[e-users] Mouse cursor size
Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this would be first place to _start_ asking. Thanks! -- Wido ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
I seem to recall a similar issue on a system a while ago with QT and GTK apps not scaling the same - KDE uses QT. Just a guess, but you could try adding the below 5 lines as environment variables - how to do that/location will depend on your setup, I think I edited /etc/environment export QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME=qt5ct export QT_AUTO_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export QT_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTORS=1 export QT_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export XCURSOR_SIZE=24 At your own risk, but could just remove if it doesn't help...best of luck ;) On 09/01/2023 14:45, Wido wrote: Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this would be first place to _start_ asking. Thanks! -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
Hi! thanks for the reply. I think this will not fix my issue. See, my problem is not QT (all kde apps seems to be honoring my size: 24), but rather E globally and (I think) some gtk apps. Also, to me it looks like E is not able to (or doesn't want to) be involved globally in defining a global cursor theme and size. Which I guess is fine, but leaves the user to figure out how each library handles each theme, and that can be a little cumbersome. I will try those vars anyway and report back, thanks! El lun, 9 ene 2023 a la(s) 14:50, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ (snake8e...@gmail.com) escribió: > I seem to recall a similar issue on a system a while ago with QT and GTK > apps not scaling the same - KDE uses QT. Just a guess, but you could try > adding the below 5 lines as environment variables - how to do that/location > will depend on your setup, I think I edited /etc/environment > > > export QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME=qt5ct > export QT_AUTO_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTOR=0 > export QT_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTORS=1 > export QT_SCALE_FACTOR=0 > export XCURSOR_SIZE=24 > > > At your own risk, but could just remove if it doesn't help...best of luck > ;) > On 09/01/2023 14:45, Wido wrote: > > Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. > > I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse > -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system > settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. > > The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and > others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: > > * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 > * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 > * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 > * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 > > I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. > > I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given > that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this > would be first place to _start_ asking. > > Thanks! > > > -- > > > > Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ > -- Wido ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Mon, 9 Jan 2023 11:45:51 -0300 Wido said: > Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. > > I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse > -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system > settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. > > The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and > others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: > > * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme. if you use something else then "you're mileage may vary". efl's cursors will scale based on scale factor. there is no good reason to set cursor size as pointers will follow the same scale factor as everything else. > * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 > * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 > * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 > > I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. > > I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given > that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this > would be first place to _start_ asking. > > Thanks! > > -- > Wido > > ___ > enlightenment-users mailing list > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
If it doesn't help, have a look into MPX (multi-pointer x); xinput2 allows for multiple mouse pointers and windows can define a cursor per device which can override the standard cursor. On a single pointer system, where device cursors are set some windows/apps may override the standard KDE settings. This old thread goes into more detail: https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm-gtk-greeter/+bug/1024482 On 09/01/2023 20:56, Wido wrote: Hi! thanks for the reply. I think this will not fix my issue. See, my problem is not QT (all kde apps seems to be honoring my size: 24), but rather E globally and (I think) some gtk apps. Also, to me it looks like E is not able to (or doesn't want to) be involved globally in defining a global cursor theme and size. Which I guess is fine, but leaves the user to figure out how each library handles each theme, and that can be a little cumbersome. I will try those vars anyway and report back, thanks! El lun, 9 ene 2023 a la(s) 14:50, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ (snake8e...@gmail.com) escribió: I seem to recall a similar issue on a system a while ago with QT and GTK apps not scaling the same - KDE uses QT. Just a guess, but you could try adding the below 5 lines as environment variables - how to do that/location will depend on your setup, I think I edited /etc/environment export QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME=qt5ct export QT_AUTO_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export QT_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTORS=1 export QT_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export XCURSOR_SIZE=24 At your own risk, but could just remove if it doesn't help...best of luck ;) On 09/01/2023 14:45, Wido wrote: Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this would be first place to _start_ asking. Thanks! -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ -- Wido -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
...oh, just seen Carsten has also replied :) I'm no coder and really just guessing and trying to remember how I sorted it previously - he'll be best to advise, especially e-related and will probably understand what I linked better as well. The 'export QT...' environment variables I mentioned sorted it when I slapped e16 onto an XFCE Debian system with a lot of customisation with GTK and QT apps and themes. I wish I'd made better notes, but kept those 5 lines. Best of luck ;) On 09/01/2023 21:19, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ wrote: If it doesn't help, have a look into MPX (multi-pointer x); xinput2 allows for multiple mouse pointers and windows can define a cursor per device which can override the standard cursor. On a single pointer system, where device cursors are set some windows/apps may override the standard KDE settings. This old thread goes into more detail: https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm-gtk-greeter/+bug/1024482 On 09/01/2023 20:56, Wido wrote: Hi! thanks for the reply. I think this will not fix my issue. See, my problem is not QT (all kde apps seems to be honoring my size: 24), but rather E globally and (I think) some gtk apps. Also, to me it looks like E is not able to (or doesn't want to) be involved globally in defining a global cursor theme and size. Which I guess is fine, but leaves the user to figure out how each library handles each theme, and that can be a little cumbersome. I will try those vars anyway and report back, thanks! El lun, 9 ene 2023 a la(s) 14:50, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ (snake8e...@gmail.com) escribió: I seem to recall a similar issue on a system a while ago with QT and GTK apps not scaling the same - KDE uses QT. Just a guess, but you could try adding the below 5 lines as environment variables - how to do that/location will depend on your setup, I think I edited /etc/environment export QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME=qt5ct export QT_AUTO_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export QT_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTORS=1 export QT_SCALE_FACTOR=0 export XCURSOR_SIZE=24 At your own risk, but could just remove if it doesn't help...best of luck ;) On 09/01/2023 14:45, Wido wrote: Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> mouse -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this would be first place to _start_ asking. Thanks! -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ -- Wido -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
Hi Carsten! I appreciate that you always take the time to respond to users :) > E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme I know, I tried, I actually notice the "same behaviour". EFL mouse on some apps, X mouse on other apps (I just tried, sublime uses E theme, chrome and kde uses X theme) > if you use something else then "you're mileage may vary" I guess that is understandable, but would it be possible to have some hints/idea/helps on how to define this for a consistent env? Again, I am aware this is probably out of E's scope, but it _feels_ like as a DE you actually should care. As I user, I _expect_ the DE to own the cursor theme in one way on another. Emphasis on the words that are probably the most debatable. El lun, 9 ene 2023 a la(s) 18:14, Carsten Haitzler (ras...@rasterman.com) escribió: > On Mon, 9 Jan 2023 11:45:51 -0300 Wido said: > > > Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. > > > > I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> > mouse > > -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system > > settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. > > > > The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and > > others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: > > > > * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 > > E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme. if you use something else > then > "you're mileage may vary". efl's cursors will scale based on scale factor. > there is no good reason to set cursor size as pointers will follow the same > scale factor as everything else. > > > * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 > > * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 > > * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 > > > > I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. > > > > I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given > > that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this > > would be first place to _start_ asking. > > > > Thanks! > > > > -- > > Wido > > > > ___ > > enlightenment-users mailing list > > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > > > > > -- > - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- > Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com > > -- Wido ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On 10/01/2023 19:20, Wido wrote: Hi Carsten! I appreciate that you always take the time to respond to users He's the best! E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme. if you use something else then "you're mileage may vary". efl's cursors will scale based on scale factor. there is no good reason to set cursor size as pointers will follow the same scale factor as everything else. This is an unrecognised problem in all interfaces. Pointer size is probably the only item that needs to be scalable *independently* of the system scale factor, because not all screens offer the same degree of clarity for moving objects (cursors) to remain visible. That is, text, menus, icons, sliders, widgets, etc *usually* stay where they are for long periods, but the mouse pointer is constantly moving. This is why most systems can be set to blink the cursor when (eg) Ctrl is pressed, because the cursor can become "lost" among the other components of the screen. Particularly as you grow older, your visual reactivity declines, so it become harder to spot the cursor, whereas you can still easily see the more static objects without difficulty. Making *everything* scale just to get a big cursor is not a good solution: the cursor needs to be scalable independently of everything else. Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Tue, 10 Jan 2023 16:20:46 -0300 Wido said: > Hi Carsten! I appreciate that you always take the time to respond to users > :) > > > E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme > I know, I tried, I actually notice the "same behaviour". EFL mouse on some > apps, X mouse on other apps (I just tried, sublime uses E theme, chrome and > kde uses X theme) pointers work like this: all windows in x inherit the pointer from their parent window. e sets a pointer on the root window. thus apps will inherit this pointer unless they override it themselves and set a new pointer on their own window(s). nothing the wm can do about this. so apps that don't override will just inherit whatever e sets. otherwise they are on their own and set their own pointers. > > if you use something else then "you're mileage may vary" > I guess that is understandable, but would it be possible to have some > hints/idea/helps on how to define this for a consistent env? Again, I am > aware this is probably out of E's scope, but it _feels_ like as a DE you > actually should care. As I user, I _expect_ the DE to own the cursor theme > in one way on another. it's not possible. any app can set any pointer they like at any time on any window. there are x cursor themes that many apps use - these are limited and e/efl do not use them because of that (e.g. the animations that e does in pointers to show the resize direction or moving animation or the blue flash when you click are not possible via x cursor themes as they are simple static images OR a series of N images that loop. as these are limited and thus can't do things like also adapt to color palette changes, scaling like efl does it , e pretty much doesn't bother much due to it being so limited. you can set an x cursor theme yourself and go find something and set that with environment variables, .Xdefaults files etc. > Emphasis on the words that are probably the most debatable. > > El lun, 9 ene 2023 a la(s) 18:14, Carsten Haitzler (ras...@rasterman.com) > escribió: > > > On Mon, 9 Jan 2023 11:45:51 -0300 Wido said: > > > > > Happy new year! I'm having an issue with cursor theme/size. > > > > > > I'm not using E's theme, I have selected `application` in settings -> > > mouse > > > -> e theme. Then, I have configured my mouse theme and size in KDE system > > > settings -> appearance cursors. My current cursor size is 24. > > > > > > The problem I have is that some applications respect my cursor size, and > > > others do not, and I don't understand the pattern: > > > > > > * Enlightenment and EFL uses size 36 > > > > E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme. if you use something else > > then > > "you're mileage may vary". efl's cursors will scale based on scale factor. > > there is no good reason to set cursor size as pointers will follow the same > > scale factor as everything else. > > > > > * Dolphin (kde file explorer) uses size 24 > > > * Sublime (gtk3?) uses size 36 > > > * Chrome (gtk3?) uses size 24 > > > > > > I tried modifying gtk configfiles in my home, but without success. > > > > > > I know this probably is not an E issue and rather a gtk issue, but given > > > that it _apperas_ like E is following different cursors, I thought this > > > would be first place to _start_ asking. > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > -- > > > Wido > > > > > > ___ > > > enlightenment-users mailing list > > > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > > > > > > > > > -- > > - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- > > Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com > > > > > > -- > Wido -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Tue, 10 Jan 2023 21:37:23 + Peter Flynn said: > On 10/01/2023 19:20, Wido wrote: > > Hi Carsten! I appreciate that you always take the time to respond to users > > He's the best! > > >> E has its own cursors that uses the efl/e theme. if you use > >> something else then "you're mileage may vary". efl's cursors will > >> scale based on scale factor. there is no good reason to set cursor > >> size as pointers will follow the same scale factor as everything > >> else. > > This is an unrecognised problem in all interfaces. Pointer size is > probably the only item that needs to be scalable *independently* of the > system scale factor, because not all screens offer the same degree of > clarity for moving objects (cursors) to remain visible. e has 2 settings. scaling AND a pointer size. pointer size is multiplied by scale factor. 99% of the time people just want/need to adjust scale factor and that's it. not change pointer size. not change font size. just one single setting. 1% of the time - maybe a bit of fiddling is needed but chances are that if you can't see a cursor due to visual acuity problems you can't make out other ui elements either and they all need to get bigger. the mouse pointer is about the size of 2 lines of text by default (given all default sizes). if you can't make out a pointer then you probably can't read the text either... :) > That is, text, menus, icons, sliders, widgets, etc *usually* stay where > they are for long periods, but the mouse pointer is constantly moving. > This is why most systems can be set to blink the cursor when (eg) Ctrl > is pressed, because the cursor can become "lost" among the other > components of the screen. why not just wiggle the mouse? :) also produces motion. but yes - a "fund my pointer" feature doesn't exist in e. you don't want to blink the cursor. you want some kind of "takes a lot of the screen" animation that steadily zooms from a large thing down to where the pointer is now. not a "blink the cursor" as that's about as subtle as the "wiggle your mouse" which needs no special feature to do the same. > Particularly as you grow older, your visual reactivity declines, so it > become harder to spot the cursor, whereas you can still easily see the > more static objects without difficulty. Making *everything* scale just > to get a big cursor is not a good solution: the cursor needs to be > scalable independently of everything else. e's pointer has that. e doesn't have anything to do with x cursor themes... > Peter > > > ___ > enlightenment-users mailing list > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On 11/01/2023 08:53, Carsten Haitzler wrote: [...] chances are that if you can't see a cursor due to visual acuity problems you can't make out other ui elements either and they all need to get bigger. The actual answer is, we don't know. I need to arrange a proper usability test in the labs in my college (which I can do, given the time). why not just wiggle the mouse? :) also produces motion. If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is much more easily visible. but yes - a "fund my pointer" feature doesn't exist in e. you don't want to blink the cursor. you want some kind of "takes a lot of the screen" animation No, I think people with this problem just want a bigger cursor. End of story. e's pointer has that. e doesn't have anything to do with x cursor themes... Can you describe for me the difference between e's pointer and an x cursor? Is one logical and the other physical? Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
/"If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is much more easily visible."/ If you're having problems locating your mouse, perhaps try using a larger rodent like a rat or even a pacarana if you're really struggling.but be careful; although I've never wiggled one myself, they can be a bit grumpy and get vicious when provoked and I've heard they don't take too kindly to being wiggled :) There's usually accessibility options with hot keys that zoom in the screen at the cursor location. On 11/01/2023 13:41, Peter Flynn wrote: On 11/01/2023 08:53, Carsten Haitzler wrote: [...] chances are that if you can't see a cursor due to visual acuity problems you can't make out other ui elements either and they all need to get bigger. The actual answer is, we don't know. I need to arrange a proper usability test in the labs in my college (which I can do, given the time). why not just wiggle the mouse? :) also produces motion. If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is much more easily visible. but yes - a "fund my pointer" feature doesn't exist in e. you don't want to blink the cursor. you want some kind of "takes a lot of the screen" animation No, I think people with this problem just want a bigger cursor. End of story. e's pointer has that. e doesn't have anything to do with x cursor themes... Can you describe for me the difference between e's pointer and an x cursor? Is one logical and the other physical? Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
Are you aware of xmag? I think it's available by default on all linux x systems - could be useful if you bind that to a hotkey. You can try it with whatever your run command is on your system by typing "xmag". Most desktop environments have additional options with more advanced features, but it's good to have xmag as a starting point out of the box. I've actually been considering accessibility options for a laptop/tablet I'm putting together for someone, but hadn't thought about cursor movement in particular being an issue, so thanks for raising it :) On 11/01/2023 16:55, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ wrote: /"If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is much more easily visible."/ If you're having problems locating your mouse, perhaps try using a larger rodent like a rat or even a pacarana if you're really struggling.but be careful; although I've never wiggled one myself, they can be a bit grumpy and get vicious when provoked and I've heard they don't take too kindly to being wiggled :) There's usually accessibility options with hot keys that zoom in the screen at the cursor location. On 11/01/2023 13:41, Peter Flynn wrote: On 11/01/2023 08:53, Carsten Haitzler wrote: [...] chances are that if you can't see a cursor due to visual acuity problems you can't make out other ui elements either and they all need to get bigger. The actual answer is, we don't know. I need to arrange a proper usability test in the labs in my college (which I can do, given the time). why not just wiggle the mouse? :) also produces motion. If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is much more easily visible. but yes - a "fund my pointer" feature doesn't exist in e. you don't want to blink the cursor. you want some kind of "takes a lot of the screen" animation No, I think people with this problem just want a bigger cursor. End of story. e's pointer has that. e doesn't have anything to do with x cursor themes... Can you describe for me the difference between e's pointer and an x cursor? Is one logical and the other physical? Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On 12/01/2023 20:01, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ wrote: Are you aware of xmag? That does not seem to magnify just the mouse pointer (cursor). Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Thu, 12 Jan 2023 23:14:14 + Peter Flynn said: > On 12/01/2023 20:01, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ wrote: > > Are you aware of xmag? > > That does not seem to magnify just the mouse pointer (cursor). in this case it's not useful for the pointer... :) -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 13:41:02 + Peter Flynn said: > On 11/01/2023 08:53, Carsten Haitzler wrote: > > [...] chances are that if you can't see a cursor due to visual > > acuity problems you can't make out other ui elements either and they > > all need to get bigger. > The actual answer is, we don't know. I need to arrange a proper > usability test in the labs in my college (which I can do, given the time). > > > why not just wiggle the mouse? :) also produces motion. > > If you have problems locating the mouse, wiggling is not as good as the > Ctrl key, which usually produces a vibrating expanding disc which is > much more easily visible. as below - you want a larger thing that actually starts big and zooms down to where the pointer is causing motion that your eyes follow to that point and then can discover the mouse - there is no such feature in e at this point. > > but yes - a "fund my pointer" feature doesn't exist in e. you don't > > want to blink the cursor. you want some kind of "takes a lot of the > > screen" animation > No, I think people with this problem just want a bigger cursor. End of > story. if it's 2x as big it's still a pointer on a busy screen full of content that if you don't have the visual acuity to make out is still hard to see. we're attuned to motion better than still content unless your eyesight is decent or you are "trained" to look for shapes (trained here is just learning methods to hunt down specific shapes visually even if blurry). > > e's pointer has that. e doesn't have anything to do with x cursor themes... > > Can you describe for me the difference between e's pointer and an x > cursor? Is one logical and the other physical? x cursors (libxcursor and x cursor themes) are "dumb" as i described. simple images or a sequence of images to display. e renders its cursor live from the same theme elements that make up everything else (border, backgrounds, buttons, window borders) thus they can do everything any theme element can do. it's all done the same way. thus these objects accept signals (like a mouse click), scale liuke the theme and size like all of these other theme elements - cursor is defined in the theme like everything else. efl apps do the same as e - they use efl to render the mouse cursor if they need a custom one of their own. as a result x cursors are very limited in what they can do. a set of N images for sizing and then N images in sequence looping if you want animation and a hotspot. that's it. e's cursors can do this and much more as they can be made from multiple elements layered together with sizing/scaling rules as well as animation that can have every element in the cursor do something different and respond to events live (like a click). that's how the blue box that resizes/moves is done. its just a semi-trans blue rect that is told to transition between 2 or 3 or 4 states over a period of time. cursors get signals when the pointer goes idle (doesn't move for a while) so it could blink or pulse then fade out or something - up to theme. they also get signals when you blank/unlbank/suspend/resume - the pointer can and does zoom into nothingness then zoom back up again. any amount of signals can be sent to a pointer and the theme can respond. x cursors are far more "dumb". > Peter > > > ___ > enlightenment-users mailing list > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On 13/01/2023 11:34, Carsten Haitzler wrote: [...] as below - you want a larger thing that actually starts big and zooms down to where the pointer is causing motion that your eyes follow to that point and then can discover the mouse - there is no such feature in e at this point. That is not a requirement. The requirement is for a BIG CURSOR. if it's 2x as big it's still a pointer on a busy screen full of content that if you don't have the visual acuity to make out is still hard to see. If it's big and (eg) red it will be seen. x cursors (libxcursor and x cursor themes) are "dumb" as i described. simple images or a sequence of images to display. e renders its cursor live from the same theme elements that make up everything else (border, backgrounds, buttons, window borders) thus they can do everything any theme element can do. it's all done the same way. thus these objects accept signals (like a mouse click), scale like the theme and size like all of these other theme elements - cursor is defined in the theme like everything else. efl apps do the same as e - they use efl to render the mouse cursor if they need a custom one of their own. Ah. So I could write some code to make a bigger mouse pointer? as a result x cursors are very limited in what they can do. a set of N images for sizing and then N images in sequence looping if you want animation and a hotspot. that's it. e's cursors can do this Except they cannot do sizing independently from the rest of the theme, if I understand you right. any amount of signals can be sent to a pointer and the theme can respond. I love your enthusiasm and explanation. Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
Yeah, I just thought I'd mention xmag as an accessibility side note, not for increasing pointer size - Carsten had already mentioned e has settings for scaling and pointer size so thought that was covered. xmag does create a flashing box at the pointer so would help locate a /stationary/ pointer like the expanding disc you mentioned, however it's not the intended use case and I'm not sure you can easily exit the flashing square without creating the zoom snapshot first - exit the zoom with "Q". KDE has a 'zoom screen into pointer' type feature which draws the eye in towards it's location. I guess that pointer trails effect that makes you feel dizzy could actually be helpful for some people to keep track of a /moving/ pointer :) The original poster of this thread was having problems with cursor size /consistency/ - pointer being set differently and enlarging under various conditions - perhaps e and kwin were both trying to set the root cursor. Installing QT5ct and pointing the QT theming/config towards that can sometimes help get everything reading from the same page and disabling the QT auto screen scale factor may also help. These things can be quite setup dependent and need tweaking locally. On 13/01/2023 11:35, Carsten Haitzler wrote: On Thu, 12 Jan 2023 23:14:14 + Peter Flynn said: On 12/01/2023 20:01, Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ wrote: Are you aware of xmag? That does not seem to magnify just the mouse pointer (cursor). in this case it's not useful for the pointer... :) -- Φ SNAKΣ ΣYΣZ Φ ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On Fri, 13 Jan 2023 13:12:07 + Peter Flynn said: > > On 13/01/2023 11:34, Carsten Haitzler wrote: > [...] > > as below - you want a larger thing that actually starts big and zooms > > down to where the pointer is causing motion that your eyes follow to > > that point and then can discover the mouse - there is no such feature > > in e at this point. > > That is not a requirement. > > The requirement is for a BIG CURSOR. > > > if it's 2x as big it's still a pointer on a busy screen full of > > content that if you don't have the visual acuity to make out is still > > hard to see. > > If it's big and (eg) red it will be seen. > > > x cursors (libxcursor and x cursor themes) are "dumb" as i described. > > simple images or a sequence of images to display. e renders its > > cursor live from the same theme elements that make up everything else > > (border, backgrounds, buttons, window borders) thus they can do > > everything any theme element can do. it's all done the same way. thus > > these objects accept signals (like a mouse click), scale like the > > theme and size like all of these other theme elements - cursor is > > defined in the theme like everything else. efl apps do the same as e > > - they use efl to render the mouse cursor if they need a custom one > > of their own. > Ah. So I could write some code to make a bigger mouse pointer? > > > as a result x cursors are very limited in what they can do. a set of > > N images for sizing and then N images in sequence looping if you > > want animation and a hotspot. that's it. e's cursors can do this > > Except they cannot do sizing independently from the rest of the theme, > if I understand you right. they can. have you seen the pointer settings dialog with a slider for size? i said it has both a size AND pointer scale to scale. 99% of people just want the scale setting - that's good enough for 99% of cases and 99% fo uses. there is a separate cursor size slider. this size is multiplied by the scale factor to produce a final size. 99% of people will never need more than the scale factor. there is a slider in e's cursor for size as well. > > any amount of signals can be sent to a pointer and the theme can > > respond. > I love your enthusiasm and explanation. > > Peter > > > > ___ > enlightenment-users mailing list > enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users > -- - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -- Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
Re: [e-users] Mouse cursor size
On 13/01/2023 20:00, Carsten Haitzler wrote: On Fri, 13 Jan 2023 13:12:07 + Peter Flynn said: [...] they can. have you seen the pointer settings dialog with a slider for size? i said it has both a size AND pointer scale to scale. I managed to miss that, thank you! I've been away from e for 4–5 years (so I'll have other questions too :-) Peter ___ enlightenment-users mailing list enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
