[PSES] Labeling - battery operated products

[Amund Westin]

At least for CE marking purposes, there are no requirements for any battery 
related information on the product label.

 

But then I came into this web-site / document:

http://www.iata.org/whatwedo/cargo/dgr/Documents/lithium-battery-guidance-document-2017-en.pdf

 

Should a product (with batteries incorporated) have such battery information on 
its label or is this IATA requirements only for shipment packages?

 

Any IATA specialists here?

 

 

BR
Amund

 

 

 


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Re: [PSES] KC Mark E labeling

[Ben Kim]

Hi Mark,
RRA notice 2015-26 and KATS announcement (date 4/26/2016) include this 
information. Click on the following shortcut for KATS ( Not available in 
English unfortunately).
http://kats.go.kr/cwsboard/board.do?mode=download&bid=128&cid=18555&filename=18555_201605021103214061.pdf
 
Thanks,Ben


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, September 7, 2017, 12:19 PM, Schmidt, Mark  
wrote:

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Thank you Ben,
 
  
 
Is there a link to this that is accessible? Is it on the RRA or KATS site?
 
  
 
Regards,
 
Mark
 
  
 
From: Ben Kim [mailto:benki...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2017 1:42 PM
To: Schmidt, Mark; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] KC Mark E labeling
 
  
 
Mark,
 
  
 
e-labelling is acceptable in S.Korea. Both RRA and KATS allows manufacture to 
use e-label (in lieu of physical label) for the product that has its own 
display (such as smartphone). 
 
  
 
Thanks, 
 
Ben 
 
  
 
On Thursday, September 7, 2017 9:23 AM, "Schmidt, Mark"  
wrote:
 
  
 
Hello Group,
 
 
 
Can anyone direct me to information concerning e labeling of a Bluetooth module 
and Device. We are currently marking the FCC, IC and KC ID physically on the 
product label but we ran out of room due to an OEM request on one of our 
products. I understand that FCC and IC accept e labels on products with 
permanent displays and have easy access to this e label screen and its 
directions on how to get to that screen in the manual. I have heard and seen 
posts that this too is acceptable in S. Korea but these sources are not 
official. Any information will be helpful since we are designing the physical 
label for this OEM right now. Do I have to keep the KC MSIP ID on the physical 
label?
 
 
 
Thanks,
 
Mark
 
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sender and delete this message. The sender disclaims that the content of this 
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provided that the foregoing does not invalidate the binding effect of any 
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Re: [PSES] KC Mark E labeling

[Schmidt, Mark]

Thank you Ben,

Is there a link to this that is accessible? Is it on the RRA or KATS site?

Regards,
Mark

From: Ben Kim [mailto:benki...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2017 1:42 PM
To: Schmidt, Mark; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] KC Mark E labeling

Mark,

e-labelling is acceptable in S.Korea. Both RRA and KATS allows manufacture to 
use e-label (in lieu of physical label) for the product that has its own 
display (such as smartphone).

Thanks,
Ben

On Thursday, September 7, 2017 9:23 AM, "Schmidt, Mark" 
mailto:markschm...@xrite.com>> wrote:

Hello Group,

Can anyone direct me to information concerning e labeling of a Bluetooth module 
and Device. We are currently marking the FCC, IC and KC ID physically on the 
product label but we ran out of room due to an OEM request on one of our 
products. I understand that FCC and IC accept e labels on products with 
permanent displays and have easy access to this e label screen and its 
directions on how to get to that screen in the manual. I have heard and seen 
posts that this too is acceptable in S. Korea but these sources are not 
official. Any information will be helpful since we are designing the physical 
label for this OEM right now. Do I have to keep the KC MSIP ID on the physical 
label?

Thanks,
Mark
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are not the intended recipient, please notify us by email by replying to the 
sender and delete this message. The sender disclaims that the content of this 
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Re: [PSES] KC Mark E labeling

[Ben Kim]

Mark,
e-labelling is acceptable in S.Korea. Both RRA and KATS allows manufacture to 
use e-label (in lieu of physical label) for the product that has its own 
display (such as smartphone). 
Thanks, Ben  

On Thursday, September 7, 2017 9:23 AM, "Schmidt, Mark" 
 wrote:
 

  Hello 
Group,    Can anyone direct me to information concerning e labeling of a 
Bluetooth module and Device. We are currently marking the FCC, IC and KC ID 
physically on the product label but we ran out of room due to an OEM request on 
one of our products. I understand that FCC and IC accept e labels on products 
with permanent displays and have easy access to this e label screen and its 
directions on how to get to that screen in the manual. I have heard and seen 
posts that this too is acceptable in S. Korea but these sources are not 
official. Any information will be helpful since we are designing the physical 
label for this OEM right now. Do I have to keep the KC MSIP ID on the physical 
label?    Thanks, Mark Please be advised that this email may contain 
confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify 
us by email by replying to the sender and delete this message. The sender 
disclaims that the content of this email constitutes an offer to enter into, or 
the acceptance of, any agreement; provided that the foregoing does not 
invalidate the binding effect of any digital or other electronic reproduction 
of a manual signature that is included in any attachment.-

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[PSES] Composite Systems and Intentional Radiators

[Grasso, Charles]

Hello,

I am soliciting help in the interpretation of FCC rules as to what makes an 
intentional radiator and the application
of standards as a result.

The scenario:  A product is designed and tested as an unintentional radiator 
and 15.109/15.107 and/or ANSI C63.4 etc
test levels and methods are performed. A WiFi dual band radio is now added (not 
as a module) by redesign and the final product
is ready for authorization. My thought process is as follows - please tell me 
if I have erred:


1.   Test the Unintentional Portion of the new product to 15.109/15.107 
etc...radio is in rcv mode.

2.   Test the WiFI radio portion of the product to 15.209/ANSI C63.10 and

3.   A product is born.

Note though there is a very specific wording in numbers 1 and 2. Considering 
the composite nature of the FCC rules, I am under
the impression that the limits for the unintentional portion of the radio apply 
ONLY to the non-radio portions of the spec and
the limits for the intentional portion apply ONLY to the radio.

Am I correct?



Thanks

Charles Grasso
(w) 303-706-5467


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[PSES] KC Mark E labeling

[Schmidt, Mark]

Hello Group,

Can anyone direct me to information concerning e labeling of a Bluetooth module 
and Device. We are currently marking the FCC, IC and KC ID physically on the 
product label but we ran out of room due to an OEM request on one of our 
products. I understand that FCC and IC accept e labels on products with 
permanent displays and have easy access to this e label screen and its 
directions on how to get to that screen in the manual. I have heard and seen 
posts that this too is acceptable in S. Korea but these sources are not 
official. Any information will be helpful since we are designing the physical 
label for this OEM right now. Do I have to keep the KC MSIP ID on the physical 
label?

Thanks,
Mark
Please be advised that this email may contain confidential information. If you 
are not the intended recipient, please notify us by email by replying to the 
sender and delete this message. The sender disclaims that the content of this 
email constitutes an offer to enter into, or the acceptance of, any agreement; 
provided that the foregoing does not invalidate the binding effect of any 
digital or other electronic reproduction of a manual signature that is included 
in any attachment.

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Re: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

[Don Gies]

Ed, I conducted TEMPEST tests and mitigation on SINCGARS radios too.

 

Amund, the TEMPEST test procedures are classified.  

 

Don Gies

ddg...@verizon.net  

(732) 207-7828

 

From: Edward Price [mailto:e...@jwjelp.com] 
Sent: Thursday, September 7, 2017 5:20 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

 

Amund:

 

In TEMPEST testing, both the limits and the data were considered classified 
information.

 

Don:

 

The conflation of TEMPEST and 461 probably arose from the fact that most all 
equipment requiring TEMPEST compliance was being bought by DoD agencies, and 
they also required 461 compliance. As an example, back in the late 80’s, I did 
the 461 compliance testing for the SINCGARS radio system, while a TEMPEST 
certified engineer worked in my lab doing a parallel TEMPEST compliance test. 
The customer was the same, but the two efforts were on separate contracts.

 

OTOH, I recall another job, this one commercial, where the customer only asked 
us to do TEMPEST on a high-speed computer line-printer; there was no 
requirement for 461. The customer’s plan was to sell TEMPEST ready printers to 
non-governmental custoers.

 

Ed Price
WB6WSN
Chula Vista, CA USA

 

 

From: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2017 11:22 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG  
Subject: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

 

I was looking for the document NSTISSAM TEMPEST/1-92  «Compromising Emanations 
Laboratory Test Requirements, Electromagnetics», but I only found a file with 
all emission plots covered by a black spot. Classified information?

 

BR

Amund

 

 

 

Fra: Don Gies [mailto:ddg...@verizon.net] 

Sendt: 6. september 2017 23:35

Til: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG  

Emne: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

 

Years ago,  if you tested under a TEMPEST contract, you tested for MIL-STD-461 
as well. 

 

They were not considered overlapping requirements, and the TEMPEST engineer is 
looking for other things that the MIL-STD-461 engineer is not. 

 

Don Gies

mailto:ddg...@verizon.net

(732) 207-7828

 

From: rbtuk [mailto:0a0e51f5c059-dmarc-requ...@ieee.org] 

Sent: Tuesday, September 5, 2017 4:53 PM

To: mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG

Subject: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

 

In my experience of both type of testing experience - if it is tempest 
compliant it is likely to be compliant with commercial emission requirements

 

 

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 

 Original message 

From: Ken Javor  

Date: 9/5/17 16:35 (GMT-05:00) 

To: mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 

Subject: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC 

 

TEMPEST is completely decoupled from EMC. The EMC requirements are driven by 
how the item will be used.  A TEMPEST qualified PC to be used around some 
secure data center in a plant or office building will have those sports of 
CISPR EMC qualifications. If the device is going to be used on a military 
vehicle of some sort, then MIL-STD-461 is required. But these statements stand 
on their own – they are independent of the TEMPEST qualification.

 

Ken Javor

Phone: (256) 650-5261



From: Amund Westin 

Reply-To: Amund Westin 

Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2017 21:22:33 +0200

To: 

Subject: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

 

Any special EMC requirements for TEMPEST approved equipment? Is MIL-STD-461 
mandatory? …

 

Best regards

 

Amund  

-



 

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discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


 

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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

 

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Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to 
unsubscribe) http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html 

List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html 

 

For help, send mail to the list administrators:

Scott Douglas 

Mike Cantwell  

 

For policy questions, send mail to:

Jim Bacher  

David Heald  

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Re: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

[Cortland Richmond]

Oh yes.  One reason I was hired to do EMC testing after  i retired from 
the US Army in 1983 was that I had a current SECRET clearance.   THAT'S 
long gone. Heh!


Cortland Richmond

larance.
On 9/7/2017 2:22 AM, Amund Westin wrote:


I was looking for the document NSTISSAM TEMPEST/1-92 /«Compromising 
Emanations Laboratory Test Requirements, Electromagnetics»,/ but I 
only found a file with all emission plots covered by a black spot. 
Classified information?


BR

Amund






-

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list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
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David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC

[Edward Price]

Amund:

In TEMPEST testing, both the limits and the data were considered classified 
information.

Don:

The conflation of TEMPEST and 461 probably arose from the fact that most all 
equipment requiring TEMPEST compliance was being bought by DoD agencies, and 
they also required 461 compliance. As an example, back in the late 80’s, I did 
the 461 compliance testing for the SINCGARS radio system, while a TEMPEST 
certified engineer worked in my lab doing a parallel TEMPEST compliance test. 
The customer was the same, but the two efforts were on separate contracts.

OTOH, I recall another job, this one commercial, where the customer only asked 
us to do TEMPEST on a high-speed computer line-printer; there was no 
requirement for 461. The customer’s plan was to sell TEMPEST ready printers to 
non-governmental custoers.

Ed Price
WB6WSN
Chula Vista, CA USA


From: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no]
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2017 11:22 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] SV: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC


I was looking for the document NSTISSAM TEMPEST/1-92  «Compromising Emanations 
Laboratory Test Requirements, Electromagnetics», but I only found a file with 
all emission plots covered by a black spot. Classified information?



BR

Amund







Fra: Don Gies [mailto:ddg...@verizon.net]

Sendt: 6. september 2017 23:35

Til: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG

Emne: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC



Years ago,  if you tested under a TEMPEST contract, you tested for MIL-STD-461 
as well.



They were not considered overlapping requirements, and the TEMPEST engineer is 
looking for other things that the MIL-STD-461 engineer is not.



Don Gies

mailto:ddg...@verizon.net

(732) 207-7828



From: rbtuk [mailto:0a0e51f5c059-dmarc-requ...@ieee.org]

Sent: Tuesday, September 5, 2017 4:53 PM

To: mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG

Subject: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC



In my experience of both type of testing experience - if it is tempest 
compliant it is likely to be compliant with commercial emission requirements







Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone



 Original message 

From: Ken Javor 

Date: 9/5/17 16:35 (GMT-05:00)

To: mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG

Subject: Re: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC



TEMPEST is completely decoupled from EMC. The EMC requirements are driven by 
how the item will be used.  A TEMPEST qualified PC to be used around some 
secure data center in a plant or office building will have those sports of 
CISPR EMC qualifications. If the device is going to be used on a military 
vehicle of some sort, then MIL-STD-461 is required. But these statements stand 
on their own – they are independent of the TEMPEST qualification.



Ken Javor

Phone: (256) 650-5261



From: Amund Westin 

Reply-To: Amund Westin 

Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2017 21:22:33 +0200

To: 

Subject: [PSES] TEMPEST and EMC



Any special EMC requirements for TEMPEST approved equipment? Is MIL-STD-461 
mandatory? …



Best regards



Amund

-





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discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 




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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/

Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html

List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:

Scott Douglas 

Mike Cant