[PSES] RF immunity - audio noise in headsets

2018-09-04 Thread Amund Westin 
Wired headsets and microphones connected to a product, often acts as
receiver for induced RF fields. That means you quite often hear the 1kHz
modulation tone under the RF immunity tests. This is quite annoying for the
user and above a certain level, not acceptable.

 

To avoid such phenomena is quite a big task to conduct. But have anyone of
you any experience how to determine if the headsets / microphones or the
connected final product is the source to this problem? 3rd. party headsets /
microphones have of course different RF immunity performance, and after a
lot of testing, you might be able to find headsets / microphones that are
does not pick up fields and the hearing audio noise level is acceptable.

 

I assume that the final product may have great level of immunity, but as
long the headsets / microphones has poor immunity level, you will have this
audio problem anyway.

Has anyone been into this problem before? 

 

BR

Amund 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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Re: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

2018-09-04 Thread Nyffenegger, Dave 
Amund,

I’d think (since your product conformance is only valid with specific adapter) 
your adapter must be included with your product when doing all the applicable 
testing to harmonized standards and in the technical file as a critical 
component and therefore would be inherently included in your DoC.  But it 
wouldn’t be separately identified on your DoC.  Nor  would I think your DoC 
would simply include the same conformity statements to the directives and 
standards listed on the adapter DoC.

I have seen other products that do not include the adapter in their product 
DoC.  For  example the product DoC would declare to EMC, RED, RoHS but would 
not declare to LVD that would clearly apply to the adapter.  Likely in those 
cases the manufacturer chooses to have the option of using different adapters 
without changing  their product certification.

-Dave

From: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no]
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2018 12:09 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

We buy AC/DC adapters form a major power supply manufacturer. It has all the 
papers in place as DoC, CB test reports and CB certificate.

This adapter has been used under the EMC, LVD and RED tests of our product. 
There have been some questions if the adapter should be included in the DoC, 
because conformance of our product is only valid with that specific adapter. 
Even though the adapter has its own DoC, I think it is correct to include the 
adapter in our DoC since both parts are put together on the marked as a 
combined solution (in the same package).
Do we take any unnecessary adapter manufacturer responsibilities by including 
the adapter type designation on our DoC? Any thoughs?
Looked into the Blue Guide, but could not find any discussions about this.


BR
Amund






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[PSES] SV: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

2018-09-04 Thread Amund Westin 
Just to make it a bit more complicated ….

 

One of the adapters we are using is not for sale anymore. But we have a lot of 
adapters in stock and we have made tests to include the A2 for IEC/EN60950-1 
and the adapter is now good for LVD. But the original DoC from the adapter 
manufacturer is not valid (A2 missing), so in this case we might have to take 
the responsibility and issue a separate adapter DoC or the combined DoC 
(product + adapter) might be good enough? Have to think about this …

 

BR

Amund

 

 

 

 

Fra: Amund Westin  
Sendt: 5. september 2018 07:34
Til: 'Nyffenegger, Dave' 
Emne: SV: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

 

Thanks Dave

 

I have also looked into different DoCs with no listing of adapters. I think it 
should be listed in some way, but not taking the PSU manufacturer 
responsibilities. I’ll check out with the local notified body.

 

BR

Amund

 

 

Fra: Nyffenegger, Dave mailto:dave.nyffeneg...@bhemail.com> > 
Sendt: 5. september 2018 06:22
Til: Amund Westin mailto:am...@westin-emission.no> 
>; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG  
Emne: RE: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

 

Amund,

 

I’d think (since your product conformance is only valid with specific adapter) 
your adapter must be included with your product when doing all the applicable 
testing to harmonized standards and in the technical file as a critical 
component and therefore would be inherently included in your DoC.  But it 
wouldn’t be separately identified on your DoC.  Nor  would I think your DoC 
would simply include the same conformity statements to the directives and 
standards listed on the adapter DoC. 

 

I have seen other products that do not include the adapter in their product 
DoC.  For  example the product DoC would declare to EMC, RED, RoHS but would 
not declare to LVD that would clearly apply to the adapter.  Likely in those 
cases the manufacturer chooses to have the option of using different adapters 
without changing  their product certification.

 

-Dave

 

From: Amund Westin [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2018 12:09 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG  
Subject: [PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

 

We buy AC/DC adapters form a major power supply manufacturer. It has all the 
papers in place as DoC, CB test reports and CB certificate. 

 

This adapter has been used under the EMC, LVD and RED tests of our product. 
There have been some questions if the adapter should be included in the DoC, 
because conformance of our product is only valid with that specific adapter. 
Even though the adapter has its own DoC, I think it is correct to include the 
adapter in our DoC since both parts are put together on the marked as a 
combined solution (in the same package).

Do we take any unnecessary adapter manufacturer responsibilities by including 
the adapter type designation on our DoC? Any thoughs?

Looked into the Blue Guide, but could not find any discussions about this.

 

 

BR
Amund

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[PSES] DoC - 3rd party device to be included?

2018-09-04 Thread Amund Westin 
We buy AC/DC adapters form a major power supply manufacturer. It has all the 
papers in place as DoC, CB test reports and CB certificate. 

 

This adapter has been used under the EMC, LVD and RED tests of our product. 
There have been some questions if the adapter should be included in the DoC, 
because conformance of our product is only valid with that specific adapter. 
Even though the adapter has its own DoC, I think it is correct to include the 
adapter in our DoC since both parts are put together on the marked as a 
combined solution (in the same package).

Do we take any unnecessary adapter manufacturer responsibilities by including 
the adapter type designation on our DoC? Any thoughs?

Looked into the Blue Guide, but could not find any discussions about this.

 

 

BR
Amund

 

 

 

 

 


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Re: [PSES] CE marking - mixture of responsibilities

2018-09-04 Thread Scott Xe 
Hi James,

It is quite normal attitude for an oem or odm manufacturer.  They have over
hundred buyers to keep their business alive and lack of resource to meet
all standards of their buyers.  In order to meet your requirements, you
have to actively educate them for what they have to supply in order to
fulfillment of business contract.

In your 2nd para, for the product design, Yes.  In terms of production
units, you have to verify by yourselves or hire a 3rd party body upon your
behalf to verify if they have a good quality assurance system to maintain
the production units within the tolerance of approved sample.  If you act
as a retailer only, the product under their brand and their contact, you
may have limited responsibilities, otherwise, you actually act as a
manufacturer in EU.  For example, if your product is picked up by the
market surveillance for validation of compliance with applicable
regulations, do they contact your supplier or you?

Hope it is useful to your consideration!

Scott

On Thu, 30 Aug 2018 at 15:55, James Pawson (U3C) <
ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk> wrote:

> Hello all,
>
>
>
> I’m working with a company who are importing some IT products from China
> to the EU. The Chinese manufacturer is taking a very much “hands off”
> approach to approvals, expecting the importer to draw up the DoC and
> perform much of the testing. However access to the parts of the Technical
> File that detail product construction are being held by the manufacturer
> and getting access to these is not straightforward.
>
>
>
> My question is: provided that all the documentation boxes are ticked and
> the product has been sufficiently assessed, can one reasonably take on
> responsibilities for other actors in the supply chain in this manner?
>
>
>
> I’m undecided if this is acceptable. My feeling is that whilst it is not
> to the letter of the law, it is to the spirit and would be acceptable
> depending on the importers tolerance to risk. However the letter of the
> directives is explicit in determining responsibilities e.g. that the
> manufacturer shall draw up the DoC.
>
>
>
> I would be interested to hear your thoughts on the matter.
>
>
>
> Thanks and all the best
>
> James
> -
> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <
> emc-p...@ieee.org>
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in
> well-used formats), large files, etc.
>
> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
> Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to
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>
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> Mike Cantwell 
>
> For policy questions, send mail to:
> Jim Bacher 
> David Heald 
>

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