RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Gartman, Richard]

 

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for rechargeable lithium
batteries?

 

Required on cell phone batteries?

Required on consumer electronic? 

 

All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.

 

Thank you 

W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

Product Stewardship Manager

Texas Instruments, Education Technology

7800 Banner Drive, Dallas, TX 75251

Phone: 972-917-1636Email: rgart...@ti.com  

Fax: 972-917-0668 URL: www.education.ti.com
 

 

“structure influences performance – Peter Senge”

P Please consider the environment before printing this email.

 

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RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Brian O'Connell]

The following are personal opinions only.

In general, conformity to the applicable standard is always
"necessary"; but not always 'required'. In any case, note that UL
1642 is scoped specifically for Li batteries

In particular, 'it depends'. Is the charger and end-use
installation a fire or shock hazard if a battery, dies a violent
death ? Is there any normal or abnormal operating condition in
the charger or the end-use install that could result in battery
damage/explosion/fire ?

Also, there are separate DOT requirements for the shipment of
some types of Lithium batteries.

luck,
Brian 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of
Gartman, Richard
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 6:51 AM
To: emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for
rechargeable lithium batteries?
 
Required on cell phone batteries?
Required on consumer electronic? 
 
All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.
 
Thank you 
W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

-

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 Scott Douglas   emcp...@ptcnh.net
 Mike Cantwell   mcantw...@ieee.org

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 Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org
 David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com

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RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[MacArthur, Don]

If your company is going to selling a cell phone that uses AT&T as a carrier,
AT&T will require the entire device be subjected to and pass CTIA’s Battery
Registration.   The registration is based on IEEE 1725, which calls out UL
2054 and UL 1642 as requirements in a couple areas.  

 

For more details see http://www.ctia.or
/business_resources/certification/index.cfm/AID/10624

 

So far, AT&T is the only carrier I know of that requires CTIA Battery
Registration for cell phones.  

 

It’s a painful process that involves testing and auditing by one of the few
CTIA approved Battery Compliance Review Organizations (a.k.a. BCROs).

 

 

Don MacArthur

Compliance Engineer

General Dynamics Itronix Corporation

12825 E. Mirabeau Parkway

Spokane Valley, WA 99216

ph: 509-742-1342

fax: 509-742-1672

 

email address:  don.macart...@gd-itronix.com
<mailto:don.macart...@gd-itronix.com> 

 

“This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipients and may
contain GDC4S confidential or privileged information. Any unauthorized review,
use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not an intended
recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of
the original message.”



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Gartman,
Richard
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 6:51 AM
To: emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

 

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for rechargeable lithium
batteries?

 

Required on cell phone batteries?

Required on consumer electronic? 

 

All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.

 

Thank you 

W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

Product Stewardship Manager

Texas Instruments, Education Technology

7800 Banner Drive, Dallas, TX 75251

Phone: 972-917-1636Email: rgart...@ti.com <mailto:rgart...@ti.com> 

Fax: 972-917-0668 URL: www.education.ti.com
<http://www.education.ti.com/> 

 

“structure influences performance – Peter Senge”

P Please consider the environment before printing this email.

 

-  This
message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ 

To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org 

Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html 

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For help, send mail to the list administrators: 

Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org 

For policy questions, send mail to: 

Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: emc-p...@daveheald.com 

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 

http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc -
 This message
is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.
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Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html 

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All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 

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RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Ron Pickard, RPQ]

Richard,

 

IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a removable
battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL 2054. I
say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone application,
please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for lithium
batteries.

Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:

 

- These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and secondary
(rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or more
cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical energy
into electrical energy by chemical reaction.

- These requirements are intended to reduce the risk of fire or explosion
when batteries are used in a product. The proper use of these batteries in a
particular application is dependent on their use in a complete product that
complies with the requirements applicable to such a product.

- These requirements are intended to cover batteries for general use and do
not include the combination of the battery and the host product which are
covered by requirements in the host product

standard.

- These requirements are also intended to reduce the risk of injury to
persons due to fire or explosion when batteries are removed from a product
to be transported, stored, or discarded.

- These requirements do not cover the toxicity risk that results from the
ingestion of a battery or its contents, nor the risk of injury to persons
that occurs if a battery is cut open to provide access to its contents.

 

The battery manufacturer would quite likely be already aware of all of this.
They would be the one to approach for getting this work done.

 

Also, in addition to what Brian stated about shipping, the US and
international shipping authorities have specific testing and labeling
requirements for lithium batteries or products containing lithium batteries.
Testing involves the UN T1-T8 tests.

 

IHTH.

 

Best regards,

 

Ron Pickard

RPQ Consulting

7372 West Luke Avenue

Glendale, AZ 85303

+623.512-3451 tel, +623.848-9033 fax

rpick...@rpqconsulting.com

www.rpqconsulting.com <http://www.rpqconsulting.com/> 

 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian
O'Connell
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 7:21 AM
To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

The following are personal opinions only.

 

In general, conformity to the applicable standard is always

"necessary"; but not always 'required'. In any case, note that UL

1642 is scoped specifically for Li batteries

 

In particular, 'it depends'. Is the charger and end-use

installation a fire or shock hazard if a battery, dies a violent

death ? Is there any normal or abnormal operating condition in

the charger or the end-use install that could result in battery

damage/explosion/fire ?

 

Also, there are separate DOT requirements for the shipment of

some types of Lithium batteries.

 

luck,

Brian 

 



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of

Gartman, Richard

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 6:51 AM

To: emc-p...@ieee.org

Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for

rechargeable lithium batteries?

 

Required on cell phone batteries?

Required on consumer electronic? 

 

All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.

 

Thank you 

W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

 

-



This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society

emc-pstc discussion list.Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/

 

To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org

 

Instructions:  http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html

 

List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

 

For help, send mail to the list administrators:

 

 Scott Douglas   emcp...@ptcnh.net

 Mike Cantwell   mcantw...@ieee.org

 

For policy questions, send mail to:

 

 Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org

 David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com

 

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:

 

http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc

 


-

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Instructions:  http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html

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For help, send mail to the list administrators:

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 Mike Cantwell   mcantw...@ieee.org

For policy questions, send mail to:

 Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org
 David Heald:emc-p.

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Kazimier_Gawrzyjal]

Also.For end use systems seeking compliance with UL 60950-1, see
Annex P.1 with reference to cl. 4.3.8

Kaz
kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Ron
Pickard, RPQ
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:07 AM
To: 'Brian O'Connell'; 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Richard,

 

IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a removable
battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL
2054. I
say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone application,
please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for lithium
batteries.

Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:

 

- These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and
secondary
(rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or more
cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical
energy
into electrical energy by chemical reaction.

- These requirements are intended to reduce the risk of fire or
explosion
when batteries are used in a product. The proper use of these batteries
in a
particular application is dependent on their use in a complete product
that
complies with the requirements applicable to such a product.

- These requirements are intended to cover batteries for general use and
do
not include the combination of the battery and the host product which
are
covered by requirements in the host product

standard.

- These requirements are also intended to reduce the risk of injury to
persons due to fire or explosion when batteries are removed from a
product
to be transported, stored, or discarded.

- These requirements do not cover the toxicity risk that results from
the
ingestion of a battery or its contents, nor the risk of injury to
persons
that occurs if a battery is cut open to provide access to its contents.

 

The battery manufacturer would quite likely be already aware of all of
this.
They would be the one to approach for getting this work done.

 

Also, in addition to what Brian stated about shipping, the US and
international shipping authorities have specific testing and labeling
requirements for lithium batteries or products containing lithium
batteries.
Testing involves the UN T1-T8 tests.

 

IHTH.

 

Best regards,

 

Ron Pickard

RPQ Consulting

7372 West Luke Avenue

Glendale, AZ 85303

+623.512-3451 tel, +623.848-9033 fax

rpick...@rpqconsulting.com

www.rpqconsulting.com <http://www.rpqconsulting.com/> 

 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian
O'Connell
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 7:21 AM
To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

The following are personal opinions only.

 

In general, conformity to the applicable standard is always

"necessary"; but not always 'required'. In any case, note that UL

1642 is scoped specifically for Li batteries

 

In particular, 'it depends'. Is the charger and end-use

installation a fire or shock hazard if a battery, dies a violent

death ? Is there any normal or abnormal operating condition in

the charger or the end-use install that could result in battery

damage/explosion/fire ?

 

Also, there are separate DOT requirements for the shipment of

some types of Lithium batteries.

 

luck,

Brian 

 



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of

Gartman, Richard

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 6:51 AM

To: emc-p...@ieee.org

Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for

rechargeable lithium batteries?

 

Required on cell phone batteries?

Required on consumer electronic? 

 

All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.

 

Thank you 

W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

 

-



This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society

emc-pstc discussion list.Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/

 

To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org

 

Instructions:  http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html

 

List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

 

For help, send mail to the list administrators:

 

 Scott Douglas   emcp...@ptcnh.net

 Mike Cantwell   mcantw...@ieee.org

 

For policy questions, send mail to:

 

 Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org

 David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com

 

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:

 

http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc

 


-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society
emc-pstc discussion list.Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/

To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Scott Xe]

Richard,

If you want to prevent the battery pack from explosion/fire, compliance of
those standards might not accomplish it for the time being.  UL 2054, UL
1642 and UL 60950-1 were prepared and published before Sony's battery
recall.  All the standards are being revised to address the issue.  After a
large scale of Sony's battery recall, the Li-ion battery pack continues to
explode and catch fire in a smaller scale.  The users are awaiting the new
replacement of battery pack or a firm solution to the probable explosion of
existing Li-ion battery pack.

Regards.

Scott


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of
kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 12:24 AM
To: rpick...@rpqconsulting.com; oconne...@tamuracorp.com; emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Also.For end use systems seeking compliance with UL 60950-1, see
Annex P.1 with reference to cl. 4.3.8

Kaz
kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Ron
Pickard, RPQ
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:07 AM
To: 'Brian O'Connell'; 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Richard,

 

IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a removable
battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL
2054. I
say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone application,
please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for lithium
batteries.

Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:

 

- These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and
secondary
(rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or more
cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical
energy
into electrical energy by chemical reaction.

- These requirements are intended to reduce the risk of fire or
explosion
when batteries are used in a product. The proper use of these batteries
in a
particular application is dependent on their use in a complete product
that
complies with the requirements applicable to such a product.

- These requirements are intended to cover batteries for general use and
do
not include the combination of the battery and the host product which
are
covered by requirements in the host product

standard.

- These requirements are also intended to reduce the risk of injury to
persons due to fire or explosion when batteries are removed from a
product
to be transported, stored, or discarded.

- These requirements do not cover the toxicity risk that results from
the
ingestion of a battery or its contents, nor the risk of injury to
persons
that occurs if a battery is cut open to provide access to its contents.

 

The battery manufacturer would quite likely be already aware of all of
this.
They would be the one to approach for getting this work done.

 

Also, in addition to what Brian stated about shipping, the US and
international shipping authorities have specific testing and labeling
requirements for lithium batteries or products containing lithium
batteries.
Testing involves the UN T1-T8 tests.

 

IHTH.

 

Best regards,

 

Ron Pickard

RPQ Consulting

7372 West Luke Avenue

Glendale, AZ 85303

+623.512-3451 tel, +623.848-9033 fax

rpick...@rpqconsulting.com

www.rpqconsulting.com <http://www.rpqconsulting.com/> 

 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian
O'Connell
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 7:21 AM
To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

The following are personal opinions only.

 

In general, conformity to the applicable standard is always

"necessary"; but not always 'required'. In any case, note that UL

1642 is scoped specifically for Li batteries

 

In particular, 'it depends'. Is the charger and end-use

installation a fire or shock hazard if a battery, dies a violent

death ? Is there any normal or abnormal operating condition in

the charger or the end-use install that could result in battery

damage/explosion/fire ?

 

Also, there are separate DOT requirements for the shipment of

some types of Lithium batteries.

 

luck,

Brian 

 



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of

Gartman, Richard

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 6:51 AM

To: emc-p...@ieee.org

Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

I am looking for when UL 2054 testing is necessary for

rechargeable lithium batteries?

 

Required on cell phone batteries?

Required on consumer electronic? 

 

All perspectives on rechargeable lithium batteries are welcome.

 

Thank you 

W. Richard Gartman, MS, CSP

 

-



This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society

emc-pstc discussion list.Websi

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Scott B. Lacey]

Richard and Scott,

Interestingly, some years ago I worked on a 
project involving a reaction calorimeter. One 
use (for some customers) was to test battery 
chemistries for just this type of runaway 
condition.

The materials being tested were heated in a 
containment vessel until an exothermic 
reaction occurred. Temperature and pressure 
were both tracked throughout. The idea was 
to determine the conditions preceding a 
runaway reaction so that protection could be 
added to battery packs to keep them below 
the critical temperature and pressure.

I suspect the Li-ion failures involve a flaw in 
the protection scheme  implementation rather 
than a lack of understanding the mechanism 
of failure. In the meantime I would advise 
anyone using Lithium-ion batteries to avoid 
recharging heavily discharged ones until they 
have cooled for a while. The same goes for 
drawing high current immediately after a 
charge.

Scott B. Lacey

On 7 Jul 2008 at 22:29, Scott Xe wrote:

> Richard,
> 
> If you want to prevent the battery pack from explosion/fire, compliance of
> those standards might not accomplish it for the time being.  UL 2054, UL
> 1642 and UL 60950-1 were prepared and published before Sony's battery
> recall.  All the standards are being revised to address the issue.  After a
> large scale of Sony's battery recall, the Li-ion battery pack continues to
> explode and catch fire in a smaller scale.  The users are awaiting the new
> replacement of battery pack or a firm solution to the probable explosion of
> existing Li-ion battery pack.
> 
> Regards.
> 
> Scott
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
> Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 12:24 AM
> To: rpick...@rpqconsulting.com; oconne...@tamuracorp.com; emc-p...@ieee.org
> Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries
> 
> Also.For end use systems seeking compliance with UL 60950-1, see
> Annex P.1 with reference to cl. 4.3.8
> 
> Kaz
> kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Ron
> Pickard, RPQ
> Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:07 AM
> To: 'Brian O'Connell'; 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
> Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries
> 
> Richard,
> 
>  
> 
> IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a removable
> battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL
> 2054. I
> say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
> efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone application,
> please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for lithium
> batteries.
> 
> Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:
> 
>  
> 
> - These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and
> secondary
> (rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
> batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or more
> cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical
> energy
> into electrical energy by chemical reaction.
> 
> - These requirements are intended to reduce the risk of fire or
> explosion
> when batteries are used in a product. The proper use of these batteries
> in a
> particular application is dependent on their use in a complete product
> that
> complies with the requirements applicable to such a product.
> 
> - These requirements are intended to cover batteries for general use and
> do
> not include the combination of the battery and the host product which
> are
> covered by requirements in the host product
> 
> standard.
> 
> - These requirements are also intended to reduce the risk of injury to
> persons due to fire or explosion when batteries are removed from a
> product
> to be transported, stored, or discarded.
> 
> - These requirements do not cover the toxicity risk that results from
> the
> ingestion of a battery or its contents, nor the risk of injury to
> persons
> that occurs if a battery is cut open to provide access to its contents.
> 
>  
> 
> The battery manufacturer would quite likely be already aware of all of
> this.
> They would be the one to approach for getting this work done.
> 
>  
> 
> Also, in addition to what Brian stated about shipping, the US and
> international shipping authorities have specific testing and labeling
> requirements for lithium batteries or products containing lithium
> batteries.
> Testing involves the UN T1-T8 tests.
> 
>  
> 
> IHTH.
> 
>  
> 
> Best regards,
> 
>  
> 
> Ron Pickard
> 
> RPQ Consulting
> 
> 7372 West Lu

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Tyra, John]

Also be aware that the DENAN law in Japan has been amended so that some
Lithium Ion Batteries are now regulated.

Japan's Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry (METI) has added
"Lithium batteries:" into a list of regulated DENAN products. The new
requirements for Lithium batteries will be implemented on November 20,
2008. 

Scope: Lithium batteries with its internal energy of 400Wh/L or higher
are regulated by DENAN as Non-Specified Product (NSP). NSP requires a
PSE Mark (PSE in a circle). Compliance with DENAN Technical Requirements
Appendix 9 may be confirmed by a third party testing or manufacturer's
own testing. Test reports (and/or certificates) may be required upon
request from METI. Lithium batteries physically detached from an end
product in a package are covered by DENAN. Replacement Lithium batteries
are covered by DENAN.

Applicable standards are JIS C8712 and C8714 which are similar, but not
identical to IEC 62133 Standard (or UL1642). Due to METI's concern about
recent accidents from Lithium batteries, JIS Standards include several
additional tests such as forced internal short circuit test. Therefore,
batteries which comply with UL Standard or IEC Standard need additional
tests to satisfy DENAN. I contacted METI on this issue and they
commented that English version of the requirements will be released this
month sometime


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Scott B.
Lacey
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 11:41 AM
To: Scott Xe
Cc: emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Richard and Scott,

Interestingly, some years ago I worked on a 
project involving a reaction calorimeter. One 
use (for some customers) was to test battery 
chemistries for just this type of runaway 
condition.

The materials being tested were heated in a 
containment vessel until an exothermic 
reaction occurred. Temperature and pressure 
were both tracked throughout. The idea was 
to determine the conditions preceding a 
runaway reaction so that protection could be 
added to battery packs to keep them below 
the critical temperature and pressure.

I suspect the Li-ion failures involve a flaw in 
the protection scheme  implementation rather 
than a lack of understanding the mechanism 
of failure. In the meantime I would advise 
anyone using Lithium-ion batteries to avoid 
recharging heavily discharged ones until they 
have cooled for a while. The same goes for 
drawing high current immediately after a 
charge.

Scott B. Lacey

On 7 Jul 2008 at 22:29, Scott Xe wrote:

> Richard,
> 
> If you want to prevent the battery pack from explosion/fire,
compliance of
> those standards might not accomplish it for the time being.  UL 2054,
UL
> 1642 and UL 60950-1 were prepared and published before Sony's battery
> recall.  All the standards are being revised to address the issue.
After a
> large scale of Sony's battery recall, the Li-ion battery pack
continues to
> explode and catch fire in a smaller scale.  The users are awaiting the
new
> replacement of battery pack or a firm solution to the probable
explosion of
> existing Li-ion battery pack.
> 
> Regards.
> 
> Scott
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
> Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 12:24 AM
> To: rpick...@rpqconsulting.com; oconne...@tamuracorp.com;
emc-p...@ieee.org
> Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries
> 
> Also.For end use systems seeking compliance with UL 60950-1, see
> Annex P.1 with reference to cl. 4.3.8
> 
> Kaz
> kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Ron
> Pickard, RPQ
> Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:07 AM
> To: 'Brian O'Connell'; 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
> Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries
> 
> Richard,
> 
>  
> 
> IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a
removable
> battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL
> 2054. I
> say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
> efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone
application,
> please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for
lithium
> batteries.
> 
> Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:
> 
>  
> 
> - These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and
> secondary
> (rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
> batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or
more
> cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical
> energy
> into electrical energy by chemical reaction.
> 
> - These requirements are intended to reduce the ri

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Jim Eichner]

Does anybody have any insight into the changes that those standards are
going to make in light of the incidents and recalls?  If we can't rely
on UL2054's requirements, and want to apply additional testing or
requirements to UL2054 battery packs, then it would be helpful to know
where that standard is headed. 

Jim Eichner, P.Eng.
Compliance Engineering Manager
Xantrex Technology Inc.
e-mail: jim.eich...@xantrex.com
web: www.xantrex.com  

Confidentiality Notice: This email message, including any attachments,
is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain
confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use,
disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all
copies of the original message.



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Scott Xe
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 7:30 AM
To: kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com; rpick...@rpqconsulting.com;
oconne...@tamuracorp.com; emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Richard,

If you want to prevent the battery pack from explosion/fire, compliance
of
those standards might not accomplish it for the time being.  UL 2054, UL
1642 and UL 60950-1 were prepared and published before Sony's battery
recall.  All the standards are being revised to address the issue.
After a
large scale of Sony's battery recall, the Li-ion battery pack continues
to
explode and catch fire in a smaller scale.  The users are awaiting the
new
replacement of battery pack or a firm solution to the probable explosion
of
existing Li-ion battery pack.

Regards.

Scott


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of
kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 12:24 AM
To: rpick...@rpqconsulting.com; oconne...@tamuracorp.com;
emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Also.For end use systems seeking compliance with UL 60950-1, see
Annex P.1 with reference to cl. 4.3.8

Kaz
kazimier_gawrzy...@dell.com



From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Ron
Pickard, RPQ
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:07 AM
To: 'Brian O'Connell'; 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Richard,

 

IMHO, if the lithium batteries are user replaceable (such as a removable
battery pack), then they would need to be separately approved to UL
2054. I
say that because in my experience, UL has required it in past Listing
efforts of products with them. And, if this is a cell phone application,
please note that the CTIA has recently imposed requirements for lithium
batteries.

Supporting this, from UL2054's scope:

 

- These requirements cover portable primary (nonrechargeable) and
secondary
(rechargeable) batteries for use as power sources in products. These
batteries consist of either a single electrochemical cell or two or more
cells connected in series, parallel, or both, that convert chemical
energy
into electrical energy by chemical reaction.

- These requirements are intended to reduce the risk of fire or
explosion
when batteries are used in a product. The proper use of these batteries
in a
particular application is dependent on their use in a complete product
that
complies with the requirements applicable to such a product.

- These requirements are intended to cover batteries for general use and
do
not include the combination of the battery and the host product which
are
covered by requirements in the host product

standard.

- These requirements are also intended to reduce the risk of injury to
persons due to fire or explosion when batteries are removed from a
product
to be transported, stored, or discarded.

- These requirements do not cover the toxicity risk that results from
the
ingestion of a battery or its contents, nor the risk of injury to
persons
that occurs if a battery is cut open to provide access to its contents.

 

The battery manufacturer would quite likely be already aware of all of
this.
They would be the one to approach for getting this work done.

 

Also, in addition to what Brian stated about shipping, the US and
international shipping authorities have specific testing and labeling
requirements for lithium batteries or products containing lithium
batteries.
Testing involves the UN T1-T8 tests.

 

IHTH.

 

Best regards,

 

Ron Pickard

RPQ Consulting

7372 West Luke Avenue

Glendale, AZ 85303

+623.512-3451 tel, +623.848-9033 fax

rpick...@rpqconsulting.com

www.rpqconsulting.com <http://www.rpqconsulting.com/> 

 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian
O'Connell
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 7:21 AM
To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org'
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

 

The following are personal opinions only.

 

In general, conformity to the applicable standard is always

"necessary"; but not

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Brian O'Connell]

Python 2.4.2
following from CSDS proposal for UL 1642

Subject 1642
Bulletin Dated: May 23, 2008
SUMMARY OF TOPICS
The following is being proposed for preliminary review and
comment only:
1. For Preliminary Review Only: Replace the Term "Component Cell"
with The Term "Cell" in 21.2
2. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise "Fully Discharged" and Add
"Completely Discharged" to the Glossary
3. For Preliminary Review Only: Removal of Redundant Tests and
Clarification of User Replaceable
4. For Preliminary Review Only: Removal of Redundant Information
for Sample Requirements
5. For Preliminary Review Only: Temperature Monitoring for
Technician Safety
6. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of the Short
Circuit Test
7. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of the Abnormal
Charging Test
8. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of "Ultimate
Results Criteria"
9. For Preliminary Review Only: Criteria for Crush Test
10. For Preliminary Review Only: Conversion to SI Units and
Inclusion of Tolerances
11. For Preliminary Review Only: Correction of Units in
Temperature Measurement and Additional Criteria for Heating Test
for Additional Battery Chemistries
12. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 22 for Primary
Battery Markings
13. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 23 for Secondary
Battery Markings
14. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise Appendix A
15. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise 2.3.2 to Include an
Exception for PTCs Explaining How to Evaluate an Internal PTC Not
Evaluated to UL 1434 Requirements

following from CSDS proposal for UL2054

Subject 2054
Bulletin Dated: May 23, 2008
SUMMARY OF TOPICS
The following is being proposed for preliminary review and
comment only:
1. For Preliminary Review Only: Replace "Component Cell" with
"Cell" Throughout the Standard
2. For Preliminary Review Only: Deletion of "User Replaceable"
for Secondary Lithium Cells
3. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of the Definition for
"Completely Discharged" and "Enclosure" to the Glossary; Revision
to the Definition of "Casing" for Clarification
4. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Construction
5. For Preliminary Review Only: Editorial Changes for 6.3
6. For Preliminary Review Only: Short-Circuit Test
7. For Preliminary Review Only: Abnormal Charging Test
8. For Preliminary Review Only: Abusive Overcharge Test
9. For Preliminary Review Only: Forced-Discharge Test
10. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of Limited Power
11. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of Battery Pack
Component Temperature Test as New Section 13A and Addition of
Battery Pack Surface Temperature Test as New Section 13B
12. For Preliminary Review Only: Criteria for Crush Test
13. For Preliminary Review Only: Conversion to SI Units and
Inclusion of Tolerances
14. For Preliminary Review Only: Tests to Evaluate Battery Pack
Metallic Enclosures
15. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Enclosure Tests
16. For Preliminary Review Only: Mold Stress Release Test
17. For Preliminary Review Only: Drop Impact Testing for Low
Temperatures
18. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Storage Temperature
19. For Preliminary Review Only: Marking and Instructions
20. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 26 for Markings and
Instructions for Secondary Lithium Battery Packs
21. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of Appendix A

My comments:
UL 1642 provides test requirement for following electrical tests:

Short-Circuit at room and elevated temps
Abnormal Charge 
Forced Discharge
UL 1642 provides test requirement for following mechanical tests
Crush
Impact
Shock
Vibration
UL 1642 provides test requirement for following environmental
tests
Heating
Temperature Cycling
Altitude Simulation

So what other type tests should be added ? I feel it is the
tester and/or the person that 'designs' the test that cannot be
relied upon, not necessarily the standard.

luck,
Brian 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of
Jim
Eichner
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 3:42 PM
To: emc-p...@ieee.org
Cc: Jim Eichner
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Does anybody have any insight into the changes that those
standards are
going to make in light of the incidents and recalls?  If we can't
rely
on UL2054's requirements, and want to apply additional testing or
requirements to UL2054 battery packs, then it would be helpful to
know
where that standard is headed. 

Jim Eichner, P.Eng.
Compliance Engineering Manager
Xantrex Technology Inc.
e-mail: jim.eich...@xantrex.com
web: www.xantrex.com  

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society
emc-pstc discussion list.Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/

To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org

Instructions:  http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html

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F

RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

[Scott Xe]

It is a bit encouraging to see the relevant standards that are being revised
in light of the incidents and recalls.  It seems the recall does not help
remove the problem completely.  The explosion continues after the recall.

For example, LG appointed the Korea Electrotechnology Research Institute to
find out the root cause of their battery pack caught fire and the published
result was unknown.  They said that the battery exploded in unusual heat and
pressure circumstances.  How come did the normal customers operated the
product in unusual heat and pressure circumstances?

I also watched some video clips that showed no explosion when the battery
pack was dropped from 2nd floor and knocked by the hammer.  I encountered a
couple of battery packs that caught fire while they were not being used at
night.  The investigation revealed that it is normal in this type of battery
cell and cell manufacturers admit that the failure rate is still very low as
compared with other safety failures.

I do hope the Japanese government and other governments force the trading
companies to find out the root cause and fix it permanently.  Otherwise,
what is the point to revise the relevant standards that set out the MINIMUM
safety requirements!

Scott
 


From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian
O'Connell
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:22 AM
To: emc-p...@ieee.org
Subject: RE: UL 2054 testing for lithium batteries

Python 2.4.2
following from CSDS proposal for UL 1642

Subject 1642
Bulletin Dated: May 23, 2008
SUMMARY OF TOPICS
The following is being proposed for preliminary review and
comment only:
1. For Preliminary Review Only: Replace the Term "Component Cell"
with The Term "Cell" in 21.2
2. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise "Fully Discharged" and Add
"Completely Discharged" to the Glossary
3. For Preliminary Review Only: Removal of Redundant Tests and
Clarification of User Replaceable
4. For Preliminary Review Only: Removal of Redundant Information
for Sample Requirements
5. For Preliminary Review Only: Temperature Monitoring for
Technician Safety
6. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of the Short
Circuit Test
7. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of the Abnormal
Charging Test
8. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of "Ultimate
Results Criteria"
9. For Preliminary Review Only: Criteria for Crush Test
10. For Preliminary Review Only: Conversion to SI Units and
Inclusion of Tolerances
11. For Preliminary Review Only: Correction of Units in
Temperature Measurement and Additional Criteria for Heating Test
for Additional Battery Chemistries
12. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 22 for Primary
Battery Markings
13. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 23 for Secondary
Battery Markings
14. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise Appendix A
15. For Preliminary Review Only: Revise 2.3.2 to Include an
Exception for PTCs Explaining How to Evaluate an Internal PTC Not
Evaluated to UL 1434 Requirements

following from CSDS proposal for UL2054

Subject 2054
Bulletin Dated: May 23, 2008
SUMMARY OF TOPICS
The following is being proposed for preliminary review and
comment only:
1. For Preliminary Review Only: Replace "Component Cell" with
"Cell" Throughout the Standard
2. For Preliminary Review Only: Deletion of "User Replaceable"
for Secondary Lithium Cells
3. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of the Definition for
"Completely Discharged" and "Enclosure" to the Glossary; Revision
to the Definition of "Casing" for Clarification
4. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Construction
5. For Preliminary Review Only: Editorial Changes for 6.3
6. For Preliminary Review Only: Short-Circuit Test
7. For Preliminary Review Only: Abnormal Charging Test
8. For Preliminary Review Only: Abusive Overcharge Test
9. For Preliminary Review Only: Forced-Discharge Test
10. For Preliminary Review Only: Clarification of Limited Power
11. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of Battery Pack
Component Temperature Test as New Section 13A and Addition of
Battery Pack Surface Temperature Test as New Section 13B
12. For Preliminary Review Only: Criteria for Crush Test
13. For Preliminary Review Only: Conversion to SI Units and
Inclusion of Tolerances
14. For Preliminary Review Only: Tests to Evaluate Battery Pack
Metallic Enclosures
15. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Enclosure Tests
16. For Preliminary Review Only: Mold Stress Release Test
17. For Preliminary Review Only: Drop Impact Testing for Low
Temperatures
18. For Preliminary Review Only: Battery Storage Temperature
19. For Preliminary Review Only: Marking and Instructions
20. For Preliminary Review Only: New Section 26 for Markings and
Instructions for Secondary Lithium Battery Packs
21. For Preliminary Review Only: Addition of Appendix A

My comments:
UL 1642 provides test requirement for following electrical tests:

Short-C