Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
Ugh... I realized I was trying to reply on this thread from a different email account and the mails didn't come through. In any case, I ended up solving this with a classicladder program for estop and a separate one to delay the spindle fault estop signal until one second after the machine was on. This allowed the Anilam 240V contactors to power up the VFD so it was able to report un-faulted. This is documented some more here: http://code.google.com/p/sector67-sandbox/wiki/1100SpindleBlok#Integration_stage_1:_spindle_controller_fault Thanks all very much for the solid advice. Scott On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 3:17 PM, Thomas Powderly tomp4...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/8/11, Karl Cunningham ka...@keckec.com wrote: On 11/06/2011 08:36 PM, Scott Hasse wrote: It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Any opinions on the best way to integrate multiple external estop signals? We have a spindle VFD which faults every few hours. We really need a new one, but that will come. Not sure the cause, but there are electric trains nearby and we suspect power surges may be the problem. Or maybe just a flaky VFD. The VFD has a fault relay which has NC and NO contacts. We wired one of the contacts to motion.enable, like this: net vfd-ok motion.enable = hm2_5i20.0.gpio.052.in_not We also have a pushbutton called RESET in the pyvcp panel of axis, which drives the VFD's reset line. When there is a fault it halts motion, and after pressing F2 in axis and the reset button on the panel, it can be restarted. Not sure if this is optimal, but it seems to work ok. I'm not sure if this would work with the vault logic your VFD has. Karl -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On 11/8/11, Karl Cunningham ka...@keckec.com wrote: On 11/06/2011 08:36 PM, Scott Hasse wrote: It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Any opinions on the best way to integrate multiple external estop signals? We have a spindle VFD which faults every few hours. We really need a new one, but that will come. Not sure the cause, but there are electric trains nearby and we suspect power surges may be the problem. Or maybe just a flaky VFD. The VFD has a fault relay which has NC and NO contacts. We wired one of the contacts to motion.enable, like this: net vfd-ok motion.enable = hm2_5i20.0.gpio.052.in_not We also have a pushbutton called RESET in the pyvcp panel of axis, which drives the VFD's reset line. When there is a fault it halts motion, and after pressing F2 in axis and the reset button on the panel, it can be restarted. Not sure if this is optimal, but it seems to work ok. I'm not sure if this would work with the vault logic your VFD has. Karl -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On 11/06/2011 08:36 PM, Scott Hasse wrote: It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Any opinions on the best way to integrate multiple external estop signals? We have a spindle VFD which faults every few hours. We really need a new one, but that will come. Not sure the cause, but there are electric trains nearby and we suspect power surges may be the problem. Or maybe just a flaky VFD. The VFD has a fault relay which has NC and NO contacts. We wired one of the contacts to motion.enable, like this: net vfd-ok motion.enable = hm2_5i20.0.gpio.052.in_not We also have a pushbutton called RESET in the pyvcp panel of axis, which drives the VFD's reset line. When there is a fault it halts motion, and after pressing F2 in axis and the reset button on the panel, it can be restarted. Not sure if this is optimal, but it seems to work ok. I'm not sure if this would work with the vault logic your VFD has. Karl -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On 11/06/2011 10:36 PM, Scott Hasse wrote: I am working on the finishing touches of an Anilam 1100 knee mill conversion to EMC2, with details here: http://code.google.com/p/sector67-sandbox/wiki/ProjectSheetCake Over the last couple of months our spindle VFD (a Compumotor SpindleBlok) has faulted 5 or 6 times I have a Magnetek VFD and it has a relay that signals fault. I wired it in series with my E-top switches, servo amp fault relays, etc. It works fine to stop the machine when the drive shuts down. (When I started doing rigid tapping that requires the spindle to reverse several times a minute it started tripping a LOT, I finally found out that the electronic overheat error meant it thought the motor was overheatin g due to all the reversals. I turned that feature off as the Bridgeport motor is made to take plug reversing all day long. If you have a normally-closed E-stop switch, just put the NC contacts on the VFD in series with it. Jon -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On 11/06/2011 11:47 PM, Kirk Wallace wrote: I read a little more from your website. I see your chicken and egg problem, even with the independent loop I would think the VFD's fault relay would be open until the VFD powers up, but you can't power up until the loop is closed. Obviously, I don't have my VFD's set up for e-stop, but I been meaning to :) I can't say for any other make/model, byt the Magnetek will only trip the fault relay for an ACTUAL fault. So, it will not signal fault unless it has a motor run command and you power it off. It will not signal fault on power up or power down UNLESS it is running the motor at the time. Jon -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
I am working on the finishing touches of an Anilam 1100 knee mill conversion to EMC2, with details here: http://code.google.com/p/sector67-sandbox/wiki/ProjectSheetCake Over the last couple of months our spindle VFD (a Compumotor SpindleBlok) has faulted 5 or 6 times (a description of that particular problem can be found at http://code.google.com/p/sector67-sandbox/wiki/1100SpindleBlok, but that is not really central to the issue). The spindle and EMC2 to this point have not been integrated at all. However, I am hoping to integrate a spindle fault signal to put EMC2 to an estop state, or to at least stop milling. This has been somewhat complicated as the previous Anilam system simply switched 240V on and off to the spindle on machine enable. The 240V also powers the VFD logic, and so when the machine is off it appears to be in the faulted state. I've worked through this particular problem by creating a classicladder program that takes in a delayed enable signal as input and my custom spindle-fault as an input and outputs a signal that appropriate signals a spindle fault when the machine is enabled. So far so good. Now, I want to integrate that spindle faulted signal into EMC2 and am somewhat struggling with the best way to do that. The machine is a CNC mill for a hacker space and we'll likely be running it in multiple configurations, e.g. normal 3-axis milling, different 4th rotary axis configurations, etc. I am hoping to make the configuration somewhat modular so that alternative configurations don't have to be copy and paste but rather can include files as needed. I've been using the hal source filename command to include other files with custom hal commands (an analog joystick jog and a custom servo-reset signal that Anilam used), and this has so far worked to make the configuration somewhat modular. Now I find myself with two ladder logic programs and needing to add a new way to get to the estop state. I don't seem to be able to determine a clean, modular way to do that. I can run the two classicladder programs in one file and hook up the inputs and outputs as necessary of course, and that is not such a big deal (but if there was a way to load individual classicladder programs that would be great). However, the bigger challenge is now to add a new way to get the machine to estop when the spindle faults. It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Any opinions on the best way to integrate multiple external estop signals? Thanks in advance, Scott -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
Now I find myself with two ladder logic programs and needing to add a new way to get to the estop state. I don't seem to be able to determine a clean, modular way to do that. I can run the two classicladder programs in one file and hook up the inputs and outputs as necessary of course, and that is not such a big deal (but if there was a way to load individual classicladder programs that would be great). However, the bigger challenge is now to add a new way to get the machine to estop when the spindle faults. Not sure if I understand the problem. You can name ladder programs with different names and change the CL loading line to use the new name. - of course only one program can run at a time. It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Why can't you use CL to channel the estop signals? There is a sample of estop control in PNCconf . Chris M -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On Sun, 2011-11-06 at 22:36 -0600, Scott Hasse wrote: ... snip It seems the normal way to do this would be to take the input to the existing estop-ext signal put that into an or or component and link that with the spindle fault and the link the or component to the estop-ext. However, that can't be done in a very modular way from what I can see. Any opinions on the best way to integrate multiple external estop signals? It looks like you can program your VFD to use a relay output for a fault output. I would consider putting this relay in your e-stop loop. So, you might have an e-stop button, an EMC2 e-stop and other fault relays or switches wired in series so that if one of them trips, the loop breaks and releases a relay or relays to the VFD, and servo driver power. The e-stop loop should be independent of EMC2 so that you won't be relying on software to invoke the emergency power down, just switches and relays. The PC can stay powered up, and connect the e-stop input to let EMC2 know of the e-stop event. EMC2's e-stop out signal should be in the loop as peer, but the loop should be the mechanism that breaks to power to the dangerous bits. You might also look into a charge pump which can monitor a PC or software fault. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?About_Charge_Pumps That's what comes to mind so far. -- Kirk Wallace http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/ http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html California, USA -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] integrating a spindle fault signal in a modular way?
On Sun, 2011-11-06 at 21:28 -0800, Kirk Wallace wrote: ... snip EMC2's e-stop out signal should be in the loop as peer, but the loop should be the mechanism that breaks to power to the dangerous bits. You might also look into a charge pump which can monitor a PC or software fault. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?About_Charge_Pumps That's what comes to mind so far. I read a little more from your website. I see your chicken and egg problem, even with the independent loop I would think the VFD's fault relay would be open until the VFD powers up, but you can't power up until the loop is closed. Obviously, I don't have my VFD's set up for e-stop, but I been meaning to :) -- Kirk Wallace http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/ http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html California, USA -- RSA(R) Conference 2012 Save $700 by Nov 18 Register now http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsa-sfdev2dev1 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
