Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread John Allen 
Charlie

 

That would be my reaction as well - which is why I would expect AV
specialists to question its application to their kit, and why the 62368-1
Scope needs clarification.

 

John Allen

 

From: Charlie Blackham [mailto:char...@sulisconsultants.com] 
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:58
To: John Allen; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: RE: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

 

I think EN 60905-22 is overkill for occasional use outdoors.

 

1 Scope

1.1 Equipment covered

This part of IEC 60950 applies to information technology equipment intended
to be installed in an OUTDOOR LOCATION.

 

The requirements for OUTDOOR EQUIPMENT also apply, where relevant, to empty
OUTDOOR ENCLOSURES supplied for housing information technology equipment to
be installed in an OUTDOOR LOCATION

 

3 Terms and definitions

For the purposes of this document, the terms and definitions given in IEC
60950-1 and the following apply.

3.1

OUTDOOR LOCATION

location for equipment where protection from the weather and other outdoor
influences provided by a building or other structure is limited or
non-existent

3.2

OUTDOOR EQUIPMENT 

equipment specified by the manufacturer to be installed where exposed wholly
or partly to the conditions in an OUTDOOR LOCATION

 

The product is designed to be used indoors, with occasional, portable, use
outdoors, then 60950-22 is not appropriate.

 

That said, you may want to make the equipment splash/drip proof, but that
would be more for functional / customer experience.

 

Regards

Charlie

 

From: John Allen [mailto:john_e_al...@blueyonder.co.uk] 
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:34
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

 

Good evening

 

I had the same idea as Ken re 60950-22 - and then got to thinking about
62368-1 which is replacing both 60065 & 60950, and the likelihood of  a
"Part XX" to that standard.?

 

Did a quick search on "62368 outdoor equipment" and no "Part XX" was flagged
up, but amongst the results was a link to this CSA page
http://shop.csa.ca/en/canada/it-telecom-and-audio-video-equipment/cancsa-c22
2-no-62368-1-14-/invt/27033302014

 

About 2/3rds of the way down that page it states the following:

 

"Additional requirements for information and communication technology
equipment intended for outdoor installation are given in CSA/UL 60950-22.
Additional requirements for audio/video equipment intended for outdoor
installation are given in the relevant requirements in CAN/CSA C22.2 No.
60065 or UL 60065." - so N.America is certainly "covered".

 

Presumably, however, the IEC Committees will (or should be!) working on a
suitable "Part XX" to 62368 - so does anyone have leads on that?

 

John Allen

W.London, UK

 

From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:13
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

 

Hi Ken,

 

Thanks for your suggestion on 60950-22.  I did not know or have this
standard but had some search on internet and note that the standard is for
equipment intended for outdoors.  I doubt it is too tough for my said
equipment.  That is reason why I believe there may be different levels for
outdoor use equipment.

 

Regards,

 

Scott

 

 

On 23 Dec, 2015, at 12:40 am, IBM Ken  wrote:

 

Hi Scott, I don't have any experience in this area but have you looked at
60950-22?

 

On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Scott Xe  wrote:

It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product
is powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but
can be used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally,
we use EN 60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety
standard covering the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product,
are there any defined levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product
to be used outdoor permanently?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread Charlie Blackham 
I think EN 60905-22 is overkill for occasional use outdoors.

1 Scope
1.1 Equipment covered
This part of IEC 60950 applies to information technology equipment intended to 
be installed in an OUTDOOR LOCATION.

The requirements for OUTDOOR EQUIPMENT also apply, where relevant, to empty 
OUTDOOR ENCLOSURES supplied for housing information technology equipment to be 
installed in an OUTDOOR LOCATION

3 Terms and definitions
For the purposes of this document, the terms and definitions given in IEC 
60950-1 and the following apply.
3.1
OUTDOOR LOCATION
location for equipment where protection from the weather and other outdoor 
influences provided by a building or other structure is limited or non-existent
3.2
OUTDOOR EQUIPMENT
equipment specified by the manufacturer to be installed where exposed wholly or 
partly to the conditions in an OUTDOOR LOCATION

The product is designed to be used indoors, with occasional, portable, use 
outdoors, then 60950-22 is not appropriate.

That said, you may want to make the equipment splash/drip proof, but that would 
be more for functional / customer experience.

Regards
Charlie

From: John Allen [mailto:john_e_al...@blueyonder.co.uk]
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:34
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

Good evening

I had the same idea as Ken re 60950-22 - and then got to thinking about 62368-1 
which is replacing both 60065 & 60950, and the likelihood of  a "Part XX" to 
that standard.?

Did a quick search on "62368 outdoor equipment" and no "Part XX" was flagged 
up, but amongst the results was a link to this CSA page 
http://shop.csa.ca/en/canada/it-telecom-and-audio-video-equipment/cancsa-c222-no-62368-1-14-/invt/27033302014

About 2/3rds of the way down that page it states the following:

"Additional requirements for information and communication technology equipment 
intended for outdoor installation are given in CSA/UL 60950-22. Additional 
requirements for audio/video equipment intended for outdoor installation are 
given in the relevant requirements in CAN/CSA C22.2 No. 60065 or UL 60065." - 
so N.America is certainly "covered".

Presumably, however, the IEC Committees will (or should be!) working on a 
suitable "Part XX" to 62368 - so does anyone have leads on that?

John Allen
W.London, UK

From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com]
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:13
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

Hi Ken,

Thanks for your suggestion on 60950-22.  I did not know or have this standard 
but had some search on internet and note that the standard is for equipment 
intended for outdoors.  I doubt it is too tough for my said equipment.  That is 
reason why I believe there may be different levels for outdoor use equipment.

Regards,

Scott


On 23 Dec, 2015, at 12:40 am, IBM Ken 
mailto:ibm...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Hi Scott, I don't have any experience in this area but have you looked at 
60950-22?

On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Scott Xe 
mailto:scott...@gmail.com>> wrote:
It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product is 
powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but can be 
used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally, we use EN 
60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety standard covering 
the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product, are there any defined 
levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product to be used outdoor 
permanently?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread John Allen 
Good evening

 

I had the same idea as Ken re 60950-22 - and then got to thinking about
62368-1 which is replacing both 60065 & 60950, and the likelihood of  a
"Part XX" to that standard.?

 

Did a quick search on "62368 outdoor equipment" and no "Part XX" was flagged
up, but amongst the results was a link to this CSA page
http://shop.csa.ca/en/canada/it-telecom-and-audio-video-equipment/cancsa-c22
2-no-62368-1-14-/invt/27033302014

 

About 2/3rds of the way down that page it states the following:

 

"Additional requirements for information and communication technology
equipment intended for outdoor installation are given in CSA/UL 60950-22.
Additional requirements for audio/video equipment intended for outdoor
installation are given in the relevant requirements in CAN/CSA C22.2 No.
60065 or UL 60065." - so N.America is certainly "covered".

 

Presumably, however, the IEC Committees will (or should be!) working on a
suitable "Part XX" to 62368 - so does anyone have leads on that?

 

John Allen

W.London, UK

 

From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 22 December 2015 17:13
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

 

Hi Ken,

 

Thanks for your suggestion on 60950-22.  I did not know or have this
standard but had some search on internet and note that the standard is for
equipment intended for outdoors.  I doubt it is too tough for my said
equipment.  That is reason why I believe there may be different levels for
outdoor use equipment.

 

Regards,

 

Scott

 

 

On 23 Dec, 2015, at 12:40 am, IBM Ken  wrote:

 

Hi Scott, I don't have any experience in this area but have you looked at
60950-22?

 

On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Scott Xe  wrote:

It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product
is powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but
can be used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally,
we use EN 60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety
standard covering the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product,
are there any defined levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product
to be used outdoor permanently?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread Ted Eckert 
Hello Scott,

There are many products that are commonly used outdoors yet are not tested to 
any specific standard for outdoor use. Cell phones and tablet computers are 
just two examples of such devices. It is not uncommon for the manufacturer to 
specify the ingress protection (IP) rating under IEC 60529. In many cases, the 
manufacturer will not specify that their product is acceptable for outdoor use. 
The manufacturer will only specify the IP rating. It is then up to the user to 
determine the acceptability of any given use. 

Many cell phones are rated IP20 and have no rating for water ingress 
protection. The phones have moisture sensors inside, and the manufacturers will 
void the warranty if any repair finds that the phone has gotten wet. The user 
is given instructions on acceptable environments, and it is up to the user to 
make sure that their phone stays dry if they are going to use it outside.


Ted Eckert
Compliance Engineer
Microsoft Corporation
ted.eck...@microsoft.com

The opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily reflect those of my 
employer.

-Original Message-
From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 22, 2015 8:21 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product is 
powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but can be 
used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally, we use EN 
60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety standard covering 
the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product, are there any defined 
levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product to be used outdoor 
permanently?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread Scott Xe 
Hi Ken,

Thanks for your suggestion on 60950-22.  I did not know or have this standard 
but had some search on internet and note that the standard is for equipment 
intended for outdoors.  I doubt it is too tough for my said equipment.  That is 
reason why I believe there may be different levels for outdoor use equipment.

Regards,

Scott


> On 23 Dec, 2015, at 12:40 am, IBM Ken  wrote:
> 
> Hi Scott, I don't have any experience in this area but have you looked at 
> 60950-22?
> 
> On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Scott Xe  > wrote:
> It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product is 
> powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but can 
> be used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally, we 
> use EN 60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety standard 
> covering the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product, are there 
> any defined levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product to be used 
> outdoor permanently?
> 
> Thanks and regards,
> 
> Scott
> 
> -
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
> mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>>
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> 
> 
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ 
>  can be used for graphics (in 
> well-used formats), large files, etc.
> 
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Re: [PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread IBM Ken 
Hi Scott, I don't have any experience in this area but have you looked at
60950-22?

On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Scott Xe  wrote:

> It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product
> is powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but
> can be used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.
> Traditionally, we use EN 60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any
> specific safety standard covering the said operating conditions?  For
> outdoor use product, are there any defined levels of outdoor condition as
> this is not a product to be used outdoor permanently?
>
> Thanks and regards,
>
> Scott
>
> -
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <
> emc-p...@ieee.org>
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> well-used formats), large files, etc.
>
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> Mike Cantwell 
>
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>

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[PSES] Outdoor Bluetooth speakers

2015-12-22 Thread Scott Xe 
It is my first time to test an audio product for outdoor use.  The product is 
powered by rechargeable lithium batteries and primarily used indoors but can be 
used occasionally for outdoor picnics and/or parties.  Traditionally, we use EN 
60065 for safety evaluation.  Is there any specific safety standard covering 
the said operating conditions?  For outdoor use product, are there any defined 
levels of outdoor condition as this is not a product to be used outdoor 
permanently?

Thanks and regards,

Scott

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