Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Tania Grant]

Deal All,

This trace of e-mail messages just shows that a very careful read of a not
very well written series of Bellcore standards is absolutely required to
understand the whole.  I apologize if I, in my hurry to respond, led anyone
astray regarding UL1950/60950 safety testing.   In our case this was a
definite requirement.   A few other points I would like to reinforce:

*  In my 15 years of dealing with NEBS requirements and customers, not a
single customer was
willing to waive NRTL safety Listing.

*  All required Level 3 compliance and, as mentioned earlier, some RBOCs
(Regional Bell Operating Companies, for those who are unfamiliar with the
Acronym)  have their own Checklists with additional (more gruesome)
requirements.

*  It is absolutely essential that you constantly communicate with your
RBOC customer;-- some state that they want to witness all or some of these
tests!

Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com


- Original Message -
From: "Peter Tarver" 
To: 
Cc: "Joe Finlayson" ; "'Peter Merguerian'"
; "'Tania Grant'" ; "Michelle Cho
/ INT Compliance" 
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 8:31 AM
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


> Joe -
>
> Your statement is not in all cases.
>
> Please refer to GR1089, 4.5.3, R4-3, -4, -5, 4.6.1, and
> CR4-29
>
> Although not a requirement, refer also to 4.5.13, Item 10,
> related to R4-18.
>
> Regards,
>
> Peter L. Tarver, PE
> Product Safety Manager
> Sanmina-SCI Homologation Services
> peter.tar...@sanmina-sci.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Joe Finlayson
>
> Peter,
>
> NRTL Listing is not a requirement for CO equipment per
> GR-1089 although every one of our customers (CO's) requires
> it.  You'd meet the requirements of the standards but you'd
> have a tough time selling it.
>
> Thx,
>
>
> Joe
> -Original Message-
> From: Peter Merguerian
>
> Tania,
>
> Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This
> may be true for CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO.
> Please correct if I am mistaken.
>
> This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential
> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you may
> not disclose, use, disseminate, distribute, copy or rely
> upon this message or attachment in any way. If you received
> this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding
> the message and its attachments to the sender.
>
> PETER S. MERGUERIAN
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Tania Grant
>
> Michelle,
>
> I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several
> years back of an actual product that underwent NEBS
> compliance testing.  I have stripped out any product
> references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
> differ depending upon your particular product, and does not
> include any safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is
> also a NEBS requirement.  Thus, the time and cost will
> increase.   Also note that, depending upon your location,
> not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
> laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be
> also aware that the same can happen even though the lab
> states that they will take care of everything (then they
> sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need to
> have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC
> immunity testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage
> units/modules/equipment.   Packaged tests require that
> certain parameters are tested prior to packaging (you need a
> viable product), then come the packaging stress tests, then
> you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
> parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The
> test duration increases as you find that certain parts of
> your product need to be redesigned.   As was also previously
> stated, you need to make sure that the whole engineering
> team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and understands
> the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
> obvious failures.
>
> Tania Grant
> taniagr...@msn.com
> - Original Message -
> From: Michelle Cho
>
> Dear all,
>
> I need some help about something called NEBS(Network
> Equipment Building System). The whole procedure...
> What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How
> much? How long does it take?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Michelle
>
>
>
>

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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Joe Finlayson]

Agreed.  My point was that for those who believe there is a
justification for not obtaining NRTL certs, your best bet is to get the
mark on your product as this could likely create an obstacle when you try
to make a sale.

Thx,


Joe

-Original Message-
From: Peter Tarver [mailto:peter.tar...@sanmina-sci.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 11:32 AM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Cc: Joe Finlayson; 'Peter Merguerian'; 'Tania Grant'; Michelle Cho / INT
Compliance
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Joe -

Your statement is not in all cases.

Please refer to GR1089, 4.5.3, R4-3, -4, -5, 4.6.1, and
CR4-29

Although not a requirement, refer also to 4.5.13, Item 10,
related to R4-18.

Regards,

Peter L. Tarver, PE
Product Safety Manager
Sanmina-SCI Homologation Services
peter.tar...@sanmina-sci.com


-Original Message-
From: Joe Finlayson

Peter,

NRTL Listing is not a requirement for CO equipment per
GR-1089 although every one of our customers (CO's) requires
it.  You'd meet the requirements of the standards but you'd
have a tough time selling it.

Thx,


Joe
-Original Message-
From: Peter Merguerian

Tania,

Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This
may be true for CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO.
Please correct if I am mistaken.

This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential
information. If you are not the intended recipient, you may
not disclose, use, disseminate, distribute, copy or rely
upon this message or attachment in any way. If you received
this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding
the message and its attachments to the sender.

PETER S. MERGUERIAN

-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant

Michelle,

I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several
years back of an actual product that underwent NEBS
compliance testing.  I have stripped out any product
references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
differ depending upon your particular product, and does not
include any safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is
also a NEBS requirement.  Thus, the time and cost will
increase.   Also note that, depending upon your location,
not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be
also aware that the same can happen even though the lab
states that they will take care of everything (then they
sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need to
have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC
immunity testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage
units/modules/equipment.   Packaged tests require that
certain parameters are tested prior to packaging (you need a
viable product), then come the packaging stress tests, then
you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The
test duration increases as you find that certain parts of
your product need to be redesigned.   As was also previously
stated, you need to make sure that the whole engineering
team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and understands
the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
obvious failures.

Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com
- Original Message -
From: Michelle Cho

Dear all,

I need some help about something called NEBS(Network
Equipment Building System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How
much? How long does it take?

Thanks in advance!

Michelle



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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[JIM WIESE]

Hello All,
 
I thought I would chime in after the last response.
 
It is a common mis-conception that NEBS does not apply to CPE.  This is 
incorrect and GR-1089 and GR-63 explicitly support this position.
 
GR-1089-CORE in Appendix B, table B-1 describes Type 1, 2, 3, and 4 equipment 
and which tests apply to those.  Types 3 and 4 are specifically for CPE 
equipment and thus testing is required.  The only difference between C.O. tests 
and CPE tests is in section 4 which is Lightning and Power Fault.  
 
GR-63-CORE describes how it applies to "Network Equipment at Remote Locations" 
in section 2.9.  Basically it describes in section 2.9 how GR-63-CORE criteria 
apply to virtually all equipment deployed by a service provider that was not 
mentioned in the scope at the beginning of the standard.
Section 2.9 also adds additional requirements from other Telcordia documents 
depending upon the equipment and its intended deployment location.  Why this is 
in section 2.9 and not discussed in the scope or other more appropriate place I 
have never been able to figure out.  The point is that it is
there, and as such GR-63-CORE also applies to CPE deployed by a service 
provider.
 
With regard to Listings do not forget that OSHA requires equipment located in a 
workplace to be Listed by an NRTL even if the location is exempt by the NEC via 
article 90-2.  That is why most RBOC's require Listings even when NEBS does not 
(although it should be corrected to reflect the OSHA
regulations for most equipment ).
 
Just my two cents and not necessarily that of my employer,
 
-Original Message-
From: Servais, Jean [mailto:jean.serv...@spirentcom.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 8:26 AM
To: Peter Merguerian; 'Tania Grant'; Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; 
emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


According to GR-1089, if the unit is AC powered it must be listed through an 
NRTL.  If the unit is DC powered there is no requirement for listing as long as 
the unit is in the space defined as a CO.  CPE equipment does not fall under 
the guidance of NEBS.  RT equipment, depending on the customer
may need NEBS or FCC and Safety.
 
Alain Servais
Manager Product Compliance
Spirent Communications
15200 Omega Drive
Rockville, MD 20850
301-590-3691
 
 
-Original Message-
From: Peter Merguerian [mailto:pmerguer...@itl.co.il]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 5:23 AM
To: 'Tania Grant'; Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..
 
Tania,
 
Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This may be true for CPE 
but not equipment sitting at the CO. Please correct if I am mistaken.
 
This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If you 
are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate, 
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you 
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the
message and its attachments to the sender.



PETER S. MERGUERIAN
Technical Director
I.T.L. (Product Testing) Ltd.
26 Hacharoshet St., POB 211
Or Yehuda 60251, Israel
Tel: + 972-(0)3-5339022  Fax: + 972-(0)3-5339019
Mobile: + 972-(0)54-838175



-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant [mailto:taniagr...@msn.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 10:07 AM
To: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..
Michelle,
 
I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several years back of an 
actual product that underwent NEBS compliance testing.  I have stripped out any 
product references.  Please note that test duration and cost will differ 
depending upon your particular product, and does not include any safety
testing to UL 60950 even though this is also a NEBS requirement.  Thus, the 
time and cost will increase.   Also note that, depending upon your location, 
not all of these tests can be performed by a single test laboratory;--  you get 
to ship your product around.   Be also aware that the same can
happen even though the lab states that they will take care of everything (then 
they sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need to have one or more 
of your people at the labs to assist in EMC immunity testing & ESD testing, to 
package and unpackage units/modules/equipment.   Packaged
tests require that certain parameters are tested prior to packaging (you need a 
viable product), then come the packaging stress tests, then you unpackage the 
equipment and repeat tests to see which parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as 
Mike stated.   The test duration increases as you find that
certain parts of your product need to be redesigned.   As was also previously 
stated, you need to make sure that the whole engineering team reads the GR-63 
and GR-1089 standards and understands the requirements.   No sense s

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Peter Tarver]

Joe -

Your statement is not in all cases.

Please refer to GR1089, 4.5.3, R4-3, -4, -5, 4.6.1, and
CR4-29

Although not a requirement, refer also to 4.5.13, Item 10,
related to R4-18.

Regards,

Peter L. Tarver, PE
Product Safety Manager
Sanmina-SCI Homologation Services
peter.tar...@sanmina-sci.com


-Original Message-
From: Joe Finlayson

Peter,

NRTL Listing is not a requirement for CO equipment per
GR-1089 although every one of our customers (CO's) requires
it.  You'd meet the requirements of the standards but you'd
have a tough time selling it.

Thx,


Joe
-Original Message-
From: Peter Merguerian

Tania,

Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This
may be true for CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO.
Please correct if I am mistaken.

This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential
information. If you are not the intended recipient, you may
not disclose, use, disseminate, distribute, copy or rely
upon this message or attachment in any way. If you received
this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding
the message and its attachments to the sender.

PETER S. MERGUERIAN

-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant

Michelle,

I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several
years back of an actual product that underwent NEBS
compliance testing.  I have stripped out any product
references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
differ depending upon your particular product, and does not
include any safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is
also a NEBS requirement.  Thus, the time and cost will
increase.   Also note that, depending upon your location,
not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be
also aware that the same can happen even though the lab
states that they will take care of everything (then they
sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need to
have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC
immunity testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage
units/modules/equipment.   Packaged tests require that
certain parameters are tested prior to packaging (you need a
viable product), then come the packaging stress tests, then
you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The
test duration increases as you find that certain parts of
your product need to be redesigned.   As was also previously
stated, you need to make sure that the whole engineering
team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and understands
the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
obvious failures.

Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com
- Original Message -
From: Michelle Cho

Dear all,

I need some help about something called NEBS(Network
Equipment Building System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How
much? How long does it take?

Thanks in advance!

Michelle




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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Cortland Richmond]

>> Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This may be true
for CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO. Please correct if I am
mistaken. <<

There's been a long wrangle but, yes, NEBS does now follow 60950. Some
accommodations appear to have been necessary, as it's evident that
clearances permitted under 1490 (and which work in the CO) were to be
forbidden under 60950. But having recently worked on CO equipment I can say
that the changeover has been made.

Regards,

Cortland

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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Servais, Jean]

According to GR-1089, if the unit is AC powered it must be listed through
an NRTL.  If the unit is DC powered there is no requirement for listing as
long as the unit is in the space defined as a CO.  CPE equipment does not
fall under the guidance of NEBS.  RT equipment, depending on the customer
may need NEBS or FCC and Safety.
 
Alain Servais
Manager Product Compliance
Spirent Communications
15200 Omega Drive
Rockville, MD 20850
301-590-3691
 
 
-Original Message-
From: Peter Merguerian [mailto:pmerguer...@itl.co.il]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 5:23 AM
To: 'Tania Grant'; Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-
p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..
 
Tania,
 
Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This may be true for
CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO. Please correct if I am mistaken.
 
This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If
you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate,
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the
message and its attachments to the sender.



PETER S. MERGUERIAN
Technical Director
I.T.L. (Product Testing) Ltd.
26 Hacharoshet St., POB 211
Or Yehuda 60251, Israel
Tel: + 972-(0)3-5339022  Fax: + 972-(0)3-5339019
Mobile: + 972-(0)54-838175



-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant [mailto:taniagr...@msn.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 10:07 AM
To: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..
Michelle,
 
I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several years back of an
actual product that underwent NEBS compliance testing.  I have stripped out
any product references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
differ depending upon your particular product, and does not include any
safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is also a NEBS requirement.
Thus, the time and cost will increase.   Also note that, depending upon
your location, not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be also aware that
the same can happen even though the lab states that they will take care of
everything (then they sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need
to have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC immunity
testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage units/modules/equipment.
Packaged tests require that certain parameters are tested prior to
packaging (you need a viable product), then come the packaging stress
tests, then you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The test duration
increases as you find that certain parts of your product need to be
redesigned.   As was also previously stated, you need to make sure that the
whole engineering team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and
understands the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
obvious failures.
 
Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com <mailto:taniagr...@msn.com>  
- Original Message - 

From: Michelle <mailto:m...@intcompliance.com>  Cho / INT Compliance 
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org>  
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 11:31 PM
Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..
 
Dear all,
 
I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building
System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long
does it take?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
Michelle
 
 

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Cortland Richmond]

I wasn't able to see the formatted original message, but by looking over
shoulders in others' replies I could read it. Another advantage of Classic
Compuserve; I can only get ASCII text. Of course this eliminates most
viruses. (grin)

The Telcordia document called Network Equipment Building Standards is
SR-3580.  This lists what requirements are associated with each level of
NEBS compliance. These requirements are found in GR-63, GR-78 and GR-1089. 
However, SR-3580, in setting different levels of compliance, seems to allow
omitting some NEBS requirements, and that, customers might not accept. For
example, some RBOC's may not only refuse to accept this approach, but also
supplement existing requirements with ones of their own. They do this
because they've found NEBS compliance to be a _minimum_ requirement. 

Yes, NEBS testing is exhaustive. It is expensive. You will destroy
equipment doing it, both as part of the testing (burn testing, second level
lightning and power-cross) and when it fails (ejected cards and bent card
cages from shaking, charred backplanes, etc). But this is merely the cost
of doing business. And not every lab does it, so you must deal with those
who do. Likewise, if you are thinking of setting up a lab, don't think it
merely mirrors IEC and FCC tests. Far from it!

So, you need to contact Telcordia and buy copies of the standards involved.
If you are making telecomm equipment, NEBS is not the only hoop you will
jump. But if you are looking at NEBS, you can START with SR-3580. That will
let you know what to buy _next_. (IMO, GR-1089) And it doesn't end there!

I am no longer in a position to answer specific questions about NEBS. But
if you are serious about business, the cost of buying the standards  is
WELL justified.

 Cortland

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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Joe Finlayson]

Peter,
 
NRTL Listing is not a requirement for CO equipment per GR-1089 although
every one of our customers (CO's) requires it.  You'd meet the requirements
of the standards but you'd have a tough time selling it.
 
Thx,
 
 
Joe

-Original Message-
From: Peter Merguerian [mailto:pmerguer...@itl.co.il]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 5:23 AM
To: 'Tania Grant'; Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-
p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Tania,
 
Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This may be true for
CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO. Please correct if I am mistaken.
 

This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If
you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate,
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the
message and its attachments to the sender.






PETER S. MERGUERIAN

Technical Director

I.T.L. (Product Testing) Ltd.

26 Hacharoshet St., POB 211

Or Yehuda 60251, Israel

Tel: + 972-(0)3-5339022  Fax: + 972-(0)3-5339019

Mobile: + 972-(0)54-838175




-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant [mailto:taniagr...@msn.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 10:07 AM
To: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Michelle,
 
I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several years back of an
actual product that underwent NEBS compliance testing.  I have stripped out
any product references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
differ depending upon your particular product, and does not include any
safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is also a NEBS requirement.
Thus, the time and cost will increase.   Also note that, depending upon
your location, not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be also aware that
the same can happen even though the lab states that they will take care of
everything (then they sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need
to have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC immunity
testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage units/modules/equipment.
Packaged tests require that certain parameters are tested prior to
packaging (you need a viable product), then come the packaging stress
tests, then you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The test duration
increases as you find that certain parts of your product need to be
redesigned.   As was also previously stated, you need to make sure that the
whole engineering team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and
understands the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
obvious failures.
 
Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com <mailto:taniagr...@msn.com>  

- Original Message - 
From: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance <mailto:m...@intcompliance.com>  
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org>  
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 11:31 PM
Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

Dear all,
 
I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building
System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long
does it take?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
Michelle
 
 

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Peter Merguerian]

Tania,
 
Your state that NEBS requires UL1950 safety testing. This may be true for
CPE but not equipment sitting at the CO. Please correct if I am mistaken.
 

This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If
you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate,
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the
message and its attachments to the sender.






PETER S. MERGUERIAN

Technical Director

I.T.L. (Product Testing) Ltd.

26 Hacharoshet St., POB 211

Or Yehuda 60251, Israel

Tel: + 972-(0)3-5339022  Fax: + 972-(0)3-5339019

Mobile: + 972-(0)54-838175




-Original Message-
From: Tania Grant [mailto:taniagr...@msn.com]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 10:07 AM
To: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Michelle,
 
I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several years back of an
actual product that underwent NEBS compliance testing.  I have stripped out
any product references.  Please note that test duration and cost will
differ depending upon your particular product, and does not include any
safety testing to UL 60950 even though this is also a NEBS requirement.
Thus, the time and cost will increase.   Also note that, depending upon
your location, not all of these tests can be performed by a single test
laboratory;--  you get to ship your product around.   Be also aware that
the same can happen even though the lab states that they will take care of
everything (then they sub-contract it to other labs!).   You will also need
to have one or more of your people at the labs to assist in EMC immunity
testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage units/modules/equipment.
Packaged tests require that certain parameters are tested prior to
packaging (you need a viable product), then come the packaging stress
tests, then you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The test duration
increases as you find that certain parts of your product need to be
redesigned.   As was also previously stated, you need to make sure that the
whole engineering team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and
understands the requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for
obvious failures.
 
Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com <mailto:taniagr...@msn.com>  

- Original Message - 
From: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance <mailto:m...@intcompliance.com>  
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org>  
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 11:31 PM
Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

Dear all,
 
I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building
System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long
does it take?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
Michelle
 
 

Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Tania Grant]

Michelle,

I am providing you with a generic test matrix of several years back of an 
actual product that underwent NEBS compliance testing.  I have stripped out any 
product references.  Please note that test duration and cost will differ 
depending upon your particular product, and does not include any safety testing 
to UL 60950 even though this is also a NEBS requirement.  Thus, the time and 
cost will increase.   Also note that, depending upon your location, not all of 
these tests can be performed by a single test laboratory;--  you get to ship 
your product around.   Be also aware that the same can happen even though the 
lab states that they will take care of everything (then they sub-contract it to 
other labs!).   You will also need to have one or more of your people at the 
labs to assist in EMC immunity testing & ESD testing, to package and unpackage 
units/modules/equipment.   Packaged tests require that certain parameters are 
tested prior to packaging (you need a viable product), then come the packaging 
stress tests, then you unpackage the equipment and repeat tests to see which 
parameters failed.   Brutal it is, as Mike stated.   The test duration 
increases as you find that certain parts of your product need to be redesigned. 
  As was also previously stated, you need to make sure that the whole 
engineering team reads the GR-63 and GR-1089 standards and understands the 
requirements.   No sense spending money on lab tests for obvious failures.

Tania Grant
taniagr...@msn.com 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance 
  To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 
  Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 11:31 PM
  Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


  Dear all,

  I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building 
System). The whole procedure...
  What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long 
does it take?

  Thanks in advance!

  Michelle




NEBS testmatrix.doc
Description: MS-Word document

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Gregg Kervill]

My experience is much the same - USE A STRUCTURED APPROACH - Identify the
Need - plan to Do what is Necessary for your product - CONFIRM THE NEED
before commitment.
 
Best regards
 
Gregg
 
PLEASE NOTE:

We are currently experiencing serious problems with our service provider
PLEASE reply only to gr...@test4safety.com <mailto:gr...@test4safety.com>
and ignore any reference to pgtv.net, Thank you.

-Original Message-
From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
[mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of Robert Wilson
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 1:38 PM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Without getting into details, the main point is that it is brutal (and even
that is an understatement), and it is expensive. A full-on test involves
everything from EMI compliance, to earthquake testing, to flame and fire
tests. Costs can easily run to US$100,000 and time to do the test can range
from 6 weeks to months. There are several independent test labs in the US
that can do the testing. I have not personally put any equipment through
NEBS, but last spring I spent a couple of days at a test lab in the San
Francisco Bay area  (MET Labs)  looking at their capabilities and how NEBS
would impact the design of  our  telecom power electronics equipment.
Perhaps others with more actual testing experience may be able to fill in
the details.

Bob Wilson.



<>

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Robert Wilson]

Without getting into details, the main point is that it is brutal (and
even that is an understatement), and it is expensive. A full-on test
involves everything from EMI compliance, to earthquake testing, to flame
and fire tests. Costs can easily run to US$100,000 and time to do the
test can range from 6 weeks to months. There are several independent
test labs in the US that can do the testing. I have not personally put
any equipment through NEBS, but last spring I spent a couple of days at
a test lab in the San Francisco Bay area  (MET Labs)  looking at their
capabilities and how NEBS would impact the design of  our  telecom power
electronics equipment. Perhaps others with more actual testing
experience may be able to fill in the details.

Bob Wilson.

Re: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Cortland Richmond]

This message had no text in its body. This is because you sent it in an
attachment. To read what you wrote, we who use off-line-readers on
Compuserve are required to locate and edit the downloaded file that
actually contains your message. This would not happen if you placed text in
the message body rather than sending it as an attachment.

 Thanks,
 
 Cortland Richmond

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RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Mike Cantwell]

NEBS compliance is required by the US Regional Bell Operating Companies
(RBOCs). The major aspect of this consist of Telcordia standards (
www.telcordia.com  ):
 
GR-1089-CORE:EMC and safety
GR-63-CORE:Environmental
 
If you have products that must comply with NEBS, you need to purchase these
standards and review them, the requirements are substantial and definitely
have an effect on the design of your product. They also have an impact on
your schedule and budget as the testing can easily take 2 months and cost
$100k (if you pass).
 
Hope this gives you a good start.

-Original Message-
From: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance [mailto:m...@intcompliance.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 1:32 AM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Dear all,
 
I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building
System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long
does it take?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
Michelle
 
 

RE: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..

[Peter Merguerian]

Michelle,
 
I am forwarding your e-mail to our NEBS expert, Ilan Cohen, for help. For
your info, we are also holding a NEBS seminar March 18 and 19th here in
Israel with speakers from the USA. You are most welcome to attend.
 

This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If
you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate,
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the
message and its attachments to the sender.






PETER S. MERGUERIAN

Technical Director

I.T.L. (Product Testing) Ltd.

26 Hacharoshet St., POB 211

Or Yehuda 60251, Israel

Tel: + 972-(0)3-5339022  Fax: + 972-(0)3-5339019

Mobile: + 972-(0)54-838175




-Original Message-
From: Michelle Cho / INT Compliance [mailto:m...@intcompliance.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 9:32 AM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: [URGENT] Need some information about NEBS..


Dear all,
 
I need some help about something called NEBS(Network Equipment Building
System). The whole procedure...
What exactly the NEBS is and where can I do the testing? How much? How long
does it take?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
Michelle