Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Pete Perkins 
Dave et al,

 

   This is an ongoing issue.  TC108 worked to update the accessible 
temperature requirements in 62368-1 in the early 2000s based upon reports in 
the popular news of similar incidents.  I reviewed this in a PSES 2004 
presentation which was later converted to an article in the  PSE News, 
15v11No2.  The technical basis for reasonable requirements were drawn from 
earlier work done as discussed in the paper.  You can find this paper by 
searching for it by name online: ‘Ouch Hot Laptop’.  

   Enjoy the reading upon your new laptop (which, as stated, an 
attempt was made to rename these as notebooks to steer away from similar claims 
– but the popular name returns).  

 

:>) br,  Pete

 

Peter E Perkins, PE

Principal Product Safety & Regulatory Affairs Consultant

PO Box 23427

Tigard, ORe  97281-3427

 

503/452-1201

 

IEEE Life Fellow

 <mailto:p.perk...@ieee.org> p.perk...@ieee.org

 

From: Nyffenegger, Dave  
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 11:47 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

 

That’s in the plan.  This one slows down apparently when it’s not too busy.  If 
it’s just the OS running with no programs it’s cool as can be.  But if I wanted 
a laptop to only do one thing at a time I’d use MS-DOS.  With several programs 
running and multiple browsers with multiple windows it runs the CPU full out 
regardless of temp.

-Dave

 

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 2:42 PM
To: Nyffenegger, Dave; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 
<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> 
Subject: hot laptop

 

 

Get a new laptop.  Intel devices now slow down if they get too hot.  My new 
laptop barely gets warm.

Rich

 

 

From: Nyffenegger, Dave mailto:dave.nyffeneg...@bhemail.com> > 
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 7:35 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> 
Subject: Re: [PSES] CB Certificate For Samsung Tablet - Need Contact

 

I’d like to ask the same question of my “name brand” laptop with the same 
circumstances.  The CPU runs just under 100 degrees F according to Intel 
diagnostics and the case bottom runs hot enough it can’t actually sit on a lap.

 

-Dave

 

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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Nyffenegger, Dave 
No that you mention it I think I remember that story too.
-Dave

From: Doug Smith [mailto:d...@emcesd.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 7:44 PM
To: Nyffenegger, Dave; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

Hi Everyone,

This "hot laptop" problem has been going on for many years now. I remember a 
story in the tech mags out of Silicon Valley about Apple laptops burning, 
really leaving an injury, on the order of ten years ago. Apple said the 
machines were not intended to be used on one's lap.

Doug
[https://hostingemail.xo.com/api/storage/d...@emcesd.com/signatures/images/2476c205-f457-4395-87cc-7aa199c734f2]


On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:58:12 +, "Nyffenegger, Dave" wrote:


We agree I need a new laptop due to this issue alone.  It’s not hot enough that 
it can’t be moved away quickly enough to prevent a permanent burn.  But it is 
hot enough to leave sun-burn like splotches on skin if left to long over a thin 
layer of clothing.  Hot enough to discolor some other materials it may rest on 
as well.

-Dave

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 3:44 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop


Its not the temperature, but the thermal energy that is transferred to a body 
part.  Consider aluminum foil versus cast aluminum at the same temperature, say 
140 F.  The foil won’t burn you, but the cast aluminum sure will!

The thermal resistance of plastic will give you the time to disconnect from the 
140 F surface of your laptop before you suffer a burn.

You need a new laptop, too!  😊

Best regards,
Rich



From: IBM Ken 
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 12:31 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

Aren't we supposed to call them "notebook" computers now, so it can be claimed 
they're not intended for use on a lap?

For what it's worth, I've measured up to 140F on the surface of my computer...

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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Doug Smith 




Hi Everyone,

This "hot laptop" problem has been going on for many years now. I remember a 
story in the tech mags out of Silicon Valley about Apple laptops burning, 
really leaving an injury, on the order of ten years ago. Apple said the 
machines were not intended to be used on one's lap.

Doug








On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:58:12 +, "Nyffenegger, Dave"  wrote:

 




We agree I need a new laptop due to this issue alone.  It’s not hot enough 
that it can’t be moved away quickly enough to prevent a permanent burn.  
But it is hot enough to leave sun-burn like splotches on skin if left to long 
over a thin layer of clothing.  Hot enough to discolor some other 
materials it may rest on as well.

 

-Dave

 



From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 3:44 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop



 

 

Its not the temperature, but the thermal energy that is transferred to a body 
part.  Consider aluminum foil versus cast aluminum at the same 
temperature, say 140 F.  The foil won’t burn you, but the cast aluminum 
sure will!

 

The thermal resistance of plastic will give you the time to disconnect from the 
140 F surface of your laptop before you suffer a burn.

 

You need a new laptop, too!  😊

 

Best regards,

Rich

 

 

 

From: IBM Ken <ibm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 12:31 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

 



Aren't we supposed to call them "notebook" computers now, so it can be claimed 
they're not intended for use on a lap?  



 



For what it's worth, I've measured up to 140F on the surface of my computer...




 


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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Nyffenegger, Dave 
We agree I need a new laptop due to this issue alone.  It’s not hot enough that 
it can’t be moved away quickly enough to prevent a permanent burn.  But it is 
hot enough to leave sun-burn like splotches on skin if left to long over a thin 
layer of clothing.  Hot enough to discolor some other materials it may rest on 
as well.

-Dave

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 3:44 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop


Its not the temperature, but the thermal energy that is transferred to a body 
part.  Consider aluminum foil versus cast aluminum at the same temperature, say 
140 F.  The foil won’t burn you, but the cast aluminum sure will!

The thermal resistance of plastic will give you the time to disconnect from the 
140 F surface of your laptop before you suffer a burn.

You need a new laptop, too!  😊

Best regards,
Rich



From: IBM Ken 
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 12:31 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

Aren't we supposed to call them "notebook" computers now, so it can be claimed 
they're not intended for use on a lap?

For what it's worth, I've measured up to 140F on the surface of my computer...

-


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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Richard Nute 
 

Its not the temperature, but the thermal energy that is transferred to a body 
part.  Consider aluminum foil versus cast aluminum at the same temperature, say 
140 F.  The foil won’t burn you, but the cast aluminum sure will!

 

The thermal resistance of plastic will give you the time to disconnect from the 
140 F surface of your laptop before you suffer a burn.

 

You need a new laptop, too!  😊

 

Best regards,

Rich

 

 

 

From: IBM Ken  
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 12:31 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] hot laptop

 

Aren't we supposed to call them "notebook" computers now, so it can be claimed 
they're not intended for use on a lap?  

 

For what it's worth, I've measured up to 140F on the surface of my computer...

 


-

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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread IBM Ken 
Aren't we supposed to call them "notebook" computers now, so it can be
claimed they're not intended for use on a lap?

For what it's worth, I've measured up to 140F on the surface of my
computer...

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 2:47 PM, Nyffenegger, Dave <
dave.nyffeneg...@bhemail.com> wrote:

> That’s in the plan.  This one slows down apparently when it’s not too
> busy.  If it’s just the OS running with no programs it’s cool as can be.
> But if I wanted a laptop to only do one thing at a time I’d use MS-DOS.
> With several programs running and multiple browsers with multiple windows
> it runs the CPU full out regardless of temp.
>
> -Dave
>
>
>
> *From:* Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 16, 2018 2:42 PM
> *To:* Nyffenegger, Dave; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> *Subject:* hot laptop
>
>
>
>
>
> Get a new laptop.  Intel devices now slow down if they get too hot.  My
> new laptop barely gets warm.
>
> Rich
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Nyffenegger, Dave 
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 16, 2018 7:35 AM
> *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> *Subject:* Re: [PSES] CB Certificate For Samsung Tablet - Need Contact
>
>
>
> I’d like to ask the same question of my “name brand” laptop with the same
> circumstances.  The CPU runs just under 100 degrees F according to Intel
> diagnostics and the case bottom runs hot enough it can’t actually sit on a
> lap.
>
>
>
> -Dave
>
>
> -
> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <
> emc-p...@ieee.org>
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in
> well-used formats), large files, etc.
>
> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
> Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to
> unsubscribe) 
> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html
>
> For help, send mail to the list administrators:
> Scott Douglas 
> Mike Cantwell 
>
> For policy questions, send mail to:
> Jim Bacher 
> David Heald 
>

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Re: [PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Nyffenegger, Dave 
That’s in the plan.  This one slows down apparently when it’s not too busy.  If 
it’s just the OS running with no programs it’s cool as can be.  But if I wanted 
a laptop to only do one thing at a time I’d use MS-DOS.  With several programs 
running and multiple browsers with multiple windows it runs the CPU full out 
regardless of temp.
-Dave

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 2:42 PM
To: Nyffenegger, Dave; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: hot laptop


Get a new laptop.  Intel devices now slow down if they get too hot.  My new 
laptop barely gets warm.
Rich


From: Nyffenegger, Dave 
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 7:35 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] CB Certificate For Samsung Tablet - Need Contact

I’d like to ask the same question of my “name brand” laptop with the same 
circumstances.  The CPU runs just under 100 degrees F according to Intel 
diagnostics and the case bottom runs hot enough it can’t actually sit on a lap.

-Dave


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[PSES] hot laptop

2018-08-16 Thread Richard Nute 
 

Get a new laptop.  Intel devices now slow down if they get too hot.  My new 
laptop barely gets warm.

Rich

 

 

From: Nyffenegger, Dave  
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2018 7:35 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] CB Certificate For Samsung Tablet - Need Contact

 

I’d like to ask the same question of my “name brand” laptop with the same 
circumstances.  The CPU runs just under 100 degrees F according to Intel 
diagnostics and the case bottom runs hot enough it can’t actually sit on a lap.

 

-Dave

 


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