Re: [E-devel] Re: E17 future
On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:41:51 PST, Xun Cheng [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: I actually hope E17 could get rid of dependencies on gtk, freetype etc. On the other hand, if a package like gtk or freetype fulfills the need, you get several benefits: 1) You save programmer time not re-creating the library. 2) You get to share the shared library instead of dragging along your own subtly different library. Take your 'etc' to the logical conclusion. Get rid of dependencies on libX11? libc? How much longer will E17 take if those have to be re-done because we're trying to get rid of a dependency? ;) pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [E-devel] Re: E17 future
On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 14:48:46 -0500 [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:41:51 PST, Xun Cheng [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: I actually hope E17 could get rid of dependencies on gtk, freetype etc. On the other hand, if a package like gtk or freetype fulfills the need, you get several benefits: 1) You save programmer time not re-creating the library. 2) You get to share the shared library instead of dragging along your own subtly different library. yup. as far as gtk is concerned it's a we use it for now because we need tools to create data etc. in order to later be able to build a widget set - ie EWL. so gtk is a bootstrap. we used 1.2 - well - because 2.x wasn't really out at the time, it is now, but i have not seen a reason to move. gtk isn't a long term plan - just a bootstrap. EWL is the long term plan. freetype is useful - but at the same time presents problems - where do we get good FREE shippable ttf fonts? i find it very hard to find ANY! even helmet now from openoffice can't be shipped! (that was a mistake on openoffice's part and sun can't let them ship/use it). theres little use of a text engine that uses ttf's when we can't ship any ttf's (worth looking at) i REALLY would like it if someone here has known free ttf's (or can make them) that are nice readable helvetica/arial/helmet style sans-serif so we can use it to start. Take your 'etc' to the logical conclusion. Get rid of dependencies on libX11? libc? How much longer will E17 take if those have to be re-done because we're trying to get rid of a dependency? ;) actually libX11 would be tough to replace... BUT i could actually make a lot of optimizations if i did... i could change the API itself to be completely asynchronous avoiding round-trips entirely... :) Xlib still is only partially asynchronous. but i'm not doing that any time soon. for now ecore is my focus to build a VERY solid set of common convenience routines that are related to an apps event loop. i'm adding in right now what i think i'll DEFINITELY need in the nearish future. a lot of bits are coming together now that have been planned/laid out for a long time. example: ecore has an evas convenience module - it means you can create a window in x with an evas canvas and it sets up the event wrappers etc. for you. the idea is that when we make small tools/apps you can make them REALLY quickly by just re-using the same common code. another module is the x module - of course, that just makes using setting up x easier. there's now a new ecore_con module that is all about communications and setting up a server to accept clients and connecting to servers. the idea i this wraps all we need for ipc so e, and other tools can advertise services in 1 function call, just get ipc requests as events in the event queue/callbacks. connecting to a services is a 1 liner. right now it only handles the connection as a raw data stream, but my next step is to now interpret that stream as request chunks and now produce them as already-decoded request data in events, so when the event arrives you KNOW its complete and you can just use the request as it is, and not have to possibly buffer, wait for more etc. all that is done for you by the module (as well as buffering output to avoid system calls blocking when kernel buffers are full). things are coming together. these are building blocks that will make building e + tools + apps a VERY easy task. -- --- Codito, ergo sum - I code, therefore I am The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile Phone: +61 (0)413 451 899Home Phone: 02 9698 8615 --- This SF.net email is sponsored by:Crypto Challenge is now open! Get cracking and register here for some mind boggling fun and the chance of winning an Apple iPod: http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0031en ___ enlightenment-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
[E-devel] Re: E17 future
On the other hand, if a package like gtk or freetype fulfills the need, you get several benefits: 1) You save programmer time not re-creating the library. 2) You get to share the shared library instead of dragging along your own subtly different library. If the external dependencies do not have a stable enough API, I wouldn't bother to have those benefits. Having several versions of gtk+ or freetype (freetype1, freetype2, freetype in XFree 4 ...) doesn't make you feel sharing much, does it? Take your 'etc' to the logical conclusion. Get rid of dependencies on libX11? libc? How much longer will E17 take if those have to be re-done because we're trying to get rid of a dependency? ;) --- This SF.net email is sponsored by:Crypto Challenge is now open! Get cracking and register here for some mind boggling fun and the chance of winning an Apple iPod: http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0031en ___ enlightenment-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
Re: [E-devel] Re: E17 future
* Carsten Haitzler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030313 18:57]: things are coming together. these are building blocks that will make building e So, when will e17 be released ?? :) --- This SF.net email is sponsored by:Crypto Challenge is now open! Get cracking and register here for some mind boggling fun and the chance of winning an Apple iPod: http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0031en ___ enlightenment-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
Re: [E-devel] Re: E17 future
On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:30:46 -0500 Hall Stevenson [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: * Carsten Haitzler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030313 18:57]: things are coming together. these are building blocks that will make building e So, when will e17 be released ?? :) when its ready. :) -- --- Codito, ergo sum - I code, therefore I am The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile Phone: +61 (0)413 451 899Home Phone: 02 9698 8615 --- This SF.net email is sponsored by:Crypto Challenge is now open! Get cracking and register here for some mind boggling fun and the chance of winning an Apple iPod: http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0031en ___ enlightenment-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
Re: [E-devel] Re: E17 future
On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 16:20:05 -0800 (GMT) Xun Cheng [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: On the other hand, if a package like gtk or freetype fulfills the need, you get several benefits: 1) You save programmer time not re-creating the library. 2) You get to share the shared library instead of dragging along your own subtly different library. If the external dependencies do not have a stable enough API, I wouldn't bother to have those benefits. Having several versions of gtk+ or freetype (freetype1, freetype2, freetype in XFree 4 ...) doesn't make you feel sharing much, does it? imlib2 needs ft1 because it hasn't had its internals updated to use ft2. at the time the imlib2 text code was written ft2 wasn't out. i don't currently have that on my list of priorities - but it is in imlib2's TODO list and anyone is more than welcome to go do it. evas has a nice abstract and good set of ft2 wrapping routines. so it can be moved into imlib2. i people want to help there's stuff to be done there. -- --- Codito, ergo sum - I code, therefore I am The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile Phone: +61 (0)413 451 899Home Phone: 02 9698 8615 --- This SF.net email is sponsored by:Crypto Challenge is now open! Get cracking and register here for some mind boggling fun and the chance of winning an Apple iPod: http://ads.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/redirect.pl?thaw0031en ___ enlightenment-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
