Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 23:57:30 Jon Elson wrote:

> On 04/08/2017 07:09 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Saturday 08 April 2017 19:42:26 Jon Elson wrote:
> >> On 04/08/2017 01:51 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >>> I need to go to tsc or somewhere, wallies maybe, and get
> >>> me some of those 3 to 2 electrical adaptors as I just
> >>> found my gigahertz sampler scopes 3rd wire ground pin is
> >>> .2 ohms from a damned probe ground lead, so just hooking
> >>> up a ground lead is making a ground loop. I may even just
> >>> uncover the darned thing and see if I can find the jumper
> >>> and cut it. What the hell were they thinking?
> >>
> >> The problem with that is they used to have line filters with
> >> huge caps to line and neutral, and you'd get knocked on your
> >> rear if you touched a scope with an isolated ground and
> >> anything else.  You could even get sparks off the ground clip.
> >> Not sure your current scope has such a filter, but if so,
> >> beware when using it isolated.
> >>
> >> Jon
> >
> > That consideration has indeed crossed my mind, Jon, so before I make
> > it permanent, that will be checked.  Those honking big line bypass
> > caps have tossed me around a bit in the last 70 years. Not the most
> > pleasant feeling...
> >
> > On the lcnc joint errors front, I unplugged the cat-6 and hdmi video
> > to the monitor cables, pulled them out of the holes in the bottom of
> > the box, and took them back to the pi from an overhead direction,
> > putting 15" of air between the cables and the noise from the stepper
> > drivers. It had, the last time I checked 15 minutes back, made 45
> > copies of lathe_pawn.ngc w/o a joint error. So I guess I go prowling
> > about fleabay for a separate box to put whats now on the inside of
> > the door in this too small a box.  If I close the door, the whole
> > maryann will be too close to the noisemakers.
>
> Yup, the noise produced by unfiltered stepper drives (or PWM
> servo drives) is a major problem.
> VFDs, too, of course.
>
> Jon
>
The vfd, since I put a Corcom 20 amp 3 phase brick wall between it and 
the cable to the motor, and a spinx1 to isolate the controls, hasn't 
been a major contributor to the noise. I thought maybe the filter would 
damage the vfd, but apparently its inductive enough to protect the vfd 
from its capacitors. vfd and motor power are now switched by the enable 
button by way of a 40 amp SSR on each side of the 254 volts.

Unortunately, most of whats available in boxes is too small, or too wwell 
ventilated to keep the swarf out. I need something about 14" long, 9 to 
10 wide, and at least 3.5 deep internally. The only thing I could find 
over 2.5 deep, was also 15x17.  And about $130. Nice, heavy alu 
construction, I could mount it on the outside face of this boxes door I 
think. I just can't convince myself to reach for the card.  But if that 
what it takes...  OTOH, knowing I could clear the top of an Automation 
Tech driver I bought to be able to put some speed into the x driver, I 
could swap out the 2m542 for it, and find a bigger toroid to power it up 
about 20 more volts, then that problem is solved. That m542 driver is 
running wide open driving that nema24 motor in parallel mode, and works 
well up to a bit over 40 ipm, but 41 vdc, just isn't enough. With the 60 
volt switcher back in for a motor psu, and the ATech driver ought to get 
it up to 60+ ipm. OTOH, x speed on a lathe doesn't have to match z speed 
as the G0Z moves on the lathe are generally much longer than G0X 
retracts.

In the end, I'll do what I have to. Spend the money...

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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Jon Elson]

On 04/08/2017 07:09 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Saturday 08 April 2017 19:42:26 Jon Elson wrote:
>
>> On 04/08/2017 01:51 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>> I need to go to tsc or somewhere, wallies maybe, and get
>>> me some of those 3 to 2 electrical adaptors as I just
>>> found my gigahertz sampler scopes 3rd wire ground pin is
>>> .2 ohms from a damned probe ground lead, so just hooking
>>> up a ground lead is making a ground loop. I may even just
>>> uncover the darned thing and see if I can find the jumper
>>> and cut it. What the hell were they thinking?
>> The problem with that is they used to have line filters with
>> huge caps to line and neutral, and you'd get knocked on your
>> rear if you touched a scope with an isolated ground and
>> anything else.  You could even get sparks off the ground clip.
>> Not sure your current scope has such a filter, but if so,
>> beware when using it isolated.
>>
>> Jon
>>
> That consideration has indeed crossed my mind, Jon, so before I make it
> permanent, that will be checked.  Those honking big line bypass caps
> have tossed me around a bit in the last 70 years. Not the most pleasant
> feeling...
>
> On the lcnc joint errors front, I unplugged the cat-6 and hdmi video to
> the monitor cables, pulled them out of the holes in the bottom of the
> box, and took them back to the pi from an overhead direction, putting
> 15" of air between the cables and the noise from the stepper drivers.
> It had, the last time I checked 15 minutes back, made 45 copies of
> lathe_pawn.ngc w/o a joint error. So I guess I go prowling about fleabay
> for a separate box to put whats now on the inside of the door in this
> too small a box.  If I close the door, the whole maryann will be too
> close to the noisemakers.
>
>
Yup, the noise produced by unfiltered stepper drives (or PWM 
servo drives) is a major problem.
VFDs, too, of course.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 19:42:26 Jon Elson wrote:

> On 04/08/2017 01:51 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > I need to go to tsc or somewhere, wallies maybe, and get
> > me some of those 3 to 2 electrical adaptors as I just
> > found my gigahertz sampler scopes 3rd wire ground pin is
> > .2 ohms from a damned probe ground lead, so just hooking
> > up a ground lead is making a ground loop. I may even just
> > uncover the darned thing and see if I can find the jumper
> > and cut it. What the hell were they thinking?
>
> The problem with that is they used to have line filters with
> huge caps to line and neutral, and you'd get knocked on your
> rear if you touched a scope with an isolated ground and
> anything else.  You could even get sparks off the ground clip.
> Not sure your current scope has such a filter, but if so,
> beware when using it isolated.
>
> Jon
>
That consideration has indeed crossed my mind, Jon, so before I make it 
permanent, that will be checked.  Those honking big line bypass caps 
have tossed me around a bit in the last 70 years. Not the most pleasant 
feeling...

On the lcnc joint errors front, I unplugged the cat-6 and hdmi video to 
the monitor cables, pulled them out of the holes in the bottom of the 
box, and took them back to the pi from an overhead direction, putting 
15" of air between the cables and the noise from the stepper drivers.  
It had, the last time I checked 15 minutes back, made 45 copies of 
lathe_pawn.ngc w/o a joint error. So I guess I go prowling about fleabay 
for a separate box to put whats now on the inside of the door in this 
too small a box.  If I close the door, the whole maryann will be too 
close to the noisemakers.

But I think its progress.

Thank you Jon.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Jon Elson]

On 04/08/2017 01:51 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> I need to go to tsc or somewhere, wallies maybe, and get 
> me some of those 3 to 2 electrical adaptors as I just 
> found my gigahertz sampler scopes 3rd wire ground pin is 
> .2 ohms from a damned probe ground lead, so just hooking 
> up a ground lead is making a ground loop. I may even just 
> uncover the darned thing and see if I can find the jumper 
> and cut it. What the hell were they thinking?
The problem with that is they used to have line filters with 
huge caps to line and neutral, and you'd get knocked on your 
rear if you touched a scope with an isolated ground and 
anything else.  You could even get sparks off the ground clip.
Not sure your current scope has such a filter, but if so, 
beware when using it isolated.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 10:39:09 Fox Mulder wrote:

> On the Rpi you can get the current speed of the cpu with the following
> command: cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_cur_freq
>
And that says its running at 120, eg full speed for a 4 core.

> But beware that the Rpi default uses the on-demand governor for cpu
> clocking. This means when you overclock the Rpi and it is idle you get
> a lower clock with this command. Only when the CPU is on heavy load it
> will get overclocked and the command shows this.
>
It was, when I left to go tend the washing machine, makeing air copies of 
the lathe_pawn.ngc. I've rerouted some cables to get them a bit further 
from the motor drivers, but what its doing now is the test run.  If no 
joint errors, it should make 50 copies of it.  Hasn't made it to the end 
of the 7nth yet.

I need to go to tsc or somewhere, wallies maybe, and get me some of those 
3 to 2 electrical adaptors as I just found my gigahertz sampler scopes 
3rd wire ground pin is .2 ohms from a damned probe ground lead, so just 
hooking up a ground lead is making a ground loop.

I may even just uncover the darned thing and see if I can find the jumper 
and cut it. What the hell were they thinking?

> You can also set the threshold when the CPU gets overclocked (in
> percent CPU load) with help of the following file. System default is
> 50% on my Rpi and 95% on my desktop PC:
> /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpufreq/ondemand/up_threshold
>
> Ciao,
>  Rainer
>
> Am 08.04.2017 um 16:15 schrieb Gene Heskett:
> > On Saturday 08 April 2017 09:33:33 sam sokolik wrote:
> >> does cat /proc/cpuinfo work?
> >
> > It doesn't answer the how fast is it now question Sam, only stating
> > the present bogomips as 38.something per core.
> >
> > I have found a line in /boot/config.txt that seems to say its
> > running at 700 MHz as default, and could uncomment a line that tells
> > it to run at 800 MHz.
> >
> > But I suspect that is assuming no stickon heat sinks, which I have
> > on it, and which aren't noticably warm. With the heat sinks on it,
> > and forced fan cooling 1200 MHz. I may clone that u-sd card to use
> > as a recovery, then raise that to 800 MHz.  Wash, rinse & repeat
> > until its heating according to my ir thermometer, to an unhealthy
> > temp. I don't have a fan on it. But if it will do 1 GHz, that would
> > be a noticable improvement.
> >
> > Unfortunately, the spi buss seems to be limited by the slew rate of
> > a gpio pin to about 32 MHz. A single spi clock pulse, on a gigahertz
> > scope, is a quite good approximation of a classic sine-squared
> > pulse, very little evidence of an extended logic 1 to trigger the
> > 7i90, and so fussy that the 7i90 will not talk to it if the 10x
> > probe is on the signal at lcnc startup. I do not know how, but it
> > might be helped if the pi could drive two gpio's for the clocking
> > signal, thereby increasing the slew rate by paralleling two gpio's
> > for that function.  That of course would need a modified adaptor
> > board to combine them. Better yet would be a schmidt trigger buffer
> > to steepen up the sides of the pulse, and by adjusting the trigger
> > level, widen the pulse by a couple nanoseconds.  All this of coarse
> > would be before the src termination on the adaptor board.
> >
> > Thank you Sam.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Fox Mulder]

On the Rpi you can get the current speed of the cpu with the following
command: cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_cur_freq

But beware that the Rpi default uses the on-demand governor for cpu
clocking. This means when you overclock the Rpi and it is idle you get a
lower clock with this command. Only when the CPU is on heavy load it
will get overclocked and the command shows this.

You can also set the threshold when the CPU gets overclocked (in percent
CPU load) with help of the following file. System default is 50% on my
Rpi and 95% on my desktop PC:
/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpufreq/ondemand/up_threshold

Ciao,
 Rainer

Am 08.04.2017 um 16:15 schrieb Gene Heskett:
> On Saturday 08 April 2017 09:33:33 sam sokolik wrote:
> 
>> does cat /proc/cpuinfo work?
>>
> It doesn't answer the how fast is it now question Sam, only stating the 
> present bogomips as 38.something per core.
> 
> I have found a line in /boot/config.txt that seems to say its running at 
> 700 MHz as default, and could uncomment a line that tells it to run at 
> 800 MHz.
> 
> But I suspect that is assuming no stickon heat sinks, which I have on it, 
> and which aren't noticably warm. With the heat sinks on it, and forced 
> fan cooling 1200 MHz. I may clone that u-sd card to use as a recovery, 
> then raise that to 800 MHz.  Wash, rinse & repeat until its heating 
> according to my ir thermometer, to an unhealthy temp. I don't have a fan 
> on it. But if it will do 1 GHz, that would be a noticable improvement.
> 
> Unfortunately, the spi buss seems to be limited by the slew rate of a 
> gpio pin to about 32 MHz. A single spi clock pulse, on a gigahertz 
> scope, is a quite good approximation of a classic sine-squared pulse, 
> very little evidence of an extended logic 1 to trigger the 7i90, and so 
> fussy that the 7i90 will not talk to it if the 10x probe is on the 
> signal at lcnc startup. I do not know how, but it might be helped if the 
> pi could drive two gpio's for the clocking signal, thereby increasing 
> the slew rate by paralleling two gpio's for that function.  That of 
> course would need a modified adaptor board to combine them. Better yet 
> would be a schmidt trigger buffer to steepen up the sides of the pulse, 
> and by adjusting the trigger level, widen the pulse by a couple 
> nanoseconds.  All this of coarse would be before the src termination on 
> the adaptor board.
> 
> Thank you Sam.
> 
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> 

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 09:33:33 sam sokolik wrote:

> does cat /proc/cpuinfo work?
>
It doesn't answer the how fast is it now question Sam, only stating the 
present bogomips as 38.something per core.

I have found a line in /boot/config.txt that seems to say its running at 
700 MHz as default, and could uncomment a line that tells it to run at 
800 MHz.

But I suspect that is assuming no stickon heat sinks, which I have on it, 
and which aren't noticably warm. With the heat sinks on it, and forced 
fan cooling 1200 MHz. I may clone that u-sd card to use as a recovery, 
then raise that to 800 MHz.  Wash, rinse & repeat until its heating 
according to my ir thermometer, to an unhealthy temp. I don't have a fan 
on it. But if it will do 1 GHz, that would be a noticable improvement.

Unfortunately, the spi buss seems to be limited by the slew rate of a 
gpio pin to about 32 MHz. A single spi clock pulse, on a gigahertz 
scope, is a quite good approximation of a classic sine-squared pulse, 
very little evidence of an extended logic 1 to trigger the 7i90, and so 
fussy that the 7i90 will not talk to it if the 10x probe is on the 
signal at lcnc startup. I do not know how, but it might be helped if the 
pi could drive two gpio's for the clocking signal, thereby increasing 
the slew rate by paralleling two gpio's for that function.  That of 
course would need a modified adaptor board to combine them. Better yet 
would be a schmidt trigger buffer to steepen up the sides of the pulse, 
and by adjusting the trigger level, widen the pulse by a couple 
nanoseconds.  All this of coarse would be before the src termination on 
the adaptor board.

Thank you Sam.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[sam sokolik]

does cat /proc/cpuinfo work?

On 04/08/2017 07:47 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Saturday 08 April 2017 03:56:48 Erik Christiansen wrote:
>
>> dmidecode | grep MHz
> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo dmidecode | grep MHz
> pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo dmidecode
> # dmidecode 2.12
> # No SMBIOS nor DMI entry point found, sorry.
>
> No info by that means either.
>
> This has all the tatoo's of "trust me, I'm a Doctor" attitude someplace
> in the armhf tree.
>
> That sucks so hard Kirby could sell it as their new model vacuum. :(
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 03:56:48 Erik Christiansen wrote:

> dmidecode | grep MHz

pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo dmidecode | grep MHz
pi@raspberrypi:~ $ sudo dmidecode 
# dmidecode 2.12
# No SMBIOS nor DMI entry point found, sorry.

No info by that means either.

This has all the tatoo's of "trust me, I'm a Doctor" attitude someplace 
in the armhf tree.

That sucks so hard Kirby could sell it as their new model vacuum. :(

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Erik Christiansen]

On 08.04.17 03:08, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >
> On the pi 3b, the closest I can come is:
>  dmesg |grep timer
> [0.00] Architected cp15 timer(s) running at 19.20MHz (phys).
> [0.18] Switching to timer-based delay loop, resolution 52ns
> [0.002230] Calibrating delay loop (skipped), value calculated using 
> timer frequency.. 38.40 BogoMIPS (lpj=19200)
> 
> 1.752415] bcm2835-cpufreq: min=60 max=120
> Which is not a heck of a lot of help. 153 bogomips is later claimed for 
> all 4 cores.

That sounds like a lot of pie-fill. You need to be root to do:

# dmidecode | grep MHz
External Clock: 100 MHz
Max Speed: 1500 MHz
Current Speed: 1500 MHz

Heck, that even tells us there's a PLL cranking in there, and whether we
have the pedal flat to the floor.

Summat's gotta give ya the sauce on the Pi innards.

Erik

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Re: [Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 April 2017 01:46:45 Erik Christiansen wrote:

> On 07.04.17 13:16, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > I do not know what the current clock speed is, could be as low as
> > 700 or as high as 1200 MHz.
>
> What I usually do is no more than:
>
> $ dmesg | grep MHz
> [0.00] Detected 1499.981 MHz processor.
> [0.062078] CPU0: Centaur VIA C7 Processor 1500MHz stepping 00
> [1.992110] Refined TSC clocksource calibration: 1499.999 MHz.
>
> Erik
> (Who has filed away all the good oil on this thread, like a squirrel
> with cheeks full of nuts.)
>
On the pi 3b, the closest I can come is:
 dmesg |grep timer
[0.00] Architected cp15 timer(s) running at 19.20MHz (phys).
[0.18] Switching to timer-based delay loop, resolution 52ns
[0.002230] Calibrating delay loop (skipped), value calculated using 
timer frequency.. 38.40 BogoMIPS (lpj=19200)

1.752415] bcm2835-cpufreq: min=60 max=120
Which is not a heck of a lot of help. 153 bogomips is later claimed for 
all 4 cores.

About 2 hours of latency-test watching servo-thread at 100, showed 
latency at around 22, or about 1/4 of the 1ms servo-thread.

I found in the hostmot2 manpage a stepgen.timer-num reference, which was 
actually timer-number to a halmeter, which operates on all stepgens 
enabled and perportedly is good for following errors, so I looked at the 
first dpll timer at -100 and enabled that. I have serious doubts it will 
be any help as I think some sort of a noise pulse is triggering a 
framing error in an spi packet, everything gets bad data, and shuts down 
everything. The totally unfunny part about that is that while the gui 
shows both joints errored, it is not latched! Anyplace. Hell of a way to 
run a train. OTOH, I did sign up for this job. But I didn't know I ws 
going to be the only one swinging a corn knife in an r-pi jungle. But I 
do hope the trail I am cutting will be useful for others.

I put a couple pieces of 16 gage into the 7i90 power connector, makeing a 
local single point feed out of it, and then fed it 5 volts, going on 
from there to the pi, without the ferrite choke in its power cord. I 
think that helped, the error halts went from maybe 3 minutes to an hour 
or more, but I've not tried any hf bypassing on that point, the 5/8" 
long bits sticking out of the back of the 7i90's pwr plug are about 
full. I'd made up some surge absorbers out of 5 1n914's per wire from 
the jog wheels, and added a ceramic cap labeled 500M to ground on each 
of those lines, cleaning up 95% of the noise there and preventing the 
inputs to the 7i90's 3.3 volt circuitry from exceeding 3.75 volts, which 
made that ugly, noisy signal nice and clean, and its still perfectly 
square at any speed I can spin the wheels. I am tempted to do the same 
with the spindle encoder inputs too but will need to make more mounting 
provisions for more perfboard. 1n914's I have bunches of.

I don't seem to ever get to the last shoe drop with this thing...

Back to bed & see if I can get enough sleep for a change.

Thanks Erik.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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[Emc-users] CPU clock speed [Was: for PCW?]

[Erik Christiansen]

On 07.04.17 13:16, Gene Heskett wrote:
> I do not know what the current clock speed is, could be as low as 700 or 
> as high as 1200 MHz.

What I usually do is no more than:

$ dmesg | grep MHz
[0.00] Detected 1499.981 MHz processor.
[0.062078] CPU0: Centaur VIA C7 Processor 1500MHz stepping 00
[1.992110] Refined TSC clocksource calibration: 1499.999 MHz.

Erik
(Who has filed away all the good oil on this thread, like a squirrel
with cheeks full of nuts.)

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