2017-04-20 Thread T.Sato 
On Wed, 19 Apr 2017 18:51:28 -0700,
  "Ghery S. Pettit"  wrote:

> EN 55024 is based on CISPR 24:2010.  Without looking at a copy of the EN 
> document (which, IIRC, only provides references), CISPR 24 clearly has a 
> table for a port called DC input.  So, the short answer is, yes, there are 
> conducted immunity requirements for 28 VDC powered ITE.

Yes, but appliability of surge, burst, and conducted RF tests depends to
the situation:

o Surge test is required only to to ports connect directly to outdoor cables

o If the equipment is marketed with ac/dc power converter, those tests will
  be applied at the input of the ac/dc power converter

o If d.c. power is fed on conductors included in a signal cable, requirements
  for signal ports will be applied instead

Regards,
Tom

-- 
Tomonori Sato  
URL: http://t-sato.in.coocan.jp


> From: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] 
> Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 2:14 AM
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> Subject: [PSES] EN55024 - conducted immunity on 28VDC powered equipment
> 
>  
> 
> Currently, I’m not able to check EN55024.
> 
> Anybody who could tell me if conducted immunity (surge, burst, cond RF) 
> applies to 28VDC powered ITE? 
> 
>  
> 
> Cheers!
> 
>  
> 
> Best regards
> 
> Amund
> 
> -
> 
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
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Re: [PSES] Frequency range & transitted power for RED

2017-04-20 Thread Michael Derby 
Hi Scott,

 

I think Charlie already answered this, but the “20 dBm” is the limit for 2.4 
GHz WLAN and BT, as stated in the spectrum allocations and then again in the 
test standard (EN 300 328).

Each type of band and product will have its own limit.

 

Stating “<20 dBm” would just be reminding the market surveillance of something 
they already know.   They could read the standard or spectrum allocation and 
already know that information.

I think they want to know the actual rated power of the transmitter they have 
in their hands.

 

As Charlie asked, it seems unclear what exactly you’re asking.   Sorry for my 
confusion!

 

Michael.

 

 

 

 

From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 18 April 2017 14:53
To: Michael Derby ; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Frequency range & transitted power for RED

 

Dear Michael,

 

Thanks for your useful example of WiFi devices!  The permissible limit is 20 
dBm or 100 mW.  Where can we find it for different type of products?

 

Can you shed light why <20 dBm is considered useless.  That is the design to 
allow for this type of products.  Each designer can fully utilise the allowable 
power for optimising the performance of the product.

 

I agree on rated power for each product to be quoted.  Did you mean the 
tolerance +/- 1 dB is subject to the upper limit and lower limit of mass 
production.  Each product may vary depending on the complexity of the product.

 

What are about Bluetooth devices?  I have learnt the permissible limit is 13 
dBm or 20 mW but did not find the reference.  However I read a test report of 
EN 62479 on a Bluetooth speaker.  It was measured max E.I.R.P. = -7.9 dBm or 
0.16 mW in 2.4 GHz.  The manual and the RED compliance cert are stated <20 dBm. 
 It seems not right, isn’t it?  If the limit is used in mass production, the 
devices may be faulty and still fall into the limit.

 

For frequency range, did the compliance test verify it?  If so, where I can 
find the test result so I can put appropriate statement on manual accordingly.

 

Thanks and regards,

 

Scott

 

 

From: Michael Derby  >
Date: Tuesday, 18 April 2017 at 6:22 PM
To: 'Scott Xe'  >, 
 >
Subject: RE: [PSES] Frequency range & transitted power for RED

 

Hi Scott,

 

The most common, and most recent, guidance is that the user manual should list 
the rated power of the product.

 

For example, let’s say you have a WiFi device in the 2.4 GHz band, and the 
power (e.i.r.p.) is rated at 14 dBm +/- 1 dB..

Let’s say that you measure 13.8 dBm e.i.r.p. in the test lab.

We know the limit in the standard is 20 dBm.

 

It would not be necessary to state 13.8 dBm exactly.   That value only applies 
to the one unit you tested, and of course it means you cannot plan your user 
manual until you tested!

 

Similarly, it would be rather useless to state “<20 dBm” in the user manual; 
because of course we all know that.

 

The user manual should therefore state:   14 dBm, +/- 1 dB.   (the rated power)

 

You can use common terms, like GSM 900, or LTE Band 1.   But be careful with 
some things, like “5 GHz WLAN” because that would not be specific enough…. 
Because there are so many 5 GHz WLAN bands (some of which are permitted in the 
EU and some are not)

 

I am not sure I understand the second part of your question:

“With a compliance report, where do we check if they fall into the permissible 
limits?”

 

Are you testing to the standards?   Or are you checking the accuracy of the 
user manual statements?

 

 

Michael.

 

 

Michael Derby 

Senior Regulatory Engineer 

Director 

ACB Europe 

 

Certification Resource for the Wireless Industry 

Web:   www.acbcert.com   

  

e-mail:  micha...@acbcert.com 

Mobile phone:   (+44) 7939 880829   (UK area code) 

Corporate office phone: USA:   (+1) 703 847 4700 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 17 April 2017 10:27
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG  
Subject: [PSES] Frequency range & transitted power for RED

 

In user manual, it is required to give the info on frequency range & 
transmitted power.  What is the right info to give there?  With a compliance 
report, where do we check if they fall into the permissible limits?  The 
products are Bluetooth speakers and keyboard/mouse with a RF dongle.

 

Thanks and regards,

 

Scott

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Re: [PSES] EN55024 - conducted immunity on 28VDC powered equipment

2017-04-20 Thread Amund Westin 

Thanks Ghery,

I received a the EN55024 yesterday.
You are correct, conducted immunity testes for DC powered ITE is within 
the scope.


Best regards
Amund





On 2017-04-20 03:51, Ghery S. Pettit wrote:

Amund,

I have not seen any responses to your request, so here is mine.

EN 55024 is based on CISPR 24:2010.  Without looking at a copy of the
EN document (which, IIRC, only provides references), CISPR 24 clearly
has a table for a port called DC input.  So, the short answer is, yes,
there are conducted immunity requirements for 28 VDC powered ITE.

Ghery S. Pettit, NCE

FROM: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no]
SENT: Sunday, April 16, 2017 2:14 AM
TO: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
SUBJECT: [PSES] EN55024 - conducted immunity on 28VDC powered
equipment

Currently, I’m not able to check EN55024.

Anybody who could tell me if conducted immunity (surge, burst, cond
RF) applies to 28VDC powered ITE?

Cheers!

Best regards

Amund

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